How does Blood save?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

So we must eat Jesus' flesh and drink his blood to become pure? Sounds a bit vampire-ish and morbid to me.

It is vampire-ish. Welcome to reality. To live, you must eat the living.

11) Jesus said, "This heaven will pass away, and the one above it will pass away. The dead are not alive, and the living will not die. In the days when you consumed what is dead, you made it what is alive. When you come to dwell in the light, what will you do? On the day when you were one you became two. But when you become two, what will you do?"

-- The Gospel of Thomas # 11

www.sacred-texts.com...

I thought you said that God doesn't want us to consume life?

God doesn't want man to consume the life of creatures lower than man. They are filled with animal passions.

If we drink Jesus' blood, aren't we going against God's wish for us not to consume life? Because, as you said, the spirit/life is within the blood.

But, you are drinking the blood of a being "more pure" than you. So, you're moving "upscale", and not corrupting your own spirit.

I see this kind of thing a lot with Christians, they say one thing one second then the opposite the next.

They use metaphors. The blood of Christ is the spirit. You don't actually go find Jesus the man, put a syringe into his veins, and extract a pint of blood to drink. You breathe in his spirit.

Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

-- Revelation 3:20

Jesus is there waiting, patiently, until you invite him in. Then the two of you have "supper", feeding on each others spirit. You taste a bit of his spirit [blood], he tastes a bit of your spirit [blood]. And in this way, he elevates you up to a higher state of being.

Matthew 9
13 But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

If Jesus says he desires mercy and not sacrifice, then why did he require both cruelty and sacrifice during his crucifixion to forgive our sins? The whole crucifixion scenario doesn't line up with his teachings.

Jesus is the sacrifice. You don't have to sacrifice. The spirit of the righteous is already pure. Only the sinners need to be elevated.

reply to post by SQUEALER

The blood of Christ is the spirit.

Not according to him...

He said his words are spirit and life.... Not his blood...

And before you quote John 6... Jesus was speaking metaphorically...

He did not mean you have to drink his blood or eat his flesh to have eternal life... There is a deeper meaning to what he said...

You don't have to sacrifice

That is also incorrect... but the sacrifice should come from within...

Covered in earlier pages... and in the OP

Originally posted by Akragon

This is why I quoted Jesus a few replies back... Nothing that you eat can defile you...

And that is because Life is not within the blood... blood is part of the material world... not part of the spiritual world... There is nothing spiritual about blood... The spirit of a person is not held in the blood...

There is symbolism. A language is necessary to approach the truth. You cannot understand reality without using a sequence of steps, that refine ideas, and develop analogies, in order to arrive at a comprehension of what is going on.

All is illusion.

But, the illusion has form, patterns, structure, order, and mechanisms of operation.

All understanding is based on adapting a pattern that you already learned, to explain a new thing by "analogy".

reply to post by SQUEALER

All understanding is based on adapting a pattern that you already learned, to explain a new thing by "analogy".

So why explain a new thing by referring to an old outdated thing?

Originally posted by Akragon

You don't have to sacrifice

That is also incorrect... but the sacrifice should come from within...

No. You don't have to sacrifice anything.

You have to give up attachments.

Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

-- 2 Timothy 2:22

Unless you want to think of giving up attachments as "sacrificing".

Then we're just playing with words.

reply to post by SQUEALER


Aren't vampires considered to be "dead" though? The dead walking is not reality at all. You have made your own reality or conformed to someone else's.

I don't agree that any animal is inferior to us, they are no less important than we are. If they are inferior, then why do we require them to live? It's called the food chain, and it is connected in every aspect, meaning if one link breaks, then the whole chain falls apart. Nothing is inferior in this world.

But you say that we're not actually drinking his blood, so how exactly are we drinking his blood? You know sacramental wine drank during Eucharist? It's supposed to be a metaphor for Jesus' blood right? Here's a little something for you from Revelation dealing with the whore of Babylon:

Revelation 18
3 For all the nations have drunk the maddening wine of her adulteries. The kings of the earth committed adultery with her, and the merchants of the earth grew rich from her excessive luxuries."

Can you make that connection between the whore and Eucharist as I have?

If Jesus is god and Jesus doesn't desire sacrifice, then why did god (Jesus) desire to sacrifice himself? He says quite plainly that HE does not desire sacrifice.

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by SQUEALER

 

All understanding is based on adapting a pattern that you already learned, to explain a new thing by "analogy".

So why explain a new thing by referring to an old outdated thing?

Because the blood is understood as the life of the animal, and is a good metaphor for the spirit. If you want to say the word is the life, then remember in the beginning "God said" and all came into being because of that "word".

But, God was alive before he spoke. So the life precedes the word. And the spirit of God moved on the surface of the waters before God spoke, so the spirit is the life.

Originally posted by SQUEALER

Originally posted by Akragon

You don't have to sacrifice

That is also incorrect... but the sacrifice should come from within...

No. You don't have to sacrifice anything.

You have to give up attachments.

Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

-- 2 Timothy 2:22

Unless you want to think of giving up attachments as "sacrificing".

Then we're just playing with words.

*shakes fist*

You people... always quoting paul...

By giving up an "attachment" are you not sacrificing something you want or think you need?

reply to post by SQUEALER


If you think drinking Jesus' blood is metaphor then you are already playing with words.

Originally posted by SQUEALER

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by SQUEALER

 

All understanding is based on adapting a pattern that you already learned, to explain a new thing by "analogy".

So why explain a new thing by referring to an old outdated thing?

Because the blood is understood as the life of the animal, and is a good metaphor for the spirit. If you want to say the word is the life, then remember in the beginning "God said" and all came into being because of that "word".

But, God was alive before he spoke. So the life precedes the word. And the spirit of God moved on the surface of the waters before God spoke, so the spirit is the life.

Read that last line again to yourself... "so the life is the spirit"...

Not the blood...

IF blood holds the life of the animal... Why would God ask you to steal that life from said unfortunate creature?

Would that not break a commandment of this silly God?

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

If Jesus is god and Jesus doesn't desire sacrifice, then why did god (Jesus) desire to sacrifice himself? He says quite plainly that HE does not desire sacrifice.

Jesus said his Father sent him. It's not like he had a choice.

Originally posted by SQUEALER

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

If Jesus is god and Jesus doesn't desire sacrifice, then why did god (Jesus) desire to sacrifice himself? He says quite plainly that HE does not desire sacrifice.

Jesus said his Father sent him. It's not like he had a choice.

IF he had no choice then there was no sacrifice...

He knew he was going to die, and he came anyways...

reply to post by Akragon


I see , so your question 'How doe Blood save?" is not a question at all , but a statement of your beliefs and rather than a question you want an answer to , you made it look like a question but in fact was going to be your interpretation of 'how does blood save'.

I seee ..

Like I said , you and everyone else simply have got it wrong , prefer to continue to kill and eat , quite different from Peter , but hey ..

“Get up, Peter. Kill and eat.”

Three times Peter refused , never did kill and eat.

Originally posted by Akragon


Read that last line again to yourself... "so the life is the spirit"...

Not the blood...

IF blood holds the life of the animal... Why would God ask you to steal that life from said unfortunate creature?

Life is the spirit. Spirit is in the blood. So, life is in the blood. All creatures are created by the same God. It's all still HIS life. HE can do with it as he pleases. It pleases him to create skits for man to enable man to develop the concepts and ideas to eventually understand HIM.

Originally posted by Akragon

Originally posted by SQUEALER

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1

If Jesus is god and Jesus doesn't desire sacrifice, then why did god (Jesus) desire to sacrifice himself? He says quite plainly that HE does not desire sacrifice.

Jesus said his Father sent him. It's not like he had a choice.

IF he had no choice then there was no sacrifice...

He knew he was going to die, and he came anyways...

Jesus had no choice. The Father did have a choice. The Father sacrificed his son.

Originally posted by ironjustice
reply to post by Akragon

 

I see , so your question 'How doe Blood save?" is not a question at all , but a statement of your beliefs and rather than a question you want an answer to , you made it look like a question but in fact was going to be your interpretation of 'how does blood save'.

I seee ..

Like I said , you and everyone else simply have got it wrong , prefer to continue to kill and eat , quite different from Peter , but hey ..

“Get up, Peter. Kill and eat.”

Three times Peter refused , never did kill and eat.

I asked the question because there is no valid answer... Unless one is willing to accept the rule of a tyrant overlord rather then one of peace and love...

One can not Pawn off his sins on another creature by spilling its blood... a persons sins are his own... and destroying a living creature as some sort of remission or debt of ones own sins does nothing...

In short... blood can not save...

We eat meat to survive... we do not kill animals for the pleasure of killing...

Well some do... there are clearly some people who take pleasure in another creatures pain... but I am not one of them...

There are those that give, and those that take... but as he said, a person can only have one lord...

reply to post by SQUEALER


If God desired to sacrifice his son, and Jesus did not desire sacrifice, then how can you believe he was God in the flesh?

If God is perfect and knows all things perfectly, and Jesus disagreed with him on sacrifice, then how can you say Jesus was perfect?

Not saying Jesus wasn't perfect, I believe he was, but your assumption that god desired sacrifice pretty much defeats your own argument, because Jesus did not desire it.

reply to post by SQUEALER

Life is the spirit. Spirit is in the blood. So, life is in the blood. All creatures are created by the same God. It's all still HIS life. HE can do with it as he pleases. It pleases him to create skits for man to enable man to develop the concepts and ideas to eventually understand HIM.

We'll have to agree to disagree...

Jesus had no choice. The Father did have a choice. The Father sacrificed his son.

I personally believe he came of his own Free will...

The Fathers sacrifice was in letting him come to this horrid place to try to help...

reply to post by Akragon


"blood can not save"

We eat meat and the iron FROM the meat causes iron poisoning and in order to remove the iron we donate blood. So , yes blood can save from sin , the sin being , killing and eating the animals.

"We eat meat to survive"

Many people have been vegetarian for generations. We eat meat because we like and want to eat meat.

reply to post by SQUEALER


If Jesus was one with his Father, then how could he have a choice and no choice at the same time? That's circular and illogical thinking.