9/11: A Boeing 757 Struck the Pentagon

I can't even be sure it's a C130, but it's pretty clear that it has 4 engines, IMO. I think the wing sweep back too much to be a C130. But nowhere has anyone officially said it was supposed to be the 757 that hit the Pentagon. And yes, the cap sequence has been wrong for a long time, implying something that the footage did not. Looks more like a jumbo jet of some kind to me... It was probably some kind of military jet. Maybe something like this? itc.utk.edu... [edit on 21-5-2005 by Moe Foe]

I dont ever recall any 'official' statement saying it was either.Just a few here on the board. Reason why a C130 is suggested is because one was seen flying over the D.C. near the Pentagon before and after. There is MP3 of witnesses saying they saw a C130.I'll try and locate.But we all know,if a witness goes against what the 'official' story says,then it isnt welcome here as proof.If they do go with what the 'official' story says,then it is excepted.Strange how that works

Yeah, I know there were some that reported a C130, but you have to ask yourself how many people really even know what a C130 looks like? Chances are, there were quite a few military planes in the sky shortly after. SkyNews played that footage on the 8pm news. Was that their time? That could've been recorded anytime that day, I figure. Nobody ever placed a time or significance on that footage. It was pure speculation on some peoples' part. There was no reason to believe it wasn't just a filler, like when they show freeway traffic at rush hour. They were talking about planes, so of course they're going to show footage of any plane they see.

Originally posted by HowardRoark (yes, I think that is a stupid statement) Just how precisely have you calculated the angle and the speed? have you accounted for the ground effect?

Read my other post, I said I do not know for a fact that it hit, I did not see it hit...but the plane was pretty steep compared to most and ofcourse it was going fast. So with a little common sense I came to the conclusion that a plane did indeed hit....could have been the penagon, could have the ground for all I know, but a plane did hit. Kind of like when a fast car is racing towards a yellow light at an intersection....you just kinda know it it's gonna stop or not...in this case, if it's gonna hit or not.

Just thought I'd mention the plane shown in the picture above looks to me like a Boeing 747 not a C130. Living under a London flight path for so long I know the bellies of aircraft quite well. [edit on 24-5-2005 by uknumpty]

I just got around to read the head post of this thread with a critical eye and I have to say this thread starter post is a mastery of deceptions and extrapolations. I decided to post a counter arguement to this and I will be posting it in it's own thread soon. People, if you read between the lines here, you will realize just what pure deception this thread starter post is ... shame on you CatHerder! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here are two of 100 playing cards for a Game that was invented in 1995 by a Steve Jackson it is called INWO ‘Illuminati – New World Order’ also known as ‘The Kingdom of Antichrist’ Did Jackson just luck out when he designed the cards of the Trade Towers and the Pentagon being hit almost six years before it happened? www.abovetopsecret.com...

I think you are stretching it a bit there.

Originally posted by Howard I think you are stretching it a bit there.

I'm stretching nothing, I asked a question. Did Jackson just luck out when he designed the cards of the Trade Towers and the Pentagon being hit almost six years before it happened? just another 9/11 coincidence right Howard

Originally posted by Jedi_Master Look Pepe...all I'm saying is that people are judging from an unclear .gif animation, why they released it in that format...who knows, maybe some higher up in the Pentagon that knows nothing about streaming video ordered it as an animated .gif...

OK, let's try and run with that ball! Do you think the same "video challenged higher up people" ordered the time stamps be hidden with new fake ones? Do you think the same "video challenged higher up people" ordered that al those frames showing the airplane, the bright flash and the powerful shockwave be held back from the public?

The bogus date...that was added, as was the frame count down to impact in the lower right ( or did you miss that part ), I mean what camera would put that in the image ??

That is my point exactly, those time stamps fake! Now why do you think the pentagon would find it aacceptable to cover over the original time stamps with some new fake ones? After all, thar footage was evidence oon a crime scene, so isn't that illegal to willingly alter a piece of evidence on a crime scene? Think Jedi, think! Why did the pentagon altere this evidence before it was leaked out to the press? Why all other footages confiscated and never released again?

Originally posted by Jedi_Master Look Pepe...all I'm saying is that people are judging from an unclear .gif animation, why they released it in that format...who knows, maybe some higher up in the Pentagon that knows nothing about streaming video ordered it as an animated .gif...

OK, let's try and run with that ball! Do you think the same "video challenged higher up people" ordered the time stamps be hidden with new fake ones? Do you think the same "video challenged higher up people" ordered that al those frames showing the airplane, the bright flash and the powerful shockwave be held back from the public?

The bogus date...that was added, as was the frame count down to impact in the lower right ( or did you miss that part ), I mean what camera would put that in the image ??

That is my point exactly, those time stamps fake! Now why do you think the pentagon would find it aacceptable to cover over the original time stamps with some new fake ones? After all, thar footage was evidence oon a crime scene, so isn't that illegal to willingly alter a piece of evidence on a crime scene? Think Jedi, think! Why did the pentagon altere this evidence before it was leaked out to the press? Why all other footages confiscated and never released again?

slowly but surly it will come out, we have a saying where I come from "shit floats"

Missile & remote control systems added to small jets before 9-11; same parts found at Pentagon Snip~ Presidential candidate says scores of retired and active military and intelligence officials would testify before current grand jury probing government involvement in 9/11 attacks According to two civilian defense contractor employees working at commercial corporate facilities at Fort Collins-Loveland Municipal Airport (left), in the months before the September 11 attacks U.S. Air Force defense contractors brought in A-3 Sky Warrior aircraft under cover of darkness to be completely refitted and modified at the small civilian airport in Colorado. The revelations are important evidence for a reportedly ongoing secret 9/11 probe because widely available Federal Emergency Management Administration (FEMA) photographs taken during the attacks clearly show that the few aircraft parts found at the Pentagon belonged to a small jet very similar to a modified A-3 Sky Warrior--not the American Airlines Boeing 757. The two witnesses say that separate military contractor teams--working independently at different times--refitted Douglas A-3 Sky Warriors (left) with updated missiles, Raytheon's Global Hawk unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) remote control systems, fire control systems, engines, transponders, and radio-radar-navigation systems--a total makeover, seemingly for an operation more important than use as a simple missile testing platform for defense contractor Link

Description / Specifications / Propulsion / Pratt & Whitney J57-P-10 Douglas A-3A Skywarrior [edit on 26/5/2005 by Sauron]

Remember these photos Curiously, a large piece of wreckage was found in the entry hole; but the public was kept from closely observing what appears to be a sheared-off piece of wing from a much smaller jet than a Boeing 757. A group of military personnel and federal officials in suits tightly covered the piece of wreckage with a blue tarp and carried it away to a waiting truck. No reporters or independent aircraft experts have been permitted to examine any of the recovered aircraft parts and no subpoenas have been issued to hear public grand jury testimony from the "movers." The part here at the left--recovered after the Pentagon impact--is a "diffuser case," a component from the types of "dual chamber" turbojets represented by the Allison J33, J71, Pratt & Whitney J57 and JT8D. "It is not part of a Boeing 757 engine," said Schwarz, adding, we even inspected a 757 engine in a jet maintenance shop." Another component found at the Pentagon was a wheel hub--a type made by B.F.Goodrich's aerospace division. Here, Schwarz gets very specific: "They also made the wheels for the 757 but a simple proportional check of width versus diameter will easily show that the photo (left) is not a wheel hub from a 757, which has a much larger radius than width. This radius is about the same as the width of the wheel hub, and is another clue that the ' 757-crashed-into-the-Pentagon' story is a Bush lie," he said. "If one looks very closely at the diameter versus width of the tire that was found at the Pentagon," said Schwarz, "this is the type of tire used for aircraft carrier-based and general rear wheels of smaller military planes--not commercial airlines." [The now somewhat outdated Douglas A-3 Sky Warrior "Whale" served as an aircraft carrier attack plane, capable of supporting missile platforms.] Karl Schwarz is the CEO of a company which designs remote control/UAVs for the U.S. Army and had a $392 million dollar Defense Department order for 32 UAVs canceled "because they would see too much over in Iraq, and because we could put in a fleet of them for what our competition was paying for a couple Link [edit on 26/5/2005 by Sauron]

Originally posted by Sauron slowly but surly it will come out, we have a saying where I come from "poopie floats"

Your word was censored out so I hope you don't mind that I added the uncensored version to the quote. Excellent find. I think the poopie is starting to hit the fan as they say where I come from.. How soon before they will try to bury this one?

Originally posted by Sauron Remember these photos Curiously, a large piece of wreckage was found in the entry hole; but the public was kept from closely observing what appears to be a sheared-off piece of wing from a much smaller jet than a Boeing 757. A group of military personnel and federal officials in suits tightly covered the piece of wreckage with a blue tarp and carried it away to a waiting truck. No reporters or independent aircraft experts have been permitted to examine any of the recovered aircraft parts and no subpoenas have been issued to hear public grand jury testimony from the "movers."

You are something else, Sauron. That claim related to that photo was totally ripged to shreds earlier in this thread. Yet you keep bringing it up as though it is a brand new revelation. Did you honestly think that we would forget about this discussion back on page 38 of this thread?

The part here at the left--recovered after the Pentagon impact--is a "diffuser case," a component from the types of "dual chamber" turbojets represented by the Allison J33, J71, Pratt & Whitney J57 and JT8D. "It is not part of a Boeing 757 engine," said Schwarz, adding, we even inspected a 757 engine in a jet maintenance shop."

Again, more B.S. There are exploded drawings of the 757 engine that clearly show these parts. No, I’m not going to dig back through this thread to find them. If something is false, continually repeating it does not make it true.

Another component found at the Pentagon was a wheel hub--a type made by B.F.Goodrich's aerospace division. Here, Schwarz gets very specific: "They also made the wheels for the 757 but a simple proportional check of width versus diameter will easily show that the photo (left) is not a wheel hub from a 757, which has a much larger radius than width. This radius is about the same as the width of the wheel hub, and is another clue that the ' 757-crashed-into-the-Pentagon' story is a Bush lie," he said.

A 757, main landing gear

"If one looks very closely at the diameter versus width of the tire that was found at the Pentagon," said Schwarz, "this is the type of tire used for aircraft carrier-based and general rear wheels of smaller military planes--not commercial airlines." [The now somewhat outdated Douglas A-3 Sky Warrior "Whale" served as an aircraft carrier attack plane, capable of supporting missile platforms.]

Sorry, that is the nose gear. The wheel hub is smaller and slightly different. See this page: 757 main landing gear and nose gear photos This has all been brought up many, many times already. Why do you keep repeating stuff that is obviously wrong? [edit on 26-5-2005 by HowardRoark]

one word Howard you are WRONG, you and your tribe have proved nothing but the fact you believe the Bushit lies told to you. there are no 757 engine parts. I guess Karl Schwarz is lying, a man who's company made UAVs for the US. sorry I will take his word and information over anything that you dream up. LOL yea this guy is full of it, get over it Howard you and the Bushits are finished it's just a matter of time. Karl Schwarz is the CEO of a company which designs remote control/UAVs for the U.S. Army and had a $392 million dollar Defense Department order for 32 UAVs yea right this guy don't know crap [edit on 26/5/2005 by Sauron]

Oh, come on!!! Is this discussion for real?! There is one Boeing 757 engine on one photo of the ruined Pentagon wreckage. But some ppl just can't understand that it's the third, rear inbuilt engine designed to help takeoff and landing navigation! There was an ATSNN thread about this already. The Boeing gear wreckage only differs from the ones in use, that the balancing metalbits are missing due to the impact. It is clear that the Pentagon's reinforced steel-concrete walls enveloped the plane into that hole, but the right wing folded into the fuselage first, we can see the exact matching line scratching the wall. Actually, the plane first hit the Pentagon and was enveloped into the building, and after that the soft explosion of the fuel blasted the aluminium wreckage into tiny bits, that could burn very easily due to good airflow inside the building. What's so hard to understand about it?'

Pratt & Whitney engines are not part of a Boeing 757 and why have they not let any inspectors see the crashed material since 9/11 why have they not released and video footage from any of the hundreds of cameras that are inside and outside, Snip~ Interestingly, the Hughes division manufactures the AGMs; and the Raytheon division maintains the last few A-3 Sky Warriors in operation save 2-4 Air Force jets--while also manufacturing the Global Hawk UAV remote control systems Whoever did this had about a billion dollars to work with, according to my intelligence sources who have come forward," said Schwarz, adding "one crew came in to fit the jet for remote-UAV systems, another crew put in the fire control systems and another installed the new jet engines, another the AGMs, etc., and all at different times to spread out the information flow on who did what." Only the Raytheon executives and the Air Force would have known which team installed a particular system on the A-3 and who was involved in the operation," said Schwarz. Coincidentally, five key Raytheon executives died on 9-11: Stanley Hall--Director of Electronic warfare program management (American 77), Peter Gay--VP of Electronic Systems on special assignment at the El Segundo, CA division office where the Global Hawk UAV remote control system is made (American 11), Kenneth Waldie--Senior Quality Control Engineer for Electronic Systems (American 11), David Kovalcin--Senior Mechanical Engineer for Electronic Systems (American 11), and Herbert Homer--Corporate Executive working with the Department of Defense (United 175). Curiously, the five Raytheon executives chose three of the four doomed jets and all happened to fly on September 11. Have their family members been interviewed? Other co-workers? Defense Department officials? Raytheon's top people tied to the Global Hawk remote control UAV aircraft systems all died on 9/11 without a grand jury probing their memos, electronic messages, phone records, meeting calendars, visits or calls to Ft. Collins-Loveland airport or testimony related to other related matters. Link [edit on 26/5/2005 by Sauron]

I think it has not been proven that we see a P&W engine on that picture, however, it may be similar. I guess we need to come forward with that ATSNN discussion regarding this technical issue, or else it will simply be a guesswork. It is natural that the Gov't (or some individuals within it) want to benefit from the disaster, holding behind the moral rights of relatives and the community. Not just the Pentagon crash, but the whole 911 event is somehow intentionally fading, and slowly less and less informations are avilable (that were avilable in the past). For example, I'm aware of three different 1stplane impactvideo, and now we only see one (but the plane can hardly be seen due to the exhaust gases). Interesting.

Originally posted by Sauron Curiously, the five Raytheon executives chose three of the four doomed jets and all happened to fly on September 11. Have their family members been interviewed? Other co-workers? Defense Department officials? Raytheon's top people tied to the Global Hawk remote control UAV aircraft systems all died on 9/11 without a grand jury probing their memos, electronic messages, phone records, meeting calendars, visits or calls to Ft. Collins-Loveland airport or testimony related to other related matters.

These are not the only conincidences regarding Raytheon's ties to 9-11! You remember those infamous Saudi royals flown out of the country in a jiffy shortly after 9-11? Those were flown out from a Raytheon owned airfield and strangely enough, the tail N number of the aircraft used was that of a private single engine 2 seater airplane while the actual airplane was an airliner packed with Saudi royals and Bin Laden relatives.(Sounds to me like they were trying to hide something) Furthermore, Raytheon stood to double their military contracts to as high as 8 billiuons per year after the 9-11 events. It doesn't stop there, Raytheon was the first ever to fly an airliner without any pilots on board just weeks before 9-11. The links and aditional information about this here : Raytheon involved in 9/11 ??? Cheers, Pepe -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------