MS Windows Code Automatically Corrupts Itself to Force You to Upgrade!!!???

I doubt that Microsoft would implement code to destroy itself so you are forced to upgrade your computer. If they got caught it would be a public relations nightmare. It would also be very difficult to implement. If you included the code as a process that ran every time the computer turned on, you would have to configure it to make sure all the device drivers are working and haven't changed since the last boot.

It wouldn't be that difficult to find the code that expires your computer. We've got plenty of tools to dissect the source code for Windows XP, Vista, 7, so forth. Someone would find it and Microsoft wouldn't be able to cover it up.

A while back there was a file called "NSA_KEY" inside the source code for some Windows version, I think 98. Everyone was scared because they thought it might be a backdoor for the National Security Agency. But once again people jumped to a conclusion without gathering all the facts first. The file turned out to be harmless.

Computer hardware is the most likely reason for having to upgrade especially when the insides of your computer get a buildup of dust and grime. The new solid state hard drives supposedly last a lot longer than the old spinning disk ones.

Originally posted by beyondsense
People, thank you for the advice but you're taking to someone who is in the computer/programming business. The machines I mentioned have absolutely no games installed, almost no images, I used them strictly for work Dreamweaver, PhotoShop, etc. kind of programs. I'm not constantly installing/uninstalling crap into them. You all must be Microsoft employees trying to convince me I'm paranoid, but it won't work! I won't let it happen! You won't get me!!

Nawww, Windows or Linux I use both and don't get into debates about which is "better". Both have their advantages and disadvantages and for the most part both get what I need done...done.

I do however have relatives that HATE change and I often find myself shoe horning a mix of old/new programs into old/new version of Windows. These same people will claim ignorance to even the most basic of housekeeping. I guess I am just so used to giving them the "speech" it becomes automatic..

I cannot say "beyond a shadow of a doubt" there is no kill switch, but my personal opinion is Microsoft has a hard enough time keeping what is current running let alone hoping that they don't somehow trip or speed up a kill switch buried in the OS.

reply to post by beyondsense


Just cause you're not playing games, you'll still be putting loads of programs (you've said yourself), images for the websites etc. Housekeeping should be your priority, no matter what you use the machine for, it's all the same.

Must go, Bills here and I need to give him my latest propaganda report....

Originally posted by beyondsense

Hi All,

So I was wondering and I think this may be quite possible...you ever notice that after a couple of years your computer starts to "act-up", show errors, it turns "slow", even when trying to run programs that it never had a problem with before? I've been in the PC industry for about 15 years and no matter which brand I have purchased, how many system factory restores I do to the machines, they always end up with the inherent systematic problems that make you feel like the computer is "old", "outdated", and you have to "upgrade" or buy something "faster". Granted, some newer programs/games require additional RAM. CPU, etc., but I'm talking about the same programs not running as they did when the computer was first purchased.

Take for instance my Windows XP Professional, about 4 years ago this computer started "acting up". No matter how many times I restore the computer, (at first it runs fine), but after 3 or 4 months, little by little it starts to become "corrupted". Trojans, Viruses, etc. are not an issue, again, I'm in the software programming field so I can say this with authority.

So it occurred to me, since we don't have access to the actual code, what if Microsoft purposely programs its code so after "x" months or "x" years and months, the system starts "mis-behaving". Anyone who has any programming knowledge knows this is quite easy and simple to do.

Another reason why they would want to do this, is to make sure the latest govt. spying software gets installed on all the new PCs. But wait!! What am I thinking about, Microsoft who has been fined multiple times for anti-trust issues would never think of doing something like this; this idea would never occurred to any of their top executives and 6 figure engineers and programmers...and our govt. would never be in it on something like this...yeah right...

Peace!

Somebody with software programming experience should know better. A full reformat leaves no code in tact. The easiest way to test this theory is to simply replace the hard drive outright -- but you already know the answer to this test, the results would be the same.

There are other things that would make one *think* things are going slower than they used too -- example is working on a computer that is faster than yours at home, etc. This would give you the very real illusion that your computer was slower than it used to be. It's not, unless some of your hardware is being damaged, which is also a very real possibility after a few years of cooking itself.

I've been building computers for a long time, in the last 10 years, I've had three total. My current one is an I7-2600k. The computer I replaced with this one, is just as fast as it ever used to be after 4 years of operation. That was an E8600 Wolfdale, which is still being used to this day in another room, and still runs most relatively new software almost as good as my brand new I7.

Do some of the most demanding softwares of today bog down the Wolfdale? Sure -- but that's because it's not as powerful, and never was, as powerful as an I7.

It still boots in the same time, 22 seconds.

So, no -- it's actually impossible to do what you suggest. Is it impossible to make code degrade? No, but that degraded code would be replaced upon a format or a change of hard drive.

Could a computer's performance dwindle over time, sure -- but not because of the operating system, but because the heat of ~120º-140ºF with just a standard heatsink and fan can slow cook a CPU very easily.

Think of this like a light bulb. Say your brand of bulb has a life expectancy of 10,000 hours. As it gets ever closer to it's eventual demise, it's efficiency reduces and it's actual output in Lumens decreases. Meaning as the bulb gets older, it gets progressively more dim until it doesn't light anymore and the filament breaks from corrosion.


This is normally called "wear and tear." Everything with moving parts/conducts electricity is prone to wear and tear. Be it in a form of corrosion, or erosion, things that get "used" always deteriorate. More so, when left unmaintained.

I completely disagree. Ask any programmer. It is actually quite possible to make the code degrade. This is how you do it and it would work even after you do the re-install. You program the code to do the following (I will use layman's terms):

Upon boot, run program
Program=Check date
If current date is after "x" date then "slow down system by 2.5 seconds" after 97 days of use or 103 restarts
If current date is before "x" date then "do nothing"
If current date is after "x" date upon initiating "x" program 57 times show "error"
If current date is after "x" date upon restarting system "x" times show "error"

And you could make the values and variables vary so that it would be impossible find a "pattern". So I can program the code to say

If current date is after "x" date upon initiating "x" program 57 times show "error" but if current day is Monday then skip to Friday. If month is July do nothing, show error on next boot...

I mean, it is so simple to program this...and even if you re-install the system a hundred million times, it would still behave the same way because it is part of the code. You don't even have to write the code using standard language, you could make up your own language, since it's proprietary, it would be impossible to find unless you knew what the language meant. So let's assume that you somehow came across the code because someone let it out in the open and the code showed this:

asfa2342sfd asdfasfa sadf
afas23423df asd23422
2342sf2342 sr24234242 as2
2423dsfj3245-gk;g234

What would you say you have found? Nothing, you don't know the proprietary language so it would be impossible to discover anything.

In order to hide a pattern, you can program the code to work like this:

If system name starts with "a,b,c,d,e, or f" on 57th boot show "error", if system name starts with "x,y,z" do nothing. If user name starts with "1,2,3" do this, if boot is after 12 noon, do nothing, if boot is before 3 pm and user name starts with "a,b,c,d,e, or f" show alternate error...

ad infinitum...

Originally posted by beyondsense
Hard-drive has already been replaced twice. Again, this isn't an isolated issue, it has happened with nearly every machine I have bought. And something that I noticed too, after installing a required update or patch, a few weeks later, new problems start to "appear" out of nowhere. I have since disabled the automatic updates from all the PCs I have owned and thus have experienced fewer problems.

Every update to Windows 7 i have made the mistake of allowing disables my Stereo Mix Recording option, stand to reason.

Originally posted by beyondsense
I completely disagree. Ask any programmer. It is actually quite possible to make the code degrade. This is how you do it and it would work even after you do the re-install. You program the code to do the following (I will use layman's terms):

Upon boot, run program
Program=Check date
If current date is after "x" date then "slow down system by 2.5 seconds" after 97 days of use or 103 restarts
If current date is before "x" date then "do nothing"
If current date is after "x" date upon initiating "x" program 57 times show "error"
If current date is after "x" date upon restarting system "x" times show "error"

And you could make the values and variables vary so that it would be impossible find a "pattern". So I can program the code to say

If current date is after "x" date upon initiating "x" program 57 times show "error" but if current day is Monday then skip to Friday. If month is July do nothing, show error on next boot...

I mean, it is so simple to program this...and even if you re-install the system a hundred million times, it would still behave the same way because it is part of the code. You don't even have to write the code using standard language, you could make up your own language, since it's proprietary, it would be impossible to find unless you knew what the language meant. So let's assume that you somehow came across the code because someone let it out in the open and the code showed this:

asfa2342sfd asdfasfa sadf
afas23423df asd23422
2342sf2342 sr24234242 as2
2423dsfj3245-gk;g234

What would you say you have found? Nothing, you don't know the proprietary language so it would be impossible to discover anything.

edit on 25-10-2012 by beyondsense because: (no reason given)

edit on 25-10-2012 by beyondsense because: (no reason given)

It would be easily provable. Before installing the software disconnecting from the internet and setting the date to the launch of the operating system in question in the bios would circumvent your "degrading" code theory.

Hence therefor by, we could/would have conclusive evidence of the suggested. I'm here to tell you, that you're just wrong.

If/or statements don't actually work like that either. Basically, you can't tell a computer to do something in English. If/or is used for INT values, or array containers of INT values.

"Slow computer by 2.5 seconds" is not possible. Essentially what you would be required to do, is use more cpu cycles or add an artificial latency to command requests, which is a whole LOT more complicated than an if/or statement.

It would also be uniform throughout every computer using that particular software. Therefor, it would be impossible to have some users affected, while others not.

Originally posted by okamitengu
why are you still using XP,
microsoft stopped supporting it already.

windows 8 came out today.

upgrade to Linux and you do not have to buy a new computer


I run linux mint 12 on my old computers.
runs great is cheap(free)

reply to post by beyondsense


Well, lets perform a more "scientific" test:

- Get a clean drive, on an old machine (4+ years old), disconnect from the net, reset clock to 8 years ago, install windows xp on it, meassure timings on several operations, boot up, opening windows explorer, opening a pdf, etc etc.

- Get a second clean drive, on same machine, set current date, connect to the net, perform tests as above.

Check differences

Originally posted by okamitengu
why are you still using XP,
microsoft stopped supporting it already.

windows 8 came out today.
upgrade.

they might write sloppy code, but i doubt they code in a kill switch.
its more likely the hardware is no longer up to running the newer software you are using.,
hardware ages. from heat and use.

i have been in PC repair and operating system support for 25 years, so i can say this definitively.

of course as a plain old code cruncher you probably dont care what goes on inside you box.
ever cleaned it out with an air compressor?

This.

You say you've been working in the IT industry for xx years as a programmer. Awesome then you'd understand that the registry hive architecture Microsoft implemented is absolutely terrible, and as a programmer you would understand that each piece of software you install inserts data into the registry on install and during its working 'life'.

You also should understand using factory "restore" disks is a bad idea, as its pre-configured by the manufacturer in a horrible state (i mean ive seen a certain 2 letter manufacturer left a bunch of orphaned artifacts from software they use to test machines.....).

Last but not least, its Windows XP, that hasnt been supported, and is notorious for going "bad" after 12 months, most ITP's will reinstall their OS every year, we are talking full FDISK, format, install using clean OEM disks (not PC manufacturer disks).

To be honest i have a machine thats about 9 years old at home, runs Windows XP, and its still running strong with no problems, its install is going on 4 years old now, and since its hardly used as a PC (more of a UNC file server) its fine.

Originally posted by okamitengu
why are you still using XP,
microsoft stopped supporting it already.

windows 8 came out today.
upgrade.

they might write sloppy code, but i doubt they code in a kill switch.
its more likely the hardware is no longer up to running the newer software you are using.,
hardware ages. from heat and use.

i have been in PC repair and operating system support for 25 years, so i can say this definitively.

of course as a plain old code cruncher you probably dont care what goes on inside you box.
ever cleaned it out with an air compressor?

Of course they don't write code to corrupt the OS. I still have a working copy of windows 98se. I still have a working copy of XP. Of Windows 2008 server, and am running windows 7.

Hardware failing would be the first thing I'd look at. A mangled HDD can still operate without letting you know a lot, especially in XP, until it just fails. Faulty ram. old CPU electron migration if the owner tends to oc.

The only time M$ had an issue with a date was 1999/2000 and even all of that kerfuffle didn't stop people using the same software after that date. Mostly anyway.

They don't need to implement planned obsoletion in windows. Just stop supporting it. If you never upgrade your hardware, you're probably fine to use XP until something external drastically changes.

... lol and don't upgrade to windows 8. It's the deformed child. Wait for the next one, or stick with 7. 8 will be forgotten eventually, when they fork into two distinct branches, because a tablet style metro OS on a desktop with Mouse and KB will simply get in the way. It will be refined to cater to the correct market, and not some hybrid mutant that has both worlds but fails to use either properly.

But yeah, my old pentium4 still runs XP fine.

Now printers and so on, hardware.. they indeed do implement physical hardware limits. Fuses that blow after a set number of prints, or a set number of ink refills. That is unforgivable in my book.

Originally posted by RobertF
reply to post by okamitengu

 

Funny story about using an air compressor to clean the dust out of my old machine, so shave an industrial air compressor, it was set to 95psi ........turns out that is way to high, blew the heat conductor paste out of my both my my video card and my CPU. Ever since then I only use canned air....lesson learned after tearing apart the video card to put new paste for both.

Unless you had the heatsink off both, I very much doubt that. If you had enough pressure to blow sealed heatsink thermal paste clean out from between the chip and the heatsink, then you should have been ripping capacitors off the mobo too.

If you had the HS off the cpu and video card, then you should be re applying new thermal paste, especially if you're blowing dust out and around the board.

lol, and man, thermal paste is so thinly applied, and it's so viscous (decent stuff anyway, not my crappy thermal silicone gunk) you would need a blade to really scrape it off, or again, you're blowing caps off the board.

Originally posted by winofiend

Originally posted by okamitengu
why are you still using XP,
microsoft stopped supporting it already.

windows 8 came out today.
upgrade.

they might write sloppy code, but i doubt they code in a kill switch.
its more likely the hardware is no longer up to running the newer software you are using.,
hardware ages. from heat and use.

i have been in PC repair and operating system support for 25 years, so i can say this definitively.

of course as a plain old code cruncher you probably dont care what goes on inside you box.
ever cleaned it out with an air compressor?

Of course they don't write code to corrupt the OS. I still have a working copy of windows 98se. I still have a working copy of XP. Of Windows 2008 server, and am running windows 7.

Hardware failing would be the first thing I'd look at. A mangled HDD can still operate without letting you know a lot, especially in XP, until it just fails. Faulty ram. old CPU electron migration if the owner tends to oc.

The only time M$ had an issue with a date was 1999/2000 and even all of that kerfuffle didn't stop people using the same software after that date. Mostly anyway.

They don't need to implement planned obsoletion in windows. Just stop supporting it. If you never upgrade your hardware, you're probably fine to use XP until something external drastically changes.

... lol and don't upgrade to windows 8. It's the deformed child. Wait for the next one, or stick with 7. 8 will be forgotten eventually, when they fork into two distinct branches, because a tablet style metro OS on a desktop with Mouse and KB will simply get in the way. It will be refined to cater to the correct market, and not some hybrid mutant that has both worlds but fails to use either properly.

But yeah, my old pentium4 still runs XP fine.

Now printers and so on, hardware.. they indeed do implement physical hardware limits. Fuses that blow after a set number of prints, or a set number of ink refills. That is unforgivable in my book.

edit on 25-10-2012 by winofiend because: (no reason given)

I currently dual boot windows 7 and windows 8.

Windows 8 is pretty sweet. You can stay out of metro if you like. Even if you opt not to, metro is entirely functional and intuitive to use. The reason people hate windows 8 is because they don't like change. Really, that's it, and if you're one of those people, you can add the classic start menu/bar back and still have metro accessible from the side bar for easy access to metro apps.

Do I think it's a mistake leaving the classic start bar/menu out by default? Yes. Do I think metro is bad? No.

To cure the haters of windows 8, all Microsoft has to do is put an option to enable the classic start bar/menu into the "preferences" tab.

All woes are magically dissolved. And anybody computer literate has NO reason to complain, since they should be savvy enough to restore the classic interface in about 30 seconds.

Did the consumer preview have bugs, sure it did. So did windows 7, so did windows vista, so did windows XP, so did windows 2000.

The only two absolute windows flops were Vista and Millennium Edition. The rest have been vast improvements with each iteration, in terms of speed, usability, and intuitiveness.

As an enthusiast, I actually prefer metro. For those that aren't enthusiasts, those that aren't computer literate, will like metro better too, since it operates much like their phones that they already know how to use.

Windows 8 is win/win.

Don't hate something because it's different, especially when you can remove those differences in under a minute.

Originally posted by winofiend

Originally posted by RobertF
reply to post by okamitengu

 

Funny story about using an air compressor to clean the dust out of my old maachine, so shave an industrial air compressor, it was set to 95psi ........turns out that is way to high, blew the heat conductor paste out of my both my my video card and my CPU. Ever since then I only use canned air....lesson learned after tearing apart the video card to put new paste for both.

Unless you had the heatsink off both, I very much doubt that. If you had enough pressure to blow sealed heatsink thermal paste clean out from between the chip and the heatsink, then you should have been ripping capacitors off the mobo too.

If you had the HS off the cpu and video card, then you should be re applying new thermal paste, especially if you're blowing dust out and around the board.

lol, and man, thermal paste is so thinly applied, and it's so viscous (decent stuff anyway, not my crappy thermal silicone gunk) you would need a blade to really scrape it off, or again, you're blowing caps off the board.

QFT, I've been using an air compressor for years -- I don't even see how it's physically possible to blow paste out from in between the chip and the hsinks. If this really happened, you needed new paste anyway, as it means your paste was cooked, hardened, and brittle. Which usually only happens on enthusiast products like nVidia GX2's or over clockers that clock so high that it cooks the paste, in which case -- they have more serious problems then brittle paste.

Originally posted by beyondsense

Hi All,

So I was wondering and I think this may be quite possible...you ever notice that after a couple of years your computer starts to "act-up", show errors, it turns "slow", even when trying to run programs that it never had a problem with before? I've been in the PC industry for about 15 years and no matter which brand I have purchased, how many system factory restores I do to the machines, they always end up with the inherent systematic problems that make you feel like the computer is "old", "outdated", and you have to "upgrade" or buy something "faster". Granted, some newer programs/games require additional RAM. CPU, etc., but I'm talking about the same programs not running as they did when the computer was first purchased.

Take for instance my Windows XP Professional, about 4 years ago this computer started "acting up". No matter how many times I restore the computer, (at first it runs fine), but after 3 or 4 months, little by little it starts to become "corrupted". Trojans, Viruses, etc. are not an issue, again, I'm in the software programming field so I can say this with authority.

So it occurred to me, since we don't have access to the actual code, what if Microsoft purposely programs its code so after "x" months or "x" years and months, the system starts "mis-behaving". Anyone who has any programming knowledge knows this is quite easy and simple to do.

Another reason why they would want to do this, is to make sure the latest govt. spying software gets installed on all the new PCs. But wait!! What am I thinking about, Microsoft who has been fined multiple times for anti-trust issues would never think of doing something like this; this idea would never occurred to any of their top executives and 6 figure engineers and programmers...and our govt. would never be in it on something like this...yeah right...

Peace!

I find your post suspect. Although possible MS could do something like this ( and I wouldn't put it past them) there is no evidence of it from users observations. There are business that still run on windows 98. These systems are not connected to the internet, they don't have a lot of programs installed and run well with no problems. They only thing they change is hardware or backup/clone the system to a new drive if needed.

There are things you haven't taken into account, such as, is the computer your talking about connected to the internet, have you installed any updates, does it run on a standard ide/sata drive or does it use an SSD, is there a lot of apps installed, are you sure none of those apps have memory leaks, etc. All these things can effect your performance. I have used MS products for 20 years and used almost everyone of their operating systems. I know when I have troubles it's usually because of something I did or an app or driver I installed.

i would also like to defend win8
i have been using it for close to a year now, from CP to the technet release a few weeks ago.

it IS windows 7. underneath the flashy metro stuff, its still win7.
you can disable metro (or whatever it was renamed when they were sued)

i have it on an ASUS ep121 and it is without a doubt the best OS for that slate pc i have tried

win7 alone was not designed for touch interface.

the release of MS touch based OS on a tablet means businesses can finally have full office functionality on the tablet format they wanted from ipad.

file sharing, remote desktop, domain membership. real business on a real tablet.

not some half arsed apple product in the workplace hamstringing the end user from thier business.

otherwise this has been a good thread.

i appreciate others have different opinions on win8. but have they used it over any prolonged period of time?
earlier implementers opinions are based on experience not parroted blogs.

reply to post by beyondsense


Why upgrade? just reinstall your current OS, and now their evil plan is foiled.

If you have been working with computers for the last 15 years then I hope you know about fragmentation, and junk files which you should clean up regularly.

Another source of slow downs could be RAM, the older it gets the hotter it gets, which cause failures and corrupt reads.

Originally posted by beyondsense

Hi All,

So I was wondering and I think this may be quite possible...you ever notice that after a couple of years your computer starts to "act-up", show errors, it turns "slow", even when trying to run programs that it never had a problem with before? I've been in the PC industry for about 15 years and no matter which brand I have purchased, how many system factory restores I do to the machines, they always end up with the inherent systematic problems that make you feel like the computer is "old", "outdated", and you have to "upgrade" or buy something "faster". Granted, some newer programs/games require additional RAM. CPU, etc., but I'm talking about the same programs not running as they did when the computer was first purchased.

Take for instance my Windows XP Professional, about 4 years ago this computer started "acting up". No matter how many times I restore the computer, (at first it runs fine), but after 3 or 4 months, little by little it starts to become "corrupted". Trojans, Viruses, etc. are not an issue, again, I'm in the software programming field so I can say this with authority.

So it occurred to me, since we don't have access to the actual code, what if Microsoft purposely programs its code so after "x" months or "x" years and months, the system starts "mis-behaving". Anyone who has any programming knowledge knows this is quite easy and simple to do.

Another reason why they would want to do this, is to make sure the latest govt. spying software gets installed on all the new PCs. But wait!! What am I thinking about, Microsoft who has been fined multiple times for anti-trust issues would never think of doing something like this; this idea would never occurred to any of their top executives and 6 figure engineers and programmers...and our govt. would never be in it on something like this...yeah right...

Peace!

Ermmm sorry to burst your bubble, dozens of vulnerabilities are discovered everyday in OS... When you don't update your stuff you leave these gaping hole open for whomever which to exploit them... The longer you go without patching them the more vulnerable to attacks you are... The more spywares and virus you'll catch...

Lots of these attack aren't exact science it can corrupt files, crash machines and so on... An exploit may with fine once, fail the second and crash the system on the third... Usually its meant to be as stable as possible but issues can always happens...

The more virus and compromised your machine is the slower it'll be...

Lastly if you don't patch your stuff and apply updates then you certainly do not defrag your HD neither... Without trying to sound insulting your PC problems are caused only by your own negligence...

Nothing more...

XP by default install is as easy to get in than Madonna... If not fully updated it takes anyone that knows how to about 1-2 minutes to get in there, privilege escalate ur way to admin privileges and execute cmd.exe and have a straight admin command prompt running straight on the machine remotely...

And yet there are Windows Server 2000 boxes that still run just as well as they have for almost 13 years...

Heck i've got a Windows 7 box that I upgraded from XP after 7 was released. It runs just as well as the day it was installed. The OS starts slowing down due to built up garbage over time, know how to clean your registry and other things of that nature and you never have to worry about it slowing down. Works the same as pretty much every other OS out there.

I run Oracle VirtualBox on Windows 7...... never any problems with whatever system I'm running,
Well except for 95 and 98 is a kill joy with registries. Linux has never failed me, maybe I should run Windows on Linux lol.