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The Origins of the King James Bible and the New Testament, and the Forgery, and Pagan influences in

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posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 03:26 PM
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Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by BIHOTZ
 


Everyone wants to wait for the Messiah. Meanwhile, our race kills everything in its path for dominion.

Sounds about right.

Yes, many are anxiously waiting for a Messiah. First, let's look at the word itself. It is a Hebrew word. (Ma­shi­akh)

What then is the Jewish position on the Messiah?

Most significantly, Jewish tradition affirms at least five things about the Messiah. He will: be a descendant of King David, gain sovereignty over the land of Israel, gather the Jews there from the four corners of the earth, restore them to full observance of Torah law, and, as a grand finale, bring peace to the whole world. Concerning the more difficult tasks some prophets assign him, such as Isaiah's vision of a messianic age in which the wolf shall dwell with the lamb and the calf with the young lion (Isaiah 11:6), Maimonides believes that Isaiah's language is metaphorical (for example, only that enemies of the Jews, likened to the wolf, will no longer oppress them). A century later, Nachmanides rejected Maimonides's rationalism and asserted that Isaiah meant precisely what he said: that in the messianic age even wild animals will become domesticated and sweet­tempered. A more recent Jewish "commentator," Woody Allen, has cautioned: "And the lamb and the wolf shall lie down together, but the lamb won't get any sleep."

The Jewish belief that the Messiah's reign lies in the future has long distinguished Jews from their Christian neighbors who believe, of course, that the Messiah came two thousand years ago in the person of Jesus. The most basic reason for the Jewish denial of the messianic claims made on Jesus' behalf is that he did not usher in world peace, as Isaiah had prophesied: "And nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore" (Isaiah 2:4). In addition, Jesus did not help bring about Jewish political sovereignty for the Jews or protection from their enemies.

Jewish Library
The word means, simply, 'anointed' and originally applied to the kings of Israel who were anointed with the holy oil. To this writer, a Messiah would be one who leads the People of planet Earth out of the bondage and chains they made for themselves, to a new and exiting world where all one desires is instantly provided.




posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 03:30 PM
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reply to post by Americanist
 

Is that meant to be harsh, and to insult me as one who spreads "bad", instead of "good"? Is it not a good thing to question one's "faith" once in awhile? To see the origins of that which one believes in, and who actually wrote it? Or, are you one of those who never cracks a book other than the NT, and calls all works not biblical satanic?

What I do is called RESEARCH. Neither good, or bad, the chips fall where they fall.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 03:45 PM
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reply to post by autowrench

Groupies

The socalled King James Bible (1611) was re-issued three times within 12 months because of major printing and translation errors.

For the 'old Testament' they used ONLY the so-called pointed (=vowelled) Masoretic Text from 960 CE out of Leningrad - being ignorant of most older readings (the Dead Sea Scrolls for the most part (omiitting the fragments found in the Cairo Ben Ezra Synagogue's Genizah etc.) did not start to come to light until c. 1946) and decided to follow Luther's lead and totally leave out both the Apocrypha (e.g. Tobit, Judith, Susanna, Bel & the Dragon, the Wisdsom of Iesous ben Sirach (aka EcclesiastiCUS etc. ) AND the Pseudipigrapha (e.g. The Wisdom of Solomon, The Psalms of Solomon, the Testament of the 12 Patriarchs, The Book of the Words of Henoch, son of Jared to all the Sons of Light in the Last Days, or the Testament of Moses (aka Jubilees) etc.) all of which R. Yehsohua bar Yosef the Galilean Nazir (aka Iesous) and the earliest disciples in Palestine knew well since they quoted from them (e.g. 'for it is written the Salvation of Yisrso'el shall come from the Judaeans' (mistranslated as "for salvation is from the jews" in the 4th canonical gospel 'according to John' whoever he was) is derived from the Testament of Naphtali as a proof text as to why Jerusalem is more imporant than Mt Gerazim in worhipping the 'most high EL' in a story about a debate with a local Samaritan woman...

For the 5446 ancient hand copied MSS of the Greek New Testament (no two copies exactly alike !!) the translators of the KJV (King James Version) ONLY were able to use Codex Alexandrinus (A) and Codex Bezae Biglot (D) both from the late 4th century CE -

In other words, these poor translators had NO access to or knowledege of (way back in 1611) Codex Sinaiticus, Codex Vaticanus, Codex Freer-Washingtoniensis, or Codex Ephraemi Palimpsest - so their poor translation into beautiful (but flawed) Middle English was based on a VERY VERY VERY narrow selection of Greek texts (the translators certainly did their best with what stinky/mangled copies they had at their disposal - and if they only had what WE have to-day, their translation would have been much different and much better back in 1611).

But the 'church' would have had a kinipschin once they discovered that the older texts often contradict some of the most cherished 'Christian beliefs' .

If every Jew and Christian actually knew the highly corrupt state of their ancient texts (e.g. comparing the Dead Sea Scrolls from caves 1-11 with the later Masoretic family) by comparing line by line and making notes on all the differences - amounting to nearly 20% if you count letter by letter (the way Origen did c. 205-215 CE with the Greek versions of the OT in his Hexapla - talk about shock and awe !!) there would be very very very few literalist fundamentalist 'christian' or Jewish believers left in the world.

But most people (especially today) are just to plain lazy to take the time out to study Koine Greek, unpointed Paleo-Hebrew and Galilean Aramaic to do the necessary grundwerke to see just how bad the comparitive ancient MSS situation actually is - they would rather believe what their pastor or their priest or their rabbi tells them, no matter how crude or un-truthful, and think they are 'saved' from some imaginary hell-fire.

Critical Thinking IS NOT something that 'Christians' and 'orthodox Jews' are allowed to engage in - if they do, they are generally ostracised or excommunicated by 'the mindless-believing sheeple'

Then you wonder why there are so many hate crimes perpetrated against those who bother to take the time out and question the tenets they were force fed as children !!!!!!



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 03:45 PM
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reply to post by autowrench
 


Did you follow the link? Perhaps check out my signature file? Nothing personal or resembling an insult. It's additional research on Hebrew. The remainder is a quick take on natural law.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 03:54 PM
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reply to post by Sigismundus
 


Ahhh, you refer to our society of Patriots/ Pinheads culminating in the spirit of shut your mouth/ Bible thumping.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:02 PM
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reply to post by autowrench
 





A more recent Jewish "commentator," Woody Allen, has cautioned: "And the lamb and the wolf shall lie down together, but the lamb won't get any sleep."


You can make a joke out of most anything... Fortunately, consumption can be overcome. The attainment embedded in mother nature. Once activated, wild beasts won't have an incentive to devour prey.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:06 PM
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Originally posted by Americanist
reply to post by autowrench
 


Did you follow the link? Perhaps check out my signature file? Nothing personal or resembling an insult. It's additional research on Hebrew. The remainder is a quick take on natural law.

Yes, I opened, and read most of it. I have a Rabbi friend who checks Hebrew things out for me, and I keep him up to date on things I discover. I am quite aware that some will go to practically any length to discredit my research on the KJV Bible, but the research stands. If Francis Bacon could author the entire works of Shakespeare, then he could easily have completely corrupted the King James Bible. Give it to me for an edit for a year, and you would be surprised how much it would change, were I so inclined.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:09 PM
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reply to post by autowrench
 



Wait...Francis Bacon wrote Shakespeare?

Experts have not concluded, as far as I was told, that Shakespeare was plagiarizer, or even a figurehead for the whole playwright deal.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by autowrench
 



a Messiah would be one who leads the People of planet Earth out of the bondage and chains they made for themselves, to a new and exiting world where all one desires is instantly provided.


In such a wondrous world, I would kill myself.

The thrills we find in life are the thrills of challenge. Pure pleasure will only go so far...and the happiness attained from achieving a long-time desire or goal, through long months or years of work and/or study, lasts far longer than any cheap thrills you may experience riding a snowmobile or jumping from a bridge with a rope on your ankle.

It is learning, it is pushing, it is striving to match the world around you and improve yourself in every way imaginable...it is the effort this takes, and the satisfaction as you reach your goals, and the contentment as you look back on your struggles, and the realization that for every drop of blood and sweat you have shed, you've become a better person...

That is what makes life worth living.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:25 PM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 


Shakespeare's authorship was first questioned in the middle of the 19th century, when adulation of Shakespeare as the greatest writer of all time had become widespread. Shakespeare's biography, particularly his humble origins and obscure life, seemed incompatible with his poetic eminence and his reputation for genius, arousing suspicion that Shakespeare might not have written the works attributed to him. The controversy has since spawned a vast body of literature, and more than 70 authorship candidates have been proposed, including Francis Bacon, the 6th Earl of Derby, Christopher Marlowe, and the 17th Earl of Oxford.

Shakespeare authorship question

A central figure in the Shakespeare-Bacon theory is the redoubtable Ignatius Donnelly, who has been aptly dubbed "The Prince of U.S. Cranks". Donnelly found time to pursue a career in politics as well as develop not one but three major crank theories: Ragnarok, a catastrophe myth very similar in many ways to the ideas of Velikovsky, the Lost Continent of Atlantis, and the existence of a hidden message in Shakespeare's plays. The latter idea he developed in 1888 in a massive two-volume work, The Great Cryptogram. According to Donnely's own account, he had been working for a long time on proofs that Bacon was really the author of Shakespeare's plays. Quite by accident, he found a reference to Bacon's cipher in a book belonging to his young son, a book of children's amusements of the sort popular in the late 19th century. Here we see in sharp clarity the essential shallowness of the psaudoscientist. Donnelly had supposedly been studying the Bacon-Shakespeare question for a long time, yet he was entirely unaware of Bacon's well-known interest in ciphers until he stumbled accidentally across a reference to it in a child's puzzle book.

Who Wrote Shakespeare's Plays?
Candidates for Shakespeare
There seems to be a preponderance of evidence that Bacon did in fact write the plays, but I am always open to solid proof he did not.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:30 PM
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reply to post by autowrench
 


I don't know about solid proof, but I'm pretty sure there would be national headlines (perhaps global, even) if Shakespeare were solidly proven to have plagiarized.

Since such headlines have not exactly been forthcoming, I'll drop this particular tangent of the thread in file 13, until such a time as more evidence is amassed clearly pointing to the legitimate author of those plays.

And for now, that's Shakespeare.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:46 PM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 

There are a great many things that the MSN does not report on, for instance, only CNN did a piece on the discovery of the Tomb of Jesus and Mary, MSNBC and Fox ignored it, to the best of my knowledge. And when was the last time you turned on MSN and saw a report of UFOs?

In order to create the works Shakespeare is known for, the author had to meet certain criteria. He would have to be a genius of the highest magnitude possible, and be fluent in Latin, Greek, Italian, Spanish and French. He would have to have knowledge of philosophy and science, and possess a vast library. There is absolutely no evidence that the man Shakespeare fulfills any of it.
Bacon's Smoking Guns: The Hard Evidence (PDF File)



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 04:50 PM
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reply to post by Starchild23
 


In such a wondrous world, I would kill myself.

May I inquire as to why? This world was shown me by several different beings, one was my Grandfather who passed over and went there in 1962, one of the others was a Female who came to my home and took my on a journey in which I discovered many things, including the Afterlife. I have been training my mind for this for years now. I really feel sorry for those who are not prepared. Like those depending on a Saviour and nothing else.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 05:15 PM
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The word means, simply, 'anointed' and originally applied to the kings of Israel who were anointed with the holy oil. To this writer, a Messiah would be one who leads the People of planet Earth out of the bondage and chains they made for themselves, to a new and exiting world where all one desires is instantly provided.


If you could understand that millions HAVE been led out of the bondage and chains for the past 2,000 years, then you could gain a glimpse of the future Ages. As for "all one desires", the Kingdom is about learning and understanding and doing God's Will in the here and now, followed in the next Ages of mankind's future. It's the glory of the gospel, that that opportunity is still available for seeking. God is still calling out to people. He is using His people to call out the time in which we live - to repent of their ways. As for Judea mostly rejecting the Messiah, it was always God's plan to use His firstborn - Ephraim, the son of Joseph - to take the gospel to the world. Many of Judah stumbled over the stumbling stone - Jesus - AS prophecied. It was Ephraim who was PROPHECIED to become the 'multitude of nations' - the 'fullness of the 'Gentiles'. Ephraim received the adoption of Jacob/Israel. And that is why we see Christians, now thoroughly swamped in sin as the 6th day draws to a close because the true gospel message is not being taught. The two single biggest hurdles that our Bibles contain - the use of the word 'Gentile' and the use of the word 'Jew'. Understand those two, and it becomes CLEAR that the remnant of Israel have always accepted Yahushua as their Messiah. If you could only know that the attacks against the true descendants of Israel have already been happening - the western nations swimming in sin which leads them to reject the God of their forefathers. Many of those who settled our land KNEW that they were Israelites, and that's the knowledge that has been lost. Today's Christians believe that they are 'Gentiles'.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 06:13 PM
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there isn't one handwritten original that is knwon to exist.


In 1611 they used the printing press.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 06:52 PM
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A while back a member asked if anyone could prove the Bible had been rewritten. After I satisfactorily answered the question for myself as I kept digging further I came to this same conclusion. Not only that but it seemed that most religions I checked into were altered versions of some kind of original meaning, text, work etc.

Most people when they say the Bible was copied from other sources cite specific instances and while they are close they unfortunately prove nothing either way. The key for me was in the repetition of certain sacred numbers which suggest they were borrowed from another source and distorted for some reason. I believe this supports the idea that the New Testament was a fraud and I know I'll catch some heat for this but the Old as well. Though I'm not certain why a good deal seems to refer to kundalini yoga as well. I was always of the opinion Jesus was a metaphor for the "god man" attained through yoga and alchemy etc.

Mr. Bacon and alchemy are quite familiar with each other no? I can connect many themes in the Bible to alchemy but here are some kundalini ones. I hope this helps your research a little . I can give you sources if need be.

Take for instance-
3 in 1
Hinduism
Through the destruction of day and noon night is born. This chain of creation and destruction maintains each it in its own respect. Morning, noon, night and repeated the next day. The three gods Siva, Vishnu, and Brahma represent creation, maintenance, and destruction and are essentially one in the same.

Christianity
God the father/creation- Holy Spirit/maintenance- Jesus/destruction. With the death of Jesus and his resurrection we recycle back to the father and creation.

Here we begin to get into the kundalini although there is no direct the connection I can see the number 7 features too prominently to be ignored.
7
Hinduism- The 7 chakras
Christianity- 7 deadly sins, Seven Virtues, 7 devils cast of Magdalene

33-
This is the common age Jesus is said to have died. Whether it is accurate or not is up for debate. There is also some suggestion that it was 33 AD and not his age.

There are 33 vertebrae in the human spine. When Kundalini has fully ascended the spine and pierced the 7th chakra the work is complete. Jesus' work was completed at this time. Also in hermetic code 33 represents the steps to perfection of the life force.

144,000
A rather odd number but it appears once again in both works. There are allegedly 144,000 nadis (energy channels) in the human body. 72,000 paired front and back. 144,000 who John says have been sealed on the forehead descending from the 12 tribes. Now this is to be taken as saving mark from god but this is also the location of the third eye which many say is sealed until you open it. I find it curious that the use of the number talks about seals even though it is in a different context. Like I said I think they purposely distorted and used it for their own reasons.

4
It is said that 4 rivers run from Eden. The Muldahara base chakra has 4 petals or nadis which can be seen as 4 rivers of energy running from it.

And a quick mention on Revelations: Curiously when John mentions the 144,000 he also describes hearing a rushing water sound and peals of thunder. This is also supposedly a common symptom of kundalini rising.





edit on 23-4-2012 by DetectiveT because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 07:09 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

there isn't one handwritten original that is knwon to exist.


In 1611 they used the printing press.


Please, what does one have to do with the other? I am quite aware that Johannes Gutenberg invented the printing press in 1450. Any more history trivia you wish to tell me?



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 07:35 PM
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reply to post by autowrench

Hi Auto

Considering that to-day is supposed to be Shaksper's birthday - death day - birth day - death day etc. and that he spelled his name Shaksper, Shaxper, Shaxberd and Shaksperd (but NEVER as 'Shakespeare', at least the actor-theatre owner Shaxperd from Stratford upon Avon never alegedly signed his name that way !!)

Here's a curious discusion LINK

doubtaboutwill.org...


Interestingly, the low-comedy lines in Henry IV parts 1 and 2 (for the character of Shake-Speare ...woops...I meant, Fall-Staff) are written in a bawdy Warwickshire (and witty enough) dialect and may well come from the pen of William Shaxperd the comic actor who was 1/9th the owner of the Globe Theatre and 1/8th the owner of BlackFriars Theatre. He knew very very well how to get a laugh.

But these comedy lines seem to have been INSERTED into a play written by another (or perhaps by others) and some of the plays show signs of multi-authorship (such as Titus Andronicus) alla

Ditto for all the low-comedy in the Merry Wives of Windsor (which shows the Warwickshire comic style that the Actor Shaxperd tended to write in) an the comedy scenes in plays such as what we find in the Fool's speeches in King Lear etc. - we can see that Shaxperd the Actor (with his wit, but little education) did CONTRIBUTE to the comedy of the plays, but was not the sole author of them, e.g. the Comedy of Fluelen in Henry V which has a Warwickshrie accent.

We remember the 'Sonnets' (attributed to 'Shakespeare' with the rare but now famous re-spelling) being dedicated in 1609 to 'our Ever Living Poet' as if he were dead already - e.g. the 17th Earl of Oxford died in 1604.

Also the Earl of Oxford (or someone like him) had the Continental experience to write the witty court dialogue found at the Parisian Salon Style of c. 1590 that we see in some plays attributed to 'Shakespeare' and of course, the Earl of Oxford's Coat of Arms has a hand shaking a Spear as its emblem...hmmmm.

Handwriting D found in the Draft for a play (c. 1589) called The Boke of Sir Thomas More seems to be written in the same literary playwright style (roughly) as the person who penned Hamlet and Romeo and Juliet - but the handwriting does NOT match the signature of Shaxperd in his Will or in other docs (which show more than one handwriting style too) - but handwriting D is anonymous. It also is curiously similiar to the handwriting style of the 17th earl of Oxford...hmmm.....

The hand on the Will of Shaxperd is one of an alcoholic with the 'shakes' or a person who had suffered a stroke, or someone who DID NOT KNOW how to handle a quill pen in the first place (the actor Shaxperd's father was illiterate as was at least one of his daughters who signed her name with an X) - does this make sense?

Also, are we to believe that the sophisticated and broadminded author of plays like Lear and Hamlet was the same person who sued his neighbours hauling them into court in Stratford upon Avon after 1609 (more than 17 times over the next 7 years) for amounts as little as what are equivalent of USD $126.00?

How petty is that?

But since this is Shaxperd's birth day --no, death day--- no birth day---no death day...I guess we can INSERT this subject into the discusion at hand !!



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 07:46 PM
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reply to post by autowrench
 


I for one am glad to see you have truly found out that it’s all a lie except that we all came from pond scum and to pond scum we will return. There is no higher self there is no God particle. Everything came out of chaos into order by its self, and everything will return to what it was. There is no spirit no soul. You are here for a short time and then you are gone forever to never be remembered. I am thankful that you have found this out and let us know how totally hopeless life is.



posted on Apr, 23 2012 @ 08:04 PM
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Originally posted by autowrench
reply to post by Starchild23
 


In such a wondrous world, I would kill myself.

May I inquire as to why? This world was shown me by several different beings, one was my Grandfather who passed over and went there in 1962, one of the others was a Female who came to my home and took my on a journey in which I discovered many things, including the Afterlife. I have been training my mind for this for years now. I really feel sorry for those who are not prepared. Like those depending on a Saviour and nothing else.


What exactly did you see, Autowrench?

I don't believe I've ever seen you discuss what you thought the afterlife was going to be like.

Or did I?

For some reason I thought I read a thread of yours that said something to the affect of entering an afterlife where you had to be constantly guarded against something/somethings trying to take over your soul.






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