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Rapidly Warming Oceans Set to Release Heat Into the Atmosphere
page: 4share:
The great thing about the internet and countless posts about doomsday predictions is that Time proves them wrong or gives them credibility.
Lets see... they told us that this year past the North Pole would be Ice free, and that Canada would be Polar Bear Free and had magnificent warm tropical beaches, that is not the case, in fact the ice extent of the poles is att record surface NORTH AND SOUTH, and then some months ago another Global Warming NAZI told us the south pole had record Ice because the planet was warmer !!! so if the Planet got cool, then the ice would melt???
The point here is that climate is a machine controlled by THOUSANDS of variables and its IMPOSIBLE to predict in the way they are trying to sell AGW to US, the only thing predictable is TRENDS, and SADLY the trend for the next 30 years is that it will get VERY VERY COLD, so cry wolf, cut your veins, and put a shrine to Al Gore, in a mere 5 years it will be IMPOSIBLE to hide the fact of the downward trend, in fact is now quite factual that temperatures have gone down but media and crazies still see us the Al Gore Evangelism.
The people predicting the AGW cannot calculate the effect of volcanism underwater an oceans temps and that is just for staters, also they can't calculate the exact ratio of albedo by water vs clouds, because it changes all the time and there is no number crunching computer to account for the hole planet... just with those 2 variables any kind of degree by degree prediction is simply futile....
Argue all you can in some years we will be laughing at this doomsday scenarios just as I laugh everytime I see Al Gore recite his mantras about no ice and rising ocean levels... Mali and the maldives should be underwater by now!
in the mean time have fun in the snow...
Lets see... they told us that this year past the North Pole would be Ice free, and that Canada would be Polar Bear Free and had magnificent warm tropical beaches, that is not the case, in fact the ice extent of the poles is att record surface NORTH AND SOUTH, and then some months ago another Global Warming NAZI told us the south pole had record Ice because the planet was warmer !!! so if the Planet got cool, then the ice would melt???
The point here is that climate is a machine controlled by THOUSANDS of variables and its IMPOSIBLE to predict in the way they are trying to sell AGW to US, the only thing predictable is TRENDS, and SADLY the trend for the next 30 years is that it will get VERY VERY COLD, so cry wolf, cut your veins, and put a shrine to Al Gore, in a mere 5 years it will be IMPOSIBLE to hide the fact of the downward trend, in fact is now quite factual that temperatures have gone down but media and crazies still see us the Al Gore Evangelism.
The people predicting the AGW cannot calculate the effect of volcanism underwater an oceans temps and that is just for staters, also they can't calculate the exact ratio of albedo by water vs clouds, because it changes all the time and there is no number crunching computer to account for the hole planet... just with those 2 variables any kind of degree by degree prediction is simply futile....
Argue all you can in some years we will be laughing at this doomsday scenarios just as I laugh everytime I see Al Gore recite his mantras about no ice and rising ocean levels... Mali and the maldives should be underwater by now!
in the mean time have fun in the snow...
a reply to: CaticusMaximus
I could do the same thing, and lump you into the group I create...
That side will say...
1) We are in such dire straits you don't understand how dangerous your attitude is.
2) Everyone who doesn't agree to immediately give all their money to the govt to NOT fix this problem doesn't care about the environment.
3) Anyone who doesn't believe the IPCC is an oil shill who doesn't care about the planet or our futures...
blah blah blah...
see how easy that is.
Jaden
I could do the same thing, and lump you into the group I create...
That side will say...
1) We are in such dire straits you don't understand how dangerous your attitude is.
2) Everyone who doesn't agree to immediately give all their money to the govt to NOT fix this problem doesn't care about the environment.
3) Anyone who doesn't believe the IPCC is an oil shill who doesn't care about the planet or our futures...
blah blah blah...
see how easy that is.
Jaden
a reply to: Greven
Funny story also...
Where in the atmosphere does CO2 accumulate and what is the temperature there? What is the temperature in the layers of the atmosphere below that?
What percentage of added CO2 remains in the lower atmosphere where it can have more than a negligible affect on surface temps?
Are these facts EVER cited or used in computer models used by AGW doom pornographers????
Jaden
Funny story also...
Where in the atmosphere does CO2 accumulate and what is the temperature there? What is the temperature in the layers of the atmosphere below that?
What percentage of added CO2 remains in the lower atmosphere where it can have more than a negligible affect on surface temps?
Are these facts EVER cited or used in computer models used by AGW doom pornographers????
Jaden
Ice appeared two weeks early on the great lakes, the average mean global temperature has not changed for the last 16 years,
sea ice is at its most since 1988, as far as I know heat always rises, so just how do the oceans absorb heat?
sea ice is at its most since 1988, as far as I know heat always rises, so just how do the oceans absorb heat?
As the Ocean is warming you get more rain and snow.
The cloud cover increases.
Where i live in calif we need a lot more rain and snow.
I question if Ocean warming is really bad.
The cloud cover increases.
Where i live in calif we need a lot more rain and snow.
I question if Ocean warming is really bad.
originally posted by: Bilk22
a reply to: lostbook
How come it's always "more than they knew" with these type of articles? The only thing that says to me is they really know nothing as fact.
Umm, because that's how science works?
Unlike faith, its based on the current set of known data - the best set of facts available that can be confirmed. When more information is found or contradictory data is found, they know more and can give a better picture. No one knows or can claim with 100% certainty the finality of the data, but I can assure you that we are well beyond the "whoops, we were totally wrong, nothing bad will happen" point.
originally posted by: Rezlooper
originally posted by: Eunuchorn
a reply to: GoShredAK
I live in Southern California & it's been rather cold & windy. I tell everyone we should stop complaining though, the rest of the world is blizzarding.
The rest of the world is not blizzarding. GoShredAK just posted above how he hasn't even seen snow yet and he lives in Alaska!
Yep it's true, this has been the most unique winter I've seen in my 20 years of living in this area of the beautiful state.
It has attempted to snow maybe three times but then it melts immediately the next day, then maybe it'll rain for a bit, then gets really warm, then back down to the twenties again! We have yet to reach sub-zero temps yet for over an entire year now. I am used to having a few below zero days by now.
I'm not saying there is a conspiracy or anything but it's obvious we're going through some climatic abnormalities here on the Kenai peninsula of Alaska, and the rest of the world sounds pretty wacky too.
edit on 3-1-2015 by GoShredAK because: Spelling error
a reply to: CaticusMaximus
To me, a prerequisite for assessing any problem of such magnitude, is to Follow The Money. If Global Warming, AKA Climate Change, will be so devastating, why are not investors moving away from coastlines? The values of coastal property should be plummeting. I understand that according to Climate Change models, there should be a long term grave risk of flooding and extreme destructive weather. All over the world, investors should be leaving coastlines, as well as an exodus of people that believe the above. Also, with other movements believing in such impending disasters, they have Survivalist movements. As a Survivalist myself, I have never known anyone that was Prepping for disastrous Climate Change scenarios. Essentially, so many people believe in the impending disasters Climate Change promises, but why is there so little the believers are personally doing about it to survive? Even as above, the official data says it is irreversible anyways, so where is the actual panic? Have any of these scientists relocated to safer places because of it? If the effects of it are so slow, but coming for sure, at what point will believers seriously organize themselves to create survivalist movements and safe places to run away to? I mean, if someone is completely certain a tornado is approaching, they scream to everyone and then run away or take cover, and if no one else cares, you see them take action. If someone fears tornadoes, the build a tornado shelter. People who seriously fear Nuclear War made Fallout Shelters. Anyone ever heard of a Climate Change Shelter? So far, I cannot believe in the threat of Climate Change, whether man made or natural, until believers actually and personally become Survivalists because of it. So someone please help me to understand. Where is the Climate Change Survivalist movement?
To me, a prerequisite for assessing any problem of such magnitude, is to Follow The Money. If Global Warming, AKA Climate Change, will be so devastating, why are not investors moving away from coastlines? The values of coastal property should be plummeting. I understand that according to Climate Change models, there should be a long term grave risk of flooding and extreme destructive weather. All over the world, investors should be leaving coastlines, as well as an exodus of people that believe the above. Also, with other movements believing in such impending disasters, they have Survivalist movements. As a Survivalist myself, I have never known anyone that was Prepping for disastrous Climate Change scenarios. Essentially, so many people believe in the impending disasters Climate Change promises, but why is there so little the believers are personally doing about it to survive? Even as above, the official data says it is irreversible anyways, so where is the actual panic? Have any of these scientists relocated to safer places because of it? If the effects of it are so slow, but coming for sure, at what point will believers seriously organize themselves to create survivalist movements and safe places to run away to? I mean, if someone is completely certain a tornado is approaching, they scream to everyone and then run away or take cover, and if no one else cares, you see them take action. If someone fears tornadoes, the build a tornado shelter. People who seriously fear Nuclear War made Fallout Shelters. Anyone ever heard of a Climate Change Shelter? So far, I cannot believe in the threat of Climate Change, whether man made or natural, until believers actually and personally become Survivalists because of it. So someone please help me to understand. Where is the Climate Change Survivalist movement?
a reply to: Starling
Irreversibly Violent Weather ?
If it is around 50 times more intense than now maybe that would apply, see nothing new really at all.
I am still waiting for the oceans to rise, now I have to worry about what's INSIDE to rise, I see.
It is too bad the experts whom we have to rely on for accurate data are using the same flawed systems and models that everyone complains about is causing all kinds of problems.
Like looking to the church for answers on how they change their mind on how to take things into "context".
I have no doubt that things change, but until we can actually know what and how, it really does not make sense for anyone to listen to it, and even less to take actions based upon things that are constantly changing.
Irreversibly Violent Weather ?
If it is around 50 times more intense than now maybe that would apply, see nothing new really at all.
I am still waiting for the oceans to rise, now I have to worry about what's INSIDE to rise, I see.
It is too bad the experts whom we have to rely on for accurate data are using the same flawed systems and models that everyone complains about is causing all kinds of problems.
Like looking to the church for answers on how they change their mind on how to take things into "context".
I have no doubt that things change, but until we can actually know what and how, it really does not make sense for anyone to listen to it, and even less to take actions based upon things that are constantly changing.
The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.
I get so tired of hearing “man is so insignificant that we can't harm the planet”. Never has there been such a bunch of BS that has been allowed to propagate through the internet. Honestly its human wishful thinking and denial.
Scientific fact: Every time we launch a rocket, we change the rotation of the planet a minute fraction.
Scientific fact: If we ever had a nuclear war, it would result in a world wide nuclear winter.
Scientific fact: Much of the ocean is dead from our direct interference.
Scientific fact: When we build a city with a lot of concrete it changes the weather pattern and temperature of the area.
Scientific fact: Contrails artificially change the climate by holding heat at night and reflecting sun in the day.
Scientific fact: The Three Gorges Dam effected not only the local climate, but caused earthquakes, etc.
I can go on all day like this...
You bet your ass we can not only effect the planet, but we have, and no amount of denial is going to change that fact.
Now most of us think, “hey, the little bit I do isn't going to effect anything”, but the problem is that now there are 10 billion people who also think that way. While what you do might only be a trillionth of a fraction of the problem, when you multiply that by 10 billion other people, and over 100 years, then take into account that it only requires a very small fraction of change to have a massive effect, it all adds up rapidly.
The thing I hate the worst is using the fact that its colder in an area to prove that this isn't happening, when in fact, that's a symptom that was clearly explained even by Al Gore. Certain areas will get colder winters because the GULF STREAM IS BREAKING DOWN DUE TO FRESH WATER INFUSION... That is also why the tremendous fluctuations we have now in Arctic and Antarctic sea ice. Water temperature controls the growth of sea ice, and the salinity of the water (fresh water intrusion from melted ice) controls the Gulf Stream. The Gulf Stream's heat is what keeps areas along the eastern US and Western Europe from having extremely cold winters. If your winters are getting colder, look at what the Gulf Stream is doing, not what the sky is doing.
As a diver here is Florida, I can tell you first hand that the oceans are dying, they have been dying for a decade, and its obvious to anyone that spends time underwater. Ocean acidification, O2 dead zones, increased levels of red tide, the movement of aquatic life, the increasing range of certain species of squid such as the Humboldt's; these are all signs that the ocean is dying, and if it does so do we.
I find it telling that three of the people laughing and joking about this topic on the first page all list their locations as in Michigan and Toledo. Being from Michigan, and having working for the Big Three myself, I can't imagine why folks that are in an area saturated by the Coal, Steel, and Auto Industry would want you to believe that this isn't happening?
As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.
edit on 1/3/2015 by defcon5 because: (no reason given)
This is worrisome.
Forget the Gore bashing and climate denying for a moment and consider the effects that this gets out of control.
Cyclones and hurricanes would develop quicker, occur more often, and would be greater in intensity. The winds whipped up could damage crops and infrastructure for hundreds of miles before these storms oven hit, and the storm surges that follow would reap as much damage as a small tsunami would.
And then there's the detrimental effects it could have on the oceans ecosystems-which are already delicate enough and if those ecosystems are disturbed then a lack of food could follow-seafood is a staple diet in many nations. Those are just a few scenarios and there could be unforeseen side effects that we are not yet aware of.
to quote CaticusMaximus' brilliant post
All efforts to reduce carbon emissions and encourage renewable energy will only soften the blow, and when that blow is coming from a sledgehammer it seems pointless. We cannot combat the combined forces of the Sun, the Earth, and ourselves.
Forget the Gore bashing and climate denying for a moment and consider the effects that this gets out of control.
Cyclones and hurricanes would develop quicker, occur more often, and would be greater in intensity. The winds whipped up could damage crops and infrastructure for hundreds of miles before these storms oven hit, and the storm surges that follow would reap as much damage as a small tsunami would.
And then there's the detrimental effects it could have on the oceans ecosystems-which are already delicate enough and if those ecosystems are disturbed then a lack of food could follow-seafood is a staple diet in many nations. Those are just a few scenarios and there could be unforeseen side effects that we are not yet aware of.
to quote CaticusMaximus' brilliant post
The situation is not reversible at this point though. So many positive feedbacks have been triggered, that its pretty much over. Even with a global concerted effort, with a 100% immediate reduction to all emissions, its still too late
All efforts to reduce carbon emissions and encourage renewable energy will only soften the blow, and when that blow is coming from a sledgehammer it seems pointless. We cannot combat the combined forces of the Sun, the Earth, and ourselves.
a reply to: Thecakeisalie
According to a report in climate depot, 2014 was a really low year for cyclones and hurricanes, I don't know if that is a trend, or just a blip, I presume I will have to wait and see.
According to a report in climate depot, 2014 was a really low year for cyclones and hurricanes, I don't know if that is a trend, or just a blip, I presume I will have to wait and see.
Well, the thing is, we don't have enough data from not even close to a long enough stretch of time to determine what is and what is not normal for
our climate.
a reply to: pikestaff
I think they were flown in to help sell the arguments.
Funny how those that believe in GW want those that don't believe in it to listen up! ?
Why don't they just fix it? And maybe try not to bother us that don't believe while doing it?
Oh, that's right, there's nothing to fix. So why keep bothering people? I really am asking these questions. I am told all the time that we can't fix it, it's too late. So stop worrying and have a beer, maybe?
Or go in your room and doom porn all you want, we don't care!
I think they were flown in to help sell the arguments.
Funny how those that believe in GW want those that don't believe in it to listen up! ?
Why don't they just fix it? And maybe try not to bother us that don't believe while doing it?
Oh, that's right, there's nothing to fix. So why keep bothering people? I really am asking these questions. I am told all the time that we can't fix it, it's too late. So stop worrying and have a beer, maybe?
Or go in your room and doom porn all you want, we don't care!
Double post
La la la
La la la
edit on 3/1/15 by JoeSignal because: Double Post
a reply to: defcon5
Thank you for your viewpoint that is very.......on point! Some people can't see outside of their own personal bubble(s) and realize what's happening with the climate. Globally, this is officially the warmest year on record since weather records have been kept, but some still deny it.
Thank you for your viewpoint that is very.......on point! Some people can't see outside of their own personal bubble(s) and realize what's happening with the climate. Globally, this is officially the warmest year on record since weather records have been kept, but some still deny it.
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