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Originally posted by Galvatron
Great Britain will never fall so long as the crows are still at the Tower of London!!!!
I think it will be a little bit before GB thinks about seriously joining the EU.
I don't know many english who consider themselves "european."
Relations between UK and US are much stronger than between EU and US.
The UK is the bridge, so to speak, between the two. It has an incredibly powerful possition in that role.
Unfortunately it's leaders dont seem to realize its true potential. If the countries were personified, I, as the UK, would play some power politics with my "gate keeper" position and see how far it takes me.
Could lead to reform and the better development of the UK to be quite powerful. But if it doesnt work, I would join the EU.
So I think the UK has a couple different directions it could go before joining the EU and suspect that it will try to explore as many as it realizes before considering.
Originally posted by bigdanprice
Yeah I appreciate that but its the next logical step. We are intergrating more and more of political, judicial and financial institutions.
I am floating this as part of the debate on the European union, I think debating its future is a legitamte part of this.
Originally posted by dh
While I have little sympathy for UKIP which comes across as little more than a British National Party for the aspiring classes, I do agree with its analysis of the European Parliament as little more than a rubber-stamping facility for the directives issued by the Commissioners.
Perhaps the usefulness of this organisation is best exemplified by the directives coming into force regarding vitamin and mineral accessability and dosage, and the application of drug standard testing to herbal and flower essence remedies
www.alliance-natural-health.org...
thereby seeking to take the possibilities of self treatment and personal resposibility for health away from the individual and to entrench treatments securely in the hands of the multnational drug cartels
A small example perhaps, but one that exemplifies the trend of the EU towards becoming a corporate led superstate, which will require the citizens of its member states to become uniform drones
The same trend will occur with the (US) dollarisation of the Americas
www.peacenowar.net... 31 02.htm and APEC will eventually incorporate China to become the third corporate bloc pushing the globalisation agenda
As has been stated by previous contributors, the EU is all about centralisation and de-diversifying and is a prime organisational thrust towards global government, which will more nearly reflect the Bush style of governance, rather than any friendly global village type of affair
It's quite possible to thoroughly anti-EU without possessing the slightest hint of xenophobia or nationalism
Every school and learning establishment in the EU has masses of glossy,very expensively produced EU literature thrown at them to use in school projects and research.
Originally posted by UK Wizard
@ sminkeypinkey, (sorry if it wasn't you who made the statement)
you say if we withdraw from the EU, we would lose 3million UK jobs?
I simply want to know why?,
people say the jobs are directly linked to us being in the EU, but they never explain how or why?
also found a web site that goes into detail about the lies that the EU pumps out
members.tripod.com...
Every school and learning establishment in the EU has masses of glossy,very expensively produced EU literature thrown at them to use in school projects and research.
In my school, i've seen a couple of glossy posters with a map of europe on and a big eu flag, talking about unity and unitedness
It's pretty low targeting school children with propaganda
When NASA sent kids across the USA packs of info about how their space missions were acomplished by them is that propaganda?
There are many areas - especially the ultra high tech fields - which medium and small sized countries like the UK simply cannot afford to do alone anymore. By sharing costs between several small and medium sized countries we can. This allows us, and the others, to protect and develop the national skills base in an manner we could never otherwise have done.
People/countires wishing to trade with the EU from outside of the EU have to pay tarriffs. Basically the price of goods and services coming from outside of the EU attract additional costs in the form of tarriff ranging from 0% (on some - few - items) all the way up to (if I remember correctly) to 10% being levied on a few major items.
IN TOTAL - Counting all income from EU countries since 1973, and taking away all we paid in imports, net fees to Brussels, etc. the actual loss by 1996 was �160,000,000,000
Originally posted by UK Wizard
You have a answer to everthing
I don't see anything wrong with the source I used, yes it's heavily anti-EU but it backs itself up with facts and figures
Completely different situation, thats education, this is propaganda
European countries can share costs and technical help without the EU being there.
If the UK was outside the EU and Germany wasn't, that wouldn't stop us developing say a new battle tank together.
I'm a supporter of free trade
I'm betting a reason the EU has tarriffs on non-EU countries is because EU member won't be able to afford leaving the EU.
According to the Source Britain has lost financially from being in the EU
posted by Rustiswordz
i want turkey to join the EU.
The burden of this economically and morally backward country will be the EU's death knell.
Be patient everyone, the EU cannot hold, lets just bide our time, all the components for the EU's collapse is already in place. Just be patient, time will do the rest.
Failing that then armed resistance is always an option and that is closer than people realise too...
......you're not suggest ignorance is better are you? Or would a conversation where folks just agreed with the one point of view, no matter what, suit you better?
The anti-EU crowd are famed for it......for instance where within that site is there the slightest recognition that the EU has ever done anything good or worthwhile ever?
Everyone does it because just about everyone who has ever traded internationally has done it in the past; for centuries in many cases.
No doubt some of them believe the EU to want to eat our first-born too.....
Originally posted by UK Wizard
No way, I'll admit when i'm wrong.... i need more convincing on the EU though
All the anti-EU sources i've read are completely against the EU
All the pro-EU sources i've read never talk about the bad things
got any neutral sources you know about????
We used to invade people who upset us in the past, we don't do that now, why do we need tarrifs...greed comes to mind
talking about propaganda
what a waste of money, i'm sure it could have been spent on something better than the EU congratulating themselves
No doubt some of them believe the EU to want to eat our first-born too.....
Originally posted by ArMaP
You can work in another EU country as if you were working in your own country, you do not need special licenses or visas.
If you want to study in other EU country, there is an almost automatic recognition of your school level in the other EU country.
In practice, the whole idea of the EU is that living in one country or living in another is just the same thing, is just as if the EU its a big country.
Originally posted by UK Wizard
The education thing is great, anything that promotes learning is brilliant
but....regarding free work movement, logic dictates that those in poorer countries (eg Eastern Europe) would move westerly to get job in the richer countries (eg Britain, Germany, France etc)
I'm in favour of European cooporation but the way we are cuurently running Europe is all wrong....now if i was in charge...
Originally posted by bigdanprice
@ukwizard
I noticed that you posted a picture about merseyside, thanking the EU. Well I come from near Liverpool and the help the EU has given, especially with the capital of culture thing is amazing. The city is regenerating. one that was left to rot during the thatcher years, There is an up beat mood there, things are happening, that would never hve happened under purely UK investment. There are things that need to be ironed out with the EU but if we are not there to influence it then we will be in serious trouble...
Would you be administering things as they actually are or just the mythical tabloid version?
Originally posted by UK Wizard
i don't see why the money couldn't be spent by the British Governement,
I personally think that local councils should have an increased budget to pay for renevation of a area. The national Government should deal with national issues and the local Governement should deal with local issues.
I'd administer from facts...yes i listen to propaganda but i make up my own mind...I've politely listening to your views and accept that you have a very relevant point.
Just a thought isn't the EU doomed to fail as it is confined to Europe,
why not the GU (global union), that way countries who can contribute can join.(just a thought)
Also the EU is going to conflict (not start a conflict) with other countries who are outside of the EU due to competition, rivalry, super power status etc
Would you not agree that regional regeneration is a matter far beyond 'local government' and it's possible budget?
Europe does 80% of it's total trade internally. We are not actually exposed to the volitility of world markets in the same way as many now are.
As soon as Germany reaches equilibrium in it's reunification then I suspect that Europe will once again grow at trend rates.
Originally posted by UK Wizard
Nope, regionisation is just the carving up of England, I support the traditional county's
Maybe Europe is being too isolationist
Tensions in Germany are increasing,
east and west are like two different countries...it's going to take a very long time for the damage to be healed.
The signing of the constitution anger's me, we should vote first then either not sign it or sign it depending on the vote result.
Also this contraversy surrounding Rocco Buttiglione is disgusting, yes he holds views that many people don't like but there are those who do share his views.
The majority of the EU MEP's are being hypocritical by saying that this man can't be a Commission nominee because he is prejudce towards certain people, the EU is being prejudce to those who don't agree with homosexuality.
(i don't share Rocco Buttiglione's views)