Atheists are actually Christians....

reply to post by FlyersFan

Atheists don't come out in Islamic lands because THEY WOULD BE MURDERED by Islamic religious nutters who think they are the only ones who are right.

And christians were persecuted in ATHEIST Russia, a few decades ago. But I am sure you would rathEr support the atheists than your own kind.

windword
I'm not an atheist though, because I do believe in a spiritual hierarchy, mysticism, angels and/or spiritual guides and in reincarnation.

Umm yes you are...

Atheism is the rejection of claims made for God/s, nothing more nothing less.

Believing in angels, spirits, mysticism or reincarnation doesn't change that.

Why are people still unwilling to describe themselves as atheist?

I guess the religous propaganda about us eating babies is still working in some places..........

Aphorism
reply to post by adjensen

 

Arguably the result of an aging population and the fact that the US has the highest rate of incarceration in the world. But I think it is naive to think that the US is a safer place today than it was in the 1950s, as I stated earlier.

Anything to offer besides conjecture?

No, not really, just a feeling that there is something different about the nature of violence in America that is not reflected by the statistics, but I don't really have the time and/or interest in digging through the numbers to see if that's borne out.

reply to post by Prezbo369


I keep having to remind people that disbelief in a god and disbelief in anything else do not go hand in hand. One can be atheist and still have a hundred spiritual ideas to believe in.

sk0rpi0n
And christians were persecuted in ATHEIST Russia, a few decades ago. But I am sure you would rathEr support the atheists than your own kind.

In atheist Russia? Or was it Stalin Russia? Yes he was an atheist, and he also had a moustache but neither has anything to do with the persecution.

Islam on the other hand.........remind me what the penalty for apostasy is in Islam?

A handshake and good wishes? A pat on the back and a going away gift?

OT:

The world has never been in a better state, there's less wars happenening than ever before in recorded history, crime and violent crime is at an all time low and now we've strarted to remove the shackles of religion we've finally gotten rid of a massive amount of prejudice in the form of sexism, homophobia and racism.

We still have a long way to go, but it's progress nonetheless

FlyersFan
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Like I said ... take it up with the studies that were done. Skorpion was wrong (again) when he said there was no correlation between education and religious beliefs. I gave the information. The fact is that there is a correlation. That's just the way it is.

There is SOLID Correlation, Look up Helmuth Nyborg. He has done studies that show Athiests are on average 1.95 IQ points higher than agnostics, 3.82 points higher than liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than dogmatic persuasions.

Here is a direct Quote from one such study conducted by Regan Clark from UCDavis,

RELIGIOUSNESS, SPIRITUALITY, AND INTELLIGENCE The main purpose of the study was to determine whether religiosity is negatively related to intel - ligence, and if it is, whether the same negative relationship exists for spirituality. I also wanted to know whether a well-validated measure of intelligence, the WAIS-III, would reveal a negative relation between religiosity and intelligence. The findings indicated that religious participants did have significantly lower QSAT scores than members of the other three relationship-to-God categories (spiritual, agnostic, and atheist). This result suggests that religious individuals are somewhat lower in quantitative ability, perhaps suggesting less rigor in certain kinds of reasoning. This pattern did not extend to the other relationship- to-God categories, suggesting that there is something special about the people who identified themselves as religious.

Here is the LINK to the paper.

What gets me is that if your not prescribed to a major western religion you are ruled out of being in higher end government. You will never find a political candidate running under the "Athiest" Flag, so are we cutting off our noses despite our face?

-Mus

Prezbo369

windword
I'm not an atheist though, because I do believe in a spiritual hierarchy, mysticism, angels and/or spiritual guides and in reincarnation.

Umm yes you are...

Atheism is the rejection of claims made for God/s, nothing more nothing less.

Believing in angels, spirits, mysticism or reincarnation doesn't change that.

This is true, I guess. But not for me.

I do believe in a "god", but not in any god that is described in the Bible or any other religious text.

My belief and definition of "God" revolves around a personal experience. There is an ultimate conscience and spiritual unity, in which all things resonate in one "voice", in my opinion.

Why are people still unwilling to describe themselves as atheist?

I guess the religous propaganda about us eating babies is still working in some places..........

LOL! Star for this!

My daughter is an atheist. She and I just don't see eye to eye on spiritual matters. She believes that all "mysticism" can be explained by brain chemicals. I think there's more. She's unabashedly unashamed to call her self an atheist, and I'm proud to claim that "My daughter is a thinking atheist".

But the term doesn't apply to me.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


DEFLECTION. Admit that you were, yet again, totally wrong about why there aren't atheists coming out in the Islamic world. You tried to downplay the reason saying that they weren't put on a pedestal like they supposedly are in the West ... but the REAL REASON is because they are threatened with death and prison and harassment and the laws are stacked against them in Islamic countries. You really shouldn't keep on telling lies to protect Islam. Lies are a 'sin', ya' know.

reply to post by spartacus699

Just because you say "there's nothing there" doesn't make it valid. Over a billion people would say you're wrong and several other billion more would say "there's something there" (maybe not the christian God, but a God). But you know more than all them right? The fact is there's tons and tons of stuff in the universe that man can't easily explain. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Like what is a Ghost? How does gravity work and what powers it? What caused the big bang? And theres' tons of unexplained things that we have some evidence about, although we don't know how it all works. But that doesn't mean it's not real or doesn't exist.

If there was something there you should be able to point it out. It's quite simple really. If you can't do that, then yes, saying nothing is there is quite valid.

However, saying something is there, when there is clearly not, isn't. In fact, that is dishonesty.

reply to post by windword


Hmm. We have an interesting burr in the bush here, so to speak. Why do you call this being a "god"? What is a god in your opinion, and how does such a being qualify as one? Remember, the word "god" is just a catch-all for "ruler" or "supreme power". It's a rather narrow term, actually - particularly given that just because an animal is a dog does not mean there aren't a hundred differences between a Schnauzer and a Great Dane. So perhaps you should explain what you mean in terms other than "god" to avoid misunderstandings, assumptions and preconceptions.

reply to post by Prezbo369

Why are people still unwilling to describe themselves as atheist?

It is a form of slander invented by religions in power to spurn and demonize those who don't believe in the prevailing doctrines. It's like calling oneself a "cur" or infidel or anything of lesser sort. It is accepting a religious rhetorical tool as if it was a badge of honor. It is the reason priests see you as lesser.

reply to post by Aphorism

It is a form of slander invented by religions in power to spurn and demonize those who don't believe in the prevailing doctrines. It's like calling oneself a "cur" or infidel or anything of lesser sort. It is accepting a religious rhetorical tool as if it was a badge of honor. It is the reason priests see you as lesser.

I fail to see how I am lesser when they are the ones clinging piteously to their balls and chains. It is a fine thing to laugh and scorn me for treating my spiritual independence as a matter of achievement, when they treat their addiction as a matter of pride.

Aphorism

It is a form of slander invented by religions in power to spurn and demonize those who don't believe in the prevailing doctrines. It's like calling oneself a "cur" or infidel or anything of lesser sort. It is accepting a religious rhetorical tool as if it was a badge of honor. It is the reason priests see you as lesser.

Maybe 500 years ago, but since the late 18th-century it's been used as the self-avowed and practical term used today (disbelief in God). Anybody using it today as an insult is using it incorrectly or dishonestly.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Slave owners don't fear men who call themselves slaves.

reply to post by Prezbo369

Anybody using it today as an insult is using it incorrectly or dishonestly.

I just find it ironic that even with the label, submission to the church is apparent.

reply to post by Aphorism

Slave owners don't fear men who call themselves slaves.

I have a hard time deciding, actually. Is the best slave the man who doesn't know it, or the man who relishes it?

reply to post by AfterInfinity


The one who is proud to be a slave I suppose.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


There is no guy in the sky, watching over us, making sure that we keep his 10 Commandments. Everything is part of God and God is in everything. God is the conscious unity of all things.

I have no use for a creator god, as I see God as a self creating consciousness , rising out of it's own self awareness.

reply to post by windword

windword
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

There is no guy in the sky, watching over us, making sure that we keep his 10 Commandments. Everything is part of God and God is in everything. God is the conscious unity of all things.

I have no use for a creator god, as I see God as a self creating consciousness , rising out of it's own self awareness.

Wouldn't God use an Avatar to represent himself?

If you made a cool game, wouldn't you want to play it??



Amazing thread OP.

The title was total troll but you had a beautiful message. Great Technique!!

reply to post by AbleEndangered

Wouldn't God use an Avatar to represent himself?

I have a better question: if there were a god...why would he think like a human? Because that question you're asking, that's a human question. Wanting to be represented is a human desire. Humans invented democracy. You have not a clue how a god would think, because you've never spent a single second as a god or anything even close.

So my answer to you is - I really can't say. And guess what? Neither can you.

If you made a cool game, wouldn't you want to play it??

Again, speaking as though, if God were to truly exist, he would think like you or me. Have the same desires, urges, instincts, the same general psychology and emotional dynamic. What gives you any idea he would feel that way? And yet you just presume that he does. Such arrogance.