Why Do Atheists Attack mainly Christians and Muslims but not Jews?

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: liejunkie01

Because they have been educated to only think inside the box. Outside thinking is blasphemous. The box is their faith and if it is wrong then their reality is shattered. Therefore they can't afford to think outside the box.

I'm sorry, you have just painted billions of people with one broad stroke and I'm afraid it was the wrong brush. Perhaps you are showing the limitations of your own little box in which you feel comfortable making such assertations because within your little box it makes sense.

No, I'm pretty spot on. I know it sucks to hear the truth, but that's your problem. Not mine. Christianity has been shown by science to be flawed and most likely not true. Everyone who believes it is believing a fairy tale in lieu of evidence that says it is a flawed and incorrect belief. If that describes billions of people, then so be it. It's a shame that a lie such as Christianity is so pervasively believed, but hey I can't change that and it is their decision to do so. Unfortunately, it starts with brainwashing and being told that Christianity is true. It's hard to shake such beliefs when you've been told they are true your whole life.

That's the trouble with some atheists, so passionate in arguing about something they profess to not believe in. You also seem to believe that all who follow a faith must by definition follow a very strictly defined set of rules - not so, perhaps in your experience, but that's your experience.
My own rule is do unto others as you would have done to you. Not that difficult is it? To me, that is the core of Christian belief. You may have a different opinion but as far as I'm concerned, that's your opinion although why as an atheist you would even have one says more about you than it does me.

originally posted by: Shadow Herder
As many of you know as you come to sites like this or any forum that discusses christianity and atheism, the topics usually discussed are usually about the credibility of whether or not Jesus existed or how extreme Islam is but no one touches Judaism? I am just curious why.

The one thing that I have noticed is that I have yet to see atheist threads debunking Judaism and the credibility of their beliefs. Its widely accepted that the jewish people mainly from poland were given Palestinian homes and land while displacing Palestinians that have lived because the land called Israel used to be called Palestine in the name of religion. I dont know which passage in the bible states that Palestine belongs to a certain people.

I am Jewish by bloodline, my family name was changed in the 15th century to avoid prosecution. My ancestors were given refuge in another country as long as they would become catholics and change their Jewish name. So as I am a non practicing bloodline jew, I am curious.

I am for all religions and atheists, you have the right to believe what you want as long as it doesn't harm, hurt, displace, exclude, segregate, or cause hate. I don't condone Atheists trying to convert anyone the same as I don't condone religious persons trying to convert atheists.

We are intelligent enough to seek the knowledge ourselves rather than having someone cram it down our throats.

I understand why atheists complain about religion because many laws and public places commonly have a christian theme and if you're muslim or other I can see how you can feel excluded or offended, after all who is to say the Christianity is the only religion or at least the MAIN one.

Many prophets have walked the earth from every race. The main thing that should be accepted is that most if not all religions at its core without the human literal misinterpretations, do teach ancient wisdom of how to live a peaceful life with your fellow brothers and sisters. This is one thing that is beautiful of most religions.

But back to thread question.... If people were to question christianity and Islam which is quite the hot topic right now in the world, why not question all religions. Is discussing Judaism an anti semitic act? Did you know that the Jewish religion does not believe that Jesus was the Messiah?

This world is a messed up place for a rational mind. You rational people know the confusion insanity all of this is, will it ever end? Yes, shortly as planned.

Will people ever accept a one world religion which is on the horizon after a great war?

Do atheists want an end to all religions of just a selected few?

Why arent there many discussions on Judaism?

Why is Atheism vs Christianity vs Islam the usual conflict and not against say Judaism?

Why when people oppose what Israel does it can be considered anti semitic or people will shout " here we go again, blame the jews for everything thread" when the topic is about government actions and not religious. I never understood this stance.

In this world where we should be allowed to question everything. but we are censored on mainstream news and websites. These areas are pushing a certain thought that goes against the intelligent mind yet it is like the world has a drunk behind the wheel laughing us all off a cliff and we are not allowed to mention it, we are forced to shut up and not tell anyone to buckle up or get out.

Why is this world full of such bad people with such poor intentions that they know will lead to blood and misery, they stop people from spreading information that may stop this world going down the path its on?

Hmm. Well first, it's actually mostly the LEFT, which has a higher proportion of non-religious people, that protest Israel's treatment of the Palestinians.

It is mostly the Christians, especially right wingers, who do NOT criticize the Israelis. Just take one look at the Republican Party and it is inarguable.

I agree with you that it is ridiculous to be called anti-semitic just for criticizing the actions of a military or government. Anybody who says that is either manipulating or is in idiot.

Yes, atheists disagree with Judaism for many of the same reasons they disagree with Christianity and Islam.

However, like Buddhism and HInduism Judaism basically stopped being a proselytizing religion a long time ago. Jews generally are not up in our face about religion. Jews are not generally not claiming to inject their religion into their political campaigns. Jews on average are not trying to get school boards to change the curriculum for all children to reflect their religion. Jews are usually not the ones trying to put religious monuments on public property.

Similarly, there are many Muslims across the world trying to do similar things, and also use Islam as an excuse for violence.

^THIS, is why Christians and Muslims are more derided by agnostics, atheists, or mystics.

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: liejunkie01

Because they have been educated to only think inside the box. Outside thinking is blasphemous. The box is their faith and if it is wrong then their reality is shattered. Therefore they can't afford to think outside the box.

I'm sorry, you have just painted billions of people with one broad stroke and I'm afraid it was the wrong brush. Perhaps you are showing the limitations of your own little box in which you feel comfortable making such assertations because within your little box it makes sense.

No, I'm pretty spot on. I know it sucks to hear the truth, but that's your problem. Not mine. Christianity has been shown by science to be flawed and most likely not true. Everyone who believes it is believing a fairy tale in lieu of evidence that says it is a flawed and incorrect belief. If that describes billions of people, then so be it. It's a shame that a lie such as Christianity is so pervasively believed, but hey I can't change that and it is their decision to do so. Unfortunately, it starts with brainwashing and being told that Christianity is true. It's hard to shake such beliefs when you've been told they are true your whole life.

That's the trouble with some atheists, so passionate in arguing about something they profess to not believe in. You also seem to believe that all who follow a faith must by definition follow a very strictly defined set of rules - not so, perhaps in your experience, but that's your experience.
My own rule is do unto others as you would have done to you. Not that difficult is it? To me, that is the core of Christian belief. You may have a different opinion but as far as I'm concerned, that's your opinion although why as an atheist you would even have one says more about you than it does me.

I am certainly not an atheist. I was raised Christian but like the person you are responding to, do not believe in it anymore theologically. Hell, 6000 year old earth, that we are all condemned and can only be saved through Jesus' sacrifice. The latter is the core of Christianity, and the only real difference between Christianity and most other religions.

I hate to break it to you bub, but treating others consciously (do unto others) is not the core of Christianity nor is that different from countless other religions. Most religious teachers say some variant of that.

originally posted by: uncommitted
That's the trouble with some atheists, so passionate in arguing about something they profess to not believe in. You also seem to believe that all who follow a faith must by definition follow a very strictly defined set of rules - not so, perhaps in your experience, but that's your experience.

When I talk about Christianity, I am referring to the bible. The bible is UNTRUE. Science has shown that to be the case. So if you believe the bible, you are believing mythology regardless of whatever religious dogma you adhere to.

My own rule is do unto others as you would have done to you. Not that difficult is it? To me, that is the core of Christian belief. You may have a different opinion but as far as I'm concerned, that's your opinion although why as an atheist you would even have one says more about you than it does me.

What does this have to do with a discussion about the legitimacy of Christianity? Do unto others is a great philosophical statement, but it isn't necessarily something that is always true. I could enjoy being beat on, so if I enjoy getting into fights, given that statement, that must mean that I'm entitled to fight anyone I want to. See, loophole. Do unto others is more of a guideline than an actual creed to live by.

PS: I'm an agnostic. I certainly believe it is possible for a god to exist, just not the Christian one. Too many scientific certainties would have to be overturned for that to be the case.

originally posted by: ketsuko
The wider forum takes care of that. It's anti-Semitic and anti-Israel in general.

If you didn't get the memo, criticizing Israel's actions regarding the Palestinians is not "anti-semitic," it's called rational political discourse.

Seriously, every single one of you should read the above, meditate on it, and STOP dropping the anti-semitic card. Truly, the world is sick of it. It's obviously fallacious. It's obviously false. It's obviously manipulative.

originally posted by: SuperFrog
I was under impression that Jews, Christians and Muslim believe in the same God?! Isn't criticizing one and finding no evidence of God existence supposed to mean other are at false as well??

There is also little fact that Jews are not recruiting, you can only be born into Judaism, where Christianity and Islam mostly spread through wars or through 'help'... (just few years back one of local Christian organization was found guilty of giving migration papers only to those who would change from Islam to Christianity... then they wonder why some find ministries in Africa not welcomed, even they provide medical and humanitarian help.

From what I know about Torah (first 5 books of bible), is that God is even more vengeful, not easy to sell stuff..

Obviously perhaps there are some uneducated people on ATS (or whoever it is some people on here talk to) but I think it's fairly common knowledge to most reasonably educated people who have an interest in such things that the Abrahemic God is the same for the three Abrahemic faiths - the clue's there in the name. I wasn't aware that was the crux of any disagreement, but then again I can only speak about people who aren't fundamentalist.

Threads like these seem to go on and on because it seems some people like to ram their non belief at people for reasons I find hard to understand - I don't believe One Direction or Justin Bieber should be considered talented, but I won't go on a forum of their fans to tell them they shouldn't believe so either.

originally posted by: uncommitted

I don't believe One Direction or Justin Bieber should be considered talented, but I won't go on a forum of their fans to tell them they shouldn't believe so either.

Poor example. This isn't a religious forum. Atheists and agnostics aren't invading a religious forum to decry religion. It is an open forum where anyone is entitled to express their opinions. Deal with it.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Shadow Herder

There is a difference between criticizing a country's foreign policy and doing so because you question their right to exist. Plenty of people simply do the one because they question the former, and if you pay attention to the posting, you will see it.

IMO, the people who live there had little say in how their country was formed. That was by mandate of other nations. If we are to criticize how Israel was formed, then we should be criticizing those nations, not the Israelis.

1) You are right that real anti-semites also criticize Israel. They exist. They should be called out.

2) A large proportion of people criticizing Israel, including myself, are NOT criticizing Jews. It is important that you not over generalize and use the anti-semitic claim to dismiss valid critiques of Israel. I have Jewish best friends. I was in a Jewish wedding party. I've had Jewish girlfriends..

3) Although you may have a point that many Israelis didn't have much choice in the history of their nation, they ARE responsible for how Israel acts now. It's just like, I can't help how the US was founded nor that slavery happened. However, I am responsible for supporting either current racism, or evil foreign policy actions like the Iraq War or CIA torture. You are responsible for the present in your country.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted

I don't believe One Direction or Justin Bieber should be considered talented, but I won't go on a forum of their fans to tell them they shouldn't believe so either.

Poor example. This isn't a religious forum. Atheists and agnostics aren't invading a religious forum to decry religion. It is an open forum where anyone is entitled to express their opinions. Deal with it.

My, you have got out of the wrong side of the bed haven't you? It was intended as a humourous analogy - deal with it.

a reply to: uncommitted

I know what you were doing, but like I said it doesn't work. It is a bad analogy.

originally posted by: Shadow Herder

originally posted by: jimmyx
it's really simple, Jewish people accept others based on their character and their actions, not on their religious beliefs.

Just like many Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, and atheists or are you insinuating that all Christians and Muslims dont accept other people because of their religious beliefs?

Most do.

Refer to my other post.

Muslims and Christians are the current militant and proselytizing groups, using religion as justification for legal, military, and conversion actions.

There seem to be much more fundamentalists, which probably is correlated with the above, than the other religions. Muslims and Christians are the most vocal currently in our modern world, and the most assertive that their way is the only way.

The fundamentalists of both religions do NOT accept other religions. Note I am not saying moderates.

Hence, people fight back.

Note that even historians will say that while this was not true in the past, generally speaking Buddhists, Jews, and Hindus have stopped actively proselytizing for the most part.

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: liejunkie01

Because they have been educated to only think inside the box. Outside thinking is blasphemous. The box is their faith and if it is wrong then their reality is shattered. Therefore they can't afford to think outside the box.

I'm sorry, you have just painted billions of people with one broad stroke and I'm afraid it was the wrong brush. Perhaps you are showing the limitations of your own little box in which you feel comfortable making such assertations because within your little box it makes sense.

No, I'm pretty spot on. I know it sucks to hear the truth, but that's your problem. Not mine. Christianity has been shown by science to be flawed and most likely not true. Everyone who believes it is believing a fairy tale in lieu of evidence that says it is a flawed and incorrect belief. If that describes billions of people, then so be it. It's a shame that a lie such as Christianity is so pervasively believed, but hey I can't change that and it is their decision to do so. Unfortunately, it starts with brainwashing and being told that Christianity is true. It's hard to shake such beliefs when you've been told they are true your whole life.

That's the trouble with some atheists, so passionate in arguing about something they profess to not believe in. You also seem to believe that all who follow a faith must by definition follow a very strictly defined set of rules - not so, perhaps in your experience, but that's your experience.
My own rule is do unto others as you would have done to you. Not that difficult is it? To me, that is the core of Christian belief. You may have a different opinion but as far as I'm concerned, that's your opinion although why as an atheist you would even have one says more about you than it does me.

I am certainly not an atheist. I was raised Christian but like the person you are responding to, do not believe in it anymore theologically. Hell, 6000 year old earth, that we are all condemned and can only be saved through Jesus' sacrifice. The latter is the core of Christianity, and the only real difference between Christianity and most other religions.

I hate to break it to you bub, but treating others consciously (do unto others) is not the core of Christianity nor is that different from countless other religions. Most religious teachers say some variant of that.

Thank you for your response. Unfortunately though, faith is a personal thing, nobody else gets to dictate the terms - that is my opinion and I'm sticking to it

The whole 6,000 year old thing seems to only have any kind of traction in America as far as I'm aware and even then it's young Earth creationists who seem to believe in it - I'm not quite sure why such a belief has somehow come to represent how anyone who defines themself as a Christian as by default expected to think the same.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: uncommitted

I know what you were doing, but like I said it doesn't work. It is a bad analogy.

Never mind, I obviously can't match your intellect - too far down for me to travel. You really should get out more.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
Christians will get very offended if you try to tell them their god is the same as the Muslim god. I've tried it before. I mean, I agree, they certainly are the same god, but that's why you get threads like this.

It is actually funny if you read Qur'an and point to Jesus, Moses and Abraham being mentioned there. Too bad people of that time did not know about plagiarism.

originally posted by: uncommitted
Obviously perhaps there are some uneducated people on ATS (or whoever it is some people on here talk to) but I think it's fairly common knowledge to most reasonably educated people who have an interest in such things that the Abrahemic God is the same for the three Abrahemic faiths - the clue's there in the name. I wasn't aware that was the crux of any disagreement, but then again I can only speak about people who aren't fundamentalist.

Fundamentalist being key word.

originally posted by: uncommitted
Threads like these seem to go on and on because it seems some people like to ram their non belief at people for reasons I find hard to understand - I don't believe One Direction or Justin Bieber should be considered talented, but I won't go on a forum of their fans to tell them they shouldn't believe so either.

I never would go to Christian, Muslim or Jewish forum and tell them that all they say is fiction made up by man long time ago. But many times here we had someone bashing science, telling urban legends and propagating their belief, and many times its something mind blowing when you hear it, like trying to prove all origin stories are essentially the same event, where everything points otherwise...

As Dr. Tyson once said, you don't see scientist or atheist go door to door and tell you not to believe.

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: uncommitted

I know what you were doing, but like I said it doesn't work. It is a bad analogy.

Never mind, I obviously can't match your intellect - too far down for me to travel. You really should get out more.

All you have to do is admit it was a bad analogy. I'm not the only one who has pointed that out to you now, but if you want to stick to your guns and not admit you were wrong, that's on you. I'd ask you to respond to the post I made earlier that you haven't addressed yet, but if you can't admit when you were wrong, I'm not sure I want a response.

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: liejunkie01

Because they have been educated to only think inside the box. Outside thinking is blasphemous. The box is their faith and if it is wrong then their reality is shattered. Therefore they can't afford to think outside the box.

I'm sorry, you have just painted billions of people with one broad stroke and I'm afraid it was the wrong brush. Perhaps you are showing the limitations of your own little box in which you feel comfortable making such assertations because within your little box it makes sense.

No, I'm pretty spot on. I know it sucks to hear the truth, but that's your problem. Not mine. Christianity has been shown by science to be flawed and most likely not true. Everyone who believes it is believing a fairy tale in lieu of evidence that says it is a flawed and incorrect belief. If that describes billions of people, then so be it. It's a shame that a lie such as Christianity is so pervasively believed, but hey I can't change that and it is their decision to do so. Unfortunately, it starts with brainwashing and being told that Christianity is true. It's hard to shake such beliefs when you've been told they are true your whole life.

That's the trouble with some atheists, so passionate in arguing about something they profess to not believe in. You also seem to believe that all who follow a faith must by definition follow a very strictly defined set of rules - not so, perhaps in your experience, but that's your experience.
My own rule is do unto others as you would have done to you. Not that difficult is it? To me, that is the core of Christian belief. You may have a different opinion but as far as I'm concerned, that's your opinion although why as an atheist you would even have one says more about you than it does me.

I am certainly not an atheist. I was raised Christian but like the person you are responding to, do not believe in it anymore theologically. Hell, 6000 year old earth, that we are all condemned and can only be saved through Jesus' sacrifice. The latter is the core of Christianity, and the only real difference between Christianity and most other religions.

I hate to break it to you bub, but treating others consciously (do unto others) is not the core of Christianity nor is that different from countless other religions. Most religious teachers say some variant of that.

Thank you for your response. Unfortunately though, faith is a personal thing, nobody else gets to dictate the terms - that is my opinion and I'm sticking to it

The whole 6,000 year old thing seems to only have any kind of traction in America as far as I'm aware and even then it's young Earth creationists who seem to believe in it - I'm not quite sure why such a belief has somehow come to represent how anyone who defines themself as a Christian as by default expected to think the same.

I agree with you that people can and should define faith for themselves. And, I actually prefer people who claim a moderate more spiritual interpretation of Christianity or any other religion. There is nothing wrong with do unto others.

The 6000 year old creationism however goes back beyond the US. It may be primarily supported now days in the US, but it wasn't always so.

To be honest, most critiques of organized religion are not aimed at moderates or spiritual people within their ranks. The critiques are aimed (rightfully) at the fundamentalists and extremists, who not only have literal interpretations of every word in ancient texts but claim that we should follow their interpretations too, that laws should be based on them, that wars can be justified based on them, etc. Do you not agree that that small subset should be criticized, even by others of their faith?

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted
That's the trouble with some atheists, so passionate in arguing about something they profess to not believe in. You also seem to believe that all who follow a faith must by definition follow a very strictly defined set of rules - not so, perhaps in your experience, but that's your experience.

When I talk about Christianity, I am referring to the bible. The bible is UNTRUE. Science has shown that to be the case. So if you believe the bible, you are believing mythology regardless of whatever religious dogma you adhere to.

My own rule is do unto others as you would have done to you. Not that difficult is it? To me, that is the core of Christian belief. You may have a different opinion but as far as I'm concerned, that's your opinion although why as an atheist you would even have one says more about you than it does me.

What does this have to do with a discussion about the legitimacy of Christianity? Do unto others is a great philosophical statement, but it isn't necessarily something that is always true. I could enjoy being beat on, so if I enjoy getting into fights, given that statement, that must mean that I'm entitled to fight anyone I want to. See, loophole. Do unto others is more of a guideline than an actual creed to live by.

PS: I'm an agnostic. I certainly believe it is possible for a god to exist, just not the Christian one. Too many scientific certainties would have to be overturned for that to be the case.

You are the first person I have seen say what I think about the "do unto others as you would have them do unto you" mantra. I also began to question this rule as a hard and fast teaching.

As you noted, it can be very problematic if taken too far. There are a lot of ignorant people who could project hypothetical situations and end up harming others. For example, if someone would want to be put out of their misery if they were old, can they then "do unto others" and put elderly people out of their misery?

If a man or woman believes in no whining and that people should just stuff it, can they then shut others down when they are conveying real concerns or feelings, because they would allow others to do so to them if they were "whining."

It goes on and on.

All this rule actually seems to accomplish in its literal sense is ostensibly limiting hypocrisy, not actual good action.

originally posted by: Shadow Herder

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Shadow Herder

'converting operatives' ie mormons or jehovas witness. people who arent happy with just having god, but need everyone else to know about it too. basically the loudest person will attract the most staunch critic.

Last I checked mormons or Jehovah don't force you to convert and certainly not by use of force or violence. You simple have to do TWO things, say no, close the door.

If you are converted between those 2 milliseconds you obviousness ave a very very weak mind

Who is converting by force or violence? I dont know anyone who has been threatened to conver to any religion. Need to be a little more elaborate.

I know plenty of people who are forced through coercion and force to "be" christians and muslims. I don't know many jewish folks, but i have heard of several who go through the same things in their families and communities.

If they do not conform, they are scolded, threatened, and if they hold out long enough they are beaten. There are plenty of stories like this. People get pushed out of their families all the time for not toeing the line.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: uncommitted

I know what you were doing, but like I said it doesn't work. It is a bad analogy.

Never mind, I obviously can't match your intellect - too far down for me to travel. You really should get out more.

All you have to do is admit it was a bad analogy. I'm not the only one who has pointed that out to you now, but if you want to stick to your guns and not admit you were wrong, that's on you. I'd ask you to respond to the post I made earlier that you haven't addressed yet, but if you can't admit when you were wrong, I'm not sure I want a response.

Ok, is that where you said the Bible is 'wrong'? Depends on how you define both the Bible and also how you define wrong.

Do I personally think it's the direct word of God? No.

Do I think all the events in it are accurate depictions and that all actually happened? Personally no, but that's my opinion.

Do I think it represents a set of rules, morals, laws that reflect (talking mainly Old Testament here) what was contemporary Jewish life at the time? In my understanding yes, but that doesn't mean they all have relevance to 21st century life and shouldn't all define how we behave and judge others. I have no particular opinion on homosexuality for example, but at the time the push was for more children/converts to both the faith and the community which I think is why all of the three faiths the OT are based on have an issue with it - times change, some people don't.

Do I believe that God created everything? You've got me there. I'm open, but do not cling to the possibility of a divine creator which I choose to think of as God. Do I think this will ever be proved? No idea

Do I think all of the miracles attributed to the man known as Jesus Christ (assuming such a person existed) took place in the way depicted in the New Testament? Personally I'd like to think so but am more than open to them being analogies for events that took place which then received some spin treatment. I read a really interesting article somewhere that put forward that the turning of water into wine at the marriage feast of Cana was actually Christ ensuring that a lower caste should be allowed to drink wine when usually they were only provided water. If that is the case then it's hardly a trick that would get you your own TV show these days, but at the time would be considered revolutionary.

Do I think Christ existed? I'd like to think so, but at this point in time it has yet to be historically confirmed. The message to me is just as important.

Do I think he was born of a virgin and was resurrected? See above, although for obvious reasons it's something your unlikely to see evidence of anytime yet (apart from of course if it all becomes clear once you pass over to the other side).

Do I reject other faiths? With the exception of Scientology and Jesus Christ and the latter day Saints (nothing against Mormons, I just don't accept the basis of that particular subset and I appreciate that may be my problem), no.

That's off the cuff and I reserve the right to change all of the opinions above whenever I want. As you may have gathered I'm probably veering more to agnosticism myself, but I don't feel the need to question others beliefs unless they are based on hate.

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: liejunkie01

Because they have been educated to only think inside the box. Outside thinking is blasphemous. The box is their faith and if it is wrong then their reality is shattered. Therefore they can't afford to think outside the box.

I'm sorry, you have just painted billions of people with one broad stroke and I'm afraid it was the wrong brush. Perhaps you are showing the limitations of your own little box in which you feel comfortable making such assertations because within your little box it makes sense.

No, I'm pretty spot on. I know it sucks to hear the truth, but that's your problem. Not mine. Christianity has been shown by science to be flawed and most likely not true. Everyone who believes it is believing a fairy tale in lieu of evidence that says it is a flawed and incorrect belief. If that describes billions of people, then so be it. It's a shame that a lie such as Christianity is so pervasively believed, but hey I can't change that and it is their decision to do so. Unfortunately, it starts with brainwashing and being told that Christianity is true. It's hard to shake such beliefs when you've been told they are true your whole life.

That's the trouble with some atheists, so passionate in arguing about something they profess to not believe in. You also seem to believe that all who follow a faith must by definition follow a very strictly defined set of rules - not so, perhaps in your experience, but that's your experience.
My own rule is do unto others as you would have done to you. Not that difficult is it? To me, that is the core of Christian belief. You may have a different opinion but as far as I'm concerned, that's your opinion although why as an atheist you would even have one says more about you than it does me.

I am certainly not an atheist. I was raised Christian but like the person you are responding to, do not believe in it anymore theologically. Hell, 6000 year old earth, that we are all condemned and can only be saved through Jesus' sacrifice. The latter is the core of Christianity, and the only real difference between Christianity and most other religions.

I hate to break it to you bub, but treating others consciously (do unto others) is not the core of Christianity nor is that different from countless other religions. Most religious teachers say some variant of that.

Thank you for your response. Unfortunately though, faith is a personal thing, nobody else gets to dictate the terms - that is my opinion and I'm sticking to it

The whole 6,000 year old thing seems to only have any kind of traction in America as far as I'm aware and even then it's young Earth creationists who seem to believe in it - I'm not quite sure why such a belief has somehow come to represent how anyone who defines themself as a Christian as by default expected to think the same.

I agree with you that people can and should define faith for themselves. And, I actually prefer people who claim a moderate more spiritual interpretation of Christianity or any other religion. There is nothing wrong with do unto others.

The 6000 year old creationism however goes back beyond the US. It may be primarily supported now days in the US, but it wasn't always so.

To be honest, most critiques of organized religion are not aimed at moderates or spiritual people within their ranks. The critiques are aimed (rightfully) at the fundamentalists and extremists, who not only have literal interpretations of every word in ancient texts but claim that we should follow their interpretations too, that laws should be based on them, that wars can be justified based on them, etc. Do you not agree that that small subset should be criticized, even by others of their faith?

A very thoughtful post which I have starred. You're right, actually the 6,000 years thing actually was initially proposed by an amatuer geologist in England in ( I think off the top of my head) the 17th century, but it wasn't a religious based assumption, it was based on how his assumption of the rock strata where he chose to dig, and what it meant for the length of time each would take to form. I'm not aware any mainstream religion ever accepted or possibly even acknowledged it. Truth is though, it was fairly much laughed away at the time.

As to your last paragraph, any group which shows intolerance at a level that could be considered threatening or worse to any other group of people because they are in some way different to themselves deserves all the criticism they get IMHO.