Humans are soulless flesh machines governed by their internal programming.

Originally posted by Ophiuchus 13

Originally posted by homeskillet

life isnt a futuristic dystopian movie where the human "spirit" is always shining through at the end.

Its energy, and there ARE hierarchies of energies over other energies some good some bad.. 1 seeks no fairy tale the balance exist. Vibrate as your will suggest maybe it means more school?

or that your pulled to that side of thinking which is very well. How better a Creator design then to let wills govern their own existences and locations of their energies until they see whats needed to be seen and are then finally freed.

edit on 9/21/12 by Ophiuchus 13 because: (no reason given)

i kind of get the vibe(rations) that you're being a bit condescending. suggesting that i havent come to an enlightened state. there is absolutely nothing wrong with coming to terms with our physicality and finite limitations. i think that would be a more balanced state to live in.

Originally posted by blah yada

I don't think they meant to insult you. I took the word primitive on it's literal meaning, and find no insult there. Some of your remarks are insulting to Alyssa though.

I would consider us primitive,far from the finished article if there is such a thing. I would welcome a world of increased ability, increased understanding, and better health.

I wouldn't worry too much though, because this is a world you and I and most other people will never be a part of. It is already happening too. People you will never know are benefitting from technology you would not allow yourself to believe in even if it was made available to you.

edit on 21-9-2012 by blah yada because: (no reason given)

edit on 21-9-2012 by blah yada because: (no reason given)

First up I wish to apologise if anyone found my comment rude or insulting. They were the product of being irritated by the implication of being primitive. I should know better. Sorry.

I understand a lot more than you give me credit for. I have been immersed in technology for over 20 years, it was my career, so you speak out of turn my friend. I know about the implants Kevin Warwick used on himself to connect his own nervous system to a computer interface. And a lot more too.

There is no such thing as a finished article in any species. And I do not deny the premise of the OP with regard human/technology interfacing. Upgrading if you want to call it that. What I take issue at is the arrogant assertion that we are just meat bags. I know this to be false. One day you and the OP will too.

Originally posted by nothingwrong


Of course, you are entitled to your opinion, but please don't try to tell me that my experiences are devoid of any meaning or value. You can no more prove you are right than I can prove that I am right. Absence of proof is not proof of absence. So you are following your faith in your beliefs just as much as I am following my faith in my beliefs. The difference is I have experiential evidence that there is a foundation for my beliefs. What do you have other than faith in your opinion?

i never said that your experiences are devoid of meaning. it's meaningful to YOU. it's fine that you find comfort in them but yet again, that still doesnt make "spirit" real.

i have my own personal experiences, as we all do, that have shaped my opinions and are just as meaningful to me as yours are to you. once again, the "spiritual" people do not have a monopoly on a better existence or a deeper appreciation for life. to think that way is not only condescending but its insulting.

and i am not following my faith. i am just living.

although our discussion is part of it i'd actually like to continue on the real topic.

where in being integrated with technology says you need to give up your faith?

We are on the verge of this. We are already so connected with technology that it seems that it will eventually happen.

With how fast technolgy is advancing its only a matter of time untill computers will be smarter then us.

Our ego will demand we keep up. The only way to do so is to merge together.

Once this is possible then ANYTHING will be possible.

Originally posted by watchitburn
reply to post by Alyssa

 

I like the way you think.

The sooner people rid themselves of all the superstitious nonsense and realize we are just bi-pedal meat sacks, the sooner we can get on with all of the fun stuff.

I agree,dead is dead

Originally posted by nothingwrong
. I know that all the experiences we have are part of the reason we incarnated in the first place.

But how do you KNOW this. On what logical, demonstrable framework is your knowledge based? Or do you really mean you have faith in this idea. Can you demonstrate a contiguous path of logic to your conclusion?

It's a nice idea and i'd love to believe in it. It's just that nobody has been able to convince me, mostly because they stringently avoid, even denounce, scientific process, common logic and deductive reasoning. When they do employ these approaches they usually corrupt them.

If we have a soul/spirit , what is it made of? I expect to be told "energy". Well, everything is energy, so I'm asking what specific type or types of energy and in what sort of arrangement, is a soul comprised of.

Where is the soul located? What is it's atomic mass?

Personally I see our brains as organic computers which end up with a little bit of miswired circuitry and a lot of bad software programming, as a result of experience.This computer has a lot of 'glitches' as would any machine running junk software. We mistake some of these glitches for some kind of spirit or soul or entity within.

We are basically personifying a series of idiosyncracies and flaws into an internalised,immortal, self emulant, archtype of our acquired sense of an ultimate being

reply to post by Alyssa


Now and then we run across something that is meaningless and trivial. Looks like i did it today when i found your thread.

Originally posted by blah yada
Personally I see our brains as organic computers which end up with a little bit of miswired circuitry and a lot of bad software programming, as a result of experience.This computer has a lot of 'glitches' as would any machine running junk software. We mistake some of these glitches for some kind of spirit or soul or entity within.

We are basically personifying a series of idiosyncracies and flaws into an internalised,immortal, self emulant, archtype of our acquired sense of an ultimate being

edit on 21-9-2012 by blah yada because: (no reason given)

i agree spot on witheverything you're saying but i think the brain has a lot of conflicting programming more so than junk. right side vs. left side for example. it also can be attributed to the programming actually doing its job too well. likePareidolia over compensating for the brains function to recognize familiar elements.


i also wanted to add this to the discussion on social evolution for people to understand why we believe that we naturally evolved to have this grand view of others as well as the horrific things we do.

Originally posted by Alyssa

You deny science?
Humans are not amazing.

I dunno...we came up with that science that you seem so enamored with.
That's pretty amazing, I think...

reply to post by homeskillet


By Junk programming , I was kind of pointing to mainstream culture and social conditioning. The aftermarket add on software if you will, life's acquired experience and conditioning in other words. This has a massive effect on our existential views, most people being involuntarily indoctrinated into a faith from early infancy, whereby existential belief is integral to familial and social acceptance and is propelled by emotions of fear and love rather than reason

What you seem to be referring to is more like the preloaded software on a computer, that has certain bugs and glitches, but basically handles all the primary functions neccesary for operation.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by Alyssa

 

Now and then we run across something that is meaningless and trivial. Looks like i did it today when i found your thread.

And you did it again with that post! And they say lightning doesn't strike twice!

reply to post by Alyssa
Hey if that's what turns you on why not, its all about experience at this point. The way I see it , its your choice.best wishes

Originally posted by blah yada
reply to post by homeskillet

 

By Junk programming , I was kind of pointing to mainstream culture and social conditioning. The aftermarket add on software if you will, life's acquired experience and conditioning in other words. This has a massive effect on our existential views, most people being involuntarily indoctrinated into a faith from early infancy, whereby existential belief is integral to familial and social acceptance and is propelled by emotions of fear and love rather than reason

What you seem to be referring to is more like the preloaded software on a computer, that has certain bugs and glitches, but basically handles all the primary functions neccesary for operation.

well, i think the culture and conditioning are outcroppings of the "preloaded software". we developed the need to be social and live in groups and all the subtleties and complexities arose from there. this is how we survived as long as we did i believe. the problem is it isnt as perfect as we'd like it to be. we still have dangerous group think. mob rules.

with that said, i stated in another recent thread on transhumanism that our best bet would be to weed out the more undesirable traits like greed and violence through genetic manipulation. also, by raising the overall IQ of everyone even minimally we could then build programs based on education. i truly believe that that would eliminate a lot of our primitive superstitions.

Originally posted by Alyssa
1-Why does mankind deny this fact about their existence? 2-If mankind accepted this ultimate truth they could then embrace Transhumanism. 3-Fusion between man The Flesh Machine and advance machine is the only logical outcome if we wish to evolve beyond our current limitations. There are no gods, angels or aliens that will guide you in life. Everything from your morals to believing in good or evil are primitive means of keeping a societal structure maintained.

4-Just imagine a world where nobody is ever alone. If you have no sexual market value you simply can buy a mate who will always love you. 5-Don't understand a language? Just download it into your cybernetic brain. 6-Can't afford a vacation? Log into a simulated reality for low price. This is true bliss of what Transhumanism can bring to all those people suffering. 7-Making the disabled walk again, cures for diseases, complete cybernetic upgrade into a better human being. NO RELIGION can do this, NO GOD will save humanity, 8-only giving ourselves to Transhumanism can push us forward.

9-Upgrade to the better human.

LL

OOOOkay,

2-and with the flip of a switch, be turned into robots, soulless machines
no thanks.

3-tens, even hundreds of thousands of years in the future
you really should read Frank Herberts Dune series, addresses the whole trans-humanism business as a major sub-theme of the whole series *SPOILER ALERT*: you even get your happy ending: the ultimate Kwisatz Haderach
is a Man-Machine Synthesis and more, with Magical Power as well, it is only the Machine Consciousness of an AI that merges with the Consciousness of the K.H. the human body being the ultimate machine already, you see, both Man and Machine have a bit of evolving to do yet, especially the latter
A.A.Athanasio's Radix is also a great read.

4- not even going to go into the psycho sexual implications...

5-Glossolalia and TP can do this, no machines required, anyone who speaks a human language does it as a baby, depowering social programming is to blame for "loss" of ability GIGO.

6-creative visualization and lucid dreaming, especially the latter are the ultimate holodeck, if you want to limit yourself to using it for only that, again, no invasive batteries, machinery, OR electronics required.

why settle for prosthetics? when stem cell tech created from donor-cells from the patient [no fetus required], 3-d bio-printing, and we also now know that babies and young children possess regenerative capabilities, to an extent [recent thread] why settle for a wooden leg when a real one can be grown? yet another example of what the Human Body, The Ultimate Chariot of Chaos, is capable of.

8- false, else how did we get this far?

9-

"I teach you the Superman: Man is something to be Overcome. what have you done to Overcome Him?"

seems to me Transhum's are lazy, looking for a cheap, quick fix, why work out, when you can replace your legs with wheels? LL

and no i didn't forget:

1-

Humans are soulless flesh machines governed by their internal programming.

you do realize this statement completely invalidates this thread and the concepts/preaching therein?

what would a soulless machine [flesh or otherwise] know about anything?

have you met member Druscilla? she wants to be downloaded into a machine too, i'm surprised you two haven't met

Despisers of the Body, are not bridges to the Superman.

reply to post by homeskillet


The Pareidolia phenomenon is interesting. I think it operates at multiple levels, not just at the visual level but at the conceptual level.

We tend to personify things we don't understand. We incorporate them as demons or gods or faeries etc.
Regardless of how bizarre or divine the creature, it is nearly always at least part humanoid, and armed with human qualities or flaws, as well as supernatural ones which are of course a convenient way to explain the inexplicable.

It's as though the mind defaults to attempting to humanise things it does not recognise or understand. As Sagan noted, the human mind seems to be hardwired for recognising the human face.

Could this be an extremely primitive function at work? That which is unknown is potentially dangerous.Being able to humanise an unknown phenomenon makes it less threatening perhaps, at least until it does something humans can't do and then becomes a god or force of divinty. I'm just guessing here.

I think this concept is what drives faith in the soul and in gods etc.Our beliefs are essentially sculpted from our mass of fear,misunderstanding and ignorance, instead of being predicated on a structure of proven logic and empirical science.

reply to post by Alyssa


This use to be my exact rain of thought when i was an atheist back in the day. It made everything pointless, no point in morals, love, grand scheme of things was nothingness .......which then meant why not sleep around, rob banks, steal from everyone, and not give a crap about anyone.......

I made a post about this train of thought and i got so swarmed by atheists, i just couldnt keep up with the replies and was completely taken out of context.

Regardless i then investigated enlightenment and found that such a thing is true and leads to an Absolute Beingness and that i eventually remembered having existed prior to being "born" on "earth".

We are headed towards transhumanism no matter what, as its an inevitable step in our evolution. Still at the end of the day, when the human body dies, you realize you still exist as soul/awareness.

Originally posted by Alyssa
Upgrade to the better human.

Seems like a downgrade to me. But then again, I know we are not soulless.

I think we are forgetting another side to life here.... You say human beings are souless flesh vehicles.... Then what about all the people that have out of body experiences? What about all the people that have experienced the energy of the chakras and kundalini? If you have not astral projected, then you will not believe in it, but that doesn't mean that it is not real. We are capable of leaving our own bodies because we are souls simply piloting the body. When we die, we leave the body completely and go back to the universal source of consciousness. Look at all the amazing things in nature. The amazing designs, the sacred geometry, how everything falls beautifully into place to create a stable environment for life. Does this not scream divine at the top of its lungs? To believe that we are souless is a sad thing. That means you have allowed your ego to take over you completely. You have identified with it, and only it, and you don't even realize it. If you cannot face your fears, feel your emotions, or accept others for who they are, then you are all ego. The minute you learn to trancend the ego, is the minute you learn that this world goes far beyond the physical world. There is a spiritual realm that we can all be a part of. That we can all experience. It is a very beaufitul experience, and it is the key to our evolution. We have the ability to raise our vibrations, to accept more positive things and create a better world that we are currently living in. We have simply forgotten who we really are, because ego has been allow to take over. All sins are ego. All acts that are immoral are ego. Profit and greed rule this planet because of ego. As soon as people wake up, and realize this fact, all of these things can be reversed. Humanity has just temporarily forgotten what they are, amnesia. It will not last forever.

www.mind-programming.com...

This website shows the entire source structure of the mind.

It is not a seminar. It is available information and highly relevant to this thread.

This post says more about you, than anything else.