Alternate THEORIES of evolution:

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by rhinoceros

 

I don't deny the first apes and humans had parents, but where did there parents come from?

From their parents of course. I think you have some misunderstandings about speciation. We'll start with one population of apes (common ancestors of humans, chimps, and bonobo). This population is split into two different populations, perhaps because a group crossed a desert for example. So now there is no more interbreeding, which means that the two populations start to drift apart genetically. Natural selection acts on both populations of course, but the criteria for fitness differ, e.g. the to-be human population might live in an area of high grass, and thus those that manage to walk upright better are favored by selection (maybe because they spot predators better). This drifting apart continues for 6-7 million years, and now you have humans, chimps, and bonobos (in the story the population that remained at place was split again some million years later after the first group left). I'm not saying that is how it happened, but the principle mechanism of speciation is this: isolation (no interbreeding) and adaption.

How did the early humans mate?

Penis into vagina. Baby some months later.

How did they survive?

By staying alive? :p

How exactly did they evolve all on there own?

Not sure what you mean by this.

And yeah, the thread title is very misleading as none of the things listed as "alternatives" are theories...at best, they're hypotheses. Mostly because they aren't backed up by objective evidence.

Originally posted by Iason321
For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.


Let those verses sink into all you unbelievers and skeptics "wise" minds,

Amen

WOW! You just got it all figured out, don't you? In your "backwards land" world, lies are truth and truth is a lie, knowledge is ignorance and wisdom is foolishness, light is dark and night is day.

And you wonder why your conversation is taken as irrelevent to us......

reply to post by MrXYZ


I read through all your links and my questions are still unanswered.

They will remain unanswered because scientists don't know, though they like to think they do....

How did the early cavemen survive? How did the first prototype humans survive?

you can give me links all day explaining the early forms of humans and showing how we evolved from apes, but you cannot answer me how the patriachs of our species survived, you can't give me the details, because they don't exist.

God is the only reason people were able to evolve from apes without dying off.....

reply to post by Iason321

How did the early cavemen survive? How did the first prototype humans survive?

What do you mean "how did they survive"??? They were hunter and gatherers. And what's a "prototype" human? Such a thing never existed, there was never just 1 human around from which everything started.

you can give me links all day explaining the early forms of humans and showing how we evolved from apes, but you cannot answer me how the patriachs of our species survived, you can't give me the details, because they don't exist.

What patriarchs???

Do you mean our and today's apes ancestors?

God is the only reason people were able to evolve from apes without dying off.....

And that's you BELIEF, not a theory....mostly because it isn't backed up by objective evidence.

reply to post by rhinoceros


How did the VERY FIRST ONES survive?

Were there apemen nursing the first cavemen? If so, who nursed them?

I want to be educated on this, and if I am not understanding due to my lack of eduation in evolutionary biology, please educate me, I do not have an issue with evolution or darwins theory or current theory, I just want to understand how it works.....and the idea of it all coming together on its own with no direction is a big pill for me to swallow.....help me understand what I'm confused about, and be patient with my questioning, as I've said, evolutionary biology is not my best subject.....I am open to explanations though

reply to post by Iason321

How did the VERY FIRST ONES survive?

Human population never dropped below 10k and this is not how evolution works. There weren't suddenly 2 humans that popped up and then took over.

reply to post by MrXYZ


Belief only quantifies my subjective experience. I gave one objective observation (Chaos Theory which points to higher order within complex or chaotic patterns, thus showing a very mathmatical universe to me that is a science minded God). DNA is another as they now suspect there is mathmatical codes written in it

www.dailygalaxy.com...

FInally Quantum mechanics and spooky action at a distance which why in the world would a Universe need have to be observed to work?

reply to post by MrXYZ


How did the infant apes or infant cavemen survive there infancy on there own?

They werent born fully grown, correct? Don't babies need to be nursed through infancy for survival?

Did males and females come into being simultaneously? If not, how did it happen?

And yes, I am speaking of todays ancestors, the original apes/"prototype" humans that we evolved from.

How did the earliest of our ancestors survive?

Also, did life (specfically human life) originate in one area of the globe, or did it spring into being in multiple places on earth at once?

reply to post by MrXYZ


How do you know that?

Was there a census back 100k years ago?

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by rhinoceros

 

How did the VERY FIRST ONES survive?

I might better answer your question, if you first tell me why you think they had trouble surviving.

Were there apemen nursing the first cavemen? If so, who nursed them?

I don't understand this question. The change was obviously slow and gradual.


edit. I read your replies to XYZ, it looks to me like you didn't even read what I wrote about speciation..

reply to post by rhinoceros


Okay, I see the problem with my second question posed....and I understand how evolution answers it....

But back to my first question, when apes first evolved out of whatever other life they evolved from (where did they evolve from? I am ignorant in this subject, and I am genuinely wanting to be educated) how did the first two survive?

There had to be a first two right? Or was there just one that somehow self replicated? How did the infants survive? Don't infants need to be nursed (animals and humans alike)?

How would the very first monkeys that evolved out of previous mammals have survived there infancy and gone on to procreate?

reply to post by rhinoceros


I believe the first apes/humans had trouble surviving because I've never seen a human being get tossed in the woods and survive on its own...

As far as I know, if you throw a infant chimp or person in the woods and left them to there own devices, they'd be dead in a day or two

reply to post by abeverage

Chaos Theory which points to higher order

By its very definition, that's not what chaos theory states: LINK

Small differences in initial conditions (such as those due to rounding errors in numerical computation) yield widely diverging outcomes for chaotic systems, rendering long-term prediction impossible in general.

If it was saying there's a higher order, it wouldn't state that long term predictions are impossible.

DNA is another as they now suspect there is mathmatical codes written in it

So far all DNA analysis supports the theory of evolution. And DNA is part of chemistry, they always express things mathematically...you can express pretty much everything mathematically...but that's not proof of a creator.

FInally Quantum mechanics and spooky action at a distance which why in the world would a Universe need have to be observed to work?

Quantum mechanics is part of theoretical physics...and since we don't understand it yet, it's not proof for/against a creator.

Just to be clear here...

My belief in God does not contradict with science and evolution. That does not mean I believe the bible to be any more than a good way to live your life, with parables and metaphors of creation and existance.

In my belief in creationism if you can call it that is that God was the spark, or pushed the first domino. That the Universe is indeed 13 Billion or so years old, and that evolution and DNA were started or designed by God.

But ultimately the only people who truly know are dead and dead men tell no tales...

Originally posted by Iason321
But back to my first question, when apes first evolved out of whatever other life they evolved from (where did they evolve from?

From something monkey like from which all monkeys and apes (including humans, gorillas, orangutangs, bonobos, chimps, and gibbons) evolved.

I am ignorant in this subject, and I am genuinely wanting to be educated) how did the first two survive?

There had to be a first two right? Or was there just one that somehow self replicated? How did the infants survive? Don't infants need to be nursed (animals and humans alike)?

No. We are talking about populations that become isolated from one another and adapt to their surroundings as a species.

reply to post by rhinoceros


What was that something?

And in that case, were males first, or females? Or did both evolve simultaneously?

And how did those isolated primitive beings survive there infancy?

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by rhinoceros

 

I believe the first apes/humans had trouble surviving because I've never seen a human being get tossed in the woods and survive on its own...

There are still tribes of humans living in the jungles/deserts/etc. sans modern equipment, surviving just fine.

As far as I know, if you throw a infant chimp or person in the woods and left them to there own devices, they'd be dead in a day or two

Again. We're talking about populations that gradually drift apart. In no point do we have a situation where infants have to find a new species..

Originally posted by Iason321
reply to post by MrXYZ

 

How did the infant apes or infant cavemen survive there infancy on there own?

They werent born fully grown, correct? Don't babies need to be nursed through infancy for survival?

Did males and females come into being simultaneously? If not, how did it happen?

And yes, I am speaking of todays ancestors, the original apes/"prototype" humans that we evolved from.

How did the earliest of our ancestors survive?

Also, did life (specfically human life) originate in one area of the globe, or did it spring into being in multiple places on earth at once?

What do you mean "infant survive on his own"??? It had parents, just like infants have today. How on earth do you come up with the belief somehow parents didn't take care of their offspring back then?

And what do you mean with "male and female come into existence simultaneously"? Evolution is a gradual change over time...it's not as if some of our ancestors gave birth to 2 humans. The ENTIRE species changed over time...gradually.

I think you need to reread at least the Wiki article about evolution, because your questions make it clear you don't really understand the theory (and that's not an attack).

Here's a good series that explains it...3 short videos, this is the first part:

How do you know that?

Was there a census back 100k years ago?

Because of the amount of remains scientists found. LINK

reply to post by rhinoceros


But those isolated peoples are around to care for there young.

How did there parents, parents, parents, parents, parents, etc, survive?

Or did the infants that evolved just survive on there own? That's a pretty damn incredible feat if it's what happened......

Why bother feeding infants and nursing them if this whole time, they don't really need all that nonsense! Let's just throw a suit and tie on kids once they hit 1, and send them out into the world.......