Top neurosurgeon 'spent six days in heaven' during a coma

reply to post by CaptainBeno


Unfortunately, as much as I'd like to know of his encounter. None of it was included.

Meanwhile this simply seems like a book promo. Perhaps if he had recorded his encounters in a manner that didn't require me to pay to read it.

reply to post by CaptainBeno


Dr. Alexander's story is fascinating, but I found this interesting...
I know Wikipedia isn't the best of sources, but this Dr. Alexander has a very interesting pedigree, if this genealogy holds true is true. He appears to be part of the upper crust more than I already thought.

Dr. Alexander's Family Ties to Skull & Bones

Originally posted by Cuervo


There's insurmountable evidence that there is a consciousness and that it is housed inside your body? So the philosophical debate that has lasted for centuries is now solved?

What is this insurmountable evidence?

Well a pretty good indication is that anyone who has ever conceived the idea of, or experienced consciousness, has been a person in a body. Even the people who say that consciousness exists outside of the body have been, people in a body.
That's at least a very strong clue.

reply to post by gusmonkey


"Eben Alexander (March 9, 1851 – March 11, 1910) was an American scholar, educator, dean and ambassador born in Knoxville. Alexander attended the University of Tennessee (then known as East Tennessee University) for two years, entered Yale in 1869, and graduated from Yale in 1873 with an A.B. He was initiated into Yale's Skull and Bones in 1873."

"In 1893 President Grover Cleveland appointed him "Envoy Extraordinary, Minister Plenipotentiary, and Consul General to Greece, Roumania, and Servia" [sic]. As ambassador to Greece, he helped in the revival of the Olympic Games, making the first cash contribution to the organizing committee, encouraging the participation of American athletes, and with his wife hosting numerous social events during the period of the games, which ran from April 6 to April 15, 1896."

"In 1905 Alexander was inducted into the Order of the Golden Fleece, an honor society at the University of North Carolina that was modeled on Yale's Skull and Bones."

reply to post by Cuervo


I wasn't arguing that there is a consciousness. I am replying to this statement:

There is no reason to believe that your consciousness is actually in your body at any given time. Perspective just makes you assume so.

Take a look around. Look in the mirror. Go for a walk. Touch your skin. Close your eyes. Can you remember or dream of anything that has zero relation to your senses or body? Has anyone ever been born without a body? Have you seen anything leave a corpse after death? Can you see the back of your head? Are you conscious of what I'm conscious of?

Show me one deceased person floating around as consciousness. No one can. All I have to do is show you 7 billion conscious human bodies.

This is self-evident stuff.

But for some odd reason, people think otherwise?

Maybe I mistook your statement, I was under the impression you were saying consciousness is everywhere.

Some of you all are so silly. Maybe some things cannot be explained. We can't think that we know everything that is for sure. If we shoot down all stories as they are relayed to us, instead of listening and absorbing and thinking about them, we might miss out on a new idea or thought.
I believe that the "ghosts" we see at times are actually in another dimension and they can also hear us at times and may be thinking we are the ghosts. Wouldn't it be something if they were actually researching our voices and sounds?
We haven't even begun to understand what is going on out there, but we have to keep trying!

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n

As for making a "few extra bucks" off a book.... I don't buy it.

I don't care who you are.....that's funny right there.

Originally posted by delusion

Originally posted by Cuervo


There's insurmountable evidence that there is a consciousness and that it is housed inside your body? So the philosophical debate that has lasted for centuries is now solved?

What is this insurmountable evidence?

Well a pretty good indication is that anyone who has ever conceived the idea of, or experienced consciousness, has been a person in a body. Even the people who say that consciousness exists outside of the body have been, people in a body.
That's at least a very strong clue.

So by your rationale, everybody's consciousness on ATS lives in my laptop since that's where I see them?

What I don't get is many people have the tunnel experience, and the experience of heaven, some have experienced hell even, but nobody (that I have heard of) experienced purgatory? I would love to hear a story about what purgatory is or may be like.

Originally posted by NiNjABackflip
reply to post by Cuervo

 

I wasn't arguing that there is a consciousness. I am replying to this statement:

There is no reason to believe that your consciousness is actually in your body at any given time. Perspective just makes you assume so.

Take a look around. Look in the mirror. Go for a walk. Touch your skin. Close your eyes. Can you remember or dream of anything that has zero relation to your senses or body? Has anyone ever been born without a body? Have you seen anything leave a corpse after death? Can you see the back of your head? Are you conscious of what I'm conscious of?

Show me one deceased person floating around as consciousness. No one can. All I have to do is show you 7 billion conscious human bodies.

This is self-evident stuff.

But for some odd reason, people think otherwise?

Maybe I mistook your statement, I was under the impression you were saying consciousness is everywhere.

You don't have to believe that we would be plagued with disembodied spirits and flying ghosts in order to entertain the idea that our consciousness is not housed in a particular place.

The only reason you have the perspective you do and see things "out there" instead of in your head is because our brains have an amazing ability to translate Fourier mathematical equations. Without that ability, we would actually be experiencing (viewing) life from an actual location but we don't. We are FPSing it and that's very strange when you think about it.

No, there is zero evidence that our consciousness is housed within our brain. Saying that it is because nothing comes out when you die sort of solidifies my point.

I read this story a little bit ago and came here to find the thread about it...This sounds '___' related. I dont know how a neurosurgeon would not know about '___' and that it causes these visons to happen.

reply to post by Cuervo


Can you explain what FSP-ing is?
I know it has something to do with computers right? But I really don't understand that term.

Originally posted by ldyserenity
reply to post by Cuervo

 

Can you explain what FSP-ing is?
I know it has something to do with computers right? But I really don't understand that term.

FPS = First Person Shooter (those games where it's all point-of-view)

Sorry for the geek reference but it's a good analog when talking about the brain, the viewer, and the consciousness.

reply to post by Cuervo


okay thanks for clearing that up.
So it sort of has to do with computers, if it is in reference to a game.

Good analogy.

reply to post by CaptainBeno

Just food for thought. You don't know, what you don't know. When you hold on too tight and look for "proof", it won't come. When you let go of all the noise in your head and really pay attention, the proof will come. Some people refer to this as faith.

Originally posted by texaschick
reply to post by CaptainBeno

 

Just food for thought. You don't know, what you don't know. When you hold on too tight and look for "proof", it won't come. When you let go of all the noise in your head and really pay attention, the proof will come. Some people refer to this as faith.

Exactly. Religion also falls into that category. It is not something binary or quantifiable so it must be experienced to prove to an individual and no amount of debate can convince a person who prefers not to believe it.

It's like trying to convince you that my local 7-11 is getting rained on at the moment. There's not a pressing reason not to believe it but some will go so far as to try to convince others that you are stupid for even considering that the 7-11 could be getting rained on.

Zero brain activity, absolute ZILCH! Assuming he is being honest and he experienced this of course.

People are saying his pineal gland kicked in ok well if your brain is not active the pineal glads effects are moot. If your engine is ceased up pouring gas in the carb is not going to make it run... get it? He is educated he knows and understands this a bit more then the arm chair experts one would think. He is a professional he is a neurosurgeon that had a experience that defies science as we understand it to be. In a world of uncertainty and the unknown these things do happen, when it does some will use nonsense filler words to explain it away. If you are not receptive to the possibility then there is no point in engaging discussion.

What is proof: instances of evidence

This is indeed evidence and quite profound and groundbreaking


This instance of evidence strongly suggests there very well may be a metaphysical existence outside our own. No brain activity hence no way for him to imagine/hallucinate inside his own mind. So then bodes the question... what happened? What was once thought impossible has become possible. People use to think earth is flat the moon is made of cheese and the universe revolves around the earth , what do we really know? Miracles or just random coincidences, it cant be explained. We are all struggling to come to terms with our own mortality... this is good news, remember when there was good news ? It's a taboo concept isn't it.

reply to post by DarthFazer



The thing is that a '___' trip lasts like 10 to 15 mins yet the person under feels like its hours, days, even weeks long. So this guys gland could have pumped out some '___' as he was coming out of the coma and he could have had an experiance that felt as long as the coma but really took place in a few mins.

Originally posted by Cuervo



So by your rationale, everybody's consciousness on ATS lives in my laptop since that's where I see them?

Sure, you can choose to think that if you like. The evidence that that is not so is more compelling though, that actual real people are communicating through a vast network via individual laptops.
But I wouldn't apply my rationale to that idea in the first place, not sure why you would? Any argument applied to where it doesn't belong can be 'proven' to be an absurdity, it's a rhetorical device, but not useful for investigation of what is true, or rather what can be SHOWN to be true, and therefore is worth believing.

Existence apart from any consciousness arising from having a body, can never be proven, because any experiential evidence must always take place through that body, and so is part of it, and can be caused by it. Or more to the point, it can never be disproven. The number of things that can never be disproved are infinite, so it seems a little irresponsible to believe in an infinity of things, just because they can never be disproven.
You make a choice to believe something, but it's not based on evidence or rational thinking, it's based on pyschological need. A rational case for believing in things that make us feel better can be made, but if you know that they're false, or possibly false, they probably lose their benefit.

Anyway, this sort of thing can really only ever be reduced to one position, rationally speaking, and that is, 'Cool story bro.'

And maybe believing the disembodied points of view you experience via ATS are produced by your laptop IS a responsible attitude, at least until further evidence is forthcoming that would prove otherwise. For most people that evidence comes earlier on in their life BEFORE they start operating a laptop and browsing forums on ATS, but if you had just come into existence now, then that would be a perfectly reasonable postion.

Originally posted by ldyserenity
What I don't get is many people have the tunnel experience, and the experience of heaven, some have experienced hell even, but nobody (that I have heard of) experienced purgatory? I would love to hear a story about what purgatory is or may be like.

The game 'Dark Souls' is a good example of purgatory. The endless repetition, the sense of despair.