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FBI: “discs recovered”, Air Force “greatly concerned”, “at a complete loss” + more memos

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posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:19 AM

Part E : Additional files that used to be on the FBI website (not recovered)

Because the FBI has varied the files available on its FOIA websites over the years, I think it is worth noting the following links to indexes of that website at different points over the years:

(1) The fbi alphabetical index as at 2004 is at:

(2) The fbi alphabetical index as at 2010 is at:

(3) An interesting article about the fbi thinning its website (which compares material available at different times) can be found at this link:

Others may be able to spot additional files relevant to UFO research that aren’t on the current FBI website but that can be recovered using the archives at the above links.

One file that appears to have been included in those archives (but I have been unable to recover from the official FBI websites) is the file on Philip Corso (controversial UFO “whistle-blower” and author of the book “The Day after Roswell”) which I’ve been unable to retrieve 42 page file from the link below:

However, a file purporting to be the FBI’s file is available on other websites. While I generally trust one of those websites (the CUFON website, which has a Corso file at the link below) I’d nonetheless still prefer to recover the PDF file from the FBI’s own website at the link above:

Philip Corso is interviewed in the video at the link below:

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:20 AM

Part F : Files on other websites purporting to be FBI releases

Part F1 : Philip Corso

As discussed in Part E above, a file purporting to be the FBI’s file on Philip Corso is available on the CUFON website at the link below:

Part F2 : J Allen Hynek
The CUFON website also has extracts (unfortunately incomplete) from the FBI’s file on ufologist J Allen Hynek at the link below:

Part F3 : Phil Klass
The CUFON website also has a copy of the FBI’s file on UFO skeptic Phil Klass :

That file was discussed by Kevin Randle on his blog in December 2012 at the link below:

According to a Memorandum dated February 21, 1975, Mr. Heim, reported that Klass had called the editor of the FBI Law Enforcement Bulletin. According to that document, Klass, “In strong terms laced with sarcasm, he derided our publication of the article by Dr. J. Allen Hynek, ‘The UFO Mystery,’ in the February, 1975, issue of the LEB. Klass suggested that by publishing this article, the FBI had given its endorsement to a hoax (that UFOs are extra-terrestrial in origin) and to a fraud (Dr. J. Allen Hynek).”

Part F4 : L Ron Hubbard / Church of Scientology

Links between members of the Church of Scientology and ufology (and remote viewing) are a complicated issue. For now, it probably suffices to say that L Ron Hubbard and scientology are discussed in several UFO books and articles.

The archived index of the old FBI FOIA website refers to FBI files on L Ron Hubbard / the Church of Scientology. However, I have not been able to recover those files from the FBI’s websites. I have, however, found a copy of 2,826 pages of FBI documents on L Ron Hubbard and the Church of Scientology released on the Wikileaks website at this link.

Part F5 : Dorothy Kilgallen

Dorothy Kilgallen was an American journalist. She has featured in connection with several UFO stories (in addition to stories about the Kennedy assassination). The wikipedia entry in relation to Dorothy Kilgallen includes the following:

Reporting on UFOs
On February 15, 1954, Dorothy Kilgallen commented in her syndicated column, "Flying saucers are regarded as of such vital importance that they will be the subject of a special hush-hush meeting of the world military heads next summer."
In a May 22, 1955 report from London, syndicated by the INS, Kilgallen stated, "British scientists and airmen, after examining the wreckage of one mysterious flying ship, are convinced these strange aerial objects are not optical illusions or Soviet inventions, but are flying saucers which originate on another planet. The source of my information is a British official of Cabinet rank who prefers to remain unidentified. 'We believe, on the basis of our inquiry thus far, that the saucers were staffed by small men—probably under four feet tall. It's frightening, but there is no denying the flying saucers come from another planet.'" This article, which was separate from Kilgallen's column, appeared on the front pages of the New York Journal American, the Cincinnati Enquirer, and other newspapers. The Washington Post ran it on page 8. Gordon Creighton, editor of the magazine, Flying Saucer Review, alleged the information was given to Kilgallen by Lord Mountbatten of Burma at a cocktail party, but attempts to verify this were unsuccessful.

Dorothy Kilgallen also features in the video below:

A 167 page file relating to Dororthy Kilgallen is listed in this article as having been on the FBI website. While I have seen the file mentioned on one index of the FBI reading room, I have not found a copy in the archived copies of the FBI websites.

However, I have found 4 files on the website at the link below which purport to be the FBI’s files on Dorothy Kilgallen:

Part F6 : James McDonald
Ufologist James McDonald is the subject of a 29 page file mentioned in this article. Again, I have not (yet…) found that file in the archives of the FBI’s various FOIA websites.

However, extracts of that file are available on the CUFON website at the link below:

edit on 6-2-2013 by IsaacKoi because: (no reason given)

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:20 AM

Part G : Files not online purportedly released to some researchers

Various researchers have helpfully shared details pointing towards further FBI relevant to ufology. It seems almost rude to those researchers to fail to follow up on some of their pointers by seeking to make the relevant files easily available online (whether by finding them online and posting relevant links or seeking to put them online by obtaining the files from relevant UFO researchers/groups and/or making focused Freedom Of Information Act request to the FBI itself).

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:20 AM
Part G1 : Files listed by Nick Redfern

In his various books and blog posts, Nick Redfern has written a lot about FBI files on, amongst others, various contactees.

I found one very useful online list by Nick Redfern of "people and groups who have been the subject of files (whether FBI, CIA, Special Branch etc.) that have been declassified and are in now in my possession".

For ease of use, I've put the relevant link into alphabetical order and added links to relevant files when I've been able to find them online so far.

This list should prove very useful as a starting point in putting together a fuller archive of FBI documents in relation to individuals relevant to the history of ufology.

At the very least, this list could provide the basis for further Google searches, requests to UFO groups/researchers and – if necessary - focused Freedom Of Information Act requests to the FBI.

Adamski, George (Contactee);
Arnold, Kenneth (Mr. UFO, of course);

Barker, Gray (MIB author);
Bender, Albert (MIB witness and author);
Bennewitz, Paul (scientist);
Berney, Harold (cold-hearted crook and claimed Conactee)
Bethurum, Truman (met a shapely space-babe in the 50s; or so he claimed).
Bush, Vannevar (alleged player in the MJ12 saga);

Cathie, Bruce (author of Harmonic 33 and other titles);
Conrad, Mikel (actor, film-director);
Corso, Philip (The Day After Roswell co-author);

Crisman, Fred (of the Maury Island caper);

Crowley, Aleister (invoker of the alien-Gray-like Lam);

Dick, Philip K. (science-fiction author);

Edwards, Frank (of Flying Saucers – Serious Business);

Fry, Daniel (Contactee);

Goff, Oliver Kenneth (ufological evangelist);
Gleason, Jackie (actor, allegedly saw alien corpses);
Gebauer, Leo (Aztec UFO crash player);

Hynek, J. Allen (of the Air Force, CUFOS, and author of The Hynek UFO Report and The UFO Experience);
Hynek FBI file extracts:

Jessup, Morris (author and player in the Philadelphia Experiment story);

Kilgallen, Dorothy (journalist and teller of crashed UFO story);

King, George (Contactee) and the Aetherius Society;

Maier, Mildred and Maier, Marie (UFO researchers of the 50s);

McDonald, James (ufological legend);
FBI file extracts at:

Menzel, Donald (alleged player in the MJ12 saga);

National Investigations Committee on Aerial Phenomena (NICAP);

Newton, Silas (Aztec UFO crash player);

Parsons, Jack (legendary rocket-man and occultist);

Rea, Charles E. (referenced in one of the Tim Cooper/MJ12 papers);

Reich, Wilhelm (of Orgone fame);

Sagan, Carl (scientist);

Scully, Frank (author of Behind the Flying Saucers);

Stranges, Frank (Contactee);

Stringfield, Leonard (crashed UFO researcher and author);

Swan, Frances (UFO/alien channeler);

Tesla, Nikola (brilliant scientist);
FBI file at:

Valdez, Gabe (New Mexico State Police and cattle-mutes);

Van Tassel, George (Contactee);

von Karman, Theodore (player in the Project Twinkle investigations of the late 1940s);

Williamson, George Hunt (Contactee);

edit on 6-2-2013 by IsaacKoi because: (no reason given)

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:20 AM
Part G2 : Jan Aldrich’s list

The Project 1947 website referred to above includes Jan Aldrich’s list of “Government Folder Headings”.

That list includes several entries relating to the FBI:
FBI Field Offices (rt)
FBI Green Fireball Documents (bh)
FBI UFO Records, Chicago, IL (bh)
FBI UFO Records, Los Angeles, CA (bh)
FBI UFO Records, Omaha, NE (bh)
FBI UFO Records Philadelphia, Pennsylvania (bh)
FBI UFO Records, Seattle, WA (bh)
FBI, Mail Cover/Mail Intercept Operations (rt)
LTC Phillip J. Corso, FBI file (wl, lb, apb)
James V. Forrestal, FBI file (bh)
Dr. J. Allen Hynek, FBI File (bh)
Dr. Howard Menzel, Boston FBI file (bh)
Dr. Howard Menzel, FBI file (bh)
Dr. Nikola Tesla, FBI file (rt)
FBI Bulletins # 42 and #57, 1947 (ja)
FBI Field Office UFO Records (bh)
FBI Records on UFO, 1947 (bg)
FBI Records Released by the US Army (bh)
FBI, UFO Documents in FBI files referred to other agencies (rt)
FBI files and FOIA History (rt)

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:20 AM
Part G3 : Barry Greenwood’s list

The Project 1947 website also includes a list of folder headings in the government file holdings of Barry Greenwood. Again, that list includes a few entries relating to the FBI:
1975 Overflights (Greenwood Files)
Loring AFB: FBI
Malmstrom AFB: FBI

1975 Overflights (Todd Files):

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:20 AM

Part H: Conclusion

Some UFO groups seem to be so busy publicising petitions calling on Governments to release UFO documents (petitions, incidentally, that usually prominently feature the name of the relevant UFO group or its director and often seem to serve merely as a way for them to get publicity…) that they don’t seem to have the time to read UFO documents that actually have been released by government agencies or to follow up issues arising from those documents. It’s enough to make someone wonder whether some of those involved in UFO groups are merely seeking to obtain some publicity for themselves rather than actually wanting to see any progress.

I hope that this thread helps prompt more of an effort to obtain (and make available searchable PDF copies of) other FBI files of interest to ufologists not explicitly labelled "UFO" by the FBI, e.g. files relating to specific contactees/witnesses and UFO researchers. Various researchers (particularly Nick Redfern) have written about such files and some relevant files are identified in this thread. I think ufology would benefit from full copies of relevant files being easily accessible (rather than merely summaries of them).

I hope that those members that are already fairly familiar with the FBI documents relating to UFOs which are already available online focus on taking forward the issues arising from Part F and (particularly) Part G above.

The material above in Part F and Part G (particularly the latter) should, at the very least, give some ideas for focused Freedom Of Information Act requests to the FBI, so that complete copies of the files mentioned in those categories can be added to the above collection of files.

It is fairly easy to make FOIA requests to the FBI via a page on its website at the link below:

edit on 6-2-2013 by IsaacKoi because: (no reason given)

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:21 AM

Part I : References

Links to download searchable collection of FBI documents mentioned in the introduction to this thread:

The FBI’s current FOIA website:

The FBI’s previous FOIA website:

References to discussion of Hoover’s “access to discs recovered” memo:

Berlitz, Charles and Moore, Bill in their “The Roswell Incident“ (1980) at pages 140-142 (in Chapter 8) of the Granada hardback edition (with the same page numbering in the Granada paperback edition).

Maccabee, Bruce in his “UFO-FBI Connection” (2000) at pages 6-7 (in Chapter 1), with image of relevant document at page 292 (in Appendix 2) of the Llewellyn softcover edition.

Randle, Kevin and Schmitt, Donald in their “The Truth About the UFO Crash At Roswell” (1994) at pages 91-93 (in Chapter 13) with image at page 200 (in Appendix C) of the Evans hardback edition.

Randle, Kevin in his “The Roswell Encyclopedia” (2000) at pages 142-144 (in an entry entitled “Hoover Note”) of the Quill softcover edition.

Redfern, Nicholas in his “The FBI Files” (1998) at page 7 (in Chapter 1) of the Simon & Schuster softcover edition, with the same page numbering in the Pocket Books paperback edition.

References to discussion of the Guy Hottel memo in various books:

References to discussion of the toilet seat upset memos in various books:

References to discussion of the Socorro sighting in various books:

References to discussion of the Desvergers scoutmaster sighting in various books:

Further details of the “alien” photo in the FBI files:

CUFON website:

Nick Redfern’s main blog:

Nick Redfern’s Facebook page:

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:21 AM

Part J : Postscript

I think it’s time for me to watch the “X-Files” again...

I haven’t watched it since it was first broadcast.

I’m looking forward to it.

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:28 AM
reply to post by IsaacKoi

Wow if that's not an ATS record thread I'll eat my hat....sticky this now , took me over 5 mins to star and no doubt It'll a fair while to get through it so this post is just a pat on the back .... well done

And already something new and interesting ,Dorothy Kilgallen and the Caldbeck UFO 1954 ... I must admit I've never heard of either of them before today but what an interesting case ,

edit on 6-2-2013 by gortex because: Edit to add

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:42 AM
Stellar work IsaacKoi

I will sink my teeth into this info later when I get the time.

Something tells me that I will be visiting this thread for quite a while.

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 09:56 AM
THANK YOU!!!! You have restored my faith in ATS.

I can now spend the rest of the week pouring over this thread instead wasting time on some of the paranoid, fear-mongering wacky threads going on now. Super, super job.

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:01 AM
Great Post! S & F...Thanks OP for all your research & hard work in order to
share a wealth of information. I'm looking forward to many visits to your thread...


posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:04 AM
Great contribution, IsaacKoi.

Flag and a bunch of stars.

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:11 AM
very impressive! For any beginner this should definately be their holy grail! As with other's i'll spend quite a bit of time reading all this....A GIANT THANKS FOR THE HARD WORK AND RESEARCH!!!

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:25 AM
reply to post by IsaacKoi

So much information... Congrats on your effort to organize known evidence from your government..

I'd like to share unexplained episode of an UFO sighting, brought up by the Portuguese Military Air Force that should be an example of cooperation with scientific comunity...

(watch vídeo from 00:00 to 22:40 min)

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:25 AM
reply to post by IsaacKoi

Whoa... Guess I'll jump right in.. Willhelm Reich eh?? You have sparked my interest..
I wonder if the files from the FBI are just criminal investigation for selling "illegal" medical devices, or if it gets to the goods?

I'll post back in a year when I have gone through it all.. Wow..

Bandwidth seems Nice too.

Looking at just about 2 minutes to grab it all.

Who is jack parsons? I have heard that name so many times, but never knew who he was?

And there are FBI files on Sagan?

WAIT am I missing a File?? There doesn't seem to be a Reich 5 a, just 5 b, and 5 c

So Hoover was involved in locking up Reich? How long was he at the FBI? Looks like they started looking into him based on the fact he was in the American communist party. hmm.
edit on 2/6/2013 by Dustytoad because: (no reason given)

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:26 AM

Originally posted by xpoq47
Flag and a bunch of stars.

Thanks xpoq47, and others, for the kind words and flags/stars.

Flags matter to me on a thread like this one because the more flags the thread gets, the more attention it (probably) will get from members of ATS and that increases the number of people that may help out with a bit of work on the possible follow-up research and action indicated in this thread (particularly in Part G and Part H).

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:44 AM
reply to post by IsaacKoi

Great post s&f
you just defined why I joined ATS
The “Koi Alien Photo 04" ? I guess that's a real alien in that picture, looks like its handcuffed and got air respiration module attached to face, perhaps its the alien from "alien interview"

edit on 6-2-2013 by Spacespider because: (no reason given)

posted on Feb, 6 2013 @ 10:48 AM

Originally posted by Dustytoad
Bandwidth seems Nice too.

Looking at just about 2 minutes to grab it all.

Good to know. Thanks. The issue with files mentioned in one of my previous threads emerged after a few hours, when my bandwidth limit was reached due to the number of people downloading those files. Hopefully I've avoided that issue this time by giving links to two different websites that now host the relevant FBI files.

Who is jack parsons? I have heard that name so many times, but never knew who he was?

I've just added a Wikipedia link to the description of him (and other links relating to him) in Part D1 above. (Unless you've read Nick Redfern's book "Final Events", it's unlikely that you would have previously heard of Jack Parsons in a UFO context. However, he is a main character in the story told in that book, so I thought it worth including him).

And there are FBI files on Sagan?

Well, the file relates to Sagan but isn't exactly on him. As mentioned above, the documents relate to predictions of criminal activity that were received by Sagan (but the file is labelled as a Carl Sagan file on the FBI's website).

WAIT am I missing a File?? There doesn't seem to be a Reich 5 a, just 5 b, and 5 c

Many thanks for pointing that out. I'm not sure what happened there, but I've now added the "Reich 5a" file to both the link and the Skydrive link given in the introduction to this thread. Sorry about that.

edit on 6-2-2013 by IsaacKoi because: (no reason given)

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