Am I Exempt From The 2nd Amendment?, page 1

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 3 times

Topic started on 27-9-2012 @ 05:47 AM by wantsome

I'm 36 years old and I have paranoid schizophrenia. I'm a avid sportsman and do a lot of fishing. I've been hunting a few times and wanted to get more into it this year.

What kept me back from hunting more often is I'd like to have my own equipment instead of using my friends stuff.

I finally have the money this year to get my own equipment. I went my local gun store yesterday and was checking out a few guns. I was thinking about getting a 12 gauge and maybe hand gun.

I had a talk with the owner and asked him a few questions. I asked if there would be any restrictions since I have schizophrenia. He said if I had a involuntary hospitalization that I couldn't buy a gun. His reaction was priceless when I told him I have schizophrenia. I told him I wasn't a psychotic murderer.

Anyways I'm pretty pissed right now. I had a involuntary hospitalization when I was 20 years old. I have no criminal record what so ever. I feel betrayed that the constitution don't apply to me.

When I came down with schizophrenia I had access to 15 guns. My step dad had a unlocked gun cabinet in our basement.

Not everybody with schizophrenia is James Holmes.

Should I be excluded from the second amendment?

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 05:53 AM by exponent

I'm British, but from my perspective you suffer from a disorder which affects your ability to perceive and understand reality. You suffer from it to such an extent that you've had to be forcibly hospitalised before.

No, I don't think you should be permitted a firearm. How are we to know that you will not see danger where there is none, or fail to understand the danger of a loaded gun? With power comes responsibility, and it's not clear from what you have said that you are capable of that responsibility.

It's not your fault, but it's just the card you have been dealt.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 05:57 AM by wantsome

reply to post by exponent

I've been symptom free for over 10 years. I still have access to guns. If I wanted to kill someone I'd use a baseball bat.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:04 AM by Maxatoria

Perhaps you just need to goto another shop and only answer any questions that they ask and see if you're on the ATF's no sell list and if you can get a CCW then you don't need to wait for clearance in some places

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:07 AM by projectvxn

Yes you are exempt from purchasing firearms of any type legally.

You must be of sound mental health to purchase any firearms in the US.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:07 AM by exponent

Originally posted by wantsome
I've been symptom free for over 10 years. I still have access to guns. If I wanted to kill someone I'd use a baseball bat.

You may be symptom free, but you are not cured. If you wanted to kill someone with a baseball bat it would be much much harder than shooting them.

That difference is important to me.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:10 AM by 369821

reply to post by projectvxn

Incorrect. Some states do not care about mental health status. And usually a gun shop only has your criminal history run, and nothing else. Especially with the current patients rights/privacy laws.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:11 AM by havok

reply to post by wantsome

Since I don't believe the framers wanted to exclude certain people from it...and since I believe there should be the right to protect life and liberty to everyone then yes, you should still be able to bear arms.

If in your own mind you see a danger, then refrain from owning deadly weapons.
At some point people must take responsibility for their own mind, or conscious.
I know that some minds are more complex than others or more simple than others...
Usually those people know inside the difference or might have a fear of said weapons.

If you feel, in sound mind, that owning a gun will benefit you, and you have been "borrowing" one for some time, then it seems you are no more of a threat than some of the psychopaths that carry them everyday and "enforce" the law.

Only you know what you can handle...
But if you are a law abiding citizen and the law says you can't own a gun...it's your duty to abide.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:15 AM by DerekJR321

I believe it depends on your state.

Here is a link that lists all states, and the restrictions if you are diagnosed as "mentally ill".

Possession of a Firearm by the Mentally Ill

Hope that helps.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:20 AM by glassspider

i have to agree with the first response you had, whilst it's not your fault that you have the condition you have it is a condition where you can't seperate reality from delusions, i'm english and we just have a very different attitude to guns than a lot of Americans,
i had good friends back in liverpool with schizophrenia lovely blokes but the fact was when it took over them they couldn't separate what they were imagining from what was really happening, they would lash out at good friends without reason, also if you were forcibly hospitalised then at that time you were considered to be a danger to yourself or other people, this is not a dig at you personally but i don't think buying a gun is the right idea, also imagine the uproar if you did do something, the gun laws would get a lot tighter pretty quick, because people will be asking how somebody who has openly admitted he has paranoid schizophrenia who had earlier been forcibly hospitalised for their own protection or the protection of others was just handed a gun over the counter. i hope you find peace with this rather than winding yourself up and getting more angry and feeling like your rights are being violated, i think other peoples rights are being protected in this case.
good luck, i hope you stay symptom free

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:30 AM by Hefficide

reply to post by wantsome

I am not an expert on guns or the law. But if you read my posts you probably know I am a strong advocate about mental health issues. And here's my thoughts, from that perspective,

With Schizophrenia the problem is that you lack perspective to know if you are symptom free or not. You have to rely upon externals ( other people ) to make that assessment for you. Your treatment likely has removed all of the noticeable or recorded symptoms or delusions. But you do still possess the capacity for symptom recurrence. And it may come in the form that you are not acclimated to recognizing as a symptom at all.

Your writing style makes me think you have some hostility issues. Maybe it's just because you're angry at this situation... maybe it's that text is not the best indicator of personality and is easily misinterpreted regarding tone and inflection. If you do happen to have a predisposition towards aggression, however, you might want to consider that as you think this through.

I do understand that you feel slighted, singled out, and offended by this. And I do sympathize. But as a person who has mental health issues himself, I ask you this in earnest... Try to see it from outside of yourself and wonder, if you were one of your neighbors, or friends, or doctors, or relatives... what would they say? How would they react to this question?

In that, I think you will find, at least, the best answer for your personal thoughts. Again, the legal aspects aside.

~Heff

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:31 AM by wantsome

Interesting reading some of the reply's. My buddy said he'd buy the shotgun for me if I couldn't get one. I really wanted a handgun but I can live without it. I mostly wanted it for home protection. I live 2 blocks from Detroit and I can't walk to the store after dark. I hear gunshots every night. Someone was stabbed by a crackhead at the end of my street on xmas.

Personally I wouldn't get a gun if I didn't think I wasn't sound of mind enough. The last thing I wan't is to end up in a psyche ward of a prison for the rest of my life.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:32 AM by Dustytoad

reply to post by wantsome

My aunt may have had the same thing as you or psychotic something not sure. She would get paranoid and think that my uncle was releasing thousands of black widows in the house to kill her. She called the cops on him when he was working on something for the military.. She thought it was a bomb to kill her..

She talked to people I couldn't see..

She seems fine now on medication, but I wouldn't want her to buy a gun.

I don't know, but I'm leaning towards no.

but maybe?

it's hard to say

edit on 9/27/2012 by Dustytoad because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:36 AM by glassspider

reply to post by wantsome

if you are considering knowingly getting your friend to break the law for you to buy you a gun then you are already showing poor judgement on this subject. as the poster above said when the symprtoms return you will not see them as symptoms, you will see them as a genuine thing you have to confront. i hope your friend doesnt get a gun for you but if they do i hope that you never hurt yourself or anybody else. good luck

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:41 AM by Asktheanimals

Then again many people sell used firearms through classifieds etc, usually the most they will ever ask you for is a valid drivers license.
If you've been symptom free for decades then I agree you should be able to legally purchase firearms.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:44 AM by wantsome

reply to post by glassspider

I just want my own gun for hunting that's it. I don't like using other peoples stuff. I also speed when I drive it's a risk I'm willing to take.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:45 AM by Asktheanimals

Originally posted by Hefficide

With Schizophrenia the problem is that you lack perspective to know if you are symptom free or not. You have to rely upon externals ( other people ) to make that assessment for you.
~Heff

That's pretty much true of everyone, not just schizophrenics.
Who of us are capable of seeing ourselves in any kind of detached manner?

We all rely on social cues to decide whether or not our behavior is correct.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:47 AM by glassspider

reply to post by wantsome

I also speed when I drive it's a risk I'm willing to take.

okay but what you don't seem to realise is that both things are risks you take with other people's lives, that comment suggests that if you can't handle a car responsibly you shouldnt really be given another dangerous weapon. you're willing to take risks that could end other peoples lives if you read your own comment back do you really think you should be handed a firearm?

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:47 AM by LeatherNLace

Originally posted by wantsome
reply to post by glassspider

I just want my own gun for hunting that's it.

Interesting, just a few posts up you said:

Originally posted by wantsome

I mostly wanted it for home protection.

I'm not making an attempt to be critical of you, I'm just making an observation.

reply posted on 27-9-2012 @ 06:48 AM by Hefficide

reply to post by wantsome

Originally posted by wantsome
reply to post by glassspider

I just want my own gun for hunting that's it. I don't like using other peoples stuff. I also speed when I drive it's a risk I'm willing to take.

Therein is the crux of the issue. You are willing to take the risk, but are apparently not realizing that it's the risk to others that is being called into question here. That sort of egocentric thought is not a strong indicator of a predisposition towards responsible thinking.

Not being judgmental. But truthful and hopeful that you can see the point.

~Heff

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