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Another gun killed a person

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posted on Dec, 13 2012 @ 11:25 PM
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Originally posted by defcon5
So did a person shoot this woman, or did a gun do it?


Police said gun discharged when the woman placed her purse on the ground.


no. the gun did Not .. an either inexperienced or incompetent gun owner is/was the 'culprit' in that particular case, incident ... much the same as a car getting 'inadvertently knocked' out of park and running someone over.- accidents Do happen.


It's the REAL world and you Can Not Simply legilslate away Accidents - They Happen.




posted on Dec, 13 2012 @ 11:39 PM
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Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
those who would claim that it's the 'guns' and NOT the 'people' have typically proven or shown to me that they have little or no True Understanding or experience with the same - firearms.
...
to state or haphazardly claim and suggest otherwise is nothing short of ridiculous ... nonsensical or otherwise, to say the least. - THEY CANT PULL THEIR OWN TRIGGER(S).

Maybe you can explain who “pulled the trigger” on these then:

Woman Shot In Leg By Gun Left Hidden In Her Oven
SAN ANTONIO -- A Texas woman heating fish sticks was shot in the leg Friday by a gun that had been stashed in her oven, police said. Roxanne Perez, 29, was hospitalized in good condition, they said. They said a friend of hers had hidden the .357-caliber handgun in the stove two weeks earlier without telling her after she told him no guns were allowed in her house. When Perez heated up the fish sticks she also heated up the gun, which caused several rounds to be fired. One hit her in the leg.


No charges filed in accidental shooting at Inlet Square Mall
Horry County police will not file charges in connection with the accidental shooting at Inlet Square Mall Tuesday.
Just before a veterans pinning ceremony, a woman was shot in the leg when a gun went off inside another woman's purse.
The bullet went into the victim's right leg and lodged in her left leg.
Police said gun discharged when the woman placed her purse on the ground.


A 7-year-old boy was shot and killed at a Pennsylvania gun store when his father's weapon accidentally went off.
MERCER, Pa. — Authorities say a 7-year-old boy was shot to death when a gun accidentally went off as his father was getting into his truck outside a western Pennsylvania gun store.



Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
guns are inanimate objects, and by mere deign/definition ARE incapable of inflicting harm unto others without some sort of outside influence or action - FACT.

www.consumerfed.org...


Sturm, Ruger & Company's Old Model Single Action Revolver. More than 600 people,
including children, have been killed or injured by unintentional discharges from Old Models.
This revolver was manufactured from 1953 until 1972. It incorporated no positive safety device
and is therefore extremely prone to discharge when dropped or bumped.


Remington Model 700 Bolt-Action Rifles. The Remington 700 is the most popular bolt-action
hunting rifle. Yet the rifle contains two design defects, which cause the rifle to fire
unintentionally when the gun is jarred or when the bolt of the gun is moved.


Glock Pistols. The Glock is one of the most popular sidearms used by law enforcement
officers in the United States. Deficiencies in the guns’ design make it prone to unintentional
discharge. For example, the gun contains no external safety device that would allow the gun to
be placed in a safe mode or “turned off”. The pistols also have a very short and light trigger pull
which can allow even very young children to fire the gun. For example, in 1996 the 3-year-old
daughter of a District of Columbia police officer unintentionally shot and killed herself with her
father’s service pistol.



posted on Dec, 13 2012 @ 11:40 PM
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reply to post by defcon5
 


The last portion about the Glocks is grossly inaccurate and misleading and just not correct.



posted on Dec, 13 2012 @ 11:47 PM
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I bore witness to an interesting even a few months ago on our range here in Mandurah, a guy new to reloading his 38 revolver mentioned that he was using this ADI AR2217 Powder in his loads. I thought about that for a minute while we were in prep time and asked him why was he using rifle cartridge powders to which he replied it was the only powder the shop had.

At this point I thought he was joking until he pulled the trigger and then stopped shooting, basically his cylinder had ruptured and jettisoned the rear sight blade into space. This could of resulted in the gun killing the user but luckily all he got was the embarrassment of having to put a drop saw through his now useless revolver.



posted on Dec, 13 2012 @ 11:54 PM
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reply to post by Cosmic911
 

Why? Because Glock says so, and has paid a LOT of cash out to advertise it as safe?

Glock Pistol Used by Police Raised Safety Issues
Glock markets its weapons as "safe action pistols." But internal company documents reviewed by BusinessWeek—and reported here for the first time—reveal that in the late 1990s, company employees in the U.S. expressed concern about the safe performance of the Glock 22, a model commonly used by American police officers.
….
"These documents should have been disclosed in discovery. There is no excuse—no legitimate excuse—for their not being disclosed."
….
The Consumer Federation of America has cited the Glock's design as one reason the gun has been the subject of dozens of lawsuits filed after unintentional shootings, including a number by police officers. The company has won or confidentially settled most of these cases without acknowledging any liability.
….
Paul F. Jannuzzo, Glock's former top executive in the U.S., says in an interview that, overall, the company's pistols are as safe as comparable handguns—and more durable. "The one problem," he says, "was [the Glock] would go off sometimes when it wasn't supposed to."

Notice here that they “settle out of court” when there is an accident...
that's to keep it out of the news.
edit on 12/13/2012 by defcon5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 13 2012 @ 11:57 PM
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reply to post by defcon5
 


each and every of those situations and circumstances can be attributed to mishandling or improper storage.

nary a one to that of the 'gun' itself'.

try again.

people do stupid things ... guns don't.



posted on Dec, 13 2012 @ 11:58 PM
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99% of mass killings in the US in the passed 20 years are done in places that prohibit firearms.
What you do with that knowledge is up to you.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 12:00 AM
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Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
reply to post by defcon5
 

each and every of those situations and circumstances can be attributed to mishandling or improper storage.
nary a one to that of the 'gun' itself'.
try again.
people do stupid things ... guns don't.

Are we cross posting, and your not getting my posts until after you post again?
Let me repost this in case:


Sturm, Ruger & Company's Old Model Single Action Revolver. More than 600 people,
including children, have been killed or injured by unintentional discharges from Old Models.
This revolver was manufactured from 1953 until 1972. It incorporated no positive safety device
and is therefore extremely prone to discharge when dropped or bumped.


Remington Model 700 Bolt-Action Rifles. The Remington 700 is the most popular bolt-action
hunting rifle. Yet the rifle contains two design defects, which cause the rifle to fire
unintentionally when the gun is jarred or when the bolt of the gun is moved.


Glock Pistols. The Glock is one of the most popular sidearms used by law enforcement
officers in the United States. Deficiencies in the guns’ design make it prone to unintentional
discharge. For example, the gun contains no external safety device that would allow the gun to
be placed in a safe mode or “turned off”. The pistols also have a very short and light trigger pull
which can allow even very young children to fire the gun. For example, in 1996 the 3-year-old
daughter of a District of Columbia police officer unintentionally shot and killed herself with her
father’s service pistol.

edit on 12/14/2012 by defcon5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 12:05 AM
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not at all. cross-posting or otherwise.

nothing is 100% guaranteed, but to attempt to qualify those type situations as the reason, cause or 'need' to restirct firearm ownership is simply ridiculous.

manufacturing defects and/or piss poor 'OWNER' handling and storage is not the gun's fault

try again, as i've said before.

a properly designed, machined and manufactured firearm will not kill another human being in, of and or By itself..

People, on the other hand, Do & Will.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 12:19 AM
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reply to post by 12m8keall2c
 

Fist off, please show me where I have commented on restricting gun ownership?
Secondly, did you not say:


guns are inanimate objects, and by mere deign/definition ARE incapable of inflicting harm unto others without some sort of outside influence or action – FACT.

Now, you've been shown that is an untrue statement, yet you are for some reason still defending it?


There are LOTS more examples of guns killing people without any improper handling by people. As I said above, about 1500 case/year...

Guns DO kill people, sorry if you don't like it, but that is a - FACT...



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 01:14 AM
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reply to post by citizenoftheworld
 


so i suppose all knives, bows, cars, trains, planes, ink pens, belts, weighty books, large objects, and even sticks should be banned as well right? hell while we are at it lets ban spoons so we wont have fat people anymore. you are a fool to even think that the gun itself is the problem. if you look at real world statistics the places with the MOST guns have the lowest levels of crime. that is a FACT.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 01:32 AM
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Originally posted by defcon5
reply to post by 12m8keall2c
 

Fist off, please show me where I have commented on restricting gun ownership?
Secondly, did you not say:


guns are inanimate objects, and by mere deign/definition ARE incapable of inflicting harm unto others without some sort of outside influence or action – FACT.

Now, you've been shown that is an untrue statement, yet you are for some reason still defending it?


There are LOTS more examples of guns killing people without any improper handling by people. As I said above, about 1500 case/year...

Guns DO kill people, sorry if you don't like it, but that is a - FACT...

Yeah- I think you and I are on the same page here. Its a dumb argument.

Both sides try to make this a clear cut and "black and white" issue when it is actually marred in shades of grey.

There is a reason that these punk mass killers prefer guns over knives- The Colorado Shooter could NEVER have killed but maybe a person or two until the Theater would have turned on him had he not had a gun.

Guns are dangerous and you are statistically more likely to hurt yourself than to ever defend yourself.

Guns ownership does not prevent violence- This is a fallacy. Michigan recently went from totalitarian gun laws to very Liberal gun laws. The amounts of CCW is insane here now (really, it seems nearly everyone has gotten one in the last few years)- Crime is not down... One of these guys (a legal CCW holder) just recently shot through a neighbors house here (or something- cannot recall the story) and fortunately nobody was hurt.

THAT SAID- The idiots and criminals already have guns. I want them too- With society going crazy I want to be able to protect myself against these idiots and its my RIGHT (and yours) and RESPONSIBILITY to my family. Statistically we are now more likely to be hurt by our own weapon- But we are not statistics. I am not an idiot and its a risk I have chosen to take in acknowledging this right and defend myself against the hordes of fools running around and committing mad acts on what looks (to me) like a society in peril.
edit on 14-12-2012 by DarKPenguiN because: clarity



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 01:40 AM
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If you really wanted to hurt me in a fit of rage and you had a gun on your person, I would be dead.

If you didn't have one or was not allowed to carry one, most likely you'd cool down before you did something stupid.

Guns don't kill people, but people using guns do. How many people are killed in the USA each year by being hit over the head with a baseball bat compared to shootings. You can't hide a bat!



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 03:22 AM
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Originally posted by whatsecret

Originally posted by marvinthemartian
Last year over 300,000 guns where stolen in the u s a.
That is 300, 000 guns in the hands of criminals.
WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG?


It means that 311,291,917 law abiding citizens need guns to protect themselves.




Let the bloodbath begin.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 03:39 AM
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reply to post by defcon5
 


The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


Justify? I don't need to "justify". My right to own firearms is, at least for the moment, written in metaphorical stone.

But, just for fun, I own four, soon to be five, weapons. That's right, they're weapons. A dbl. barreled twelve gauge shotgun, used for hunting, and with a shorter, yet legal, barrel it lives in my closet ready should the unthinkable occur...

My second is an older Smith and Wesson .38spl revolver, with three speedloaders...it lives in my desk for the sole purpose of that event I pray never happens...that I should have to use it to protect myself.

My third is a bolt action .30-30 by Savage. It's older than I am by twenty some years having been manufactured just after WWII... I've had it since I was a child. No bells. No whistles. Just an appropriate level of skill behind it.

My fourth is a single shot twenty gauge, with a .30-30 barrel accessory. Kicks like a mule with the rifle barrel attached... But the twenty gauge is a sweet shooting little shotgun.

The common thread with all four of these? Not one of them has ever, ever jumped up and fired without me behind it. Not once. They are, much as some of you seem to imply (not you Def...) otherwise, inanimate objects...completely incapable of doing anything on their own. Even accidents have humans on the backend of it all. Drops. Malfunctions. etc...

Handguns, rifles, shotguns are tools. ...and like any tool, can be used for a myriad of purposes. Some benign. Some not so much.

Guns were invented to aid humans in their task of killing each other. ...and? They don't do it by themselves.

I own because I can. I own because firearms are useful tools in many cases. I've used them to hunt for food. I've used, on one occasion, to deter a crime. I own firearms because it's a fun time to go to the local firing range and plink at targets. Clay pigeons are even more fun...

It's been said that when firearms are outlawed the only people who will own them will be criminals... So very, very true. I'll be one, so too will millions of (or thousands, anyway) my fellow citizens. For I will not surrender them willingly...and I can hide them better than they can look. extra DIV



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 04:03 AM
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reply to post by whatsecret
 




Sad stories but people should not forget that guns don't kill... people do.

So why don't you change the title of your thread which is misleading....


Another gun killed a person

?



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 04:58 AM
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reply to post by whatsecret
 


In the words of Eddie Izzard (British commedian) when addressing an American crowd on gun control:

'Its not guns that kill people do - er I think the guns help!



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 05:00 AM
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Would banning firearms reduce murder and suicide???

www.law.harvard.edu...



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 06:38 AM
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Originally posted by HellstormRising

Originally posted by citizenoftheworld
reply to post by whatsecret
 


It may be the person itself that chose to shoot, but a gun is still a tool that provides this action to happen. Therefore all guns should be banned, at least for public use, everywhere! But that is whish full thinking! It does do more bad than good.



Not sure if you're trolling or not but by the logic above, you can ban the following items as well.

Bow & Arrows
Cars,
Butter Knives,
Fixed blade boot knives,
hatchets,
axes,
power drills,
saws - power and hand held,
flat head and philips head screw drivers,
awls,
rope,
cement,
socks and doorknobs,


I hope you get my point.


Don't forget the ever popular rock.

Note: I do not believe WhatSecret understands the point being made.



posted on Dec, 14 2012 @ 06:39 AM
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Originally posted by marvinthemartian
Last year over 300,000 guns where stolen in the u s a.
That is 300, 000 guns in the hands of criminals.
WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG?


Look to the UK to find out...

It has gone very well for your people to ban guns huh?...

edit on 14-12-2012 by ElectricUniverse because: (no reason given)



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