Introducing "Bibleman"! And a host of other kid-oriented indoctrination tools

reply to post by guitarplayer

Originally posted by guitarplayer
If you want to go tit for tat on wrong doings we'll start with putting children in microwave ovens or cloths dryers. Which to my knowledge no Christian parent has not done.

Do you think that's something to brag about? (By the way, there's a double negative there that means ALL Christian parents do it.)

You said nothing about microwaves or dryers here: reply to post by guitarplayer


You said:

Originally posted by guitarplayer
I do not know any Christian parent that has beat their child and forced them into Chrstianity.

And I showed you AND told you about parents who do. So, you raised the bar to putting kids in microwaves and dryers. Not putting kids in microwaves and dryers is nothing to brag about.

And no. I'm not interested in going tit for tat with anyone. I was simply showing you that there is a large portion of Christians who DO beat their children and use the bible to justify it. Google Christians who beat their children and you'll see what I mean. Deny it of you want, but the truth is the truth.

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes

I could go on, but I think the point is made. I have to ask; is the real objection the toy, or the fact that parents are teaching their children the things they believe? From what I have read, it seems to be the latter, with the toy being simply another small part of the picture. If that's the case, do you not think parents have a right to raise their own children? If that is what you believe, then who does have that right, in your eyes? If the state, then what about when that changes, and whoever is in control no longer has ideas similar to your own? That's a dangerous path.

reply to post by Witness123

My first question to you is this: Are you going to let a bunch of ignorant people separate you from what is true? If you are determined to arrive at the truth of everything, and I believe you are, are you going to let a few of these individuals, because of your dislike of them, turn you away from that?

First, I want to thank you wholeheartedly for taking the time to write out your thinking more fully.
If you want a better idea of who I am, and my "story" (which I have openly and freely shared on ATS all along), have a look at the OP in the thread linked in my signature.

I'm glad to hear that your Baptist church is going the way of warmth, kindness, and all the "right" things. That's laudable and awesome. I was not terrorized in church by any means, but as a little girl all it took was the Creed to instill in me a sense of shame and worthlessness. That was all. JUST RECITING the Creed. No one told me I was worthless or going to hell (until I came on here and started talking about the things I care about! )

You spoke of a class on marriage and parenting. I have been the teacher in those types of classes, I have an advanced degree in Children & Families, counseling, and have worked as a Parent Educator with first-time parents who voluntarily ASKED for help with their newborns. We used the basics of the "Birth to Three" method. I've had dozens of classes for professionals BY professionals, especially in regards to Child Abuse and Early Childhood Development.

So, you see, it's really and truly my profession to study these things and to address them. I am a social worker. MSW.
I know what I'm talking about as well as any other specialist in Children & Families, and I'm a qualified trainer and have spoken at the Prevent Child Abuse Assocation's national convention. My session was on Brain-Training, and working with/parenting Adolescents. My proposal was chosen out of hundreds of anonymously submitted "RFP"s (Requests for Proposals). My session was standing-room-only.

I keep up with things, and pay attention, not because I WAS damaged (although I did have self-esteem issues in Adolescence, AND was mocked, bullied, and ridiculed by the "Mean Girls" in town - but that's another subject) as a kid with indoctrination, but because I CHOSE to study Children & Families.

After working for years in Alternative Schools for kids with "Severe Behavioral and Emotional Disorders." I worked with those kids every day. They trusted me, and told me THEIR horror stories. I SAW their rage, their anxiety, their desperation and pain - every day. All of that - which was "culture shock" to me, as it was in the Urban Core - led me to where I am now:

DETERMINED to prevent the kind of parenting that lands kids in Alternative Schools, labeled with SB/ED, to prevent Jesus Camps and things like Bibleman from corrupting little kids' open, trusting, and totally vulnerable minds.

Now, as to what I see as closest to the "truth":
That we are all 'children' of 'the Universe' - that we cannot, and DO NOT know what, if any "Unmoved Mover" or "Creator Force" is. We can't even describe it, let alone speak to it.

Whatever it is, it is definitely not an old man or a pimped-out white guy handing out judgment from above the clouds, with Jesus on his right hand side watching every move we make. That is, in my view, simple superstition and a means to control the masses who do not have the training, disposition, or temperament to understand the more esoteric and philosophical roots of all of it.

That Jesus's message was plenty. Not Paul, not "The Church" - just the man, Jesus. And as many have pointed out here and in other threads, the problem is with those Megachurch Pastors who are doing what they do TO GET RICH, and a LOT OF THEM KNOW that they are lying. They don't care. Read Klassified's thread as highlighted early in the thread, titled "Preachers Who Don't Believe." Those are the people I'm fighting against.

Not mamabeth, not you two, not the truly loving Christians doing the right thing. ONLY the extremist militants, anywhere.

reply to post by Siberbat

Originally posted by Siberbat
If Jesus were to return today, I believe he would call these apostates sons of serpants, the pastors white washed tombs, and the church a synagage of satan.
...
No, my agitation is not with the atheist, or non-believers, but the apostate Christians.

I starred your post because I couldn't agree more. I have often thought... If everything I learned about Christ in my youth turned out to be true, the vast majority of so-called Christians would NOT make it into heaven.

My agitation is not with the true, loving and non-judgmental Christian (of which there are VERY few). It is with those who USE their religious beliefs as some kind of weapon with which to instill fear, chastise and browbeat others into their way of thinking.

It's nice to meet you, Siberbat.

reply to post by openyourmind1262

There already IS "Koran-man."
I hope you'll take the time to read through the thread. Others have contributed a LOT of good information, videos, snippets and further investigation.
Thanks for your contribution.

reply to post by wildtimes

There already IS "Koran-man." I hope you'll take the time to read through the thread. Others have contributed a LOT of good information, videos, snippets and further investigation.

i read about the 'Koran-man.'
seems odd, i don't know if Islamically its ok but i wonder what he teaches and hope he teaches good things.
Personally i would never get a toy like that for my kids. I like the good old toys.
In Islam its forbidden to make images/figures of beings with soul except for kids to play as toys.

The one thing among the toys shown on this thread that i completely hate is crucifiable Jesus pbuh. That is sick and potentially very dangerous for a child's mind.

I also want to ask Christian posters that, do some churches crucify Jesus pbuh symbolically during some rituals etc?

reply to post by Siberbat

No, my agitation is not with the atheist, or non-believers, but the apostate Christians. The ones who cling to ignorance and their fat cat preachers. The ones who cheer when our country invades other countries and kills millions of inocents...because the buy into the fear from their government and lack faith that God has a plan.

Yes, I absolutely 100% agree with you. Tools like bibleman are harming our children and is promoting something sinister.

Thanks for sharing your opinion. I'm sure we WILL see this all escalate and finally implode - probably in my lifetime. It's gaining momentum, and when I think of the possibility of the Evangelical Theocrats actually RUNNING this society, because they ARE involved in politics, actively so, I get quite disturbed. It seems a forced "backwardness", when what we must have, as this global society Progresses, is "forward" movement appropriate to the incredible things that science, including Social Science and Anthropology have determined by studying the past. Going back to the "past" is a ridiculous notion.

reply to post by logical7


The article from lark news that Theflyingweldsman posted says that Bibleman was in the Middle-east, and went on stage, in his same getup, as "Koran-man", and talked about "Slaying the Infidels" with his light-saber, in front of a group of kids, and they LOVED it.

One can easily imagine Bibleman making similar appearances in Western countries as "slaying the heathens and godless and ANYONE who is not 'Christian' by HIS definition." The little video link that Benevolent Heretic posted of a Bibleman episode from 1999 shows him "killing" the Gossip Queen...melting her with his lightsaber, like the Wicked Witch of the West was melted in the Wizard of Oz.

Another member pointed out he's been around for a LONG time - so that also says something about the phenomenon. I was talking to my husband about it, and he said, "Uh oh. So, now you could be portrayed as "marketing" for them, because you're introduced him at ATS!"

We both laughed, but it's the flip side of the coin. If he's been so little-known, that's probably a good thing. Nevertheless, the Christian Evangelical Far-Right ARE EXTREMISTS, and MILITANTS, and they are trying to infiltrate politics and government, AND THEY ARE making some headway. We have to stand against them - if they are allowed to "govern" this country, it is no longer a free place with separation of Church and State.

The Wizard of Oz shows EVERY YEAR - and as a little kid I watched it, and it terrified me. As an adult, I can see that it's not really a story FOR CHILDREN, but is shown to them throughout their lives. It also can be seen as indoctrination, insidious "programming", as with many "pop culture" phenomena.


EDIT: Sorry, it was Theflyingweldsman who brought the link.

reply to post by wildtimes


Well, toys are for IMAGINARY play now arent they. Enough said. Having an imaginary Bibleman is no different than a Star Wars figure. They both both came from some ones imagination. And have made quite the dollar.

reply to post by openyourmind1262

Originally posted by openyourmind1262
Well, toys are for IMAGINARY play now arent they.

The religion that Bibleman is pushing isn't imaginary.

Having an imaginary Bibleman is no different than a Star Wars figure.

Kids are taught that what Bibleman says is the Truth. They are taught that Star Wars is an imaginary story. Kids are not indoctrinated to believe that Hans Solo is REAL. THAT'S the difference.

reply to post by openyourmind1262


Here is more from the article Tfw posted:

ATLANTA — According to a LarkNews investigation, BibleMan, Christianity’s highest-ranking superhero, has been performing as “Koran-Man” in wealthy Arab nations for nearly a year, banking more than $15 million, including $1 million for a two-hour performance at a Ramadan event in Dubai. The Saudi royal family has paid him at least $3 million to perform at private events for children, and has dedicated a private jet to whisk him to and from Atlanta.

“I’m devastated,” said one of hundreds of distraught fans who flooded blogs with messages.

By Monday, more than 24,000 people had signed an online petition pleading with BibleMan to “abandon the Koran-Man persona forever.”

“BibleMan’s audiences were dwindling in the U.S.,” says Christian superhero expert Dawn Riddel. “Kids suffered ‘superhero fatigue’ after Spider-Man and the Incredibles. BibleMan appears to have felt squeezed out, until he found this lucrative outlet.”

There's a Christian superhero expert? Wow.
Well, the plus side is that his audience IS DWINDLING. (whew!). The down side is he's richer than rich and courting the Saudis, who fly him over to do his "slay the infidels" thing for them. MILLIONS of dollars, 3 ponies, a private jet....

A full investigation revealed that BibleMan had been slipping away to the Middle East dozens of times, returning in time to perform at American churches. He also maintained his superhero responsibilities, catching demented genius scientists and bank robbers, as SuperFriends membership demands.

But the Koran-Man persona grew so popular that it threatened his other activities. On one occasion, the Saudi royal prince put his arm around “Koran-Man,” calling him Arabs’ “great hope,” then gave him three polo ponies and a gold chain worth $500,000. He was forced to stay for an honorary dinner, and missed a performance at Bible Baptist Church in North Platte, Neb.

When confronted by reporters at a private Atlanta airfield in January, BibleMan sped away in a chauffeured Mercedes limousine, but the next day his office issued an apology:

“I created an alter-ego to support my ministry activities. I thought I could use the money for missions,” it read in part. “I made a grave mistake and let my fans down. I am sorry.”

Churches immediately cancelled BibleMan events.

“It’s over for him,” says one pastor. “He is compromised. He might slip up and quote Mohammed.”

But some fans, still reeling from the disclosures, urged people to welcome BibleMan back, so he won’t be tempted to permanently “go Muslim.”

Strangely, there's no date on the linked article. So I don't know (yet) when this happened. Maybe he IS all washed up.

To add to his woes, BibleMan may be booted from the SuperFriends for accepting pay for performances. Furthermore, it is unclear if BibleMan’s Arab benefactors knew of his true Christian identity, and if the revelation will lead to a fatwa, or death sentence, against him. •

"Dear Fans,
This is BibleMan. Recent news reports are true. I created an alter-ego to support my ministry activities. I thought I could use the money for missions. I made a grave mistake and let my fans down. I am sorry.This is a sad time for my family and fellow evangelical superheroes. I ask for privacy to work through these issues. I also say to criminals and mad scientists: this does not affect my ability to fight evil. My superpowers are intact. Be warned.
The rest of you, thanks for your prayers.Signed,
BibleMan"

Scum.

Apparently it was in 2009 that he got busted.
I'm still looking into it.

AND, there is at least one place that is saying it was a "joke." So I really don't know if it's true or not.

reply to post by wildtimes


There is indoctrination everywhere!!!
The extremists in race, religion, nation(nationalism) are teaching to hate the 'others'!
The increasing atheistic and material culture, including 'pop' is teaching to hate/deny God!
The consumer culture is indoctrinating the masses to consume till they drop dead!(an expensive coffin even after death!)

one extreme group is countering the other by their own extreme indoctrination.

All posters on this thread are right in their own way. They are afraid of the 'enemy' extremist group taking over!!

This would not work, extremism cannot be fought with extremism, that will just breed more extremism and widen the divide. It will also slowly polarise the 'yet not extreme' and then it will be hell!

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

Kids are taught that what Bibleman says is the Truth. They are taught that Star Wars is an imaginary story. Kids are not indoctrinated to believe that Hans Solo is REAL. THAT'S the difference.

Are you implying that teaching kids that God is REAL is wrong?
I don't believe what the bibleman says(christian creed) myself but i see(hope i am wrong) that you are hinting that your belief is in some way superior and you definitely know whats real/true and whats not.

reply to post by logical7


It could teach kids some rather irrational ways of dealing with natural imperfections in the human character.

reply to post by wildtimes

Wha else is there??? What else can be used to counter the forced kissing of young schoolgirls to train them in lesbianism??? The public schools have become insane asylums, run by the inmates...

reply to post by logical7

The increasing atheistic and material culture, including 'pop' is teaching to hate/deny God!

log7,

as always, I thank you for your input. However, the statement above is not actually true.

First, I'm not sure you understand what "pop culture" means. It is short for "popular culture" - the music, clothing, movies and TV shows, all of the 'stuff' that gets popular with large groups of people, and makes LOTS OF MONEY for the people who come up with it. It's also very subject to change, and things become fashionable for a while (called a "fad"), and then fade away as something new or more 'interesting' comes along.

Secondly, "atheistic" thinking and "material culture" are two separate things.
The Christian Far-Right have 'worked' the "material pop culture" to line the pockets of pastors as well as the non-Christian media companies that sell this stuff.

Yes, consumerism is a problem, but it's a problem that does not have anything to do with "God." It's about MAKING MONEY.

Atheists come in a wide variety of forms as well. MOST atheists are perfectly normal, moral people who are doing the right thing, NOT BECAUSE GOD SAID SO, and NOT BECAUSE THEY ARE AFRAID OF HELL - but simply because it's the obvious right thing to do. They don't "need" God or church to tell them how to behave. People ARE CAPABLE of being altruistic, gentle, kind, and helpful even without God. And since God can not be "proven" in any reliable way to exist, but it HAS been proven that extreme religious militants DO HARM PEOPLE in the name of their "God," it must be addressed.

reply to post by Iscool

Wha else is there??? What else can be used to counter the forced kissing of young schoolgirls to train them in lesbianism???

Wait.

WHat??
Do you have a link or evidence that ANYONE is trying to "TRAIN girls in lesbianism"? Absurd. Show me, please where this "force" you speak of is happening.

reply to post by logical7

Are you implying that teaching kids that God is REAL is wrong?

I don't know how Ben Heretic will answer this, but I will tell you my opinion:

There is no proof that God is real. That is a fact. No proof. So, teaching kids that God IS real is something that is 'wrong' based on education into how to navigate THE WORLD, where God isn't doing anything visible to "give help" or stop wars, hatred, suffering, starvation....nothing. God's doing nothing. What we see is PEOPLE doing something to help other PEOPLE. That is all the evidence we have. PEOPLE doing things for - or to - other people.

reply to post by logical7

Originally posted by logical7
Are you implying that teaching kids that God is REAL is wrong?

That's not the only thing Bibleman says. He kills people who disagree with him (his "enemies") and justifies it by using the bible. I wouldn't teach my children that something is real when there is no evidence of it. I do think teaching children that the biblical God is real is wrong. But how you teach your children is your business.

I don't believe what the bibleman says(christian creed) myself but i see(hope i am wrong) that you are hinting that your belief is in some way superior and you definitely know whats real/true and whats not.

Quite the opposite. On the subject of deities, I don't know what's true and what's not and that's what I would tell my children. I don't believe in the biblical God, so I wouldn't teach them anything about it. When they came to me with questions, I would answer as honestly as possible.

reply to post by wildtimes


There's plenty of evidence suggesting the Wizard of Oz was a metaphor for the 1900's economic situation.

symbolism.wikia.com...