A Question to the Scot's Here on ATS? ....

reply to post by angelchemuel


Do you agree with all of your fellow "wherever-you-were-borns" on everything political? If you don't, does that make you disingenuous?

If you did agree with everything your countrymen believed in unison, then there would be no need for opposing political parties.

Rather than disingenuous, I'd say I was realistic.

Thanks for your comments. I'll choose to let them wash over me.

alldaylong

Soloprotocol

alldaylong

Soloprotocol

alldaylong
reply to post by eletheia

 

I would find it most amusing if after Scotland gained independence it all went tits up and they asked to rejoin the union. They where answered with a resounding NO.

Why would Scotland ask to go back...Out of every country that has went indi from the UK in the past.."16 countries, No-one else has. what would make us special.

And why would you find it amusing.?

England bailed Scotland out when it went bankrupt in 1707. If it went bankrupt again why would we want to bail it out a second time?
Countries do go bankrupt you know. Remember Iceland?

And you think the UK wont ever go Bankrupt...just give it time...it's already on the bones of it's arse, they are just hiding it from plain sight.
Scotland's Lords in 1707 arsed it up..not the people of Scotland...anyway...stop talking bollocks about crappola from yesteryear.

Just quoting facts dear boy

Would i rather be a part of a nation which has the worlds financial centre within it (London) or take a chance on God knows what ?
All i can say is if you go it alone, we won't miss you.

All things being Equal..

Soloprotocol

justwokeup
reply to post by Soloprotocol

 

Its pretty simple really. Scotland is not currently a nation.

Where's a rolly about on it's arse emoticon when you need one.. this is exactly why i'm voting yes..

edit on 28-11-2013 by Soloprotocol because: (no reason given)

Be that as it may, its correct. Scotland is not currently a nation state. We may feel that we are, but feelings are irrelevant to the point we were discussing.

Which was whether or not Scotland had automatic entitlement to EU membership and could get the benefits without having to join the euro like everybody else.

When the EU itself says "sure, you can join the EU without taking the euro, a special concession for the scots" then i'll believe it. Until then its just the usual Salmond snake oil show.

AngryCymraeg
I'm Welsh and much as I love my country we can't afford to be independent. The bloody English have smashed our heavy industry to pieces (god, how I cheered when that evil witch Maggie died this year!) and our mining industry is dead.

Well take the power back...Outbid them at every twist and turn and open back up the Coal Mines...do you think they were closed because they ran out of Coal??...they closed because Westminster decided it was cheaper to import from Poland..
They closed the steelworks and outsourced the ship buildinging because they could source the steal and cheap labour at a far lower cost...it wont always be like that you know.... that's where Independence comes in....we take our future in our own hands.

reply to post by angelchemuel

Erm....did you read the whole article, because I did and it also says this...

Yes, I read the article.
The word that needs emphasising here is negotiate. In other words it would come at a price.
And if you were Scottish would you vote for independence and then have to negotiate terms with the EU who would know that Scotland was negotiating from a much weakened position having committed to sever it's ties from the UK.
I don't think the EU would be looking after Scotland's best interests do you?

Salmond and the SNP seem to be saying that Scotland will be granted admission on their terms - a very dangerous and incorrect assumption, it would be on the EU's terms.

And bear in mind Spain isn't the only country that has regions seeking self-government.
Here is a list of independence movements in Europe.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Granted, not all are in the EU, but many are.

Smaller independent countries are the direct opposite of the dreaded European Superstate that is the stated aim of many of the eurocrats who would be part of the negotiating team or directing policy.

The soundbites coming from Brussels suggests that either way EU membership will come at a high price.

stumason
reply to post by TechniXcality

 

An Irish Yank...Hmmm, your opinion isn't coloured by anything then... It was your lot sending money to the IRA in spades to kill us.

As for the vote - we have nothing to lose. The RUK will be perfectly fine, if not better off. I have Scottish relatives myself and the only thing I am interested in this Scotland making a decision based on facts, not sentiment or emotional blackmail, which is what the SNP are peddling with a healthy dose of fantasy.

I resent that statement, my lot has done no such things. I do have an interest in world politics albeit non vested. I think the Scottish should become independent i see so much pride from Scottish friends these sincerely are a people who don't take sh* from no one, and i respect that. Like i have said if they want independence and vote yes than so be it. I see no contradiction from making such a choice i see fortune and independence and a wealthy society built from the ground up. Of course my opinion is colored im a yank we wanted our independence and fought for it. So of course i support the Scottish or any other country that may want to fracture.

Freeborn
reply to post by angelchemuel

 

Erm....did you read the whole article, because I did and it also says this...

Yes, I read the article.
The word that needs emphasising here is negotiate. In other words it would come at a price.

Ok, that price would be..."how do you want you Nuclear Missiles....Hot or Cold.

Check this!

Alex Salmond ‘relies on Google’ to make case for independent Scotland's EU place

www.express.co.uk...

This guy should just wear a clowns outfit with a big pair aye floppy shoes.

reply to post by angelchemuel


Lots of people have said otherwise...

Speaking on a visit to the Scottish Parliament, Ivan Grdesic, the Croatian ambassador to the UK, said nations wanting to join the EU are forced to “take pretty much what is offered”.

“Negotiating accession is really not a negotiating process – it’s pretty much taking the decisions already done and written down in Brussels,” he told this newspaper after giving evidence to Holyrood’s Europe committee.

“What you really do is you look when you can fulfil them and how. If you take too many opt-outs or too many delays then you are probably not ready.”

The Croatian government will probably look back at the terms it struck to get membership and realise it could have got a better deal, he admitted.

“But at the very beginning you take pretty much what is offered because you cannot change the rules … It’s a template,”

The president of the European Commission, Jose Manuel Barroso, has said that any new independent country would have to apply to join the EU.

"What I said, and it is our doctrine and it is clear since 2004 in legal terms, if one part of a country - I am not referring now to any specific one - wants to become an independent state, of course as an independent state it has to apply to the European membership according to the rules - that is obvious."

"For European Union purposes, from a legal point of view, it is certainly a new state. If a country becomes independent it is a new state and has to negotiate with the EU."

"Scotland could still find itself competing against a variety of European political agendas that would make its path to the EU far from straightforward or automatic,"

Edgars Rinkevics, the Latvian foreign minister, told the BBC Scotland would be considered a “new country” and would have to go through the full accession process.

Mr Rinkevics, said: "If Scotland clears independence, it is a new country. The procedure of admitting a new member to the EU would have to be followed.
"All the chapters of negotiations have to be opened, duly negotiated and then closed."

Similar opinions have been expressed by the foreign ministers for the Czech Republic and Ireland and José Manuel Barroso, the European Commission’s President.

Not so straight forward, If only Salmond got some EU legal advise instead of squandering the money. Or better yet spent some time with his white paper and answered the important questions instead of creating more questions.

DrunkYogi
Check this!

Alex Salmond ‘relies on Google’ to make case for independent Scotland's EU place

www.express.co.uk...

This guy should just wear a clowns outfit with a big pair aye floppy shoes.

If you ever get the Chance, Listen to Alex tear all and sundry apart at First Ministers questions....In fact, listen to the lies being peddled from the opposition... Alex Catches them out on every question asked.

Not one, Labour, Tory, Lib-den are a match for the guy on the dance floor...Nicola Sturgeon will be Scotland's next first Minister...Another Match for anyone.
To cast the guy as a clown is waaaaay off the mark.

DrunkYogi
Check this!

Alex Salmond ‘relies on Google’ to make case for independent Scotland's EU place

www.express.co.uk...

This guy should just wear a clowns outfit with a big pair aye floppy shoes.

And of course....you don't google!
Rainbows
Jane

reply to post by tdk84

I have never said he was the best man to be the mouthpiece for Scotlands independence. Infact if they lose the yes vote, I shall be blaming Salmond, only because I think he's either been set up or he's agreed to be the mouthpiece of the no camp....but meh, what do I know.....just my conspiratorial hat talking today.

Besides, you didn't note the legal beagles who he is listening to. The very same ones who advise the current government on all things EU.

Rainbows
Jane

angelchemuel

DrunkYogi
Check this!

Alex Salmond ‘relies on Google’ to make case for independent Scotland's EU place

www.express.co.uk...

This guy should just wear a clowns outfit with a big pair aye floppy shoes.

And of course....you don't google!
Rainbows
Jane

Sure, but i am not The First Minister of Scotland putting forward an argument for Independence! Surely you aren't trying to defend this Angel.

Soloprotocol

DrunkYogi
Check this!

Alex Salmond ‘relies on Google’ to make case for independent Scotland's EU place

www.express.co.uk...

This guy should just wear a clowns outfit with a big pair aye floppy shoes.

If you ever get the Chance, Listen to Alex tear all and sundry apart at First Ministers questions....In fact, listen to the lies being peddled from the opposition... Alex Catches them out on every question asked.

Not one, Labour, Tory, Lib-den are a match for the guy on the dance floor...Nicola Sturgeon will be Scotland's next first Minister...Another Match for anyone.
To cast the guy as a clown is waaaaay off the mark.

So two wrong's make a right? Is that what we have come to? You could be right about the clown comparison maybe i should have said Monkey! Although come to think of that to, i could be doing the Monkey a disservice. Maybe i will stick with Plagiarist.

reply to post by Freeborn


Apologies to everyone for posting the wrong link in this post;
www.abovetopsecret.com...

The link should have been this one which shows the European nations with separatist movements in them. Some aren't in the EU, many are.
en.wikipedia.org...

The point I was trying to make is that Scotland voting for independence could set a dangerous precedent - more the reason for the EU to exact a high price for membership.

ETA.

Oops, forgot - Thanks to eletheia for letting me know I'd posted the wrong link.

reply to post by Soloprotocol




The fact that Alex Salmond can "talk his way out of a paper bag" does not

negate the lies that get picked up on.

There are people capable of, and good at talking (snake oil salesman??) However

it is short term success that never holds up to scrutiny .... Are the Scottish

people prepared for that? ... Getting independence may just turn out to be 'castles

in the air'


HE TALKS THE TALK ... BUT CAN HE WALK THE WALK ??

reply to post by Freeborn




Lol .... Just to make sure you know I'm reading everything!!

reply to post by angelchemuel


worrying isn't it.

Damn, en.wikipedia.org...

That must be a lot of minorities, mercia, never heard of that movement before. You always here of Cornwall, devon etc.

There's a pattern here of people wanting to hang onto old historical ties, talk about living in the ages.

DrunkYogi

angelchemuel

DrunkYogi
Check this!

Alex Salmond ‘relies on Google’ to make case for independent Scotland's EU place

www.express.co.uk...

This guy should just wear a clowns outfit with a big pair aye floppy shoes.

And of course....you don't google!
Rainbows
Jane

Sure, but i am not The First Minister of Scotland putting forward an argument for Independence! Surely you aren't trying to defend this Angel.

No of course I'm not. But it's your source for a start...Torry and pro union. I am just trying to strike a balance that is all. I have also been very clear on my views about Alex Salmond too.
Rainbows
Jane