5 Ways Powerful People Trick You Into Hating Underdogs

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: greencmp

I don't know about you, but as I read that article I was like, "Damn I remember these VERY arguments used against me in various discussions." It's amazing how people will repeat rhetoric over and over again just because it sounds plausible or agrees with their position, yet never fact check it to see if they are really just being useful idiots for the ptb.

You are right.

There are a LOT of "useful idiots," and in fact this probably describes most people with most topics. Most people don't actually have an evil agenda, but just aren't informed on most issues and go with what is comfortable or what they have been manipulated into thinking.

I'm sure all of us have fit that at some point in our lives.

a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

For me, I was an outcast growing up. I would get made fun of if I said something uninformed or dumb, so I started looking up information on topics before actually speaking about them (though what didn't help was when I moved to northern mississippi and ended up being smarter than my teachers and my intelligence made me stand out in the opposite direction). My natural curiosity on things also helped. Even when I first joined ATS, I was loath to come out of the gate swinging and posting on every post I could see. I spent many of my early months just reading and posting here or there on things that I may have already knew about.

People will say that the internet is our greatest tool to liberate and inform ourselves. It also happens to be a 24/7 conduit for disinformation and propaganda. Even those most committed to truthiness will invariably be led astray. Let's face it - money has the power in this world and that includes the web. Often it is the interests of the wealthy that are being promoted even when we think something else is. They've been working on these rules of disinfo for 100 years and pretty well have them mastered.

What's lacking is discretion and education that would help us navigate the mindfield of information to find what is true and what isn't. Our emotional makeup is our undoing, the ever-open door for disinfo to sneak through. One has to be some kind of master web Jedi to think they can't make it through without their own core values being compromised.

In brief then while we think we are arming ourselves with information that will help us they are sneakily indoctrinating us at an even faster rate. It's a learning curve that keeps moving ahead of you, like trying to climb a slide that keeps extending itself upward. Maybe the best thing to do is to get off the slide entirely.

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14

6) Characterize the poor or disadvantaged as "lazy," "on drugs," "welfare queens," "irresponsible." This is probably the most common way the oppressed are dismissed, by making them responsible for their state of oppression.

Your other points apply to liberals too, but #6 I just listed is classically Republican in the US sense. #FoxNews.

Great point, can't believe that one didn't make the list.

I'm not lazy, I'm unmotivated.
I'm not on drugs, I'm self-medicated.
I'm not a welfare queen, I'm disabled.
I have no comment on that last one.

One of the best ones I've heard all through my life is in the form of a question. I don't know how to categorise it, is it reverse logic?
Asked of a poor person "what if you were a millionaire and could earn more money YOU'D do it wouldn't you". Now any idiot would say yes. BUT it wouldn't be right.
What if you were in their shoes, you'd do the same.
I don't know if I've put that in the right way!

a reply to: Asktheanimals

It's better than what the public had at their disposal before, which was just propaganda laden media outlets. Now, at least, we can hunt up both sides of the argument to get the middle ground. I'd rather have a propaganda laden internet then go back to not having an internet.

a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

I'd like to see that on a video learning
class like at Khan Academy or Udemy.

If I taught the class, lesson one would
be about the Heigain dialectic.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Asktheanimals

It's better than what the public had at their disposal before, which was just propaganda laden media outlets. Now, at least, we can hunt up both sides of the argument to get the middle ground. I'd rather have a propaganda laden internet then go back to not having an internet.

Depends on how far back "before" we're talking about. I remember in the 60's all the way to the 90's newspapers and some tv news would aggressively investigate government and corporate malfeasance. But when the media ownership of all the newspapers, tv and radio stations went from having 500-some owners to around 5 that all stopped. Often all we get now are 2 sides of a story created by the same people, the old controlled opposition.

You can bet there are loads of blogs out there that appear to be small-time individual efforts that actually aren't. They are using every last trick in the book to keep us fact free. It's the only way their criminal enterprise can go on running smoothly without interruption. We should be suspect of all sources - there is no such thing as unimpeachable sources anymore.

What we are left with then is trying to figure out what isn't being discussed. What elements are conveniently forgotten and ignored. Quite often the truth lies in the exact opposite direction from what they would point us in. The same goes for the names of new Federal laws; the Freedom Act, Affordable Care Act, PATRIOT Act - they are everything but what the name would imply.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

This is all true and I don't disagree, but you have to take into account you have to take the good with the bad. The truth IS out there in the sea of lies. If you know how to find it, it isn't even that hard to locate. Rhetoric and propaganda follow formulas and patterns that make them easy to pick out and ignore. Unfortunately, the public at large isn't trained to detect these things.

originally posted by: wasaka
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

I'd like to see that on a video learning
class like at Khan Academy or Udemy.

If I taught the class, lesson one would
be about the Heigain dialectic.

Yeah for sure. They might have classes that cover some of the psychology and persuasion behind propaganda on such sites as coursera or EdX, which are great for free online courses from universities.

originally posted by: CretumOrbis

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14

6) Characterize the poor or disadvantaged as "lazy," "on drugs," "welfare queens," "irresponsible." This is probably the most common way the oppressed are dismissed, by making them responsible for their state of oppression.

Your other points apply to liberals too, but #6 I just listed is classically Republican in the US sense. #FoxNews.

Great point, can't believe that one didn't make the list.

I'm not lazy, I'm unmotivated.
I'm not on drugs, I'm self-medicated.
I'm not a welfare queen, I'm disabled.
I have no comment on that last one.

I can't tell if you are agreeing with me or being sarcastic, lol.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

For me, I was an outcast growing up. I would get made fun of if I said something uninformed or dumb, so I started looking up information on topics before actually speaking about them (though what didn't help was when I moved to northern mississippi and ended up being smarter than my teachers and my intelligence made me stand out in the opposite direction). My natural curiosity on things also helped. Even when I first joined ATS, I was loath to come out of the gate swinging and posting on every post I could see. I spent many of my early months just reading and posting here or there on things that I may have already knew about.

I hear you man, and good for you. You know, sometimes I've often pondered why some people wake up to certain things and some people don't. It's hard to know, and varying things might trigger it.

Like yourself, I wasn't a popular kid when I was young. I was incredibly shy and only had a couple close friends until probably late high school, at which point I became more outgoing. As a result I kinda kept to myself for much of my childhood but READ A LOT. Maybe also because I wasn't swept up in the normal crowds I already began to question things a bit.

I also just read posts on ATS for a while before I joined and then even then I didn't post a lot at first.

Here's another tactic that's is very effective and used not only in abusive personal relationships but also on a global scale.

They use the normal reaction to abuse or oppression as proof they person/group are the crazy/out of control ones.

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14


I can't tell if you are agreeing with me or being sarcastic, lol.

A little bit of both.

I hope that's alright.

a reply to: Krazysh0t
There are often more than 2 sides to an argument and seldom is middle ground the best or even a good solution.

But I agree, at least we have the option of finding different sources of information and news. The internet is flooded with bad and misleading information and most are unaware of the common tactics used to sell BS.

originally posted by: CretumOrbis

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14


I can't tell if you are agreeing with me or being sarcastic, lol.

A little bit of both.

I hope that's alright.

It's alright.

However, check my original message about why those talking points aren't supported by evidence. That's why I brought it up as a sixth form of "keeping down the underdog."

originally posted by: Daughter2
Here's another tactic that's is very effective and used not only in abusive personal relationships but also on a global scale.

They use the normal reaction to abuse or oppression as proof they person/group are the crazy/out of control ones.

Very true.

"Wait, you don't like the fact that the West and USSR have chopped up the Middle East or caused Afghanistan to become a wasteland. Wait, what, your family was killed by indiscriminate bombing during a war of questionable legality? Why, you hate our freedoms and are terrorists!"

a reply to: Krazysh0t

You posted what I am thinking

S andF

I see one tactic as the deliberate 'silence' especially from the tv news about things being done by protestors especially in the UK. You have to use social media to find out what's going on or RT etc.

I also noticed that Cameron remains silence on certain subjects - the referendum for being in the EU is his current little game against the people.

originally posted by: Daughter2
Here's another tactic that's is very effective and used not only in abusive personal relationships but also on a global scale.

They use the normal reaction to abuse or oppression as proof they person/group are the crazy/out of control ones.

Yes the old provoke to defend, or to anger and then call them reactionaries or something.