Secrecy still shrouds Sandy Hook investigation!

reply to post by GoodOlDave


I have no idea what is contained in those 911 calls, and I'm not "claiming" anything. That's the entire point really. All most of us are saying/thinking, is that evidence should not be secret.

Please don't presume to know what or how I think. I believe you have linked to sources in the past. Maybe not on this topic, but you have certainly researched other topics.

Though correct in what you say about MSM, that doesn't make it right, doesn't mean everyone who feels something odd about this case ought to let it go, just because it's happened before (msm confusion).

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, but sometimes it isn't.

RobinB022
reply to post by GoodOlDave

 

I have no idea what is contained in those 911 calls, and I'm not "claiming" anything. That's the entire point really. All most of us are saying/thinking, is that evidence should not be secret.

Please don't presume to know what or how I think. I believe you have linked to sources in the past. Maybe not on this topic, but you have certainly researched other topics.

Though correct in what you say about MSM, that doesn't make it right, doesn't mean everyone who feels something odd about this case ought to let it go, just because it's happened before (msm confusion).

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, but sometimes it isn't.

With all due respects, there is no way I can avoid presuming what you think. I have asked I don't know how many times what it is exactly that the people crying fowl here at the secrecy need to know and it's still as clear as mud, so all I have to go on is what is being argued over as a result of said supposed secrecy. One person here claimed there was a lot of radio traffic indicating confusion among the myriad police forces but that obviously wouldn't be in the 9/11 calls they insist on releasing. Another person here claims the it was a fake shooting because the school was really empty because of some nearby gas line...but why wouldn't this shadowy entity releasing fake information about a shooting not just release a fake 9/11 call too?

The only thing I can determine with any reason of certainty is that you all agree there's something suspicious going on, but not even two of you can agree among yourselves on what it actually is. Quite confusing.

I have a problem with this book that was written by MATTHEW LYSIAK.

www.nydailynews.com...

When Adam first came to the school he tried getting in but was confronted by the Principal who would not open the door. The Psychiatrist then came to the front entry to see what the yelling was and to try to talk Adam down who was still locked outside the school. At this time the police were called to say some one was outside the school demanding to come in. Then Adam retrieves his weapons and returns to the front entry way and begins kicking and then starts shooting the glass window. The police are now called again to say he is shooting his weapon at the front door and breaking in. The original police called are approaching the driveway to the school and are told shots have been fired wait for back up. They stay at the end of the drive way. Paramedics are told to position at the firehouse a short distance from the drive way. Adam enters the school and starts firing. Police are still waiting for back up. State police show up as back up so the Local Police and State Police move down the driveway and approach the school. Firing has already stopped. The State and Local Police then enter the building from three positions.

You can read the book at the link and they seem to really miss a lot of what happened. Are they trying to rewrite history? Is it a story put out to say case closed stop looking into it? Strange thing it seems to remind of the Roswell Case Closed story and how the government presented it. Maybe there is something to flying saucers and Roswell?

Here is another article about the book.
www.nydailynews.com...

And a comment from the book.

The home that Adam Lanza lived in while growing up in Sandy Hook. He killed his mother in this house, then went to Sandy Hook Elementary and killed 20 children and six teachers before killing himself. Lanza transformed an exercise room into a military room with an indoor target range.

The last part he transformed the exercise room into a shooting range?
ww2.hdnux.com...

ww4.hdnux.com...

Where is the shooting range? You can see the treadmill. That to me says exercise room. We know Adam did not move that it is to heavy. And it is plugged in so it must be being used in that spot?

So why is MATTHEW LYSIAK book changing so much about the story?

reply to post by JBA2848

Thanks for the info JB2848
(never mind the rest of what I wrote - - - guess I didn't go to the correct URL)
Will get back later...
Thanks again.

JBA2848
...When Adam first came to the school he tried getting in but was confronted by the Principal who would not open the door. The Psychiatrist then came to the front entry to see what the yelling was and to try to talk Adam down who was still locked outside the school. At this time the police were called to say some one was outside the school demanding to come in. Then Adam retrieves his weapons and returns to the front entry way and begins kicking and then starts shooting the glass window. The police are now called again to say he is shooting his weapon at the front door and breaking in. The original police called are approaching the driveway to the school and are told shots have been fired wait for back up. They stay at the end of the drive way. Paramedics are told to position at the firehouse a short distance from the drive way. Adam enters the school and starts firing. Police are still waiting for back up. State police show up as back up so the Local Police and State Police move down the driveway and approach the school. Firing has already stopped. The State and Local Police then enter the building from three positions.
...

First - Thanks again for the pointer.
Second - even though I found two pages...one that was simply excerpts and the other that appears to have been more from the book - I still did not find what you've stated, above...
So - maybe they've shortened what is being made available (to public, non-paying eyes), or maybe I'm just a bumbler...

Anyway - Just a couple of observations...
In the "Excerpts" article, I found this...

...He...left his shotgun leaning against the passenger's side door...
He climbed out of the driver's seat. Adam left the car doors open and walked at a deliberate pace toward the school's large double doors. The rifle was in his hands...

Somewhere in the discussions of this topic, I have read that all 4 doors were left open.
The "Summary Report", however (at least in one instance) states that one of the first officers/responders on scene saw the shotgun sitting on the seat...and, to my recollection, does not say that the doors were open.
There is a difference between a shotgun leaning against an open door...and sitting/laying on a car seat - - - isn't there?

Next - and, in direct line (or - contradiction) with the sequence of events you highlighted...

...Adam hesitated briefly at the entrance. Then stepped back, pointed the rifle at the large plate-glass window to the right of the door, and pulled the trigger eight times. In less than a second, six .223-caliber bullets shattered the glass, creating a hole large enough for him to walk through.

And - it goes on to say that the Principal was in a room down the hall where a Parent-Teacher conference was about to commence...
This was all, supposedly, excerpted from the same "book"...

Okay - maybe a scrivener's error ("pulled the trigger eight times" and "six .223-caliber bullets shattered the glass") - or...something else... Who Knows?!

Likewise - if there is no video recording of this event...HOW would anyone know he walked at a deliberate pace...etc... ?

... ... ?

reply to post by GoodOlDave


Actually there is alot confusing about this event.

Of course I can see the police being told to wait for back up. Then again, knowing children were in danger, they waited.

A man with an app on his phone telling him about the event??? What app? A scanner? Then how did he get there so fast and why would he be creeping in the woods making himself look suspect? Then the others in the woods.

The man who came up with "stray children" who changed his story more than once in different interviews. I would think that if I found some kids I would know exactly where I found them and certainly would have called 911 before just taking them into my house. But he didn't. Just let them hang out for awhile.

Parents seeming very eager to do interviews, when in fact most normal people would be grieving or in shock over losing a child. I would not be and doing interviews, and joking would not be in the forefront of my mind. I guess those cameras were rolling at an inopportune time for him and caught that.

The principal who was killed, and then gave an interview. ?? Still confused how a reporter could misidentify a person, maybe get a first or last name mixed up, but to say someone who is the principal and that person being deceased, did she not know who she interviewed?

How did 15 kids fit in a small bathroom? Most bathrooms connected to classrooms are the size of broom closets. I will say I don't know the actual size of that bathroom, but odds are it was just large enough for a toilet and sink.

How could they have state of the art security but cameras that did not record? And the man who installed those was linked to Adam Lanza in a tech club.

The coroner going o TV and stating the children were killed by one weapon, yet that was found in the car. They were shot with a different weapon. And why police would move a gun, evidence, from the front seat to the trunk for safekeeping. Wasn't that a secured crime scene? Footage shows so many LEO's casually milling around and certainly someone could have been assigned to stand at the car and not let any one bother it. That was breaking a major rule as far as evidence goes.

Nancy Lanza...she worked at the school, she never worked at the school, she volunteered there years before, no one had ever heard of her. The school system would have records of her.

Adam had his brother's ID on him? Where and when did he get that?

Footage of EMT's standing around in the parking lot and not inside checking for any survivors or any one who would be in need of medical help. And still so far from the school.

No sign of teachers or students having been evacuated. Where were they all? With all of the aerial footage of the events of that day, you never saw any children or teachers or any movement of anyone leaving that building.

The footage mistakenly aired, which was from a drill at another school. Something strange here no one has pointed out yet. Those officers are running like hell and look like they are going to an actual emergency...for a drill, yet the officers in the Sandy Hook parking lot don't look like they are in much of a hurry to do anything.

The demolition crews having to sign non-disclosure agreements? What did they see, or not see in that building? What secrets did the building hold? What harm would it be for someone to say, yeah, it was sad, seeing the bullet holes in the walls, or something to that effect? I can sort of understand why the citizens of Newtown don't want reminders, but hey, it was a national event, it's never going away. Dead children and loved one aren't just forgotten because you don't want it brought up. They don't want reminders, but what doesn't remind one on a daily basis that one's child was murdered? You really can't just stick your head in the sand and pretend it didn't happen.

Yes, some ideas are far fetched, but here's the thing. The report was released and there are alot of redactions in it. The whole story here isn't being told. If the story was told in its entirity leaving no questions unanswered, there wouldn't be much to look for. Sure there are still some who would be looking for things, but the stories being told have changed, and changed again, and reports are blacked out (victims names, I can see that, no need to have them publicly identified, even though their deaths are public record).

Granted, events such as these can turn into a cluster, and adreneline is rushing, and things get confused, but again, the aerial footage shows law enforcement cars about equal to the number of officers standing around in the parking lot. Where are the others? Inside? I hate to say again, but it bothers me the EMT's were stationed so far from the building and not looking like they are in a rush to do much either.

So, yes, there are many questions left unanswered. I for one am not looking for the big conspiracy here, but there are alot of things off with the whole thing from the beginning. And as a matter of public record, people have a right to know what happened. And I for one have never stated or hinted that there was no one killed, but I feel there were deaths, but they were collateral damage to whatever really went on there that day.

Someone knows. Maybe someone will eventually speak out on the matter

reply to post by WanDash


That is what the real events were. The book misses that completely. The Article had several paragraphs in it more than ATS lets you quote so I did not bother quoting them. They leave key things out all over the story. Then I did quote the second story to show the problem with a gun range in the exercise room. Not sure why the guy is off on so much. I thought the book released a year later would of been more accurate and even show things the police and politicians might not want in there. Instead this book went the other way with even less then what the State Attorney has given as evidence. But on the part to demonize Adam they went all out with gun ranges in the exercise room?

reply to post by WanDash



I was going to ask the same thing. No video recordings, no recording security cameras, so how would one know how he walked, if he left doors open or where he left a gun.

I truly believe anyone who writes about this is censored and coached about what to write and what can and can not be said. No wonder people ask questions. It is human nature. People looking for a conspiracy, yes some, but more just wanting questions answered and the truth told. It's not asking for much.

This appears to be the route they say he took.

goo.gl...

So did he go to the High School or drive past it on the road to Sandy Hook?

reply to post by JBA2848


Good question. He was apparently taken out of high school, at least that is what I gathered, so his mother could home school him as he was having problems there. Seems like he would have a grudge against the high school or the students and/or teachers there. Maybe harder to get in and out of, as many high school students drive and have a better chance of leaving school, or sneaking in. Although they would be less vunerable than elementary school students. Or maybe they had better security and cameras that recorded. He know the guy in charge of it, so he probably knew what schools had what equipment.

reply to post by opal13


Yes Expelled at the same time Ricard Novia his Tech Teacher got fired for threatening and hitting a student? Ricahard Novia was the Security guy hired by the School Board for all the schools. And took the job as Tech Teacher on the side. He insisted that Adam join the class. Richard Novia who did over night and even all weekend Tech Classes. Even did one at Adam Lanzas house.

JBA2848
reply to post by WanDash

 

...That is what the real events were. The book misses that completely. ...

When you say "That is what the real events were.", are you referring to the conversation between Adam Lanza & the Principal and the Psychiatrist...and then, Adam returning to his vehicle to retrieve weapons?

If so - can you please tell me where to find this "account", as I don't know that I've ever seen these details.
Thanks.

reply to post by WanDash


Came out early on when Sandy Hook happened and then was backed up by official sources.(News interviews on TV) unsure which channels. Following this case now that it hits the news a year later they are twisting the facts in the wind. I guess they had time to make people change there comments and cover for people. When it first came out about the psychiatrist being there with the principal to talk to him through the door it was guessed maybe she was his psychiatrist. Then the story the mom worked there came out and the media went crazy trying to find answers. And then the weird stories took over. People claiming to be his uncle who was not and later arrested. Then the whole gun thing started and the arguments came out quit talking about it. Give them there privacy. They are faking it and there only trying to take your guns away. But if you were not interested in the fake BS gong on and only followed the real events and what happened it was easy to put together.

And don't forget the Officer Champion going to speak to the press and was the brother of Nancy Lanza. They squashed that interview and made it disappear quickly. That is the same time the fake uncle showed up for interviews. It got weird after that.

And I kind of question the brother and his ties to the media due to this story about him.

www.unionleader.com...

Defibrillator? Strange how those EKG pads were found on Nancys north pillow? Wonder if it could be defibrillator pads?

Even stranger the guy Nancy Brother saved. Mark Ethridge. Think he is a student who had his life saved?

"There's no question it's a life saver," said Ethridge, a former Danville selectman and Navy and civilian intelligence specialist who served several tours in Iraq and Afghanistan.

So here he is.

www.linkedin.com...

Now the company he was working for NEK Advanced Securities Group, Inc had a big money deal take places Dec 14 2012.

www.cubic.com...

SAN DIEGO, California – December 17, 2012 Cubic Corporation (NYSE: CUB) has acquired from NEK Advanced Securities Group, Inc. the operating assets of its NEK Special Programs Group, LLC subsidiary, their Special Operation Forces training business based in Fayetteville, NC and Colorado Springs, Colo. The all-cash transaction closed on December 14, 2012 with a total consideration of $52 million subject to the terms of the purchase agreement.

The assets are being acquired by NEK Services, Inc., a wholly owned subsidiary of Cubic Corporation, and will operate under the leadership of Jim Balentine, President of Cubic Mission Support Services. The more than 200 highly skilled and experienced operational and technical experts of NEK’s Special Operations Forces training business will become employees of Cubic and significantly expand the company’s current knowledge base in advanced tactical training, surveillance /counter surveillance, mission planning, and personnel recovery.

Strange the brother saved a guy with this as his special abilities.

Mark Ethridge's Skills & Expertise

Security Operations HUMINT Command Intelligence Analysis Surveillance Security Management Intelligence Security SIGINT Force Protection Counterterrorism Security Clearance Military Counterintelligence DoD Government National Security Defense Physical Security Private Investigations Military Operations Army Enforcement Afghanistan

reply to post by JBA2848


A gun range, inside his house in suburbia? Yeah, that sounds legit lmao.

reply to post by JBA2848

Thanks, JBA2848 - I seem to remember some of what you're saying is/was the "breaking" storyline... Wish you would/could have saved some of those "reports" &/or "interviews" for sanity's sake...
Nowadays, I save every article I read related to storylines-of-interest to pdf...for future reference.
Oddly - I have found a genuine lack of integrity (or, minimally - journalistic integrity) or intelligence among the troops of "reporters" and "free lance journalists" plaguing the gamut of online & print publication nowadays... ( sigh )

ETA: See you've added some about the brother since I began the response...
Interesting!!!!!!
How many major events (mass shootings, massacres, bombings, terrorisms) have not been closely-linked to something like this...?
Starting to boggle the imagination... !

JBA2848

And I kind of question the brother and his ties to the media due to this story about him.

I see nothing suspicious about this whatsoever. What specifically are you alleging?

You've surfed up a handful of links but I don't see any logical connection Sorry, but it seems like complete pareidolia to me. There is quite a bit of that going on with regard to this incident.

repeat post

JBA2848

 

I have a problem with this book that was written by MATTHEW LYSIAK.

www.nydailynews.com...

When Adam first came to the school he tried getting in but was confronted by the Principal who would not open the door. The Psychiatrist then came to the front entry to see what the yelling was and to try to talk Adam down who was still locked outside the school. At this time the police were called to say some one was outside the school demanding to come in. Then Adam retrieves his weapons and returns to the front entry way and begins kicking and then starts shooting the glass window. The police are now called again to say he is shooting his weapon at the front door and breaking in. The original police called are approaching the driveway to the school and are told shots have been fired wait for back up. They stay at the end of the drive way. Paramedics are told to position at the firehouse a short distance from the drive way. Adam enters the school and starts firing. Police are still waiting for back up. State police show up as back up so the Local Police and State Police move down the driveway and approach the school. Firing has already stopped. The State and Local Police then enter the building from three positions.

Now, this is EXACTLY what I was referring to before. Whenever these shootings occur the media always gives the shooter such rock star treatement that his name becomes a household word, and it puts the idea into the next sociopath;s head on how to go out in style. The report was only released a week or so ago and already we have people writing books documenting the life of that punk (I refuse to say the name of that POS). I will even put money on it that Hollywierd will eventually make a docudrama on the life of that POS complete with dramatic music and CGI special effects.

If anyone this I'm exaggerating, then consider this. Out of all the dozens of Ar-15 manufacturers out there, that OTHER POS (who I likewise refuse to name) who ambushed those fire fighters in White Plains used the exact same model of rifle the POS who shot up Sandy Hook used. Do you really think that's just a coincidence?

Going back to the Richard Novia being fired in 2008 at the same time Adam Lanza was pulled out of school and his mother began to battle the school. I found a interesting article.

A kid tied to a chair with plastic wrap, choked, hitler mustache drawn on his face. He was then pushed down the hallway of the school on a cart. And then a video of what they did to him was posted on Youtube. 7 kids were punished and then the school was sued by the victim?

www.newstimes.com...

Now here is another story about Adam Lanza and his mother teaching him to shoot guns.

“She took Adam to the gun ranges with her,” said Emily Edgerton, who attended Newtown High School with Lanza. “He knew she had these guns, and she shared the gun hobby with Adam.”

She also goes on to say this.

“He didn’t fit in,” Edgerton said. “When I heard about what happened, I guess it was a little more understandable that it was him compared to other people. But I still was surprised because I did not feel like anybody I had ever met in my life had the capability to do something like this, emotional problems or not.”

She said he always carried a briefcase in school. “That stuck out. Everybody had their own way of carrying their stuff. Some people had backpacks. Some people had bags. He chose a briefcase,” she recalled.

And she has a little bit more to say.

Adam Lanza had a small circle of friends at school, according to Emily Edgerton, a former classmate who took an honors math class with him. Adam Lanza was a member of the tech team, a group of students who run a public access television station at Newtown High.
She remembered him as highly intelligent but socially awkward.

Now I was not going to post this. But that one phrase she says really bothers me.

“When I heard about what happened, I guess it was a little more understandable that it was him compared to other people. But I still was surprised because I did not feel like anybody I had ever met in my life had the capability to do something like this, emotional problems or not.”

Strange? Here is the real kicker. She is the one who cheered on the other 6 people as they did that to a sixteen year old kid at Newtown HS in 2008.

Here is the court document wanting her school records from the lawsuit that followed what happened.

civilinquiry.jud.ct.gov...

1. Records of Christopher Basso. The defendant, Town of Newtown Board of Education, shall produce
all Basso’s transcripts, attendance and disciplinary records.
2. Records of Matthew Cluff. The defendant, Town of Newtown Board of Education, shall produce all
Cluff’s transcripts, attendance and disciplinary records.
3. Records of Michael Coates. The defendant, Town of Newtown Board of Education, shall produce all
Coate’s transcripts, attendance and disciplinary records.
4. Records of Emily Edgerton. The defendant, Town of Newtown Board of Education, shall produce all
Edgerton’s transcripts, attendance and disciplinary records. The defendant shall not disclose Planning
and Placement Team records.
5. Records of Kenton Lord. The defendant, Town of Newtown Board of Education, shall produce all
Lord’s transcripts, attendance and disciplinary records. The defendant shall not disclose Planning and
Placement Team records.
6. Records of Alan Ritche. The defendant, Town of Newtown Board of Education, shall produce all
Ritche’s transcripts, attendance and disciplinary records.
7. Records of Mark Scheunemann. The defendant, Town of Newtown Board of Education, shall produce
all Scheunemann’s transcripts, attendance and disciplinary records.

Here is the other court record.
civilinquiry.jud.ct.gov...

So she was charged with a felony for a crime on a fellow student. Who was the fellow student?

JBA2848
When Adam first came to the school he tried getting in but was confronted by the Principal who would not open the door. The Psychiatrist then came to the front entry to see what the yelling was and to try to talk Adam down who was still locked outside the school. At this time the police were called to say some one was outside the school demanding to come in. Then Adam retrieves his weapons and returns to the front entry way and begins kicking and then starts shooting the glass window. The police are now called again to say he is shooting his weapon at the front door and breaking in. The original police called are approaching the driveway to the school and are told shots have been fired wait for back up. They stay at the end of the drive way. Paramedics are told to position at the firehouse a short distance from the drive way. Adam enters the school and starts firing. Police are still waiting for back up. State police show up as back up so the Local Police and State Police move down the driveway and approach the school. Firing has already stopped. The State and Local Police then enter the building from three positions.

I'm glad you caught that because it's not there anymore.
How long did they wait?
Doesn't this also contradict that the principal was in a meeting room with the school psychologist and 2 or 3 other women when they heard the glass break and came out the door only to be face to face with the shooter?

I agree this book is playing fast and loose with the "facts".
Lanza couldn't have shot 6 or 8 bullets from the Bushmaster in 1 second. There was no bumpfire stock, this was a standard AR15 requiring him to pull the trigger once for every shot.
That kind of hyperbole is lying.

All good questions you ask - the thing is should he be sued how could the suit be resolved without calling witnesses to testify?

Much is what he writes is invented history created from a bare skeleton of known events. Did Dawn Hochsprung really lunge at the gunman? How could he interview witnesses without running afoul of Lt. Vance? Or did they allow him?

Lanza's Lair , don't you mean typical teenager's bedroom?

I hope nobody buys this book because it's bound to full of creative fantasies by the author.
Will he get the same criticism that online truth seekers get or does he get a pass because he's published by Simon & Schuster?

Glad you found that.
Thanks.