Why Are We Not All Dead Already?

reply to post by ENrgLee


Thanks for pointing that out.

This article is from 8/2013 but says according to a TEPCO regulator, it is believed that 300 tons of water is being released into the ocean daily.

TEPCO said it detected 2.35 billion becquerels of cesium per liter in water that is now leaking into the groundwater through cracks in the plant’s drainage system. This radiation level is roughly the same as that measured in April 2011.

The normal level is 150 becquerels of cesium per liter of water.

I am curious where you came up with your figures of only a few milligrams of radioactive particles being in the water? My conversion isn't the best but going by the figures quoted, wouldn't that still make the water radioactive?


Edit: I get what you're saying. It should be quoted that approximately 300 tons of water containing 2.35b becquerels of cesium per liter is leaking into the ocean everyday. That would be more accurate.

It is obvious, but I will admit I am not familiar with how many particles it would take for every bit of that water to be contaminated, considering (I believe) you're talking about sub-atomic particles that take up a minute amount of space compared to a water particle.

Bottom line folks is no matter how you slice/dice/mince it...

FuKu is a constant out pour of Rads...period.
The more you have the more you get, in water air and food.

This is not a opps, just a little bit got loose.
This is a Holy Chit Fatman, we can't stop it!!

They are not able to stop this flow at any point and it continues to spew/dump/leak.

As I said before this will not be fast death, this is a SLOOOOOW killer.
It will get us all in some way shape of form.

Do all the math fuzzy or not to try and feel better about this issue.
Point is it is bad and Only getting worse and more abundant.

reply to post by DogMeat


Math is fuzzy? Do you expect to be taken seriously about your claims when you top it off with that?

reply to post by Kevinquisitor

I am curious where you came up with your figures of only a few milligrams of radioactive particles being in the water?

Aw, geeze.... you just had to ask, eh? okay... here comes the math.


A bequerel is a unit of measurement that means "One atom discintigrating (decaying) per second."

A "Mol" is a unit of measurement of mass, based on the specific atomic mass of the substance in question.... Based on Carbon-12

One mol of an element is equivilant to it's atomic number in grams.

Hence, one mole of carbon-12 is 12 grams.

One mole of Caesium-137 is 137 grams.... etc...

To find the molar mass of a element, you must multiply it's atomic number, by Avogadro's Constant (Atoms per Mole) which is:

6.02214129 × 10^23 per mol

Or, in easier to read numbers....

602,214,129,000,000,000,000,000 atoms

602 septillion atoms per mol (137 grams)

Now, if we take Caseum 137 as our example, again... we need to find the half life of it, which is 30 years.

Which means that of one mol of caesium 137 (602 septillion atoms per mol (137 grams)) half of that decays in 30 years.

So, over the course of 30 years, we would expect 301 septillion (half of 602 septillion) discintigrations over a 30 year period.

Now, we have to find out how many seconds are in 30 years....

And google tells me it is 946,708,000seconds /30 years

So, now, we take that first figure of the half life discintigrations from one mol (137 grams) of caesium 137 (which is 301 septillion discintigrations) and divide that by 946,708,000seconds, and that should give us the normal decay activity of caesium 137...

Whic is:

301,107,060,000,000,000,000,000 divided by 946,708,000 seconds = 318,056,950,000,000 bequerels per mol

That's 318 trillion discintigrations per second, from a base sample size of caesium 137 of 137 grams.

You said that there was:

2.35b becquerels of cesium per liter

2.35 billion discintigrations per liter.... so....

318 trillion discintigrations per second, divided by 2.35 billion discintigrations per second = a ratio of 138260.869565 to 1

So, we take our molar mass of 137 grams, and divide that by 138260, ad we get:


0.00099088673 grams of caesium 137 per liter of water, based on radioactivity.

Which is not quite a milligram.



Edit: Now, to take this calculation even further.... we have to consider the fact of dilution.

Your stated activity of the caesium-137 (2.3 billion bequerels per liter) is the undiluted activity directly AT the fukushima plant.

Considering that the atlantic ocean contains:

323,600,000 cubic kilometres of water... which is 323,600,000,000,000,000 cubic meters

One liter of water is the standard of a kilogram (roughly)

And by volume, one liter is 1/1000 of a cubic meter.

So, 1,000 liters is a cubic meter of water.

So, the Atlantic ocean contains 3.23600 × 10^17 * 1,000 = 3.23600 × 10^20 liters, or

323,600,000,000,000,000,000 liters

So, if you take one liter of the caesium-137 laced water from fukushima, and dilute it's activity (2.3 billion bequerels) over the entire ocean....

You will have a new activity measurement per liter of: 0.0000000000071075402 bequerels per liter

Multiply that by the 300,000 liters per day and you get a new reading of: 0.00000213226 bequerels per liter

And multiply that by the (roughly) 1460 days since the incident, and we get a activity measurement of: 0.0031130996 bequerels per liter.


Which means that the total ceasium-137 release from fukushima has increased the natural radioactivity of the Atlantic ocean by one three thousandth of a discintigration per liter.

Keep in mind, the NATURAL activity of ocean water is on the order of 8,000 discintigrations per cubic meter (from uranium, potassium-40, and carbon-14)

So, we really don't have anything to worry about...

And it would take decades more steady release from Fukushima to bring the average radioactivity of the ocean up by a single bequerel.

Keep in mind, a Bequerel is a single atom discintigrating.

"It is by will alone I set my mind in motion, it is by the juice of saphu that the thoughts aquire speed, the lips aquire a stain, the stain becomes a warning, it is by will alone I set my mind in motion."

ENrgLee
reply to post by Kevinquisitor

 

I am curious where you came up with your figures of only a few milligrams of radioactive particles being in the water?

Aw, geeze.... you just had to ask, eh? okay... here comes the math.


A bequerel is a unit of measurement that means "One atom discintigrating (decaying) per second."

A "Mol" is a unit of measurement of mass, based on the specific atomic mass of the substance in question.... Based on Carbon-12

One mol of an element is equivilant to it's atomic number in grams.

Hence, one mole of carbon-12 is 12 grams.

One mole of Caesium-137 is 137 grams.... etc...

To find the molar mass of a element, you must multiply it's atomic number, by Avogadro's Constant (Atoms per Mole) which is:

6.02214129 × 10^23 per mol

Or, in easier to read numbers....

602,214,129,000,000,000,000,000 atoms

602 septillion atoms per mol (137 grams)

Now, if we take Caseum 137 as our example, again... we need to find the half life of it, which is 30 years.

Which means that of one mol of caesium 137 (602 septillion atoms per mol (137 grams)) half of that decays in 30 years.

So, over the course of 30 years, we would expect 301 septillion (half of 602 septillion) discintigrations over a 30 year period.

Now, we have to find out how many seconds are in 30 years....

And google tells me it is 946,708,000seconds /30 years

So, now, we take that first figure of the half life discintigrations from one mol (137 grams) of caesium 137 (which is 301 septillion discintigrations) and divide that by 946,708,000seconds, and that should give us the normal decay activity of caesium 137...

Whic is:

301,107,060,000,000,000,000,000 divided by 946,708,000 seconds = 318,056,950,000,000 bequerels per mol

That's 318 trillion discintigrations per second, from a base sample size of caesium 137 of 137 grams.

You said that there was:

2.35b becquerels of cesium per liter

2.35 billion discintigrations per liter.... so....

318 trillion discintigrations per second, divided by 2.35 billion discintigrations per second = a ratio of 138260.869565 to 1

So, we take our molar mass of 137 grams, and divide that by 138260, ad we get:


0.00099088673 grams of caesium 137 per liter of water, based on radioactivity.

Which is not quite a milligram.



Edit: Now, to take this calculation even further.... we have to consider the fact of dilution.

Your stated activity of the caesium-137 (2.3 billion bequerels per liter) is the undiluted activity directly AT the fukushima plant.

Considering that the atlantic ocean contains:

323,600,000 cubic kilometres of water... which is 323,600,000,000,000,000 cubic meters

One liter of water is the standard of a kilogram (roughly)

And by volume, one liter is 1/1000 of a cubic meter.

So, 1,000 liters is a cubic meter of water.

So, the Atlantic ocean contains 3.23600 × 10^17 * 1,000 = 3.23600 × 10^20 liters, or

323,600,000,000,000,000,000 liters

So, if you take one liter of the caesium-137 laced water from fukushima, and dilute it's activity (2.3 billion bequerels) over the entire ocean....

You will have a new activity measurement per liter of: 0.0000000000071075402 bequerels per liter

Multiply that by the 300,000 liters per day and you get a new reading of: 0.00000213226 bequerels per liter

And multiply that by the (roughly) 1460 days since the incident, and we get a activity measurement of: 0.0031130996 bequerels per liter.


Which means that the total ceasium-137 release from fukushima has increased the natural radioactivity of the Atlantic ocean by one three thousandth of a discintigration per liter.

Keep in mind, the NATURAL activity of ocean water is on the order of 8,000 discintigrations per cubic meter (from uranium, potassium-40, and carbon-14)

So, we really don't have anything to worry about...

And it would take decades more steady release from Fukushima to bring the average radioactivity of the ocean up by a single bequerel.

Keep in mind, a Bequerel is a single atom discintigrating.

"It is by will alone I set my mind in motion, it is by the juice of saphu that the thoughts aquire speed, the lips aquire a stain, the stain becomes a warning, it is by will alone I set my mind in motion."

edit on E7Sun, 12 Jan 2014 13:23:29 -060010America/ChicagoAmerica/Chicago by ENrgLee because: reasons

Wonderful math... tell you what.... you ingest 1 becquerel of cesium a day (swallow one day and inhale the next and repeat) from this day forward and get back to me in a few years on how your health is doing.

Dont worry...that 1 bec will only be like .00000000000000000000000000001% of your body's atoms........ nothing to worry about.



or if I bec of cesium is too much,,,, try 1/10 of a bec of strontium 90 every day and let me know how that works for you

reply to post by RickinVa


Considering you take on an average dose of 300 to 340 rems/day ... do you live in a lead-lined box?

reply to post by RickinVa

Wonderful math... tell you what.... you ingest 1 becquerel of cesium a day (swallow one day and inhale the next and repeat) from this day forward and get back to me in a few years on how your health is doing.

The human body contains 8,000 bequerels of radioactivity.

All day, Every day.

From birth to death.

So... that's 8,000 times more radiation than you suggested....

86,400 times more often than you suggested.



and I feel fine.

So, tell me.... fellow radioactive mortal human... how do you feel?

reply to post by ENrgLee


Prime Example of pure Logic!

Arigato Gozaimasu for your Input.

I don't believe anything I can't actually see or touch, there has to be "palpability".

But sometimes there is a long time span between the event and the resulting damage, kind of like old injuries that were accrued when one was young.

I have seen the results of things that everyone basically forgot about within a year of their occurring, manifested many years later.

But I'm just a guy, nobody cares what I see.

reply to post by ketsuko



Natural radiation is completely different from man made radiation,,,,, take the test


let me guess... now you want to talk about bananas lol

reply to post by RickinVa

Im a FED... so what?

Natural radiation is completely different from man made radiation

How?

I will buy anybody a one-way ticket to Japan that's willing to walk inside the reactor 3 building for 20 minutes... don't worry... you wont need a ticket home...

but then again radiation is harmless

reply to post by RickinVa

I will buy anybody a one-way ticket to Japan that's willing to walk inside the reactor 3

So you are saying that the only place where the radiation is dangerous, is DIRECTLY INSIDE THE REACTOR?

Very well, I agree.

reply to post by ENrgLee



How bout you go take a swim 1 mile off the coast of the reactor....... don't worry the water is perfectly safe.. and while you at it, catch some fish to eat for dinner,,, don't worry they are safe says the man

reply to post by RickinVa

How bout you go take a swim 1 mile off the coast of the reactor....... don't worry the water is perfectly safe

So, you are saying that the only PLACES that are dangerous because of the radiation, is INSIDE THE CORE, and directly off the coast of the leaking reactor?

Very well, I agree.

reply to post by RickinVa


[SNIP]

I am glad I am in my twilight years,,, the full effects of Fukushima won't be known for years, but trust me.... they will become known to your grandchildren.

But we have already agreed that the extent of the damage is contained within the exclusion zone, and a small area directly offshore.

I don't see what the fuss is about...

Unless you were going to dare me to live on the coast of california for a year....

20 years from now... people will still be talking about the disaster at Fukushima....... problem is.... it will still be spewing radiation and hot ground water will still be going into the ocean.... nothing can stop it.


You people remind me of a little kid....covering your eyes because if you can't see it then it must not be able to see you....

Fukushima is a nightmare many times over and no matter how much you try to gloss it over.... its not going to go away.

reply to post by ENrgLee


Do not try to put words in my mouth...... we obviously don't agree on anything...... nuclear power is not safe and has never been safe.