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The Accusations Are True ATS - I Do Have An Agenda And I Have Been Manipulating You! My Confession.

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posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by Hefficide
reply to post by judus
 


Ah, but you did reply, and I did incite some level of indignation - apparently based upon the thread title alone.

Just sayin'


~Heff


I've never seen your posts, however you seem like a bright fellow.

It does, although, particularily strike me that you need a [new] hobby.




posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:01 PM
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I for one have been completely manipulated by this forum. I mean, when you think about the following beliefs I now have due to manipulation by members . . . .

- steel framed sky scrapers can fall because of fires hundreds of degrees less then the temperature at which steel melts.

- concrete can be pulverized in free flight, but foreign passports can free fall through fireballs and survive.

- an airplane can hit the ground and disappear leaving only a smoking hole.

- a bullet can turn around in flight.

- you can still see the earth as if it's right next to you even while orbiting the moon.

- a us president can be elected regardless of what country they come from.

- powerful hackers with names like " the freedom fighters " are out to cause our infrastructure harm.

- bad guys are mostly white and wear hoodies.



I mean think about it, of course none of this is true and I have definitly been manipulated !!!!! Next someone here will tell me my social security is in jeapordy..... I mean come on guys, I'm not that gullible.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:02 PM
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edit on 20-9-2012 by lernmore because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:07 PM
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Originally posted by LeoStarchild
Im not shocked.

But you failed. I am unable to be manipulated..because i see the truth everywhere.

As for your thread.. one word - Ego

Too many people have it and cherish it, as it will be the end of mankind

edit on 20-9-2012 by LeoStarchild because: (no reason given)



As said by someone on first page.
Useless thread showing "I'm right, you should follow me" and everybody jump into the water.

Not me.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:27 PM
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reply to post by Hefficide
 


I think you try to confuse people by layering your intentions.

It seems you do manipulate. Pretty much all the main members do.

They all latch onto "group psychosis" else trigger it subtly.

I learned to see it here a long time ago...

Extreme black and white between false dichotomies...purposefully complicating periodically to shut down critical thinkng...there's a ton of little techniques...

then you find out a specific weakness in someone who challenges you...

the problem with learning manipulation techniques is you gain power in the process.

damned difficult to not abuse the less psychologically informed.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:31 PM
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reply to post by judus
 


Hopefully, that's exactly what they do.

But in reality, how many actually do that? I'm guessing it's not a majority, given that ATS is a microcosm of real life, and how people react to manipulation in the real world...

Great thread, Heff.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:33 PM
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I dunno,
What do you do in a place like this? Do you make a thread, or post in the hope that people will agree with you, and sex it up with that intention? I don't see the point if there is even a nub of truth in your thread or post, because there will always be the "Oh really!" post back at you from somewhere, even though you know what they deny in a rhetorical way is dogs b####. I've had that many times, I've been called a liar, even though I was not lying. Much of the time I need to manipulate myself,
no, not that sort of manipulation, but holding back on stuff you do know about already, because there are people who make posts, and who do offer some information, while leaving certain elements out that they indeed do know about which might just alter the way to look at a particular subject perhaps because they have a vested interest, or just want to disrupt, or dissuade others. Holding back is not manipulation on others who would be economical with the truth, it is simply trying to get at the truth/a truth which just might be important.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by moniesisfun
reply to post by Hefficide
 


I think you try to confuse people by layering your intentions.

It seems you do manipulate. Pretty much all the main members do.

They all latch onto "group psychosis" else trigger it subtly.

I learned to see it here a long time ago...

Extreme black and white between false dichotomies...purposefully complicating periodically to shut down critical thinkng...there's a ton of little techniques...

then you find out a specific weakness in someone who challenges you...

the problem with learning manipulation techniques is you gain power in the process.

damned difficult to not abuse the less psychologically informed.



Absolute power corrupts absolutely.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:37 PM
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reply to post by Hefficide
 


Is this a way to cover up stupidity? Just curious.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:45 PM
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reply to post by Staroth
 


That's actually pretty insightful.

Many people who learn manipulation do so because they feel and/or know they are cognitively defective in at least one department.

Obfuscation works wonders to turn someone with a talent or two, and a chunk of idiocy into some sort of "savant" or "genius" in the eyes of fools.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:47 PM
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1 - Wow, you mind effed me, I totally fell for it.

2 - Nope, didn't fall for jack, nice try.

Which one is it?

We may never know.

/yawn



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 04:59 PM
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reply to post by Hefficide
 


I'm curious if there's a point to this thread. One that goes beyond "words and images effect us", because that seems incredibly elementary.


Originally posted by Hefficide
Now, if a slightly “off” guy on the Interent can be this frank about it, and still accomplish it, imagine how insidious, dangerous, and prevalent these practices are when governments and corporations invest untold sums of money in figuring out how to trick your emotions into overpowering your reason.


Is this thread about advertising?


Originally posted by Hefficide
Are you afraid yet? Are you beginning to question it all yet? Good.


Afraid of what??
What is it that we should be questioning?


Originally posted by Hefficide
With world events unfolding faster than we can keep track of good denizens of ATS, I implore you... question everything. Question it all. And look to see if anybody is yanking at your heart strings, your values, your ego your sense of security, or your emotions. If so? Refuse to be manipulated! Fight the good fight.

And maybe offer a word of thanks to the cranky old ATS moderator who clued you in on a few of the tricks of the trade.



I liked that part and agree with you, but it took you over 7000 characters to say something of substance. Does the ATS community really need to be talked down to and treated like a small child? Is there anyone here that didn't know that a photo of a cute, cuddly puppy produces good feelings? Or that a picture of Hitler punching himself in the side of the head makes you laugh?
(oh, see what I did there? I just manipulated your emotions via satellite
)


Originally posted by Hefficide
Over the years I've learned one thing - the core ATS membership is wise, thoughtful, and well informed.


I hope that's true, I really do, but this thread does not seem like it's for them. I'd like to see you expand on your original idea and maybe not be so vague. Right now you're basically preaching to the choir.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:08 PM
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OP, I posted before but never got a reply.

In what specific way are you manipulating people?

I get the feeling from your last few threads that you feel something is very close to happening that will change the world?

Not really seeing any manipulation in those threads though? Care to go into more detail?

Personally, I tend to make my own opinions but am well aware I may have been manipulated many times in the past!
edit on 20-9-2012 by Wonderer2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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Originally posted by MyMindIsMyOwn

Originally posted by fnpmitchreturns

While I know SOME people lie everyday... others DON'T


Horse pucky. Even the most trustworthy will lie to some extent. A lie of omission is still a lie, the little white lie one tells from time to time to 'save face' is still a lie. To make the assumption that some people do not lie is a subtle manipulation of your view of them, by them, in some form or another. It is human nature to tell the occasional lie and you well know that and the fact that their occasional lie goes undetected by you means that their manipulation skills are superb.


I understand what you claim but once any person tries to manipulate me by using my good nature and trust I toss them to the side in a pile of garbage that used to be people I knew or knew.....


Then the number of folks you surround yourself with must be very small. Do you not see that parents use this tactic all the time when bringing up their children? "If you clean your room then we can go get ice cream after dinner". Do you see that subtle manipulation of behavior to be molded into actions that fit more in line with the mindset of the parent's expectation?

Have you never debated someone on a topic you feel passionate about? Is not debate a means of manipulating your side of an issue in a way to win someone over to your way of thinking? To present the 'facts' as you see them in direct response to what you see as possible flawed judgement of another is a form of manipulation.... and it goes on all day everyday.


How would we really know if you lied? Your apparent claim and need for psychiatric help or need to work all goes in the trash bin to me......


And to reverse this, how do we really know that you have not lied at some point? Do you not see that at some point you, or any of us for that matter, could possibly be accused of passing on a lie as fact? The debate example above expresses this possibility nicely.


Have you tried politics? I hear in Georgia there are plenty of sheeple to be your fodder.....

I have been watching your threads and I haven't posted on many of them because over time people will prove who and what they are.... just like you have!


And the 2 statements above could also be seen as a means of manipulation, if you think about it. "I don't like what you have to say so I will try to shame you into changing your current actions to the way I believe you should be". See how this works?

Now, as for the negative responses in this thread thus far, I see them more as responses made out of fear. It's a scary thing to have someone point out to you (general term, meaning all of us) that you have been played, manipulated, been made to dance to a tune you would otherwise ignore. Now that we've admitted it, what do we do about it..... Well in my opinion, Heff has it right. Question everything.


You are right... I don't surround myself with people.... the only faith I have is in the corruption of man and our capacity for humanity when we choose to how it!
edit on 20-9-2012 by fnpmitchreturns because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:17 PM
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Originally posted by judus

Originally posted by Hefficide
reply to post by judus
 


I agree with the premise of that - which is why many of my threads ( the ones not directly linked to Associated Press stories ) tend to fall into the promotion of critical thinking and discussion of social engineering.

I want a world where Phage ( and for the record, I really like the guy ) is questioned and not taken at face value. I suspect he'd say exactly the same thing too.

~Heff


You hit the nail on the head ! he is taken at face value and that's the problem.

You build your character based on trust and knowledge then once you have enough followers you manipulate them to do your bidding.

Its a bit like running for president.
edit on 20-9-2012 by judus because: (no reason given)

edit on 20-9-2012 by judus because: (no reason given)


There is something else that I find simiar to manipulation - forgiveness.

There are probably several other things that can be seen in the same light, but the act of manipulation and the act of forgiveness are the ones that seem obvious to me.

Forgiveness is something that is given to someone who has done you wrong, in one way or another. Though forgiveness is given to the person who wronged you, it is not for that person's gain. Forgiveness is granted, in general, by the victim to allow them to close the issue and move on. Many have heard this comment, or one similar, 'I am not forgiving you for you, I am forgiving you for me'.

Manipulation seems to be very similar. Manipulation can be done in many different scenarios, but the majority of manipulation done is for the gain of the manipulator. Sometimes the victims of manipulation benefit from the process, depending on what end results the manipulator is pushing for.

Both forgiveness and manipulation are things that do not need to be revealed to anyone for them to have effect.

When you manipulate someone successfully, there is no need or common benefit gained informing the manipulated party; the same can be said for forgiveness. All the benefits offered with forgiveness can be gained without ever informing the forgiven.

There must be something to say about ego driving the need to inform the manipulated or forgiven party. Maybe some form of control or gaining the upper hand in a relationship between those manipulating and those manipulated (same for forgiveness - though forgiveness also serves to strip the forgiven of any perceived power or control gained from the psat deed being forgiven).

It seems, in some cases, the actions of manipulation or forgiveness are revealed as a way to serve ego and attempt to display intellectual superiority over those who have fallen prey. This type of divulsion can leave the manipulator a feeling they have out-witted the unsuspecting victims. It can also leave those who were manipulated feeling foolish in some ways.

I don't think the OP author was doing this, atleast not intentionally. I do not doubt the OP author experienced some feelings of intellectual superiority, situational control, and or general dominance from participating as described.Again, I do not think the OP was consciously driven by the reward of these feelings, but experienced them due to the nature of the process.

I think my opinion is less a reflection of what I see in the OP and more a generalization of what might drive an average person to manipulate or forgive and then reveal the facts to the manipulated or forgiven person.





.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:30 PM
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I was 6. On T.V., the space craft was totally remote control, being flown by a boy a little older than me from maybe 30 feet away. How cool!

I saved my allowance and when the day finally came, I couldn't wait until we got home and opened the box in the back seat. The "remote control" was a plastic mock-up with holes for a couple of small dowels like you made kites with back in the day that then connected to the space ship. Remote control my behiney.

I knew then that there was something very wrong with this world. It took a few more years before I had a name: Madison Ave. But they are not the only ones, no far from it. Even good ol' Unca Sam enjoys the shell game.

Fight fire with fire. I like it. In a World of Meme Warfare, Guerilla Fighters are Needed.




edit on 20-9-2012 by The GUT because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:37 PM
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Nearly every time anyone posts on this site they are trying to manipulate you.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:38 PM
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reply to post by The GUT
 





posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:46 PM
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reply to post by Hefficide
 


Nice post Heff. It shows how much you truly understand about psychology - which I see now is a pretty great deal. But... Your Jedi mind tricks do not work on me - because my shwartz is bigger than yours.



posted on Sep, 20 2012 @ 05:46 PM
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Originally posted by RealSpoke
Nearly every time anyone posts on this site they are trying to manipulate you.


I don't believe that is entirely true.

People come here to post opinions and share research or whatever.

Not really sure what or why people would come here intentionally to manipulate people?

Surely a site like ATS would be full of people who would read something and then try and make their own opinion on the matter?

Perhaps people are manipulating on here, but I don't see what purpose it serves as threads are forgotten, there's no real outcome from it.

Care to enlighten me?



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