Family is dead in America, greed and lust for power have destroyed it..

I just love how the feminists are always blamed!
there was a time when dads could legally sell or pimp their daughters for a bottle of wiskey!
women could be legally beaten by their husbands for whatever reason.
and when the man died the wife lost everything and was a ward of the state or dependent on her children.
some women always had to work to earn the money while their husbands sat "at the gates of the cities" or whatever the common meeting place was in their town and chatted about whatever happened to be the hot topic of the day!
buying a person on the auction block was common and acceptable.

I don't agree entirely the way system is set up now. I believe that it favors women too much but I also believe that this is because the powers that were at the time (mostly male dominated if not entirely) just didn't want to share the power with the women! It was preferable to just offer the women another lord if her husband wasn't acceptable to her. So instead of creating an economy where she could have an equal footing they created a welfare system and made the gov't her new lord!

They have found it very profitable to throw a ton of not too healthy chemicals into our air our food and our water as well as just about every product sold in stores!
They have a large percentage of the population diagnosed with some kind of mental illness an on drugs that alters the chemical processes of the brain.
They have a social welfare system that leaves many couples with no choice but to separate so that the mom and kids can have what they need!!
They have places so little value on many of the workers they might as well be telling them to go off and die! They certainly can't support themselves of their kids on what they are making!
And they are spending most of the money and resources destroying other countries and killing their citizens than they are creating a better place here!!

And yet.....
It's the feminists!!!

umm what's the alternative??
we women go back to not having a voice and just doing whatever the men decide should be done???
Give up our own desires and sacrifice our spirits just so our men can be happy?
If that is the price then our society isn't worth saving!

originally posted by: onequestion
To often I find myself being stabbed in the back by my own family, watching people around me get stabbed in the back. People are to busy pursuing their own goals and idea for success they are to busy lusting for power.

We've lost our way in America. No longer do we have a moral compass, we've lost what it means to take care of each other and our community and we have our blinders on full force.

It's happening now and the future is no bright for our children.

Parents should always be on guard for the development of unhealthy competition and jealousy between siblings.

Instead we often see parents promoting it, possibly without knowing and with knowing, or allowing it to go on due to stupidity, laziness or blindness do to favoritism. The results spill out into society.

a reply to: ArchPlayer
Really? Funny, how the majority of the people working minimum wage jobs in the country happen to be White people, at a rate of about 58%. That would mean that the majority of the working poor happens to be Caucasian.

So yes, you are born into knee deep poverty, but it is the choices you make that determines if you stay there or not, if you are able to raise yourself up, taking opportunity or not to get ahead in life. The choices that you make. That is life, your parents are not responsible for that, the individual is.

And how is personal responsibility limited to the environment that one lives in, when the environment does not control you, but you control yourself? Are you saying that the environment controls you, that you have no say in how you act or live, or the choices that you make?

Money does not equal quality of life. A person can live effectively without TV or computer. A person does not need that brand new item, when second hand can do just as well, until you can afford the new item. It may take a while, and one does have to scrimp and save, making sure that they save and take the time to weigh the options, but they can do it.

Care to guess who gets the highest tax basis in this country? I know cause I lived it, and believe me it was not pleasant or nice, but I paid them. If I was out selling drugs, yes, then the reality is that I would go to jail. But then again no one forces a person to go out and sell drugs, it is an easy way out.

And you brought up another point, about people not wanting to do hard work. Or meaningless labor. Time and time again, I have watched people I know refuse to flip a burger or scrub a toilet cause they think it is beneath them, yet fail to understand that while it may not be glorious, it is honest work, and they can use it as a ladder to take a step up to the next rung to get to someplace better.

People are not being forced to eat that hamburger, that is a misconception. Are there no grocery stores in the inner cities, that sell food? Or is it cause it is hard to go to the grocery store, pick up the items, get on the bus, travel back home and actually prepare a meal, that will feed a family of 4? Is it cause people don’t want to eat left overs, or do the dishes? Is clipping coupons a thing of the past? Where taking advantages of sales and purchasing items so bad?

Growing up I had to eat a lot of baloney, I lived the working poor. And we never took charity, cause my parents found it revolting and abhorrent. So yes I did not get what I wanted, but I grew up, knowing the difference between right and wrong, not breaking the law. While all of my school mates were out driving cars, I was still taking a bus or having to walk everywhere.
And after being in school for 12 years, I do recall that reading was a fundamental subject, and can read a label. And anyone who was around in the 1970’s on, should know that smoking can and will lead to cancer. Yet it seems like children, still manage to get ahold of tobacco products and will end up on such, even though there are warnings everywhere. Does no one read anymore or pay attention to what the experts are saying?

Hate to break it to you, don’t you watch TV, the days of getting pregnant early is no longer an excuse for women. They choose to have unprotected sex, and then complain when they guy ditches them, or seem to be hopping from bed to bed, instead of taking care of the children that they do have. Seems like you can’t turn on a TV show like Maury or any talk show without it being about who is the daddy of my child, where it is clear that the woman is just as guilty and to blame for that child as the men she slept with.

And would say it is not just TV, but also the families that lead to the children committing crimes. After all if you give a child everything that child wants who is to blame for that? No one said that a child should be given everything he or she wants, but should be made to work hard to earn that new toy or gift. I have seen that too in many families where the children are spoiled rotten.

originally posted by: sdcigarpig
a reply to: ArchPlayer
Really? Funny, how the majority of the people working minimum wage jobs in the country happen to be White people, at a rate of about 58%. That would mean that the majority of the working poor happens to be Caucasian.

So yes, you are born into knee deep poverty, but it is the choices you make that determines if you stay there or not, if you are able to raise yourself up, taking opportunity or not to get ahead in life. The choices that you make. That is life, your parents are not responsible for that, the individual is.

And how is personal responsibility limited to the environment that one lives in, when the environment does not control you, but you control yourself? Are you saying that the environment controls you, that you have no say in how you act or live, or the choices that you make?

And would say it is not just TV, but also the families that lead to the children committing crimes. After all if you give a child everything that child wants who is to blame for that? No one said that a child should be given everything he or she wants, but should be made to work hard to earn that new toy or gift. I have seen that too in many families where the children are spoiled rotten.

On your first point.....its good that we still have a culture and economy that can support the idea of bootstrapping your way out. It really is. There are a lot of places on earth where when you are down that s where you will stay. There is no golden ring to strive for as we know it.

On your second point I would offer my observation from life that most of your criminals and thieves do not come from families that have spoiled them rotten with toys and gifts.

originally posted by: ArchPlayer
a reply to: olaru12

I wouldn't call this a hostile snarky commentary. The ATS family tends to be passionate about certain subjects and its hard to show you have no animosity behind a keyboard.

Actually my comment was an illustration of the family dynamic that is taking place in this very thread. Rude comments, blame game, animosity and eventually resentments. There are people on ATS that it would be best if we never meet in person!!!

This doesn't seem like dinner table conversation? does to me!

On a personal level; one of my smartest moves was to divorce myself from that white trash group of mouth breathers that claims to be my family. My GF and I consider ourselves a unit. No marriage, No kids and certanily no family.

In this technological age the family group/unit is obsolete. That is the reason it's breaking down...greed and power struggles have always been present even in families that aren't dysfunctional.

a reply to: ArchPlayer

Oh, so you don't address the "innate physical strength inferiority" that I originally stated, and provided evidence towards. No, now you're having to add in testosterone shots.

So you're telling me a woman should be able to join the front lines, because she may be able to match a man, when she takes illegal steroids indefinitely, likely accelerating the destruction of her internal organs, but of course all bets are off if the male actually takes steroids, of course he's going to greatly surpass her... but still, it's not as if strength really matters in the military. It's not as if having a weak-link is something your squad would mind, or would put them in harms way.

Your argument is so incredibly ridiculous, that I'm embarrassed to see you still continue on. Give up, you lost long ago, fool!

Mens Raw Bench World Records

Nearly doubled! They're all juiced up in these records. It's ridiculous to have women on the front lines. This isn't sexist, it's science and realizing we're equal, yet different. No shame in putting a woman in a more suitable field. I'm not sure if you're aware, but taking steroids and working out doesn't increase the amount of muscle fibers you have, and the type of fibers you have can only change so much. It's innate, and genetically determined. Your argument was dead from the beginning.

a reply to: sdcigarpig

let's take all those who are working low wage jobs now. Let's imagine that they all did manage to get themselves through college with degrees in fields that are useful in our current economy.
Will there be enough higher paying jobs for all of them???
And if there was who would be doing the jobs that they left behind? And before you answer the next question take a few minutes and think about just what those lower wage jobs are because they are more than just the burger flippers serving up the not so healthy big macs!!
Could we really function in our society without the factory workers the cashiers the bus drivers and all the other occupations who's wages have not kept up with inflation?

How many of our kids now have those degrees and are flipping burgers checking out your groceries printing your banners making that nifty plastic gadget you want to badly? And the only reason why we don't have more underpaid manufacturing workings is because that low wages that the businesses are required to pay here is so much more than what they have to pay the chinese Falun Gong follower that is a prisoner in some slave camp!

In order for people to be personally responsible there must be a way opened for them to be.. Unfortunatly over the past decades those ways have been steadily decreasing for higher profit for big corps.

No TV?? Been there!
No cellphone- wouldn't own one if I could!
No new clothes $100 sneakers - up till my kids started leaving the nest I wore their rejects (a screenprinter doesn't need good clothes for work!)
The recommended three meals a day was decreased to one meal every other day!
Healthcare?? Don't make me laugh!
And our income was considerably more than minimum wage!
I don't know how much is required to live in today's society but considering that welfare was handing out the equivilent of a $10/hr job in the 80's for a family of 4 I am pretty sure that minimum wage isn't gonna support a person no matter how much luxury they give up!
Are all those jobs out there that are paying under that living wage so unimportant to society that we can tell them all to go crawl under a rock and die? Because that is basically what is being said when we tell them that the service they are providing to society isn't worth their cost to live!
And just who is making sure these people live now? It's not the companies that are receiving the direct benefit of their services! It's not the customers of those companies at least not directly.. No all of us taxpayers are being forced to pitch in to make sure that that burger flipper continues to show up for work the next day! Unless they have another helping them out like a husband or wife or parents we are making sure they have a roof over their heads food on their table heck childcare for their kids and decent clothes on their backs.......even if we never ever visit a mcdonalds in our lives! While the CEO of Mc Donalds makes how much money????
While at the other end our fine gov't prints our currency into oblivion and the cost of everything just raises higher and higher to prop up their pet industries and wage their destructive wars..

Sorry just ain't buying the "personal responsibility" anymore. And I think the further down this road we are on we go the more people will come to the same realization. We can't be responsible because the powers that be don't want us to be. just like in colonial times when they conquered the natives they would move them to another location preferable one where their way of life was no longer workable! They want slaves! And slaves are not personally responsible they are responsible for only what the master desires for them to be!

a reply to: ArchPlayer

Sorry, some of your views of why children are the way they are today are twisted.

A lof of your reasoning was pretty far fetched. This one was ridiculous...

The youth are less physically engaged in athletics because playing tag now gets them arrested.

And this one...

Children are obese or overweight from all the GMO and hormones in the food

Compare the weight of kids who are physically active on a daily basis playing sports or doing outside activities with kids who spend most of their time indoors playing video games, watching movies and texting on their cell phone. The difference in weight comes down to the fact that kids who are more active burn off more calories and are seldom overweight.

You can't always use the blame game to justify a poor attitude or lack of morals. I can agree there are some outside influences causing the poor behavior such as role models, the media and technology, but most of it comes from the fact that children today have no consequences for their bad behavior. Parents are afraid to discipline their children today because children have more rights than their parents.

Everyone is in control of their own attitudes. We all know the difference between right or wrong. Making excuses for poor behavior is simply not taking responsibility for your own actions.

I was a bookworm growing up
I wasn't that physical at all really and I was a bean pole!
I believe it's more than just eating habits and lack of physical exercise at play here.
There was only one person I knew then that even came close to matching some of the people at the steakhouse we visit occasionally here where I live and she has a physical reason for her problem!
I go into that steakhouse because my husband likes it.
Personally I am afraid to eat there many of the people are beyond obese!
I go into the wendy's the mcdonalds the burger kings and there isn't anyone there that matches them either!
Of course there is very little actual real meat in those hamburgers!
Whereas the steakhouse couldn't add much in the way of fillers into a steak.
It's all beef my only guess is that it's beef from cows that were fed alot of growth hormones.

originally posted by: onequestion
To often I find myself being stabbed in the back by my own family, watching people around me get stabbed in the back. People are to busy pursuing their own goals and idea for success they are to busy lusting for power.

We've lost our way in America. No longer do we have a moral compass, we've lost what it means to take care of each other and our community and we have our blinders on full force.

It's happening now and the future is no bright for our children.

I think you should edit the title and say YOUR family is dead ... just because your family consists of greedy, evil individuals does not translate to every other family in America. That is just ridiculous. My family is loving, close and connected with each other. We would do anything for one another.. stop projecting.

Greed- the single most destructive force on the planet. Imagine the world without it.

originally posted by: olaru12

In this technological age the family group/unit is obsolete. That is the reason it's breaking down...greed and power struggles have always been present even in families that aren't dysfunctional.

I've had friends who came from large extended families. The biggest problem was that in every personal decision that you wanted to make, every other family member wanted to have their own say on every issue and their own priorities on how any money you earned should be spent.

Suppose one of the young women in the family had a full-time job working in a store and was earning enough to attend evening classes as well as save up money, with the plan to take driving lessons and buy a car. Achieving those
goals would allow her to work as a midwife.

Oh no, the whole family has got to get involved; why does she need a car? If she needs to go anywhere, one of her brothers will drive her. Then if she doesn't have a car, then she doesn't need driving lessons right now. Then that money saved could help with Aunt Emertrudes medications, she's getting on a bit and could do with a new hearing aid - those aren't cheap, especially not the modern digital ones. And if she does put in another couple of months wages, that would help a bit with buying a new wheelchair as well. Suddenly, you're no longer working for yourself but essentially living as a slave. In the worst case, you end up having to pay for other relatives court fees, bail or gambling debts.

a reply to: ArchPlayer
The draft WILL be interesting this time then,YOU have accepted it. It's a bad move but ,you go with YOUR sought equality and doom those who don't hold YOUR values. I say NO.

Not just family but a sense of community is falling apart.

Growing up in the seventies, I remember kids playing together in the streets - all sorts of games. People hanging out together outside, and talking. Now, you rarely see that.

a reply to: ArchPlayer
Which is why they are so easily swepped aside when we see them, you know like Desert Storm? You see we aren't allowed to lose THAT is for our leaders to steal. I bet you change your values when YOUR daughter gets called up.
WE win by current doctrine which resembles FOOTBALL when we assault a position ,that gear is HEAVY then too I was recon all I would need is silence and compliance to the mission.THAT don't sound like you. Get a girl passed R.I.P. and 2 combat deployments ALIVE then we'll talk. As to YOUR values statements and the rest I was from a nuke family I didn't like their ethics and never really have liked popular culture after the 80s.
Kindly quit even comparing my service and skill to some street Bulls##t without training a joke is nothin but a solid joke.
I don't need love, I have enough.

a reply to: dawnstar
You brought up another issue that is also one that tends to be a trend in the USA. When there is a promising job, the colleges and higher education places tend to produce more than what is necessary for the market. So that means, if you go back at the start of the 1980’s the big thing was computers and computer programmers. In that time frame, up until just past the year 2000, there was a big demand for such. And the field got overloaded and put out more than what is needed. Point in case would be say lawyers, where there are a lot of students, but not enough work or jobs to go around for all of them.

Can we really function in our society without factory workers, or cashiers or bus drivers, no, unfortunately, we are not going to be able to function with such, as there is a percentage of the population that will refuse or does not like to deal with machines. So there will always be a need for such.

Businesses for years have been moving companies out of the USA. The wages they pay are cheaper and the regulations on what all has to be done is also there, along with a lower tax base for them to pay. Yet they still maintain companies here in the USA, and when it starts to become unprofitable, they tend to move it to another country as it is something that most have to deal with. Consider this; any major corporations have to answer to the stock holders. If the stock holders are not making money or returns on their money they will sell and move their funds to another company.

You mention McDonalds, yet fail to take into account that the CEO of McDonalds, really have no say in what an employee is paid. The stores are a franchise, which means someone else is the boss of that store, to run and operate, to include deciding on what all they want to do, including on pay. Most paychecks that a person, who works at a franchise, does not see McDonalds Corp on the paycheck, but something else. And that is true of all of the other franchises out there.
We all have had hard lives, and ultimately, who was it that got you back on your feet, the government or yourself? Was it the government that was standing there, patting your hand and leading you in a direction or was it you that decided that it was time to change your life?

And yes personal responsibility is something that we should be promoting, not refuting or refusing to accept in our lives and that of others. Do you expect me to think that you cannot help yourself, but you can make a choice to have 4 children? No one told you to have 4 children, that was your choice. And ultimately there are consequences for choices that we make. The choices we make are like seeds you plant, and when the fruit ripens it is either sweet or bitter.

Many here would advocate the removal of the business system, yet fail to see that once that is done, what choices you have would also be removed. That means that someone will have to go out and farm or scrub a toilet, and with no freedom of choice or incentive, then it becomes where the government tells you what to do. No thank you I would rather live in poverty and have choices, than to have all choices removed from me.

a reply to: Logarock
I disagree, and that is from looking and watching the world and news. I am sure people like Lindsay Lohan is thrilled that her family was able to bail her out time and time again.

But point in case would be 2 things: One is the heir to the Dupont family. You know the man who raped his own children and got probation and the equivelent of a slap on the wrist. The other, well Ethan Coach. You remember the teen in Texas, who was drunk driving, injured/killed people and care to guess what his defense was?

Or how about any of the number of children who break laws and the parents tend to look and state that they are such good children, just hung out with the wrong people.

a reply to: sdcigarpig
that's funny because I have two sons who work for corp franchises and well one has a boss who would love to help him out ya know give a small raise some overtime and such
he can't it's corp headquarters that make those decisions and you check glassdoor and see if you want but they give the wages earned for all the different positions in the mc donalds resturants and then the payrate of each and they don't distinguish between a mc donalds in ny or one in tx.
such things are decided at corporate headquarters by people who are making way way more than minimum wage.

and people have always made bad decisions yet all but only a small percentage of them couldn't earn a living with a full time job. and just what do you think is a bad desicion? you brought up the graduates with computer degrees that became so numerous
did they make a bad decision? or were they more like mislead and exploited? or was it just that sh-t hapens???

I don't know how old you are but I think I can safely say that those younger ones entering the colleges today will find that even if they have made the best decision that they could make in their career they will find it very much obsolete or devalued within a decade or so
you'd have to be a psychic to make the "good decisions" in a world that is changing so much so quickly!

food has increased over 100% since 1980 has wages for the average worker increased even half that much?

oh and I have three grown children not four which my husband and I struggled together for the most part to raise up!!
which would have been a little easier to do if the businesses that hired the working poor would accept what is in fact their responsibliity and paid them a living wage instead of placing that burden on the backs of the taxpayers so their upper management could make a few hundred thousand dollars more this year than the last! not to mention the inflationary effect of having the gov't decide how much rent this or that apartment is worth or healthcare or food or childcare regardless of weather or not the taxpayers footing the bill for them could afford it!

originally posted by: onequestion
To often I find myself being stabbed in the back by my own family, watching people around me get stabbed in the back. People are to busy pursuing their own goals and idea for success they are to busy lusting for power.

We've lost our way in America. No longer do we have a moral compass, we've lost what it means to take care of each other and our community and we have our blinders on full force.

It's happening now and the future is no bright for our children.

Be that example which you would like to see in the world.

When people are lost they are looking for examples of goodness, and stability, it may take awhile but the pain that comes from choosing a self-centered life will eventually push people in another direction.

Be that lighthouse in the darkness for them.

Peace,

RT

a reply to: DoubleDNH

I agree. I am in my late 40's and my family is loving and supportive. My husband's family is loving and supportive. I don't work outside the home, but I work hard. Raising responsible and empathetic humans is hard work. In my circle of friends, most are married, a few are divorced, but all are raising good kids. We are not rich, but we are not in need of basics. Do not paint all American families with your broad paintbrush. I am so sorry some of you have horrible relatives. If I may point out, "family" does not need to be blood, and you can choose the caliber of people you are with.