Senator Asks CIA Nominee When Drones Can Kill Americans

Essentially he is being asked how the CIA justifies the killing of Americans connected to terrorism who cannot be detained yet still present a risk to national security.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin

It certainly is a fair question. Let me give you my view on this issue.
First, over the last 40 or so years, peoples' view of what a terrorist certainly have varied greatly.
For instance, at times our government has labeled the oil embargoes of the 1970's terrorists acts. Would they have sent drones over those governments' sites, if such drones had existed? In addition, for decades, our government labeled Mubarak a friend, and only when the administration change, did we turn and call him a terrorist. Likewise, we provided aid and support to Osama Bin Ladin, when he was fighting in Afghanistan against the Russians, but when that war ended, we then labeled him a terrorist, even though what he was doing then was not so different from what he did afterward, leaving out the 911 issue, which has been discussed ad nauseam on ATS.
Since most "targets" of drones have not been given a trial, we must accept the word of the government that they are indeed terrorists, and that is not what our country stands for.
I need not repeat the heroic words of Pastor Niemöller in Nazi Germany.
Furthermore, as stated, drone attacks kill more innocent civilians than intended targets, even when the target has been properly identified as a convicted terrorist.
Understand, I have no problem with executing a terrorist, proven as such in a fair trial. However, at what point, do you think government officials will stop, in terms of who they identify as terrorists? I am very concerned with that issue, and given the polarized nature of our country over the last two decades or so, terrorism has become defined by what party is in office.
This should concern every American, because today you may be considered a model citizen, but tomorrow, you may be labeled a terrorist, even though your actions and beliefs have not changed. Terrorism is like beauty, in that it is in the eyes of the beholder.

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
reply to post by AgentX09

 

I won't believe it until the first American is actually killed by drone.

Actually its already happened al-Awlaki and his son both held American citizenship.

One they picked up arms they forfeited the US citizenship as far as I'm concerned and not losing any sleep over their deaths.Also I thought the question was drone use in the states.

reply to post by AgentX09


I agree with you I am just telling you that it has already happened

What we are talking about isn't just execution without a trial.

It is execution without even being arrested.

Execution because of suspicion of guilt. Does that sound like the way justice should work for Americans?

And absolutely no proof they're killing anyone that should be called a terrorist. They could be contracted to kill the activists and label them terrorists. They don't have to proof any thing at all. There is no proof, no trial, nothing. Just execution and murder.

It's called being an emperor to have those powers.

Originally posted by The0nlytruth
reply to post by silo13

 

Death death and more death. America *Sigh*. You have lunatics running your country, REVOLUTION 2013 woop woop woop woop

Lunatic is an understatement. These people are monsters.

One of the most amazing things to me is that it would appear from the responses in this thread, correct me if I am wrong, that the notion of using legislation to circumscribe the uses to which drones can be put, just never occurs to anyone.

There is so little faith in the legislative process in America that the notion of the unarmed by law drone, just never arises. (I don't count. I'm a furriner.)

The cherry on the sundae is that loss of faith in legislators and legislation is far, far, far more serious than the appearance, twice nightly, of the drone with the gatling gun under the wing shooting up the neighborhood.

Surely.

Americans have lost civilization. They no longer understand what it is to be civilized. They don't live in a society anymore. They have tents pitched at an arms bazaar.

reply to post by silo13


You could look at it this way,
this list is basically the government admitting a whole lot of crap.

Originally posted by ipsedixit

Americans have lost civilization. They no longer understand what it is to be civilized. They don't live in a society anymore. They have tents pitched at an arms bazaar.

edit on 16-1-2013 by ipsedixit because: (no reason given)

Ummm.....Wax hyperbolic...much? I mean really, I've been to your quaint little country quite a few times. Other than the smug sense of superiority it seemed to be just like crossing the street...you even drive on the right side of the road. You should get out more, come on down and take advantage of the shopping....like millions of your countrymen do every week. You might see then that we're not the three headed zombies that you portray us as...only our politicians qualify as such. So climb on down off of that high horse, cause we even like your beer and booze down here. You might just find that we're people after all and not your whipping post.

Cheers

YouSir

This is the perfect thread for me to add the following from Noam Chomsky of all people.

Mr. Chomsky thinks that Obama is running a "global assassination campaign" I think Noam is right. Wonder what the mastermind behind the drone war has to say...??

Obama lacks a moral Center!!

MIT Professor of Linguistics Noam Chomsky, a long-time left-wing writer and activist, told Al-Jazeera that he does not believe President Barack Obama has a “moral center,” and that he is running a “global assassination campaign” using drone warfare.

“There’s some nice rhetoric here and there, but you look at the actual policies, they’re pretty shocking,” Chomsky said, speaking of President Obama. “The drone assassination campaign’s a perfectly good example. It’s just a global assassination campaign.”

cnsnews.com...

No question asked of Obama regarding this campaign during the 2012 election cycle. NONE!! He prefers to kill vs. capture and interrogate to gather much needed real time intelligence. Killing them just gives Obama the perception that he is doing something good. Little does he know, that for every "terrorist leader" killed by a drone there are twenty more waiting in the wings to fill the position.

I was going to say, "It's getting to the point where I actually want to take matters into my own hands. Somehow, go on strike? I dunno that sounds stupid."

But then why would I say that when it's already been happening else where in the world. Makes me look foolish.

Wired magazine, Danger Room, is what reporting should be... courageous..

stop whining - you elected him to office - TWICE - Americans are fools? Americans are in denial? Americans are uneducated? What the hell is going on over there?

I suspect that at least 90% of the complainers and whiners here on ATS voted for the DICTATOR OBAMA knowing full well that he was a dictator when you did it!!!

One of the most amazing things to me is that it would appear from the responses in this thread, correct me if I am wrong, that the notion of using legislation to circumscribe the uses to which drones can be put, just never occurs to anyone.

reply to post by ipsedixit

I perfectly understand your point. Let me try to address it, as best as I can. You are right, in that certainly that is what should be done. In fact, Senator Rand Paul tried to do exactly that, including attempting to introduce bills to eliminate the Patriot Act, drastically change the NDAA, and other issues brought up in these ATS threads. Unfortunately, our government is completely dysfunctional, due to extreme partisanship, lobbyists, graft and corruption, spurred on by a MSM that is so biased and engaged in the partisanship, that what news does get out is so tainted in partisanship on both sides, that no one can really see what is going on. Can it be fixed peacefully? As time goes on, I truly have my doubts. Could it be, sure, but given the current environment of hostility and hatred on both sides, I fear that the result will be a scene that makes the streets of Greece, and the Arab Spring look like a picnic.

reply to post by silo13


"Wanted: Dead or Alive"

The individual, like al-walahi, know they are on a "kill" list. They know that they are Wanted: Dead or Alive, so if they want to live, they should surrender.

They have been duly warned, yet continue to evade authorities, therefore they are tried in absentee. Capture or kill orders have been around forever, the only difference is the method.

We spot the target. Can we insert a team and extract? No? Send in the drones.

reply to post by silo13

It was started by Bush, continued by Obama.

When will people realize that its all about incremental-ism.

It was fine when they were killing citizens who are Moslem. Now that NDAA is law, guns are being confiscated and drones are circling America, the sheeple are starting to wake up.

We spot the target. Can we insert a team and extract? No? Send in the drones.

reply to post by stormson

I'm afraid it isn't as simple as that. Would you feel the same way, if your family were within "drone kill distance" of that target? Terrorists frequently surround themselves with hostages. Yes, some are willing hostages, but others are not.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few.

collateral damage is never good, but having served in combat, i can assure you that we, and i can honestly only talk about the units i served in, looked for every means to reduce collateral damage.

Originally posted by YouSir

Ummm.....Wax hyperbolic...much?

Hyperbole is my middle name.

I mean really, I've been to your quaint little country quite a few times.

I wish I could say the same. I've only been here three times I believe.

Other than the smug sense of superiority it seemed to be just like crossing the street...

Canadians are jackasses, nice jackasses but still jackasses, who are even more deluded than their American partners in crime. Canada is a client state of the United States with delusions of grandeur. Cornelius Vanderbilt put it best, "Canada is a nice little country and we aim to keep it that way."

I'm sure no Canadian would take what I just wrote amiss. It's a simple fact. Heeeehaw!

You should get out more, come on down and take advantage of the shopping....like millions of your countrymen do every week.

I won't be down to the States until the Neocon crowd that did 9/11 is behind bars and the Patriot Act repealed, Gitmo closed, the US defense budget reduced to sane proportions and the US unemployment rate down to between 3 and 5 percent.

You might see then that we're not the three headed zombies that you portray us as...only our politicians qualify as such.

And who is responsible for that?

So climb on down off of that high horse, cause we even like your beer and booze down here. You might just find that we're people after all and not your whipping post.

I'm one of the best friends the American people have, at least in intentions.

Cheers

Hip, hip, hooray!

YouSir

You seem like a nice person to me, so I hope you don't take what I said above personally.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


THANK YOU!!! While reading the OP I found many of the quotes quite terrifying all by their lonesome.

What you've added is context, which shows a much larger version of the story. Good on you.