HELP! Any Proof that God Does NOT Know Everything in Advance? (Total Omniscience)

I was raised in the mainstream Baptist Christian religion where it is taught that GOD knows EVERY THING that you will do in your life, from the moment you are conceived.

For the first 40 (or so) years of my life, I accepted the teaching that God knows everything, without question.

But the more I think about this, the more it drives me up the wall.. Why? Because, If God knows EVERYTHING...

1. Why did God create Hitler, knowing in advance that this person would be responsible for the killing of millions of His children? (aka..Hitler's sisters and brothers)

2. If Christianity is the "Only Way" to Heaven, why did God create humans (his children) whom He knew in advance would be Muslims, Hindus, Athiests, etc.. and therefore be relegated to suffer throughout eternity in Hell?

3. If Satan is real, then why does GOD allow him to cause so much suffering? Isn't that the equivalent of me giving a gun with an unlimited supply of bullets to a known murderer? Am I not then just as guilty as he is? If I have the power to get rid of that murderer and don't do so, what does that make me?

Does anyone see what I'm getting at here? Why would a Father (God) have children knowing in advance that they would murder other children in masse and that 70% of his children would be sent to Hell because they did not adopt the Christian religion in their lifetime? (I read a report that only 30% of the global population is Christian)

I would feel A LOT BETTER about GOD if there was some logical basis (or proof) that God does NOT know everything in advance. In human terms, it would be pretty rotten for a Dad to have a family knowing in advance that the vast majority of the children would be condemned to eternal agony after their brief stint at life on this plane.

Is there anyone that can help me get over this growing negativity? In a way, I was happier back in the days when I didn't look at the big picture and was just thankful to be personally "Saved". But in retrospect, that was a selfish attitude? Sure wish there was Religion which teaches that God does not know everything, but show love to your fellow man/woman and you'll be fine in this life and that/those to come.

-CareWeMust (Chicago/USA)

If he knows everything, why in Genesis 6 did he say that he regretted making man, and was going to wipe them off the face of the earth, including all other animals as well? I mean, didn't he have a plan for redemption from the very beginning? If so, why act like you're going to wipe man out? Then, out of nowhere he found righteous Noah and decided to save some of them.

reply to post by carewemust


He does know everything because his foreknowledge has no limit. The reason he allowed Hitler to come into existence was he is ending the Diaspora and regathering Israel so that he can refine them in the baptism of the Fire because they failed the baptism of the Water.

Everything he does has a purpose we cannot see because we only get glimpses of puzzle pieces when he is looking at the entire picture. From Yeshua's point of view, time has already ended. Yeshua is God, that is why he could tell the Samaritan woman all she ever did without ever seeing her for the first time or knowing her.

How do you know that God does know everything? The only reason why man says that is because their understanding of omniscience can't touch it because ultimately man has a limited understanding of things, so what might be "omniscient" might only seem so if it is just an inch beyond our understanding. In other words, God's knowledge could be limited, but we aren't smart enough to say whether it is or not if it goes beyond what we can comprehend.

Originally posted by satron
How do you know that God does know everything? The only reason why man says that is because their understanding of omniscience can't be touched because ultimately man has a limited understanding of things, so what might be "omniscient" might only seem so if it is just an inch beyond our understanding. In other words, God's knowledge could be limited, but we aren't smart enough to say whether it is or not if it goes beyond what we can comprehend.

Wrong on every level. If you ever read the entire Holy Bible OT and NT and had any understanding of what you read, there is no way you could come to this conclusion.

reply to post by carewemust


Click on my signature link Jesus is Yahweh and read, it may help get you pointed in the right direction.

Originally posted by carewemust
Does anyone see what I'm getting at here? Why would a Father (God) have children knowing in advance that they would murder other children in masse and that 70% of his children would be sent to Hell because they did not adopt the Christian religion in their lifetime? (I read a report that only 30% of the global population is Christian)

I would feel A LOT BETTER about GOD if there was some logical basis (or proof) that God does NOT know everything in advance. In human terms, it would be pretty rotten for a Dad to have a family knowing in advance that the vast majority of the children would be condemned to eternal agony after their brief stint at life on this plane.

Is there anyone that can help me get over this growing negativity? In a way, I was happier back in the days when I didn't look at the big picture and was just thankful to be personally "Saved". But in retrospect, that was a selfish attitude? Sure wish there was Religion which teaches that God does not know everything, but show love to your fellow man/woman and you'll be fine in this life and that/those to come.

-CareWeMust (Chicago/USA)

edit on 17-4-2012 by carewemust because: typo correction

In short, in my opinion, I cannot help you.

Even in the event that I will be flamed for this post, I do not believe in a "god" anymore. A higher power, maybe, but not an Omnipotent entity that oversees all and everything at all times.

To paraphrase..."there's an invisible man, living in the sky, who watches everything that you do...and he has a list of 10 things that you shouldn't do. If you do any of these 10 things, you will forever suffer...BUT HE LOVES YOU!!!"

Originally posted by Hydroman
If he knows everything, why in Genesis 6 did he say that he regretted making man, and was going to wipe them off the face of the earth, including all other animals as well? I mean, didn't he have a plan for redemption from the very beginning? If so, why act like you're going to wipe man out? Then, out of nowhere he found righteous Noah and decided to save some of them.

Because Genesis is the first book of the Torah which was written by Moses as told him by pre-incarnate Yeshua. It was Yeshua's recount of the ordeal looking into the past which is why it looks to you like he didn't know it was going to happen. He knew all of this was going to happen and it's written in the geneaology of names, the entire story.

www.bible-codes.org...

I understand, you have to learn what God isn't before you can know what God is.

You're not gonna find that answer here. You keep looking for the answer within yourself. You'll find it.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
Because Genesis is the first book of the Torah which was written by Moses as told him by pre-incarnate Yeshua. It was Yeshua's recount of the ordeal looking into the past which is why it looks to you like he didn't know it was going to happen. He knew all of this was going to happen and it's written in the geneaology of names, the entire story. www.bible-codes.org...

Genesis 6:5-8 "And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart. And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them. But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. "

This is how it happened, right? First we see that god is angry with what he created and is going to wipe them all out. BUT, Noah found grace. If he knew the plan, then why doesn't it say what it is from the beginning instead of acting like you're going to wipe out everyone?

See, it WASN'T his plan to destroy man from the face of the earth, it was his plan to redeem them, wasn't it? So, why say you're going to wipe them all out?

reply to post by Hydroman


So you're saying that God DOES NOT know everything, because if he did, he would not have created us in a manner that would cause him to want to wipe us (his very children) off the map? Gosh, I wish this is true!
-cwm

reply to post by carewemust


Dear carewemust,

Well, it says that he knows everything that is, it does not say he knows everything that will be. Perhaps that is why he made us, to see what the possibilities of consciousness might be? For those who believe God knows all that will be then they must explain free will. Could God know more that all that is known and still learn, is he capable of change is the question. Peace.

Originally posted by carewemust
So you're saying that God DOES NOT know everything, because if he did, he would not have created us in a manner that would cause him to want to wipe us (his very children) off the map? Gosh, I wish this is true!
-cwm

Christians will argue that our free will caused us to sin against god. Honestly, I don't know if any gods exist. To me, the stories of the biblical god just don't make sense. Many of his actions seem so....human...

There are many christians who believe that dinosaurs were on Noah's Ark. So, if god is omniscient, he would know that those animals were going to go extinct just a few years later. Same with Mammoths, Sabre Tooth tigers, etc. etc. There were many animals that went extinct, apparently, after the flood. Why put them on the ark at all if they're not going to live much longer anyway? It would have been much less stressful on Noah and his family...

Originally posted by TheLieWeLive
I understand, you have to learn what God isn't before you can know what God is.

You're not gonna find that answer here. You keep looking for the answer within yourself. You'll find it.

A very wise statement and advice, TheLieWeLive. You're proabably right.. The answer comes ultimately from our internal "gut" feeling I suppose. After all, we are all endowed with a connection to the universal consciousness. It's only a matter of learning how to utilize it properly?
-cwm

Originally posted by AQuestion
Dear carewemust,

Well, it says that he knows everything that is, it does not say he knows everything that will be. Perhaps that is why he made us, to see what the possibilities of consciousness might be? For those who believe God knows all that will be then they must explain free will. Could God know more that all that is known and still learn, is he capable of change is the question. Peace.

Why call him god if that is the case?

Originally posted by carewemust
The answer comes ultimately from our internal "gut" feeling I suppose. After all, we are all endowed with a connection to the universal consciousness. It's only a matter of learning how to utilize it properly?
-cwm

Not everyone's gut says the same thing. How do you utilize it properly?

God has total omniscience. This does not mean He should be blamed for everything that is wrong in the world. This world is not utopia or heaven. The Prince of the World is the devil. You can't deny the damage he is capable of doing when he enters a man's heart.

God is in control, but He lets us drive this planet we call Earth. Sometimes we really screw up. It is not our place to judge God. How He can be so merciful to a world that has gone so wrong, I can not fathom.

You might think you see the big picture, but what we comprehend is so minuscule compared to the awesome ways of the Lord. Isiah 55:8-9:

“For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways,”
declares the LORD.
“As the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways
and my thoughts than your thoughts."

Sounds like you are humanizing God and in doing this you are not able to trust Him. If you contemplate a God that is made in the image of man, you will be sorely disappointed.

Asking "Why did God let _____________ happen?" is a cop out. We have brains and consciences and we have to chose how to deal with the challenges life throws our way. Maybe you should be acknowledging that man has to accept the hard times and not blame God. Nobody promised this life to be a rose garden.

It kind of reminds me of Job's lament and God's response. Reading that may help you a bit.

Trust in God's mercy. Do not limit it. Pray and don't worry.

Christ's peace be with you.

reply to post by carewemust

1. Why did God create Hitler, knowing in advance that this person would be responsible for the killing of millions of His children? (aka..Hitler's sisters and brothers)

How can you appreciate the good without the bad? Or, the day without the night.

2. If Christianity is the "Only Way" to Heaven, why did God create humans (his children) whom He knew in advance would be Muslims, Hindus, Athiests, etc.. and therefore be relegated to suffer throughout eternity in Hell?

Christianity is not the only way to heaven. God recognizes all who recognizes him, whether through a religion or direct.

In the beginning when man was created, it was planned to have bad as well as good, as to test ones true self here. The experience of life is the ultimate test of where ones heart truly is.

Your number of 70% is way off. Many are given a choice right around death. There has been far more worse things that have happened than Hitler, but Father has rewound those things as if they never happened.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by satron
How do you know that God does know everything? The only reason why man says that is because their understanding of omniscience can't be touched because ultimately man has a limited understanding of things, so what might be "omniscient" might only seem so if it is just an inch beyond our understanding. In other words, God's knowledge could be limited, but we aren't smart enough to say whether it is or not if it goes beyond what we can comprehend.

Wrong on every level. If you ever read the entire Holy Bible OT and NT and had any understanding of what you read, there is no way you could come to this conclusion.

Give me one level.

reply to post by Hydroman


When asked his name he said he was "I Am". What if we call him Jaime? Sounds more like "I am". Sounds like "I am me" and has the same meaning.