Land Of The Free No Longer

Great post OP. You just put into words what probably every non-American thinks about America. On top of that you are also right about the MSM in any Western country, it's all a bunch of bullcrap neatly packaged to keep your distracted mind busy.

You might wonder, what can we do about this? It's so overwhelming that my personal answer is nothing short of violent revolution, it's the only solution. Just talking about it gets us nowhere and protesting is just another way for the MSM to film you and then laugh at you in the evening news. I'm a pretty much a pacifist and to come to the realization that the solution for these problems is violence is very disheartening.

We live in a prison, but it's so big we can't see the walls and watchtowers. Study, get a job to pay debts that they use to keep you as a slave, retire, die. Surely this isn't what the human race is meant for? Being a bunch of worker bees to keep the queen happy. This is the reality we live in today, and globalization is just another tool to keep us under wraps even easier. And on top of that, it's a prison for your mind, because most people don't even realize they are in a prison.

And when you try to come together to talk about this kind of stuff, you get ridiculed beyond belief, because it's not what the idiot-box says. I'm only 22 and I see no way out of this, God this sh*t makes me depressed.

See the thread in my signature to understand how information shapes our world (yes it's derived from a video game but that's not the point of my thread), the MSM controls that information and this is something very very wrong.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder


Awesome post.

Everything in it was spot on.

I have a similar story to yours growing up. Not having access to any meaningful data. I was fed up with dumb americans. On the internet I met many smart people. One of my best Internet friends was an Aussie. I told him how I wished more Americans were as awake as Australians.

He told me I was wrong, and that most Aussies were sheep.

The main difference in our stories is that in America I was never taught that other countries were bad, or that other people were dumb. We were always told about falling scores in schools compared to just about every other nation.

The main thing about True awake Americans is that we are not going to listen to anyone! It could be interpreted as arrogance, but it is not so. I keep ending up telling my British brothers that they must not know what freedom is, because they keep telling us(me), "it's not that bad in america yet, just look at N. korea."

Most Americans ARE sheep. It can be said that we are naive about other cultures. We are centered in our world. What people from other countries don't realize though is that we like you guys. We are nice people mostly. It is not socially acceptable to make fun of other countries or other peoples here. (except french people after 9/11 for some reason.. "Freedom Fries" anyone? Oh wait I remember they wouldn't support us blowing up brown people in Iraq!)

I was talking to this guy from New Zealand and he was telling me about how dumb Americans are for still not using the metric system. I knew how to translate into both systems. We use both. He had no clue how to. He was telling me about his professors making an example of this rocket crash we had recently (in the last 2 years).. That was caused by incorrect conversion into SI units.

I was like huh? And then I did all the research for him. He was fine to just trust info. I am not. finally found out what he was referring to was a mars orbiter from 1999. His whole class thinks this happened in 2010...

************************************************************************************************************************

AS far as freedom goes, I am not. I have wanted to be free since I was 3. I knew what it meant. Thing is though, that I finally realized is I will never be 100% free, because I have a body. Anyway. Freedom would mean that I could grow whatever I wanted, build whatever I wanted, and do whatever I wanted, until this crosses into someone elses freedoms. I would not be able to kill because that would then take away their freedom to live.

The main issue here is not what freedom means. The issue is we are coming into a choice time that could limit freedoms to the point that we don't have the freedom left to make new choices to get back the freedom. It's like the flash point of paper. it can get hotter and hotter, and the people(paper) will say "I'm not on fire. stop it. see you can still read all my words. you just hate our paper. You can go to that other paper over there closer to the fire if you hate this paper."

And then at some point that paper catches fire. The fire won't stop until the paper is gone. It's a point of no return. So don't tell me it isn't here YET... IT's effing coming and gawd damn how can anyone not see it. I Live in the effing land of effing zombies...

********************************************************************************************************************


Anyway. As I keep telling all you guys from other countries:

If Americans don't keep our guns and our constitution you guys are all screwed. We are the last stand.

Don't judge me for the dumb Americans. I don't like them either.

Your American Friend,

~Dusty


PS. Synchronycity times 10. ok so Im in my room typing but south park is on. It's the asberger's episode. as I was writing this and wondering how to explain freedom I heard this:

"Stan we think we know what's wrong with you." (he can't enjoy anything like music and friends)
"What?"
"We think you are seeing the world for how it truly is, and it's #."
"there's no cure once you notice the world is #."
"how come other people don't see it?"
"the aliens are projecting thought patterns on them so they think it's not #, or it's robots from the future, anyway they don't see that it's all #"


If you can see it, you can't see it. Awakening isn't fun. It IS needed though. You others are wearing diapers, and riding those training wheels. True freedom is just too much to bare... I am ashamed of you.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder


Wonderful post and great that you researched this so well.

Don't forget however that our Free Speech means that protestors are not always for Freedom and some of late are opposed to Freedom. They like the Nanny State and want to dictate to the rest of us and force their views on us. They also pose a threat to Freedom.

As long as they don't violate others Rights, by all means let them protest. When they deny others their Rights though, they are no longer protesters, but common criminals.

You may not be aware we have an underground culture that attend protests for the express purpose of causing violence, looting and damaging property. They don't really have a cause. Anarchy is not Freedom or welcome in any Free Society.

I did not know you were under the Queen. That is extremely troubling in this day and age. That a Queen exists is a travesty and an affront to Freedom everywhere. Unless of course it's just people playing dress up and pretending importance by some nutty birthright. Then its just comical. If they have real power though, it's very wrong.

Good post, thank you.

I got to say OP that I find some of your arguments and positions a bit simplistic.
This type of viewpoint of the US reminds me a bit of the West Wing - some fantasy about how people originally want to do the right thing, but then things get distorted. I believe that there are always people who aren't interested in the right thing, as they are focussed on helping themselves. Whether that is in the time of the founding fathers or whether that is today.

The idea that Bin Laden can be used as a war cry to American patriots to unite and resist tyrany is an attractive but infantile fantasy. The US was headed in the wrong direction before Bin Laden was ever heard of. Americans who want to control and subjugate fellow US citizens pre-date Bin Laden and they simply used Bin Laden to advance their own agenda, Bin Laden was the excuse, not the cause of the problem. Indeed many people believe that Bin Laden was originally an American puppet.The problem then is not some outside force, but from within.

Although I agree with some of your views the idea that we could have a neutral interenet, or an unbiased press. Come on, its like saying we all have to agree with each other, because there is no way we will agree upon what is biased and what isn't. Either you believe in complete regulation or you believe in freedom. Having your wealth maintained and not stolen for example I don't have a clue what you mean by this, although I suppose it is an emotionally loaded way to say you think taxation should be abolished. Again, I don't think all of us want what you call a right, which is in fact a political position.

Don't get me wrong there are a lot of things we agree upon. I just consider it my duty to show you that there are holes in both your theory about when things went wrong, why and what you suggest would be a remedy.

This post is directed towards the OP more than any other reply.I think the OP was well said, and not too far off of what a rising percentage of average Americans themselves are thinking. Even as I write this more and more are starting to realize the deception being perpetrated against everyone on the planet. The real test is whether enough people become wise to the game being played soon enough to stop the worldwide tyranny taking place. For Americans such as myself, it's a struggle everyday to listen to other Americans recite what is dictated to them in the media and the classroom, in some cases verbatim. It shows a lack of thinking for ones self, and a dependence on the system. Not just monetarily or protection wise, but also educationally. It's a dangerous proposal to have others decide for you what is true and what is not. You open yourself up to persuasion by those who dictate truth. I could always understand the anger from citizens of other countries towards average Americans. We as a whole do dictate what most other countries do, to one extent or another. How would Americans feel if another country came here and started to dictate what we do, or how we operate? What if another country started to surround the continental U.S. with bases? The answer is self evident.Alas, this is exactly what has happened. The difference is that it's not another country who has done this. It was done by a small group of citizens from the U.S. and other countries. There is no one entity you can point at. Money does not flow to one country alone. I stress once again, it's the golden rule. Those who have the gold make the rules. People should really pay attention to the money and resources, it'll tell you most of what you need to know about today's governmental climate, virtually all operational governments today. I dare say, as long as there has been a power structure in society, money and resources dictated that ideal. Money and resources have dictated Americans' belief in what their freedoms are meant to be. The establishment has chipped away at Americans' ability to vote, voice their opinion, and protect themselves to name a few. The establishment has dictated to Americans which countries are right and wrong, which countries are good and evil. Does anyone else find it odd the evil countries are the ones with the most valuable resources? Those same countries that refuse to give the monetary leaders of this world those resources for virtually nothing.The American military is no longer a military of the country. It's a private military, evident by the anti war sentiment growing within the American populace. Regardless of this anti war sentiment, the leaders continue to push for more conflict in other countries (Iran, Syria, NK). Those who think soldiers think for themselves have no idea how the system works. Soldiers follow orders, or have their personal and professional lives destroyed. Nothing can wreck you more in American culture than a dishonorable discharge. Now if you were in your early twenties what would your mindset be? What I don't understand is the anti American sentiment from posters in this community. Here for the most part are the Americans who do think for themselves. Americans who do realize there is an issue with today's worldwide political climate. Yet members from other countries alienate an already alienated group of Americans. We are already portrayed as fringe, or crazy by the MSM. If you are from another country in this community and wonder why Americans are so defensive on this site, understanding this concept is a good place to start.Oh yeah, S&F

I have been a lurker on this site for quite a while. I have often come close to joining and posting in various threads. I have also read countless threads with a generalized anti-Amercian sentiment. While I largely disagree with many of the points made in those threads and IMO see varied degrees of hypocrisy, I still understand that are are 2 sides to every story and I respect their opinions and life experiences that led to said opinions.

Having said all of that, I feel this was a well thought out post by the OP. While I may not agree 100% with the entire post, I believe it mostly carries merit. Additionally, there have been some really thought provoking reply posts. I felt compelled to jump on in.

My personal opinion is that there are many reasons there is so much inaction by the people to elicit a real change. Here are a couple thoughts I immediately thought of in reading through this thread:
1) How many people work in a job the don't really care for? Why not quit or make a change right now? There's a certain comfort level there and a fear of the unknown. That's a minor change compared to a a national philosophy/government change.
2) I would think many people would fear that a real "uprising" for change would leave our country divided, distracted and vulnerable to other powerful governments/groups to effectively take advantage and aim to strike the "death blow" to this country and try to establish their dominance not only globally, but also here in our country.
3) What would change look like? A regime change at the top would require new people. Where are those leaders now? Who is speaking a message worth following? 1 person? I think many people would stick with "the devil you know is better than the devil you don't" philosophy - especially with the lack of many true leaders with fresh and believable idealogies and vision.
4) Finally, who is even driving this bus? Who are the real puppet masters? Who/what would people need to overcome to effect real change? Who's to say that puppet masters aren't trying to cause the uprising to fuel their agenda.

Just my ramblings and I hope they were on topic and provide something of interest/benefit to the conversation. I believe in freedom, but the longer I live and the more I see, the more I think it may be the ultimate illusion/dilusion.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder


I am a regular American, and all I get to do is work and sleep! Our country is not FREE!! We are not perfect in this country! We cannot help what our Government is doing behind the scenes! We will Protect our own damn country!! If you dont like us..stay the hell out of here!!

Originally posted by seeker1963
reply to post by ChaoticOrder

 

This is a special treat for those of you who feel that just because you can go golfing and enjoy your BBQ's and bring your smug attitudes to a very serious thread.............ENJOY your so called freedoms while they last!

That's why FoxNews, right wing billionaires and Republicans in general need to be loaded up on cattle cars before they load the rest of us on them.

You do realize America is a corporation,still owned by the Queen?
2nd line

Originally posted by GD21D
What I don't understand is the anti American sentiment from posters in this community. Here for the most part are the Americans who do think for themselves. Americans who do realize there is an issue with today's worldwide political climate. Yet members from other countries alienate an already alienated group of Americans. We are already portrayed as fringe, or crazy by the MSM. If you are from another country in this community and wonder why Americans are so defensive on this site, understanding this concept is a good place to start.Oh yeah, S&F

Exactly.

I was trying to say this.

thanks man.

I think the OP probably knows this, but it bears repeating, as many times as it takes.
For All to see.

I often feel lonely in America.
This song explains it well:

ghost in the machine

"Tell me where am I supposed to go?
And who am I supposed to believe.
If only you knew what I knew.
Then you could see just what I see.

So I grab my bags and go, as far away as I can go.
Cause everything ain't what I used to know.
And I try to hide, but I just can't hide no more.
There's nothing worse than feeling like a ghost."

more like never was

reply to post by freethinker123

Americans who want to control and subjugate fellow US citizens pre-date Bin Laden and they simply used Bin Laden to advance their own agenda, Bin Laden was the excuse, not the cause of the problem. Indeed many people believe that Bin Laden was originally an American puppet.The problem then is not some outside force, but from within.

I really didn't want to get into the whole debate about who Bin Laden was working for... there was a more important point in what I was saying. Whether or not you think the official story on 9/11 is a lie, it doesn't matter, because the result is the same. It caused America to be plunged into a state of reckless fear and rash decision making. This has resulted in a constant erosion of liberties as a trade off for more security... and we all know the famous quote about sacrificing one of those things for the other.

Having your wealth maintained and not stolen for example I don't have a clue what you mean by this, although I suppose it is an emotionally loaded way to say you think taxation should be abolished. Again, I don't think all of us want what you call a right, which is in fact a political position.

I was referring to the way the government spends ridiculous amounts of money, forcing them into debt, and then they convert that debt into inflation via monetization of the debt... thus robbing the people of the nation of their hard earned wealth in a sneaky, insidious subtle way.

you need to do a bit more study on this freedom thing .you are a slave who cant see the chains .americas not a country its a company & its owned by the virginia company .the queen of england bows to the lord mayor of the city of london or the square mile as its called & asks for his permission to enter .en loco parentis the state owned you from the moment your parents reg your birth they just got to feed you & cloth you . in 1933 blacks law dictionary had the definition of a HUMAN BEING as a beast not fit to own property god save the queen shes not a human being a line from the sex pistols .watch some freeman on the land videos on youtube . the presidents of the usa company all have that family look of the ( royals of enger land .when she sat on the stone of jacob (destiny) it was 154 lb lighter & made of scottish sandstone a copy the real one was stolen . barak & her have something in common both are traitors guilty of treason queen lizard breath or lilabeth to her pals took a oath to serve and uphold GODS laws not mans as stated in the 1611 bible she & barry sowento put their hands on. every time they sign a law into force its an act of treason thats the law . that book contained 80 books not 66 it states murderers .rapists pedos & homos be put to death amen . up the revolution ps there will be none of that when im president

reply to post by GD21D

I could always understand the anger from citizens of other countries towards average Americans. We as a whole do dictate what most other countries do, to one extent or another. How would Americans feel if another country came here and started to dictate what we do, or how we operate? What if another country started to surround the continental U.S. with bases? The answer is self evident.

That is so true and I find it quite amazing that so many people fail to understand this simple concept... however there is one man who understands it perfectly, but we label this man an "isolationist" for having those beliefs.

reply to post by Razziazoid

You might wonder, what can we do about this? It's so overwhelming that my personal answer is nothing short of violent revolution, it's the only solution. Just talking about it gets us nowhere and protesting is just another way for the MSM to film you and then laugh at you in the evening news. I'm a pretty much a pacifist and to come to the realization that the solution for these problems is violence is very disheartening.

I often find myself flip flopping between violent and peaceful resolutions... I can't seem to really decide how it must be done, that is why I'm trying not to offer any solutions. But I do know the first thing that needs to happen, is that people need to wake up and admit there is a serious problem. If we don't accept that there is a problem we will never have the ability to fix it. This is a basic concept in psychology... only when enough of us can admit the problem will we have the motivation required to unite together and seek change, whether by peaceful or violent means. That is why they are always trying to divide us and pit us against each other, instilling a distrust for our neighbors and ripping the community spirit from us. The result is everyone only cares about themselves and their own well being... they will step all over anyone else to get what they want. It's a sad state of affairs...

reply to post by Dustytoad


A lot of good posts on this page, I'm trying to respond to most of them...

The main issue here is not what freedom means. The issue is we are coming into a choice time that could limit freedoms to the point that we don't have the freedom left to make new choices to get back the freedom. It's like the flash point of paper.

Exactly. It's about the limiting and erosion of freedoms which America was designed to have. Once that threshold point has been reached it will be virtually impossible to get those freedoms back. And let me tell you that point in time is quickly approaching, a lot faster than it seems. Yet most people can't even see it approaching because the only news they hear is straight from the propaganda box and they believe every single word of it without question.

None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder


Thank you for a well thought out post, ChaoticOrder.

We all want " freedom " to do as we wish, and there is nothing wrong with that. However, I think true, absolute right to do as we please as individuals would result in anarchy, which no one wants.

Which is where rules and regulations for living in a " Civilised " society come in, to moderate our excesses.

Perhaps we have just allowed the balance between being regulated and anarchy drift towards over regulation ?

So where should the balance lie....? How much regulation is good for us ? I suspect we each perceive it differently, according to our lifestyles....

There probably isn't a " One size fits all " answer to this issue.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder

I really appreciate what you have stated in your post. I have been trying to communicate to others what is going on here, but they are too complacent! It's all true, but I have never seen so many clueless people scurrying around, tending to meaningless affairs that will do nothing to begin to tackle this huge black cloud that is sitting right over our heads! I too am depressed about all this. I wish I could talk to you personally, cause you really have got the bull by the horns! And hardly anyone around me does! It just makes me crazy, and they all wonder what could be wrong! I feel like the guy who said that he is willing to make a sacrifice, because he has had a good life, and looking down the now short road doesn't look so wonderful. yes, lets get together and stand up for what we really want! Freedom and liberty in America, and across the whole world! I've heard that we can get there, but nobody says exactly how! I guess we look to our founding fathers, and they did have to make sacrifices to get where they wanted to be. I used to wonder about how we could have a revolution every 20 years as Thomas Jefferson recommended, because I saw that the government was way too big for that! That was before my "enlightenment".
Anyway, I clearly see the whole problem, and it looms mightily before us.We just need a 2x4 to hit folks up side the head to get them to WAKE UP! If they can't see a problem, then there must be no problem! That's the part
that I haven't figured out how to overcome yet! God help us.

Excellent post. S&F.

The proverbial can of worms. What do you do. What can you do? Voting is rigged in America. I don't mean the actual votes, let me explain. All news sources list Romney as the winner. Even on ATS there was a pop up add asking you to vote who Romney will pick as a VP. See how they do that? Rigged. People are not smart enough to know the process therefore already believe Romney is the republican candidate. What can you do about that? Nothing.

Romney won before the votes were even counted.

Moving on. The wars. My dear lord, the wars. What can we do to stop this madness? Nothing. It doesn't matter how "awake" you are or how deeply sleeping you are (sheeple). It's out of our hands and there is nothing you can do about it.

I can go on and on. I'll leave you with a question.

What can you do?

reply to post by Blaine91555

You may not be aware we have an underground culture that attend protests for the express purpose of causing violence, looting and damaging property. They don't really have a cause. Anarchy is not Freedom or welcome in any Free Society.

I'm sure there are some groups like that, but I have a hard time believing they add up to any sort of large number of people... I think you will find many of those agent provocateurs are paid corporate backed insurgents, they always cover their face and go around using cheap dirty tricks to incite violence and damage the image of all protestors in the process. That is exactly their goal, to make all protestors look like extremists and anarchists with no self control... when in actuality the majority of protests are completely peaceful and civil.