American Muslims Stone Christians in Dearborn, MI

Originally posted by PurpleChiten
reply to post by petrus4

 

If Christ came back today, at least 75% of the people who say they follow him would try to re-crucify him.

I've often had the same thought myself.

reply to post by petrus4


Thank God I'm weird and would fight to stop it.

Originally posted by cavtrooper7
reply to post by petrus4

 

Thank God I'm weird and would fight to stop it.

You're the same on your own side of the fence, as Islamic extremists are on theirs.

The American military mindset, as I've said before, is purely about having a continual stream of enemies and threats to fight, one after the other. In the end, the identity of this week's current threat becomes largely immaterial, because maintaining a continual culture of war is actually the point. I figured that out not long after I read a particular quote about Vietnam.

"It may be a lousy war, but it's the only one we've got."

In other words, for the military industrial complex and some (not necessarily all) soldiers, war is actually a livelihood and a way of life; and peace itself becomes viewed as a threat to said way of life. So you're unlikely to want Islam to stop being a threat, because if it did, then in order to have war, you'd have to find another threat.

Originally posted by PurpleChiten
reply to post by petrus4

 

When people allow religious beliefs to cloud their judgment, they degrade their humanity, their intelligence AND the belief system they claim to follow.

Hitchens came to the same conclusion, and I believe he was right.

Originally posted by SuperFrog

Originally posted by PurpleChiten
reply to post by petrus4

 

When people allow religious beliefs to cloud their judgment, they degrade their humanity, their intelligence AND the belief system they claim to follow.

Hitchens came to the same conclusion, and I believe he was right.

If I hadn't seen the level of aggression from atheists that I have at times online, then I might be inclined to agree. It's been proven to me, however, that theists do not have a monopoly on negative behaviour.

I personally don't believe that theistic or atheistic belief has any correlation with practical morality whatsoever. You can have enormously kind and altruistic theists on the one hand, and atheists like Stalin on the other; or on a more mundane level, you can simply have someone who is as rage filled as Dawkins. That goes completely the opposite way of course, as well; with the Abrahamic bodycount that everyone knows about, and extremely principled and altruistic atheists.

Both exist. The challenge for some atheists is to get rid of their vendetta towards theism; which in and of itself, actually provides evidence against their claim of superior atheistic morality. Atheism can be as valuable as any other philosophy; but not, as with theism, when it is afflicted with arrogance and rage.

Originally posted by petrus4
If I hadn't seen the level of aggression from atheists that I have at times online, then I might be inclined to agree. It's been proven to me, however, that theists do not have a monopoly on negative behaviour.

Level of aggression from atheists? Really? Where? How?

Originally posted by petrus4
I personally don't believe that theistic or atheistic belief has any correlation with practical morality whatsoever. You can have enormously kind and altruistic theists on the one hand, and atheists like Stalin on the other; or on a more mundane level, you can simply have someone who is as rage filled as Dawkins. That goes completely the opposite way of course, as well; with the Abrahamic bodycount that everyone knows about, and extremely principled and altruistic atheists.

You mean atheist disbelief, not belief.

Originally posted by petrus4
Both exist. The challenge for some atheists is to get rid of their vendetta towards theism; which in and of itself, actually provides evidence against their claim of superior atheistic morality. Atheism can be as valuable as any other philosophy; but not, as with theism, when it is afflicted with arrogance and rage.

edit on 29-6-2012 by petrus4 because: (no reason given)

Here is a bit more of HItchens - why fight religion...

Originally posted by SuperFrog

Originally posted by petrus4
If I hadn't seen the level of aggression from atheists that I have at times online, then I might be inclined to agree. It's been proven to me, however, that theists do not have a monopoly on negative behaviour.

Level of aggression from atheists? Really? Where? How?

Pretty much anywhere that someone has an opinion that they disagree with. Although one particular case that comes to mind, was in the comments of one of Stefan Molyneux's videos on YouTube; where I was attacked for being opposed to the idea of ending net neutrality. They wanted the tiered payment system that some of the telecommunications companies have been trying to introduce.

I was relentlessly shouted down. One of them just kept saying, "Why shouldn't we have this? Why? Why?" when I'd already tried to explain that it wasn't purely a case of me being coercive; because if they succeeded in getting that, then it would mean that I would be forced to do something that I didn't want, as well.

There's a scenario of fairly simply not being allowed to disagree with some of them, in their own minds. A big part of the problem there, is atheists having the attitude of having science on their side; when what they're really trying to do a lot of the time, is equate their own subjective opinion with something which they consider to be objective and universal. It really isn't any different to Christians or Muslims thinking that they have the exclusive truth; the only place where it's different, is in the speaker's own mind.

This really should be separate discussion, but just to conclude - I am sure that we all can agree that extremism in any form is not good.

Originally posted by getreadyalready

” Gentlemen, we are going to relentlessly chase perfection, knowing full well we will not catch it, because nothing is perfect. But we are going to relentlessly chase it, because in the process we will catch excellence. “ -- Vince Lombardi, day one with the 1 and 10 Packers that never again saw a losing season under his leadership.

Great post flash.

Thank you for that excellent quote, I appreciate it a lot.

Vince Lombardi was the man, I gotta admit.

Originally posted by TrueAmerican
Ok, I don't even know what to think of this one. Looks like a bunch of Christians walk into a predominately Muslim festival, if I am understanding this right, and well...watch for yourself what happens.

They get stoned, egged, bottled, and cursed at by American Muslims. The police, outnumbered by a lot, are put in the position of having to escort the Christian group out. Even though they aren't the ones throwing the stuff!

So what is right here? Who is right here? The video guy makes some excellent points like "They can't give us two officers to protect us, but they sure can get 14 to lead us out!"

But I figured this one might provide an interesting conversation piece for the political madness forum- cause this is madness, if nothing else. Both sides have a right, but the police must make decisions based on manpower... Bizarre.

:shk:

Did you think this would go any other way? They do it in the M.E. and if they get their way they will do it here. Remember those honor killings in Texas and other states? Do you really think that is just a "phase" or a trend only there? Google Taqiyya.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


I'm not religios by any means. I am far from it. I think of religion as a means to control people.

Having said that, I don't see the us vs them thing so much as I see THEM.

us? Us is everyone who is not them, anyone not of islamic faith. And given the size of islam in this world, knowing it may only be a small percent that enact hate, is still a very very large number.

And by the same token, a very very silent majority when it comes down to it.

Bankers? Yeah, Well thats not anywhere near my point. Fundamentalist religious people.

You may say there are xtians of the same calibre, but they are not spread all over this planet in groups with a singular mindset.. Islam is.

Maybe if the 99.999999999999% of the rest of islam would just say "GTFO, You do NOT represent us!" it would help.. but all we get are ths likes of the video in the OP. Violent reaction. Violent reaction EVERY SINGLE TIME.

And this isn't Denmark, and those guys were not political cartoonists.. they were, perhaps, idiots. But then I see the people in this thread support them? May as well support westboro baptists... hey, they're idiots too, but no one sticks up for them..

Islam will stomp down on any objection, without prejudice, and people stick up for it.

Nah... thats crap..

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by mainidh

 

unreal, I cannot believe you said that. Did you even WATCH the video? My god..

Did you? The title of the thread is misleading. They were not "stoning"anybody, some youths were throwing bottles and rocks at a group of people there specifically to threaten, harass, and insult them.

You've got the biker mantra in your avvy, would your group of friends allow some other group to scream insults at them through a megaphone, threaten them, tell them they are going to hell, and that they have no right to be in their town? I know my wouldn't.

They were pelted with missiles - by definition. It doesn't matter what the projectiles were, after seeing it, I felt rage, and then to see people justify it? Absolute ignorance.

My avatar represents freedom. And we're absolutely scowled apon by mainstream society. Every single day. So I do know what it is to be put into a box.

But if the boot fits,wear it. And if it does not, then STAND UP AND SAY SO. I'd be against any bikers getting all pissed and attacking segments of society that they feel opposes them. Damn right.

But when it's islam, or muslims, they're allowed to break the law, attack people, and get away with it? You said Good on them.

I'd never advocate that. I will always proclaim my distance from outlaws. From miscreants. I will not attack those who oppose me, with violence. If I did, would I have your support?

reply to post by mainidh

I'd never advocate that. I will always proclaim my distance from outlaws. From miscreants. I will not attack those who oppose me, with violence. If I did, would I have your support?

This was not a simple case of "opposing" them. The aggressive group in this instance was the Christians who showed up uninvited, and proceeded to harass, threaten, and intimidate an otherwise peaceful group. That group shouted back and tried to get them to leave, and eventually escalated to throwing things at them.

Yes, if a group of people show up outside a biker bar and harass, intimidate, threaten, and scream at you and your buddies, I hope you will take it upon yourselves to shut them up. You will have my support, and I'd be disappointed if you didn't react.

Also "stoning" is a specific punishment for specific crimes, and it usually involves a helpless person tied, or buried up to their neck while an angry crowd forms around them and throws stones until they are dead. It is EXTREMELY different than a group of kids throwing rocks at a group of screaming adults. Not even in the same ballpark. The act in the video was not anything relatable to a "stoning." The headline was intentionally misleading.

I think one of the signs said "Your mother is a prostitute". Silly fanatics.

This topic is now closed.
It seems to have run its course.......


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