I Feel Chemtrailish...

Originally posted by ProudBird
reply to post by unityemissions

 

Look........let's be sure we are on the same discussion page....OK??:

You said that getting something added to the ionosphere was impossible without a rocket...period.

I aimed to show that this was an incorrect line of thought.

Please provide plausible alternatives (that don't involve anti-gravity ships, that we see in Science Fiction) to bring "anything" up to the ionosphere.......quibbling whether the ionosphere begins at "50" miles, or "60" miles is a DISTRACTION!!!!!

I did. A balloon filled with a sufficient amount of helium will reach at least 60 miles, and the quote you deem to not be a "poor source" said it is carrying a paper plane. Now that you have been discredited on this tid bit let's get off the distractions you have created and back to the real deal, shall we?!

And please.....call me "TIM!!".....or......(any MODS who wish to >snip< my actual name....?? No, you do not have to......unless the T&Cs require it.....here in the open Forum, and away from private U2U 'sharings'......up to YOU>>>> (HaH!!)

Tim, proudbird, weedwacker....I guess it's all the same you!


Anyways, my last post which you didn't properly address, showed a quote from the OP, which stated that aluminum seeded into the atmosphere (BELOW THE IONOSPERE) could mimic the ionosphere bouncing off ELF waves, naturally.

So why the hell are you focusing on the ionosphere and how can you reasonably say this has nothing to do with chemicals ..aluminum... being seeded into the atmosphere... in conjunction with ELF waves, to produce a desired effect

I'm not the one distracting. I answered your strawman, and then addressed it's invalidity. I then asked you to clarify your stance, and you tried to redirect me to the strawman.

You are either missing what I'm throwing out there, or this is intentional.

reply to post by unityemissions

So why the hell are you focusing on the ionosphere.........

BECUASE.....the 'OP' said>>>>>>

I'm ready to speculate on the relationship between HAARP, chemtrail grids and moods. [/qupte]

Then "she" (YES, the 'OP" is a "she") went SO...so, so....SO far 'afield" that I think.....ANYONE who can still think logically can......welll.......YOU KNOW!!!!!!!

edit on Fri 20 April 2012 by ProudBird because: (no reason given)

reply to post by earthdude

mellow, angry or sad

I think, judging by the current state of affairs, somnambulance is more realistic. That would be the walking dead.

ELF Infested Spaces

Clinical research indicates that somewhere between 25% to 75% of human and animal subjects may exhibit marked psychophysiological sensitivity to extreme low frequency magnetic and electric fields.

ELF fields of 6.67 Hz, 6.26 Hz and lower tend to produce symptoms of confusion, anxiety, depression, tension, fear, mild nausea and headaches, cholinergia, arthritic-like aches, insomnia, extended reaction times, hemispheric EEG desynchronization, and many other vegetative disturbances.

oscillations of 7.8, 8.O and 9 Hz produce anxiety-relieving and stress-reducing effects mimicking some "meditative" states

Coherent ELF energies have the unique and interesting property of almost lossless propagation within the earth-ionosphere cavity waveguide, and attenuation of these signals due to distance from transmitter sites is negligible.

The established physics of radio propagation therefore suggests that vast geographical areas can be readily mood-manipulated by transmissions of EM energy within the earth-ionosphere cavity wave guide.

And by artificially amplifying or altering or distorting these geomagnetic fields, or transmitting specific and coherent frequencies, vast segments of earth's populations could be affected. This now becomes an attractive modality of psychological or psionic warfare; or intentional modification of moods that could reflect in areas ranging from time-specific insomnia to stock market fluctuations. (There have been recent epidemics of 4:00 to 5:30 AM "worry", insomnia coinciding with the 9 Hz "Schumann" drop-out as observed in journals of geomagnetic research.)

Canadian Department of Transport monitoring sources have established that spectrum analysis of these strange signals appear to be higher harmonics of a fundamental frequency of 6.67 Hz.

The Canadians report alarming mood-alterations in certain areas of Eastern Canada, such as near Timmins and Kirkland Lake, Ontario, which observers believe are linked to Soviet transmissions.

much like the initial application of atomic energy, the first large-scale implementations of ELF discoveries appear to be destructive

The information in this link is from 1978 and this is...wait...2012...so there are a lot of holes in what happened in between with these ELF's. One thing is a given and that is that the Russians then were allegedly doing this and so we, the west, 'were forced' to come up to speed. It's similar to the current talks to congress wherein nebulous 'others' are manipulating the weather as weapon and therefore we must not be caught out. This is the decades, centuries old excuse for experimenting on the public.

reply to post by unityemissions


Yes, yes, yes........look, most of us can realize that:

I did. A balloon filled with a sufficient amount of helium will reach at least 60 miles.....

The "POINT" is.......depending upon the design of the specific balloons......they will BURST at certain heights.......it is based on the thickness and design of the balloon itself......this is "NOT" difficult to understand.....

reply to post by unityemissions


Awash in a trollish wake, it is sometimes difficult to locate the subject. This is true for me and I am the one who chose the subject. I can imagine how someone looking for information on geoengineering and chemtrails might feel upon entering this thread and being confused right off the bat by PB into thinking that extremely low frequency waves (ELF's) are packaged up into rockets and sent into the ionosphere.

When I reply in a geoengineering thread I find I have to often go back and read the OP in order to understand what the thread is about because of the terrific obfuscation that almost immediately takes place. I appreciate your efforts and persistence in trying to discuss the subject at hand.

ELF's and their effects on consciousness, I propose, are, in part, responsible for the trolling and irrational denial of observation and, even, the somnambulance that makes a person oblivious to their environment.

Mind control weapons, like ELF's, deliberately pulsed in herz frequencies known to cause mood changes are the ultimate weapon. Put the public into a stupor and pull out the throttle on geoengineering...only a few, unaffected, will notice. It's not rational but moods seem real to trolls and observers and researchers alike.

reply to post by luxordelphi


I'd like to make my position clear regarding the topics of chemical seeded in the sky without public awareness, and ELF being used to influence the mind.

First, a preface:

I hold the belief that anything is possible given enough focus, time, and resources.

It seems that often times, when people say something is illogical what they really mean is they lack the imagination to reasonably consider the possibility.

I know it to be true that governments have experimented on an unwitting public for centuries, if not millenia.

I see no reason to think that this has suddenly ceased.


As for ELF and/or scalar waves with an intent to influence individuals or large swarms of individuals within a specific or general geographical area/region, this may or may not be going on.

I have read stories of this for over a decade now. I note that the sources are often questionable, but that there is usually a little truth even in lies (not to imply that all, most, or many of these sources are false).

IF the Russians developed some sort of technology to beam energy at the US, and cause depression, or riots, or generally affect the thoughts/mood of the population, then it is entirely reasonable to think that once our intelligence agencies figured this out, we would spy and develop similar and one-upped technology to both: disrupt/counteract the waves being pushed our way, and to counter-attack the aggressive nation (Russia).

Perhaps IF the technology was being used by the US, on it's own population, it was of benevolent intent, but we must consider alternative intentions as well. So WHY would the US mind control it's own people That's a rabbit hole in itself that I'm just not going to touch.

As for aluminum, or other materials being seeded into the lower atmosphere, I think this could have other reasons for existing outside of bouncing ELF's back to earth. I think what MAY be happening is geoengineering on a large scale in order to curb the disastrous effects of climate change, man-made or not.

That's not to say that both projects aren't going on at once. If the aircraft are already being used for one purpose, might as well get a twofer

I'm not sold on any of this, but simply think a lot of this is much more possible than some members of this site.

Where they see limitations in possibility, I see limitations of reasonable imagination. That isn't to say everything which could possibly be going on, is. If that were the case, my, my what a fantastically frightening world we'd have!

You don't have to fully explain something, to see the possibility.

That is the difference between focusing on logical analysis, and intuitively processing.

I trust my intuitive abilities far more than my ability to logically analyze, and my analytical mind isn't all too rusty.

reply to post by unityemissions


ALL of that, as a "concept" (and maybe a Hollywood script outline) idea is fun.....but, it is STILL "science fiction"......and here's why:

....any of that, as an "idea" if it existed in "real life" would require a HUGE amount of personnel, to provide back-up (just look at NASA in the 1960s.....or, even today, in the 20-"tweens"!!).

Out of ALL of those, basically.....easily, under 500,000 (but probably more) people....Not a SINGLE ONE has come "forward". yet, to 'blow the whistle'?????

Seriously???


Just do some hard, and clever 'thinking' on this.....OK????

reply to post by unityemissions


In my experience it is often the individual who claims an open mind that is the most rigid. Coming to terms with observation, whether it be visual or auditory or in this case moody, in my experience, is an erratic edge of the precipice dance. It is better for some to never grasp implications because the security of presupposed and conformist explanations are just that - foundational to sanity and vital to belonging within a group. That doesn't mean that an evolutionary process is not at work because, as human beings, there is a lot to aspire to. Not all roads are cross roads and not all cross roads require an east or west decision. Linear analysis is limiting. Motive is a rabbit hole because it is never clear, in a fog of ELF's, as a hypothetical example, where the motive, tailored by one's own intellect to fit, came from.

So WHY would the US mind control it's own people?

This is not the correct question. Reading the e-mails of a nation is the act of the ultra-paranoid. I am old enough to remember a more gracious time not so very long ago when opening a letter belonging to another was the ultimate distasteful act and also a federal offense. There is not a question of the wish for control - there are many observations, currently, that show that this is happening. The question that will bring a profitable answer is who or what would wish the U.S. to perpetrate mind control on its' own people. Who or what would feel threatened by a nation of sovereign individuals.

To sum, it is distasteful, to me, personally, to even contemplate swaying or manipulating another into my thinking. Human beings have inherent free will and without psychotropic attack will figure it out and even with...will figure it out. Just saying...just trying...to level the field.

reply to post by luxordelphi


Nobody is reading the emails of the nation. Supercomputers sift information and when enough red flags are amassed, more resources are used in the name of national security. It's no different than what was done decades ago in regard to personal phone calls.

Look, I don't agree with a lot of things the government does, but as the terrain changes, so too does the culture, social mores, and laws.

I think you may be projecting this stance of "ultra-paranoia".

reply to post by ProudBird


I have. There are a few thoughts that come to mind.

First, how are you sure nobody has come forward

Let's say that at least 9/10 reports related to "chemtrails" are partially or entirely false, but 1/10 are genuine. Don't you see how most people wouldn't be able to handle the ambiguity of the truth of the matter, and have to jump to, "it's all false" ... "nobody has come forward" type of thought process?

Also, what if whistle-blowers did come forward, but they were "taken care of" ??

Also, anyone working on this operation would likely have military clearance. I think you know what kind of assumed consequences come from breaching the confidentiality agreements which come with sensitive information and operations regarding "national security". I honestly doubt many would try to whistle blow.

Also, military security sensitive information is given on a "need to know" basis. I doubt but a few would know exactly what was going on and why. People would be told different things to get through the process of the ongoing project each week depending on what duty needed to be performed.

Yes another also, perhaps tools such as google and MSM are used by organizations such as the NSA to shape results and filter out genuine whistle blowing of sensitive information?

There's a lot of possibilities. Like I said, I'm more comfortable saying, "I just don't know", than...absolutely yes or no. I'm just weird like that...

What a very informative thread!, I really enjoyed reading these and checking all the links provided.
I find the thoughts of the OP to be most stimulating and they make me reflect on on my own happenings here.

It is also very good to see a spade called a spade as in the intentional misdirection of threads here.

S&F
Regards, Iwinder

reply to post by Iwinder


Thankyou, Iwinder, for the breath of fresh air. The topic is confronting and not a contemplation for everyone. Still, I think, that if we want to continue to ensure that we are ourselves and that our decisions are our own, it needs to be considered. Here is an additional link that talks about HAARP and the two main dangers inherent in it's use. Boiling the ionosphere is a big one. Scientists have said that they really have no idea what this will do. The mental effects of the created ELF's are the other.

Haarp: High-Frequency Vandalism in the Sky

reply to post by unityemissions

I think you may be projecting this stance of "ultra-paranoia".

So...finally...the lunacy card. Am I psychic because I knew it was coming? Of course not - just observant. If I see a grid laid out in the sky day after day, what am I going to think: accidental? normal? aliens? No, these will not be my thoughts. These, however, are some of the seeds that are mentally planted in order that I might view the grid in a politically and militarily correct and acceptable way. Further psycho manipulation will endear the grid to me and soon, very soon, I will no longer notice and soon after that I will no longer care. It becomes as natural and normal as having a credit card - nothing to worry about unless it disappears. It's called being desensitized. Will I be aware of what happened? The answer to that reminds me of a joke:

A drunk is driving home from a party when he loses control of his car. The car hits a tree and rolls down an embankment. The drunk staggers, unhurt, from the mangled car and spies his hat a few feet away. He goes over and picks it up and sees that the top of his hat has come loose from the brim. Puzzling over this he mumbles, "What happened here?"

Originally posted by luxordelphi
reply to post by unityemissions

 

I think you may be projecting this stance of "ultra-paranoia".

So...finally...the lunacy card. Am I psychic because I knew it was coming? Of course not - just observant. If I see a grid laid out in the sky day after day, what am I going to think: accidental? normal? aliens?

You're not helping your postion....at all.

Do you not know where I stand on this all by now?

Have you forgotten my previous posts

My statement in regards to the "ultra-paranoia" has nothing to do with seeing grids laid out in the sky.

I seem to be observing a lack of listening (thoughtful reading) by more than one member of this thread.

You are claiming to be able to view other people not being open-minded, yet speak of knowing things absolutely, and are also seemingly incapable of having people disagree with you without twisting what was said.

Crazy I'm getting this from both, someone open to chemtrails, and someone opposed to their existence.

I guess egoism knows no bounds in relation to the belief or lack of belief of chemtrails.

Meh, have fun with this all...


/thread

reply to post by luxordelphi


So HAARP can somehow boil the ionosphere with 3.6MW of power, yet the sun, with 1.4 x 10^31 joules doesn't?
(That's 1.4 x 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 × 10 btw)

Please stop with the disinformation.

reply to post by Chadwickus


Oh Jesus. Oh God. Oh help me. Oh no, not again. Yes. no. wait. uh huh. Please Thank you. Can I leave now ? But first Chad are you saying HAARP can only simmer the pot ?

reply to post by luxordelphi


Great thread op. Just as an added bonus, I had a friend call me and had seen this thread and was moved not only by your info, ( Not Dis-Info ) and he said he had put a little music to go with the thread. He called it "The I Feel Chemish Song"

I Feel Chemish

* * * * * * * * * * * A T T E N T I O N * * * * * * * * * * *

This thread's topic is discussing EMP/Chemtrails/Geoengineering, not each other.

Please keep your comments on topic.

Thank you