stanton friedman finally admits

reply to post by xszawe


The MJ-12 documents are actually a FAKE. This does not mean such a group did not exist as they did. What happened was a person or I believe Persons....who were very active in the UFO community had found information through several sources detailing to a very MINOR extent about Truman's directive to IKE to form a group of various experts from all pertaining fields that could possibly be associated in their fields to developing Protocols on how to deal with any form of Alien Encounter.

These Protocols needed to consider everything from how the various selected groups of the U.S. Government, Military, Intelligence and Scientific Research...would respond and handle any Alien Encounter. IKE was ordered to create such a Committee specific for developing such Response Protocols.

The FBI was left out of this and J. Edgar Hoover was LIVID as there was already a growing Battle between Hoover and General Curtis LeMay...the founder of SAC or Strategic Air Command and famous for his...BOMB THEM BACK TO THE STONE AGE...statement. LeMay had refused to allow Hoover access to the recovered Alien materials and bodies that were flown from Roswell to the at the time...Wright Field...which later became...Wright Patterson USAF Base...home to the United States Reverse Engineering Group that is responsible for reaserch of any captured or recovered Aircraft or Space Craft or Satellites that are not American.

LeMay...sick of Hoover's threats called IKE about the issue and both IKE and Truman had a talk with Hoover who STILL did not back off. Hoover did back off when IKE became President and basically threatened Hoover with Life in Prison if he did not SHUT UP and stop talking about the issue as well as sending threatening letters and investigating and then threatening ANYONE involved it anything to do with E.T. Hoover went so far as to label some Military Officers and various Civillians that were involved as COMMUNISTS in order to get them to talk...but since these people were sworn to an oath that was PUNISHABLE BY DEATH if they spoke about anything related to E.T....Hoover could do nothing to get them to speak.

The MJ-12 documents were falsified by these people in the UFO community as although these people had through various forms of research and interviews of now very old former players in the eventually created Agency that was developed and created by this Committee that IKE was ordered to create...these people could not find any REAL DOCUMENTED PROOF through any means including the Freedom of Information act that did in fact provide some documents of various other UFO related matters.

So although something like MJ-12 did exist...the famous documents are a fake.

Split Infinity

reply to post by InhaleExhale


All I can remember is the name Dark Skies but it sounds like my sort of show, I will have to hunt it down and watch it someday when I find time.
I think your right about movies, books and TV shows, it makes people think it's just science fiction.
" What is there to know?" The truth is all I want, I had two sightings last year but they didn't stop to chat so I don't know any more than anyone else, I'm pleased they didn't take me though.

Originally posted by JayinAR

mj12
roswell
eisenhower
he tells all finally

If I were gonna guess, I would say he probably asserts that he has uncovered info that proves none of these things have any legitimacy whatsoever. Haha

Yeah, I'd have to say if I saw that list and the come-on "Stanton Friedman tells all finally", that he's going to say "I confess, I made all this crap up and on top of that, half of the "evidence" I'm presenting is something I made on an old Olivetti and a mimeo machine I got at a garage sale."

reply to post by SplitInfinity


I would like to read more on some of the information you present. Sounds like maybe it came from a book? Or is it information you've pieced together yourself? Do you have links or references?

reply to post by SplitInfinity


I will second the poster asking for a source here. That sounds like an awful lot of "I know this to be the case."

reply to post by xszawe


Dammit! I was expecting something real juicy like he admits to being a disinformation agent or something. Oh well, as they say

The MJ-12 documents are actually a FAKE. This does not mean such a group did not exist as they did. What happened was a person or I believe Persons...

Hey split, quit throwing grenades in the room. You "believe" is subjective...

On topic...

Thanks ATS for ironing this out.

Isn't Friedman the one who got MJ 12 roll of microfilm or some such in his mailbox and that is his claim to fame?
Originally?

That has nothing to do with Area 51 Lazar... But I love the way he discredits him. Whether Friedman is genuine or not I agree with his assessment of Lazar. Captain Dis-info.

reply to post by Ex_CT2


This information I learned of over some time when I acted in a capacity in my sometimes...JOB.

Some of this can be found in the Freedom of Information released documents...especially about Hoover and LeMay. There are actual letters written by both to each other that show how pissed off each were.

There is some documentation that connects a Presidential Directive that was sent to IKE for the purpose of giving him official documentation to allow him to literally PICK UP WITH M.P.'s ANYONE that was deemed necessary to this committee.

There is also some information that documents how as the Freedom of Information Act was about to take place...several Intelligence Groups along with the DIA...were FREEKING OUT as they had forgotten about some Government File Storage Facility that was publically known about and although they had destroyed all Computer Files...they forgot about very old PAPER FILES at this storage facility.

So being it last minute...they picked up the filed and Dumped them into the Dept. of Agriculture Files Storage Facility in the Midwest Farm Belt and they sat amongst countless other files about Agriculture and Farming until a few years later...BY COMPLETE CHANCE...someone looking for old files detailing U.S. Territorial Boundries and the land given away to Citizens that claimed a plot for farming....this person stumbled on to files detailing information about Alien Visitation.

After all...who would look in the Dept. of Agricultures 1800's files for UFO information?

Split Infinity

reply to post by JayinAR


I detailed what I know in the previous reply to the other person asking.

Split Infinity

reply to post by intrptr


I honestly am not sure if it was more than one person but I believe there were more than one that created the fake MJ-12 documents that were placed in his mailbox.

As I said...just because the documents were a fake doesn't mean that MJ-12...that name is probably a fake too...was not real as there is evidence to show it did exist that were found in the Dept. of Agriculture files.

If you think about it...although various details such as the letters between Hoover and LeMay which are real as well as other documents that show logistics and other followed orders being sent and followed...how is it that a Document that is quite possibly something that would have Ultra-Top Secret Classification just appears in his mailbox?

Something of this nature would NEVER be documented never mind available for someone to find.

Split Infinity

reply to post by intrptr


If you use LOGIC as far as whether Lazar is for real...think about where he is or doing now.

Where is he? What is he doing?

If LAZAR was a FAKE...he would ahve wrote a few books and been on various UFO shows in person making a HUGE FORTUNE! People would dish out money just to watch him live on a PAY PER VEIW show.

The reality is no one hears from him and Lazar has written no books or made any appearences. The LOGIC behind this is he is under House Arrest and has a GAG order upon him under threat of DEATH.

If he could do as he wished he would be making MILLIONS right now. Now why would a person not make that kind of EASY MONEY?

Because he is not allowed to.

Split Infinity

Originally posted by SplitInfinity

As I said...just because the documents were a fake doesn't mean that MJ-12...that name is probably a fake too...was not real as there is evidence to show it did exist that were found in the Dept. of Agriculture files.

As I recall the first instance of MJ-12 or MJ TWELVE was in the Aquarious teletype in the Bennewitz affair.

reply to post by cripmeister


I have not studdied the UFO lore as far as this is concerned and can only talk about what I know.

I really do not think such Ultra-Top Secret Information would be available for anyone to get a hold of...and I don't believe that such information that is so specific and detailing would have been available uncoded on any one Document or Film or whatever.

When information of such a nature is listed in any form of documentation...it is encoded and is decoded at the delivered point.

Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity


Another logical angle is that he is lying (at least about the more fantastical elements), had his fun, things got to stressful and didn't want to keep up with the facade. You've got to imagine that lying at this level is probably hard on you. People recording your every word, you have to keep your story straight. Maybe have to come up with new information as time goes on to keep the attention on you.

I'm not saying that's the case but it's another logical possibility.

reply to post by homeskillet


I would believe that if he had already made a ton of money...but he has not and since I have much experience in the Entertainment Industry...I can tell you that he has many people who would LOVE to actually find and talk with him to give him a book deal or two as well as many in TV that would love to get the exclusive rights to have him talk on their shows.

Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity

If you think about it...although various details such as the letters between Hoover and LeMay which are real as well as other documents that show logistics and other followed orders being sent and followed...how is it that a Document that is quite possibly something that would have Ultra-Top Secret Classification just appears in his mailbox?

Yah, lots of government traffic after Roswell. I would be paranoid too. After all we captured advanced craft and occupants. They would be coming to get their personnel back. We do it too... no Marine left behind? I would be paranoid as hell after that. Apparently the government was.

I have read all those memos. I believe they are real. Just not sure about what some people say about them. Whats fake?

The intentional disinfo or misinterpretation of all the events that transpired after Roswell.

reply to post by SplitInfinity

Because he is not allowed to.

Agreed, but for different reasons.

I think it might be useful to shut him up so we could not get to the bottom of his story. That way it becomes just another unprovable disinfo genre, forever. There is no actual proof to anything he says, you know. The whole time he was there he never snuck a bolt or document out of the secret secret area he was working in. But brought friends to film stuff?

That is more useful than letting him keep talking and "slip up" proving he was lying.

Door swings both ways. Why would gagging him stop him? It didn't before he came forward.

I can't understand why they WOULDNT be real in that scenario. I mean, the only thing that has changed is...well, nothing. In essence what Split is saying is that someone tipped Friedman off about a real group, using their real names, about real events, with fake documents.
Doesn't make much sense to me.
I tend to agree about Lazar, though. And this is why I get frustrated when Friedman continues to beat the decade-old dead horse about Lazar being a liar. What does it matter?! Unlike Friedman, Lazar isn't selling a new book!

reply to post by intrptr


Of what I have been told....the mass flyovers of Washington DC in the Early 50's were a direct result of our refusal to release the Alien Bodies.

I was told that a deal was made shortly after and some things were returned. I was also informed that we still to this day have a small amount of leverage which they could if they wanted to...relieve us of any time they want. But it is said that this would be too overt for them.

However they are not the only race and there are some races that do not care about being overt. It is said that partof the first deal was a limit placed upon the numbers of Human Abductions that could occur as well as a strict ban upon the one time policy of a person being abducted and never returning.

This may seem like a deal with the Devil but given the fact that we have no real ability to stop them from doing anything...the deal is a good one. Another part of the deal is in return for their ability to continue study apon Human subjects...they have agreed to moniter any incoming E.T. Craft that is of a race not bound by treaty.

When I talked to a...Navy Guy...as I will not descibe his actual job...I was informed that E.T. or this treaty bound race...has in the past buzzed our Nuclear Subs at such high rates of speed that Sonar Blips numbered in one to three before a distant incoming target passed by...but fortunately for our Navy...the High Speed underwater USO's did not create mass water displacement for if they did at such speeds so near to our subs...our subs would have cracked WIDE OPEN as their hulls would move toward any vacuum in the water created by such craft.

Split Infinity

reply to post by SplitInfinity


Any idea what sort of leverage we are talking about here? Tech?