Georgia Guidestones, Burj Khalifa, Masons and Muslims

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: liveandlearn

Not that I have an input on your theory, but to explain masonry a bit better, any man who has a belief in a higher power, can be a mason. He can be Jewish, Muslim, Baptist, Hindu, just about anything you can imagine, as long as his belief is in a single power or deity. We do not discriminate.

Is that because masons believe that there is only one most high?

a reply to: deadeyedick

I cannot say "what masons believe" because that is up to the individual, but masonry, in it's admission requirements, asks that you have a monotheistic belief. There is only one creator of all that is, in the basis the lessons are taught.

a reply to: network dude

Trying to get a bit more on topic here, i found this

So al-Afghani is critical to understanding the modern global order. I mention him here because of a surprising connection with my earlier themes. Curiously, he and his followers resembled their Western progressive counterparts in using Freemasonry as a vehicle for spiritual reform, and al-Afghani operated through Egypt’s Masonic lodges. He was even the head of that movement in Egypt. (This Masonic context was explored in a major scholarly study in A. Albert Kudsi-Zadeh, “Afghānī and Freemasonry in Egypt,” Journal of the American Oriental Society, 1972).

The connection requires a bit of explanation. Of itself, there is nothing strange about Muslim involvement in Masonry. Muslims are strict monotheists,[/ex]

So the question may be, any diety??? As long as you are a monotheist.

edit on 2-10-2015 by liveandlearn because: (no reason given)

a reply to: liveandlearn

It's implied through our learning that the single creator of all can be known by many names, but is still the same deity.
So while I pray to God, the mason next to me may be praying to Allah, and in essence, we are praying to the same God.

I believe this is the major bone of contention with those who understand, but oppose masonry. I think it's one of it's best qualities. Removing the stumbling block that is religion only leaves ego. (and old age does a fine job dismantling that)

And Masonry has to do with the Georgia Guidestones, what now exactly?
2nd. That's about it. What now?

originally posted by: VictorVonDoom
a reply to: liveandlearn

It was my understanding that Hiram Abiff was a muslim, so ...

Probably Baal worshiper. But close.

nevermind this one

originally posted by: liveandlearn
However this seemed problematic as the guidestones were built by masons

Seriously, news to me. Reference?

a reply to: KAOStheory

No? So, not true then, obviously.
Mods, dustbin already?
I'm all for discussion on the topic, but the OP is false in it's main claim, that's all there is to it.

a reply to: KAOStheory

My apology for the late reply...if you are still around.

I am guessing you didn't read any links. Below is not proof but certainly appears more than just highly circumstantial circumstantial.

from the Source

TThe “Georgia Guidestones” were built by Freemasons. This should come as no surprise. Let me tell you why they were built WHERE they were built first. The guidestones were built in Elbert county for a few reasons. One reason, vast quantities of Pyramid Blue granite, truly good for monument building. (The granite continues this day as a mecca attracting many Freemason tradesmen.) Another reason, Elberton the town was founded by Freemasons, as a matter of fact, it was named after Samuel Elbert, a very famous historical Freemason you can read plenty about. (Even in his day Elbert’s life was spared by a British mason officer’s bayonette [sic] due to recognizing him as a mason during battle [Elbert’s mason coded cry of distress].) Lastly, Elbert county sits on an Eastern most edge of the continent. This is very meaningful to masons because the sun rises in the East. It is common knowledge that masons consider the sun and its rising to be metaphorically divine. This is why for over twenty years Elberton’s sister city was Mure, Kagawa, Japan… the land of the rising sun.

So who masterminded the guidestones specifically? Lore points to R. C. Christian. Much debate has been made about who this man was. And some people have guessed correctly, yet not correctly. The big secret? R.C. Christian was actually TWO men. Robert Carter Cook was the mastermind. Robert Edward “Ted” Turner III was the talking face that Joe Fendley and Wyatt Martin actually interacted with [Van: We have maintained that Ted Turner’s relationship with Wyatt C. Martin suggests his involvement with the Georgia Guidestones, but his role is not clear]. Fendley and Martin both described Christian as a tall middle aged man with white hair in a three piece suit and tie, and that’s how Ted looked back then (here’s a TT pic circa 1982:ext

The Freemason connection… Robert Cook and Ted Turner; both of these men are/were Freemasons. Ted Turner is of the Order of Malta. I am not sure what order Robert C. Carter was involved in, only that he was a mason. He is listed as such in the Denslow record (www.phoenixmasonry.org...). Joe Fendley the granite mogul and Wyatt Martin the banker are both Freemasons [Van: Wyatt Martin denied being a Freemason when I interviewed him.], as were the majority of men who helped to construct the guidestones, including the sandblaster Charlie Clamp [Van: This is probably an understatement — I was told by Mart Clamp, caretaker of the monument and son of Charlie Clamp, that virtually every hand that touched the Georgia Guidestones during its construction belonged to a Freemason].

I don’t want to denigrate every Freemason involved in this project though, because one stood up for what was right and paid for it. I want to vouch for the credibility of one Freemason during the 1979 guidestone project. “John Kirk Nicholson, Jr.” This man was the grand master of the Georgia Freemasons during 1979. He was expelled in 1979 (www.glofga.org...) because he disagreed with the guidestone project. Too bad for him that Scottish Freemasons above his rank did not agree and had him expelled. John Kirk Nicholson, Jr. was the first grand master Freemason of GA to be expelled in the nearly 200 years of grand masters that proceeded him. It was not until 2008 that another grand master was expelled, Carl W. Dohn [Van: This appears to be largely correct, although Dohn was not a Grand Master in 2008; see: www.glofga.org...]. Carl W. Dohn knew in 2008 that the “cube” would be removed in 2009, and he knew why, and he did not agree with it. Because of this, Carl W. Dohn was expelled just as John Kirk Nicholson, Jr. was.

a reply to: liveandlearn

I have heard that turner was involved but that brings up a serious point of why on earth would they need to go to a bank for a loan if turner was involved? Was this before he had money? I think a video exist that shows rc in the bank.

Here's the deal on Masonry, Sufism, and the like.

I’ll abridge this from years of study


The European mystics were nourished from the darkness of medieval Christianity by the Hermetic tradition up until the Knights Templers and a little bit after them.


Many of them also went into Alchemy (an Arabic word) through the ME Sufic tradition


Also some of them remained in this tradition and went into magic and what is termed Natural Philosophy such as John Dee.

Many believe Dee is the secret founder of Rosicrucianism.

For it began to flourish after his death


Anyway….Many of them found out the inheritors of the Hermetic tradition AND JESUS were the Saracen Sufis.

The Knights Templers learned from this tradition before they were destroyed by the Catholic Church and the King of France and they transformed to Masonry and Rosicrucian’s.

Hermitism opened the European mystics up to also Vedanta or Hindu and Buddhist mysticism as well did the influence of Blavatsky later.


Before that though the Rosicrucian’s, Knight Templers, and other European mystics all went to the Saracen East to learn true mysticism from Hermitism and the true heritage of a real Jesus which is and was Sufism.

I personally don’t think much from the Gulf Wahhabi states is anything mystical unless it is in the tradition within Sufis of hidden saints.

The Wahhabism is an enemy of Sufism therefore anything from this area if it is Sufic or Masonic will be in secret.

a reply to: deadeyedick

Turner is highlighted but there are several other possibilities mentioned. Could be a group may have wanted to be involved thus a loan so it would not be all on one person.

My main concern is a possible muslim/mason connection and what is happening in the world today.

As it happens, I was just looking at Michael Hastings, the journalist who died, and found this

19.2K – Before his death in a fiery car crash, Michael Hastings was preparing to publish a major investigative piece tied to the undercover agent who is suspected of sanitizing President Obama’s passport records prior to the 2008 presidential election.

On Aug. 12, Kimberly Dvorak reported for San Diego 6 News that Hastings at the time of his death was working on an exposé on CIA director John Brennan. In July, a source provided the station with an email hacked from “super secret CIA contractor” Stratfor’s President Fred Burton and subsequently posted on WikiLeaks that suggested Brennan was in charge of the Obama administration’s surveillance of investigative journalists.

Though rumors persist that Hastings was near completion of a new exposè on Brennan to be published shortly in Rolling Stone, the magazine so far has not published any such piece.

source

And as I mentioned in the op, Some are reporting Brennan converted to muslim while stationed in Saudi Arabia.

Who the person was that commissioned the guidestones is a side story.

The connection between masons and muslim and the possible organized plan to set up a caliphate by next year is my concern. Just considering how the US is behaving in the Mid East and the influx of Muslims into western countries. It is yelling a setup to me.

a reply to: liveandlearn

NO worries and thanks...
But you provide no credible sources. And, you - sorry - do kinda show a little ignorance by not understanding that the name R. C. Christian tells us exactly who ordered them built, with no speculation necessary.
Just google that name and tell us if you feel the same way. Not trying to shoot you down - you care, so, keep on looking. Maybe you'll find an answer.
A good start is a few other threads already posted on here, and y'know, just, Google.
Last I heard, it's still there, and free for all, just not often used by those posting about things they think they know a lot about already, because it takes 3-5 seconds sometimes, and yknow, why bother? Hell with that.
Plus, spelling is sometimes important, so if you can't spell a word to google it, that takes care of - oh, approximately the same amount of the Earth's population the Guidestones say we don't need anymore. I can't help but agree.

a reply to: KAOStheory

Since there is only one source, one who has done a great deal of research including on site and speaking to people involved, you are free to decide credibility for yourself.

If by R C Christian you are speaking of Christian Rosenkreutz I made an assumption that ATS is well versed in who he is and familiar with Rosicrucians as well as their role in Masons.

Now, if you have some information you would like to contribute please feel free.

Let's see, seems I have been a member a couple years longer than you so thank you but I am well aware of what is on ATS. Your attempts to paint me as an ignorant child speaks well to your maturity.

Why bother to check things indeed. Should should have actually read the material before posting.

Its funny how it is all so out in the open, and we dont realize it.

originally posted by: liveandlearn

If by R C Christian you are speaking of Christian Rosenkreutz I made an assumption that ATS is well versed in who he is and familiar with Rosicrucians as well as their role in Masons.

I am a mason and have been one since 2007. I don't know of any direct link with Rosicrucians other than the masonic group that claims the same name, yet is a completely different order.

Where did you get the information that masonry was linked in any way?
www.masonicdictionary.com...

The Societas Rosicruciana in Civitatibus Foederatis (Rosicrucian Society of the United States) was formed on September 21, 1880, by three Colleges chartered within the previous ten months by the Society in Scotland. It is entirely autonomous and in no way connected with any other institution.

The Society is in amity with the only other similar societies in the wold--Societas Rosicruciana in Anglia (England) and Societas Rosicruciana in Scotia (Scotland).

Membership, which is by invitation, is predicated on Masonic affiliation and Christianity. The Society is not merely another degree of Freemasonry which may be acquired and outside of the normal "workings" of the Craft.

The Masonic qualification assures the membership that the neophyte has given proof of that fidelity and privacy which characterizes a member of that Fraternity. The Christian qualification is required because the character of the Grade rituals is completely Christian, and would not be understood or appreciated by those of other faiths. This character is emphasized in the Ceremony of Admission and it will be noted that a certain community outlook and understanding among the members (called Fraters) is necessary.

ETA: the Rosicrucian order I am refering to is AMORC

originally posted by: lovebuckets
Its funny how it is all so out in the open, and we dont realize it.

It's like the "secrets" of masonry, they aren't secret at all, you just have to go look for them.

I finally figured out what the mason’s job is and it was always looking us right in the face


Their job as some kind of hidden spiritual masters is to be God’s builders of whatever God wants built on the earth: from houses of worship to the buildings that will house the people during the apocalypse the Freemasons are supposed to be those builders.


That’s why they built the DIA and that’s why they built the Guidestones

Various churches and other God oriented houses

WillTell

a reply to: Willtell
You caught us!