BREAKING: Panetta removes military ban on women in combat, opening thousands of front line positions

reply to post by peck420


Well, you keep to your sources and I'll keep to mine.

According to the 2010 study, a recent IDF report found that female combatants maintained alertness better, were more knowledgable and professional when using their weapons, and had better shooting abilities than men. But even still, like in many other nations, a good number of combat positions remain closed to them, including much of those on the front lines. And though there was a 400 percent increase in Israeli women military careerists between 1999 and 2009, the brass ceiling in many ways still remains.

www.esquire.com...

reply to post by InTheLight


One more tidbit of news, they just keep coming and coming.

On the Egyptian border, the Israelis also have mixed-sex paramilitary border police units and a mixed-sex infantry regiment, dubbed "Wildcat", which conduct patrols and ambushes. One of Wildcat's women was decorated for bravery after she killed a jihadi gunman who had shot dead a soldier in September.

www.reuters.com...

Originally posted by peck420
reply to post by InTheLight

 

Women in the military are no problem as long as standards are maintained. No country that currently allows women in combat has maintained those standards.

Interestingly enough, just a quick search found your concerns to be justified. Hmmm... Even the IDF does not set equal standards with equal treatment.

Israel: In 1985 the Israeli Defense Force (IDF) began putting women into combat positions and by 2009 women were serving in artillery units, rescue forces, and in anti-aircraft forces. While women must take part in compulsory military service, they are conscripted for only two years, versus three for men.

A study on the integration of female combatants in the IDF between 2002 and 2005 found that women often exhibit "superior skills" in discipline, motivation, and shooting abilities, yet still face prejudicial treatment stemming from "a perceived threat to the historical male combat identity."

Source

Great if it works for the IDF I suppose. It'll be wild to see how this all finally shakes out here.

Originally posted by watchitburn
reply to post by goou111

 

The vast majority of females in the military do not want direct combat related jobs. At least in the Marine Corps anyway.

Last year the Marines opened up Infantry Officers Course to female Marines, as of right now 3 females have volunteered to attend the school. They all washed out back in October.

ETA:

Now with that being said, there will come a time when females will be allowed to serve in the infantry. It's inevitable.

Do I think it's a good idea? No. But I'm not in charge, so what I think doesn't matter.

edit on 23-1-2013 by watchitburn because: (no reason given)

There is no way I'd let my daughter (or any young woman I care about) join the military.

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere

Originally posted by Maxatoria
I'd imagine that regular pregnancy testing would be mandatory as no one wants a pregnant woman on the front line

Why not? The US is a warrior state always fighting forward for the empire.

A child born on the battlefield will surely rise to great things.

A star for the sarcasm.

Originally posted by cavtrooper7
Just in time for a war with China.So now more "useless eaters" will die.The surplus female population can be thinned out.Now lets see what happens when elite daughters get caught up in this mess.

Exactly. I doubt that the Elites would allow their daughters to join.

Then again, there probably are Elites who don't give a d*** about their kids.

Originally posted by InTheLight
reply to post by InTheLight

 

One more tidbit of news, they just keep coming and coming.

On the Egyptian border, the Israelis also have mixed-sex paramilitary border police units and a mixed-sex infantry regiment, dubbed "Wildcat", which conduct patrols and ambushes. One of Wildcat's women was decorated for bravery after she killed a jihadi gunman who had shot dead a soldier in September.

www.reuters.com...

More historical information on women in combat roles:

www.armytimes.com...

Originally posted by 200Plus
I support this decision 100%. Equality for everyone.

That means females will have to do a minimum of 42 pushup-ups in two minutes like the guys instead of 19 for females, right?

It means females will have 15:56 to run two miles now like the guys and not 21:20 for females, right?

Yea, equality for everyone.

Or maybe they will LOWER the requirements for everyone.

The following year, the Germans lifted all restrictions on women in the ranks if they could meet the same physical requirements as men. More than a decade later, women make up about 9 percent of the armed forces.

www.armytimes.com...

So, it looks like Germany kept their standard requirements and there are 9% of women that qualified? Is that what I am reading here? It's all very vague.

Originally posted by InTheLight

The following year, the Germans lifted all restrictions on women in the ranks if they could meet the same physical requirements as men. More than a decade later, women make up about 9 percent of the armed forces.

www.armytimes.com...

So, it looks like Germany kept their standard requirements and there are 9% of women that qualified? Is that what I am reading here? It's all very vague.

How is that vague? It's exactly what it says...

Originally posted by InTheLight

Originally posted by InTheLight
reply to post by InTheLight

 

One more tidbit of news, they just keep coming and coming.

On the Egyptian border, the Israelis also have mixed-sex paramilitary border police units and a mixed-sex infantry regiment, dubbed "Wildcat", which conduct patrols and ambushes. One of Wildcat's women was decorated for bravery after she killed a jihadi gunman who had shot dead a soldier in September.

www.reuters.com...

More historical information on women in combat roles:

www.armytimes.com...

I've said it over and over. Combat "roles" and combat, "frontlines", and combat infantry....are not one in the same. This term "combat" is being thrown around like it applies to anyone who picks up a gun in the military...that isn't what we are talking about.

Originally posted by LennayTheUndead

Originally posted by InTheLight

The following year, the Germans lifted all restrictions on women in the ranks if they could meet the same physical requirements as men. More than a decade later, women make up about 9 percent of the armed forces.

www.armytimes.com...

So, it looks like Germany kept their standard requirements and there are 9% of women that qualified? Is that what I am reading here? It's all very vague.

How is that vague? It's exactly what it says...

A military spokesman was unable to say how many are in ground combat units.

That's why.

reply to post by LennayTheUndead


Tell us exactly what is considered combat, if not picking up a gun and shooting it to kill.

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by LennayTheUndead

 

I have been an active member here since this site began.

I signed up in 2004. I lurked for years before.

I am familiar with conspiracy. I know things you probably don't. This goes BOTH ways my friend!!

So yes I am not going to pretend I know what it's like to be in your shoes, but don't pretend you know what it's like to be in mine!

I am NOT meaning disrespect to soldiers!

They know not what they do. And if you don't believe in the idea of Government manipulation I don't know what to say!....get used to it! You will hear it a lot on ATS.

There is nothing more admirable than sacrificing ones life for a greater cause! And certainly not a whole lot harder thand enduring the military life! I am not questioning that! I am questioning the legitimacy of most wars.

**edited**

.what do you propose they pay us? Should we be compensated with rainbows and glitter?

Apparently you're not familiar with the budget! If you think there is no room to pay veterans and not cut expenses!!.......

edit on 25-1-2013 by Lucid Lunacy because: (no reason given)

It is highly unlikely that you know anything regarding our military that I don't know....you act as if it is some badge of honor that your little avatar says member since: 2004....news for you friend, I used to lurk a site called the black vault. It disappeared while I was on my first tour of duty in Iraq, in 2005. Which was when I began lurking here. I know a few things about conspiracies too, my friend. I had an account for a rather long time, disabled it because I got tired of debating with idiots who were sitting in their basements 8,000 miles away, telling me what was going on literally right outside my door in Iraq. You appear to fall into that category.


Edited to add....my pay and benefits are both part of those cuts...so don't preach to me about understanding how the budget works.

Originally posted by InTheLight

Originally posted by LennayTheUndead

Originally posted by InTheLight

The following year, the Germans lifted all restrictions on women in the ranks if they could meet the same physical requirements as men. More than a decade later, women make up about 9 percent of the armed forces.

www.armytimes.com...

So, it looks like Germany kept their standard requirements and there are 9% of women that qualified? Is that what I am reading here? It's all very vague.

How is that vague? It's exactly what it says...

A military spokesman was unable to say how many are in ground combat units.

That's why.

Well, if 9 percent of their military is made up of women, that would lead me to believe there aren't very freakin' many who are ground pounding infantry-women....since there aren't many women to begin with.

Originally posted by InTheLight
reply to post by LennayTheUndead

 

Tell us exactly what is considered combat, if not picking up a gun and shooting it to kill.

Every soldier is trained to pick up a gun and shoot it in order to kill. Not every soldier is an infantryman....why is this so hard for you to understand? Just because a woman, served in a combat role say, riding on top of a truck manning a gun while doing convoy logistics patrols (a fancy way of saying convoy security), does not mean she is battle tested in the type of combat being discussed when you are talking about women serving in the infantry. This isn't rocket science...

Let me guess. Enlistment numbers are down and they need more bodies on the ground. Should we soon expect another G.I. Jane movie to inspire us all? Maybe next they can drop the enlistment age to 16. 16 year olds are old enough to hold a gun in their hands, aren't they?

Honestly I'm all for everyone doing whatever it is they are qualified to do. If women want to go shoot up some Middle-Eastern families and they prove to be just as good at it as their male counterparts, go for it. Just use your brain first, please. Do you really want to be part of this disgusting war? Do you really want to take orders from politicians who clearly don't give a $%(& about you or the people you're murdering on their behalf?

I really look up to the men and women who enlisted with the best of intentions, sacrificing themselves for this country,.... but I know that the current events are anything but just or "right". This is the time to let them starve. Don't feed the war machine. Stop enlisting, don't give them the man/womanpower to continue this madness. If they try to bring the draft back, we should load up every single politician who votes "yes" and drop them in the most hostile part of the Middle East. Let them get a taste of their own medicine.

reply to post by LennayTheUndead


So combat is picking up a gun and shooting it to kill. Thought so.

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
My point included an expected level of fitness. I am not arguing against that. I am saying once that minimum has been met, all things are equal between the sexes. For the women that can't meet that minimum they shouldn't be in the front lines. I'm saying it should be an option because some women will be able to meet it.

Some here were stating men are stronger ergo women shouldn't be in the front line. My post was really just in response to that.

One problem is the choice is now removed... They will be drafted into a combat rolls if a draft ever comes. Look at ALL the women you know, and think about them being handed a gun and told to go kill, think about they might go weeks without a bath wearing 120 lbs of gear and armor, think about what happens when they are captured, think about the need for them to carry a fallen comrade...I could go on. Yes some can, but as I said look around at ALL the women you know and asked the question of how any of them would fare if they didn't have a choice in the matter...

reply to post by InTheLight


Combat is harder than medical school.It means changing a tank track in the mud in Korea.No woman I know of could do that.There is NO giving up or you die,no matter what. No thinking just doing,because that bullet just whizzed by your head. Cold bowl baths by the side of the track,in the open.
My job was simple, I wasn't detectable anything that could prove otherwise is wrong. The DMZ in Korea was a great teacher.
Brutal, hard,and when you're done you ARE some peoples monster,because of what you know and to them it was for nothing,you are a criminal and a murderer.A stupid one at that,because they think you're programmed.Instead you've seen how bad things can get and for some silly assed reason it injured your soul.
I would explain the "Soul" but many progressives hate God too. Which is fine if they would leave tradition alone,outside their OWN homes.
If you're more concerned about your own life than your mission,you are a dangerous liability.
You learn one thing, win.