19 Yr Old Hostage Gunned Down By Police While Escaping Captor

Originally posted by MrWendal

Originally posted by Kastogere
If the guy didnt comply to police orders...then yes they will shoot you in those circumstances...

The real gunman fired a shot at him. Show me ONE sane person who will run out of a room with someone shooting at them- and stops right outside the door and gets on their knees! In the victim's mind, if he stops running he will get shot.

.they heard a gun shot, the door opened....and without knowing what the perp looked like they shot him.

Police are trained professionals. You don't go around shooting at random people because you do not know what the "perp" looks like- especially in a hostage situation!

Honestly I dont see how the police are at fault for this...granted they should have hesitated....

This is called a "contradiction". If you admit they should have hesitated- and they failed to do so- that is why they are at fault.

yet when gun fire is involved would you expect any less of a reaction?

From trained professionals? Yes I do expect less of a reaction. I expect them to assess the situation before they open fire.

I totally agree with every statement you made. The victim would have been so focused on getting away from his captor who is now shooting at him he would not have heard the command to stop, and all his instincts would be to keep moving. Police should be better trained and calmer before just opening fire like that.

Originally posted by Kastogere
If the guy didnt comply to police orders...then yes they will shoot you in those circumstances....they heard a gun shot, the door opened....and without knowing what the perp looked like they shot him.

Im surprised it doesnt happen more often.

Honestly I dont see how the police are at fault for this...granted they should have hesitated....yet when gun fire is involved would you expect any less of a reaction?

Really !!!

Now at the Acadamy POLICE Academy Do they have Training were they have Silueted Pop ups to Shoot At But before you Shoot you have to Idenify if the Person has a Weapon or Not ?

But we Dont Know if the Kid was Running Open Handed Arms Raise While Runnign Do we ?

Now For Citizens to be trained when you are the Hostage Situation like this Senerio

A) Find a White Piece of Material Cloth or Paper etc if Possible Put in Hand
B) Start Spreaming Out Loud , Dont Shoot Iam the Hostage/Victim
C) While Running Keep Hands Up & Open except the Hand you have the White Material Shake Material Vigorously while the hand is Up . when your Running
D) Pray That Some (( NON )) Lawenforcement is Video Recording this ...

Originally posted by hypervigilant
There has been threads here with post about the rejection of police officer candidates due to having too high of an IQ score.... They aren't hiring people that can reason rationally because they only expect them to react to a situation without thinking or questioning what is right or wrong... It has been ten years since I have spoken to a police officer that didn't appear to have a bad attitude and the ability to not see intelligent rational people as the enemy.

Scary isn't it? Brings to mind the robot cops mindlessly beating people up in THX1138

Originally posted by skalla
Reading the article, it would appear that the cops shot and killed him for not kneeling down when ordered, god bless them. i'm mad pleased that there is an ocean between me and the murderous fools some of you have the misfortune to have as police.

Didn't read thru the posts to see if someone else pointed this out. When I believe someone started shooting at me, I "DUCK" down. A police car is a great shield. In response to someone else's post. Professionals??? I would think a professional would identify an armed person before they shoot said person. This is inexcusable. As I pointed out previously, you've had these situations before but not the execution of a hostage by a firing squad of uniformed officers. I am not biased toward law enforcement. My oldest brother went to work for Texas DPS straight out of the Marines. I was majoring in law enforcement in college myself until I got a look at the dark side of some people wearing a badge.

Originally posted by Kastogere
If the guy didnt comply to police orders...then yes they will shoot you in those circumstances....they heard a gun shot, the door opened....and without knowing what the perp looked like they shot him.

Im surprised it doesnt happen more often.

Honestly I dont see how the police are at fault for this...granted they should have hesitated....yet when gun fire is involved would you expect any less of a reaction?

Yeah but it was a hostage situation. They could have at least checked to see if he was armed.

this is just plain retarded, is thoose people handling thoose guns really so low on iq ?...
Why would a hostage taker run outside to a bunch of cops, when he knows, that they assume hes armed.
Stupidity sheit...

reply to post by Kastogere


Well,,I am deaf, I guess they can shoot me if I can't hear them

Originally posted by Bisman
So it is very likely at least 1 of the 3 police involved, are of these young, excited, just out of training, kids. needing to either prove his worth as a cop, or is just to green, and got easily scared.

The three Woodbury police officers who fired their weapons are on standard paid administrative leave. They are officer Anthony Ofstead, an 11-year veteran; officer Stacey Krech, who's been with the department for five years, and officer Natalie Martin, who's been with the department for two years.

Originally posted by Kastogere
reply to post by RationalDespair

 

I do not blame them for killing him...the conditions were right for that kind of response. They acted as they were intially trained to do.

I do think personally they should have verified the victim as a threat though, but I do not fault the reaction of the police...there is that more clear?

Maybe if he had listend to police to stop and get down....he'd still be alive. or at the very least less holy.

No contradition there...Im stating a personaly belief and backing it up with another personal belief...

They are not at fault in the bare minimum of the encounter...could they have done more? Sure....but Im not knocking the action...therefore no contradiction exists.

Man, you have a very skewed view of right and wrong. You can't POSSIBLY believe that these clowns were trained to respond in that manner! Let's hope you or yours are never in such a situation. Unbelievable!!

Originally posted by Merinda

Originally posted by Kastogere
If the guy didnt comply to police orders...then yes they will shoot you in those circumstances....they heard a gun shot, the door opened....and without knowing what the perp looked like they shot him.

Im surprised it doesnt happen more often.

Honestly I dont see how the police are at fault for this...granted they should have hesitated....yet when gun fire is involved would you expect any less of a reaction?

Yeah but it was a hostage situation. They could have at least checked to see if he was armed.

Any trained officer worth his friggin' SALT, could deduce, with almost CERTAINTY, that a hostage taker is NOT running outside without guns blazing. This guy can't be serious, Merinda!

reply to post by Maroboduus




aw. well i feel more informed

Originally posted by Kastogere
If the guy didnt comply to police orders...then yes they will shoot you in those circumstances....they heard a gun shot, the door opened....and without knowing what the perp looked like they shot him.

Im surprised it doesnt happen more often.

Honestly I dont see how the police are at fault for this...granted they should have hesitated....yet when gun fire is involved would you expect any less of a reaction?

Lol


Dude. If you're scared by a little gunfire, maybe you shouldn't join the police force. Their job is to deal with situations like this. They know what they sign up for. If the idea of a little action gets them sweaty and jumpy enough to shoot an unarmed hostage fleeing his kidnapper, perhaps they should have considered a different line of work that doesn't involve handling people's LIVES on a daily basis.

Cops deserve no excuses or pardons for situations like these. If you don't want this kind of pressure on your back, if you don't want to work under public scrutiny, if you don't want people harassing you over your decisions at work, FIND A DIFFERENT JOB! If you're a little jumpy, but still want a gun, join the army reserves. Don't patrol the streets with a loaded weapon, shoot civilians and then complain that your life was in jeopardy and that's why you killed a man you were supposed to protect.

Police should be held to the HIGHEST standard of human requirements, but instead, they'll let anyone in if they're cold enough. This is a slippery slope that ends in a pile of absolutely no good

Originally posted by Kastogere
If the guy didnt comply to police orders...then yes they will shoot you in those circumstances....they heard a gun shot, the door opened....and without knowing what the perp looked like they shot him.

Im surprised it doesnt happen more often.

Honestly I dont see how the police are at fault for this...granted they should have hesitated....yet when gun fire is involved would you expect any less of a reaction?

Yes. Especially if the guy wasn't holding a gun...unless invisible guns are available now?

awe man this day keeps getting worse and worse, first i lost ten bucks, then i lost my keys, and now because i was late, im a freakin hostage all day, great this sucks now what, what? go to window and see if police are there, step step step, oh man there are tons, this is my chance, bam door flings open YES YES IM FREE and alive, POLICE OPEN FIRE AND KILL ME, WOW THIS DAY REALLY SUCKS

honestly, its a damn good thing i dont have kids, i dont have to worry about them getting killed, and i dont have to go to jail for poisoning half a police force after i sent them a cake on a job well done of killing my son and destroying my life,

thank god for police, if they hadn't shown up that kid would have been killed by his captor!

I provided PTSD counseling through most of last year to military and police professionals, most of whom were suffering symptoms relating in some way to combat or catastrophic events.

Many of the police we dealt with spoke openly in group therapy about wanting to kill criminals and enjoying the idea of putting an end to people who endanger the public good. They had difficulty understanding other points of view and nuances of right and wrong.

They had very little trouble squeezing the trigger, however.

You can't actually fully blame the cops though. The boy should have carefully weighed his options. You got a milloin guns poited at the entry of a door. And you decide to go threw the door? Like come on use some common sense.

reply to post by r2d246


So the victim should have weighed his options carefully but the police get a free pass? The victim wasn't a trained hostage. He saw freedom and ran for it. The police however, are supposed to be trained to deal with situations just like the one that was presented here. And clearly they didn't weigh their options beyond pulling the trigger.

reply to post by r2d246


You can't actually fully blame the cops though. The boy should have carefully weighed his options. You got a milloin guns poited at the entry of a door. And you decide to go threw the door? Like come on use some common sense.

common sense really? i can see the new game show now,
what would you do in a hostage situation!!

reply to post by ~widowmaker~


we dont even know if he knew about the police outside. the hostage taker himself wasnt even aware of any.
the kid could have just ran because he was sent near the door.