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What is the desired goal of attempting to appear enlightened?
I do believe everything exists, though perhaps not in a quantifiable fashion. In that respect, I view enlightenment to be in much the same vein as leprechauns. It doesnt exist outside of the mind that is perceiving/creating it. To most, enlightenment is that first time the rope is cut (using the horse story). It is a moment. One that is somehow made more special because of various reasons.
I see it as a realization of a process. One that is ongoing, whether or not it is recognized by the perceiving system. That rope only has the power that we give it. So, in a way, I concede that it exists. But I have my doubts that the universe we are all a part of considers a realization of the innate limitations of being a part of the whole is somehow special or noteworthy. Its a foregone conclusion.
love it. my problem with the scores of people on here who consider themselves 'enlightened' and 'educated' is that as soon as one rejects their opinions and assertions, they immediately retreat to labeling their foe as a sheep, sheeple, or some variation thereof. it's pathetic.
Buddha justified leaving his wife and child to go on a spiritual journey for Enlightenment because he wanted to save them from their superficial lives in the endless circle of life. He wanted to prove that he could break samsara, the circle of life, and lead others to reach Enlightenment.
Yes there is self interest involved in that he wants a complete understanding of the world. There is self interest in the fact that he wants to save his wife and child from a meaningless life.
The question is, is this self interest bad? I will agree that there is self interest involved in pursuing Enlightenment, but again there is self interest involved in everything. In this case I cannot not penalize someone for pursuing Enlightenment out of self interest because it is impossible to pursue it with no self interest.
I am on this forum to "deny ignorance." Is there self interest involved? Absolutely. I dislike ignorant people, and I dislike being ignorant, so I come here to "deny ignorance." Does the fact that there is self interest involved take away from the nobleness of the pursuit of knowledge and understanding? I say not.
Buddha justified leaving his wife and child to go on a spiritual journey for Enlightenment because he wanted to save them from their superficial lives
Does the fact that there is self interest involved take away from the nobleness of the pursuit of knowledge and understanding?
Basically I think true wisdom lies(pun intact) within the absolute obfuscation of the truth to the point that one most then decide for themselves what is the truth. And that of course is my highly unenlightened opinion. LOL
The question is, in this day and age can you claim to become Enlightened and truly be Enlightened? It seems to me one who claims to be Enlightened, as you said, is looking for a justification for their lifelong journey, is vain, and desires a higher self image. It seems to me these are all qualities of someone who is not Enlightened.
So if you are Enlightened you can't tell anyone? I think it makes sense to say that. It also takes a lot of self interest out of attaining the state of Enlightenment... but isn't that the point anyways?
Who is enlightened? Only he who declares himself so. There is no supreme judge who bestows such an honor. There is no voting process through which we can rationally choose and appoint an enlightened individual. Enlightenment is always self-declared, and the enlightened ones are always self-proclaimed. What is the reason behind this proclamation? Why does one have the desire to label himself enlightened?
Could it be that the self-proclaimed enlightened one only wishes to be quantified and referred to as enlightened?
What is the desired goal of attempting to appear enlightened?
- one needs the confirmation of others to justify his way of life and spiritual path. If others agree he is enlightened, he feels better about the choices he has made. - one seeks power or a feeling of self-gratification from being known as enlightened. - one desires followers.
All of these answers point to personal vanity as the insidious desire behind declarations of enlightenment. Could there be other reasons?
Originally posted by 0mage
what does a fish know about the animals that walk the land? and roam the sky? it can only suppose.
a butterfly may have said to a caterpillar, "i was once like you". but the caterpillar did not believe him. but the caterpillar spun his cocoon and became a butterfly and then understood the truth. he then went to a caterpillar and said, "i was once like you". but he knew the caterpillar wouldnt believe him.
Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by abeverage
Basically I think true wisdom lies(pun intact) within the absolute obfuscation of the truth to the point that one most then decide for themselves what is the truth. And that of course is my highly unenlightened opinion. LOL
We share the same opinion. How unenlightened of us.