I now believe in the fluoride conspiracy.

reply to post by CrazyRaccoon


Recommended limit is 1ppm and if you do your howework those areas where water has a higher concentration of fluoride , more than 1ppm tend to be natural water sources and not the water from a water company.

However I just read that america EPA for fluoride is 4ppm .. Uk is 1ppm

About 200,000 Americans have drinking water with fluoride concentrations at or above the EPA's limit, and 1.4 million have water with levels between 2 and 3.9 ppm, including parts of Colorado, West Texas, New Mexico, Indiana and Illinois. No Californians have tap water with fluoride that approaches the amount the scientific panel found unsafe, because state regulations limit the concentration to 2 ppm.

About two-thirds of Americans, or 162 million people, drink from fluoridated water supplies, which contain a fluoride concentration of about 1 ppm, much less than the amount the panel found had adverse health effects.

Water companies in america use the ratio of 1ppm upto 2ppm of fluroide in the water. However through natural sources people are having fluoride in far greater quantities.

articles.latimes.com...

reply to post by minor007


Are you trying to say that the British people have it better? hah please don't make me laugh they have so much cameras and no guns that it's a joke

And DUDE what are you talking about? where do you get your information from?

America's highest fluoride content is 1.4ppm i'm pretty sure UK has the same amount...

Yeah the fluoride is there because they PUT IT THERE...sodium fluoride does not form naturally it has to be man-made...calcium fluoride is natural and occurs in nature.

4ppm yeah right.

reply to post by CrazyRaccoon

What are EPA's drinking water regulations for fluoride?
In 1974, Congress passed the Safe Drinking Water Act. This law requires EPA to determine the level of contaminants in drinking water at which no adverse health effects are likely to occur. These non-enforceable health goals, based solely on possible health risks and exposure over a lifetime with an adequate margin of safety, are called maximum contaminant level goals (MCLG). Contaminants are any physical, chemical, biological or radiological substances or matter in water.

The MCLG for fluoride is 4.0 mg/L or 4.0 ppm. EPA has set this level of protection based on the best available science to prevent potential health problems. EPA has set an enforceable regulation for fluoride, called a maximum contaminant level (MCL), at 4.0 mg/L or 4.0 ppm. MCLs are set as close to the health goals as possible, considering cost, benefits and the ability of public water systems to detect and remove contaminants using suitable treatment technologies. In this case, the MCL equals the MCLG, because analytical methods or treatment technology do not pose any limitation.

EPA has also set a secondary standard (SMCL) for fluoride at 2.0 mg/L or 2.0 ppm. Secondary standards are non-enforceable guidelines regulating contaminants that may cause cosmetic effects (such as skin or tooth discoloration) or aesthetic effects (such as taste, odor, or color) in drinking water. EPA recommends secondary standards to water systems but does not require systems to comply. However, states may choose to adopt them as enforceable standards. Tooth discoloration and/or pitting is caused by excess fluoride exposures during the formative period prior to eruption of the teeth in children. The secondary standard of 2.0 mg/L is intended as a guideline for an upper bound level in areas which have high levels of naturally occurring fluoride. The level of the SMCL was set based upon a balancing of the beneficial effects of protection from tooth decay and the undesirable effects of excessive exposures leading to discoloration.

source

As the previous link had suggested the amount of recommended Flouride is too high .

Originally posted by minor007

Originally posted by CrazyRaccoon
reply to post by minor007

 

It states that fluorine is toxic YOU said that it comes from sodium fluoride magically turning into a gas known as fluorine and it is safe and no danger is present

Fluorine is safe in small quantities and it is a vital element needed by the body. Also what I said was that when Sodium fluoride is mixed with water a chemical reaction takes place. The reaction frees the fluorine from the sodium and it bonds with the hydrogen from the water producing HF the same gas you breath in at the seaside or on the ocean.

=======

Now,.... every "intelligent" person that I know that knows chemistry would never be so dumb as to claim there is HF in water, as that can't happen. HF can only exist when water isn't around.

HF is extremely hygroscopic and will combine with even water vapor in the air in an instant. It is so hygroscopic that it forms a fog or clouds from conversion of water vapor to water aerosol. Coal fired plants release HF and these release goes toward actually affecting the weather by making clouds and rainfall. These acid releases also go toward soil pH problems, uptake of toxic metals in the food chain, and is connected to the animal illness problems similar to mad cow effects.

Which means if HF was formed, in an instant it would become hydrofluoric acid. It won't exist in a water pipe.

Hydrofluoric Acid BP is around 112 C.


So, congrats on making a fool out of yourself with invalid chemistry claims.

Originally posted by CrazyRaccoon
reply to post by minor007

 

Are you trying to say that the British people have it better? hah please don't make me laugh they have so much cameras and no guns that it's a joke

And DUDE what are you talking about? where do you get your information from?

America's highest fluoride content is 1.4ppm i'm pretty sure UK has the same amount...

Yeah the fluoride is there because they PUT IT THERE...sodium fluoride does not form naturally it has to be man-made...calcium fluoride is natural and occurs in nature.

4ppm yeah right.

edit on 14-1-2012 by CrazyRaccoon because: (no reason given)

edit on 14-1-2012 by CrazyRaccoon because: (no reason given)

Do keep in mind that only 10 percent of the Brits use fluoridation. Only what they call the Midlands area in Britain has the fluoride in water.

Not all the country is dumb enough to accept fluoride. Most would say that British don't like fluoridation either.

When you see London, the Queen's palaces and such using fluoride one might claim British are trusting fluoride won't poison them.

No intelligent person accepts fluoride as essential to humans, as newborns have the lowest levels of fluoride in the body because the Mother's body does well at removing it for the development of the fetus. Likewise, mother's milk is extremly low in fluoride because the Mother's body filters it out very well.

Fluoride isn't an essential or useful mineral for plants or humans and mother nature usually does a good job of driving in down deep in the soils to keep it out of the food chain. Plants grow very well without fluoride and so do humans.

It is pure industrial lapdog non-sense to tell anyone that fluoride is a nutrient.


Also consider that calcium fluoride occurs in nature, but it isn't soluble in water. So, it basically doesn't happen that much gets into the water supply.

Grab yourself a "Hawley's Condensed Chemical Distionary" and read about the properties and then the misleading Brit can't keep pulling the wool over your eyes.


Like the new Ron Paul signature line

Raccoon,

Here are some common sense things to keep in mind. Plain old table salt, NaCl, does the same thing in water that NaF does. They both form ionic solutions. When you toss table salt in water, you don't smell chlorine suddenly. You can even boil off the water from the table salt solution and get salt back.

Same thing happens with NaF and you can see this in the food processing operations that use fluoride in the public water supplies as the source. Food processing that boils off the water results in higher concentration of fluoride in the food. So things like soups, wet processed cereals, and such have higher fluoride content than the original food stuff and higher content than the water used because the processes boil off water and leave the fluoride in the food at higher concentration. This can be a real problem in baby foods preperations.

Refer back to the food and fluoride chart that you had and you can see that effect on Cereals and many other things, when you take the time to look at the food processing steps.

So, you should be able to see an abundance of lies steming from someone. imho 007 likes poisons for Americans.


www.infowars.com...

fluoridedangers.blogspot.com...

www.orgsites.com...

If anyone noticed, the Brits started this brick tea thing----they can't be intelligent guping down that much fluoride in tea every day:

www.fluoridealert.org...


www.sciencedaily.com...


This PFPC site is really good and has tons of reference materials on protecting the kids from being Poisoned with Fluoride. Check the Tea link on the sidebar sometime and see what the Brits think is good for them.

poisonfluoride.com...

This PFPC site is one of the best on the Internet and it was begun by Andeas Schuld, who was worry about his kids not thriving due to fluoride toxic effects. Andeas is German, so he can read all those older German documents where they found all the original dangers of fluoride emissions in the days of IG Farben. Andeas has extensive archives on fluoride toxic effects, even more than you see on the public pages. If you really want to do something they join up with all the anti-fluoride groups, learn the issues, and force the legislation bans on poisoning the people with fluoride in all its forms and pathways.



Just because the Brits are dumb enough to think fluoride is a beverage doesn't mean the rest of the world should even consider being that ignorant.

reply to post by MagnumOpus


Haha yeah you nailed it perfectly brother! and it's very sad that 007 actually thinks fluoride escapes water as soon as it enters the liquid

I personally think 007 is doing this non-sense very much on purpose. Good to see that you see around the false information.

Also, news on a fluoride drug and fetal development issues:

www.dailymail.co.uk...


This is another news item that tells the fluoride isn't good for humans. Prozac and most all the SSRI drugs use fluorine in their make up.

-----

Some other things to consider on the fluoride toxic effects are the issues of fluoride in the food chain from industrial and coal fired emissions. When the acid levels of the soils rise this can affect grazing animals like deer. This is the connections for why CJD happens in the wild.

A similar issue stemmed from CJD and Mad Cow issues due to refeeding Bone Meal to feeder lot animals like cows. Since bones concentrate fluoride in the bone mass, when the feeder lot industry refeed the ground up animals bones to the next generation it makes for huge levels of fluoride exposure in the animals in successive generations. So much so, that it makes them sick.

The means to correct that was ending the bone meal feeds and limiting the age of the animals to that short enough that the toxic concentrations don't set up the CJD Prion effects.

Gardeners have to be careful of the same effects because bone meal is offered to rose gardeners and such and this contaminates the ground with fluoride. So, one has to beware of not using Bone Meals in vegetable produce growing because of the bone meal issues of fluoride concentrations.

You also see the same issues from fluoride linked antibiotic feed to chickens and the phosphates with fluoride fed to chickens, as this lands in their bone mass. So, when processed chicken picks up bone scrapings the chicken dish gets extra fluoride into the human food chain.


Nature fully intended for fluorides to be sequestered from the human diet.

reply to post by MagnumOpus


thanks , we need more people in America who are informed as we are...then MAYBE America won't be in a bad shape right now

Originally posted by MagnumOpus

Originally posted by minor007

Originally posted by CrazyRaccoon
reply to post by minor007

 

It states that fluorine is toxic YOU said that it comes from sodium fluoride magically turning into a gas known as fluorine and it is safe and no danger is present

Fluorine is safe in small quantities and it is a vital element needed by the body. Also what I said was that when Sodium fluoride is mixed with water a chemical reaction takes place. The reaction frees the fluorine from the sodium and it bonds with the hydrogen from the water producing HF the same gas you breath in at the seaside or on the ocean.

=======

Now,.... every "intelligent" person that I know that knows chemistry would never be so dumb as to claim there is HF in water, as that can't happen. HF can only exist when water isn't around.

HF is extremely hygroscopic and will combine with even water vapor in the air in an instant. It is so hygroscopic that it forms a fog or clouds from conversion of water vapor to water aerosol. Coal fired plants release HF and these release goes toward actually affecting the weather by making clouds and rainfall. These acid releases also go toward soil pH problems, uptake of toxic metals in the food chain, and is connected to the animal illness problems similar to mad cow effects.

Which means if HF was formed, in an instant it would become hydrofluoric acid. It won't exist in a water pipe.

Hydrofluoric Acid BP is around 112 C.


So, congrats on making a fool out of yourself with invalid chemistry claims.

edit on 14-1-2012 by MagnumOpus because: added content

hmmm if the ph of the water is 7 or greater it cant become an acid....

reply to post by minor007


And i also bet that you didn't know that different places have different pH levels in the water RIGHT?

Originally posted by CrazyRaccoon
reply to post by minor007

 

And i also bet that you didn't know that different places have different pH levels in the water RIGHT?

if you are talking of water sources then yes each water resource would have its own ph value depending on the types of rocks and minerals the water passes through. However water companies set the ph at a set value and its never acidic at least in the uk anyway. always 7 or greater

reply to post by minor007


So you are just pointing this to the UK? even though i am discussing an issue in the U.S about fluoridation.

OF COURSE the UK is going to set the pH standards to their value...in America, arrowhead water is mountain spring water and most of the tap water is

reply to post by CrazyRaccoon


i still dont fully get this whole thing though, the human bosy needs fluoride in some form, so where are we supposed to get it from if sodium fluoride is so bad

Originally posted by connorromanow
reply to post by CrazyRaccoon

 

i still dont fully get this whole thing though, the human bosy needs fluoride in some form, so where are we supposed to get it from if sodium fluoride is so bad

=====

That just isn't true. The Human Body does fine with no fluoride. Case in point being newborns and their rapid cell division growth-----they can't stand much fluoride.

This body needs fluoride thing was started by industry to make people think fluoride was not so toxic and damaging to human, plant, and animal health. It was a case of the polluters casting out a false message to make the public believe this was a good thing and not a bad thing.

The same thing happens in many cases in nature, like Samon don't do well with the fluoride content of the oceans. So, they migrate into fresh water areas, lay their eggs, and the new samon grow up in fresh water with low fluoride content. This is the same sort of issue that research is finding for New Born Humans, very low fluoride levels impact their growth and long term health. Oceans run around 1 ppm fluoride and the Salmon don't do well with that. Fresh water in most areas is very low in fluoride, unless it is near volcanic problems or rift zone effects that drive the fluoride out of the Earth's Crust due to heating effects.

There is even Biblical Prophecy links to Fluoride as the story of Saddom and Gomorrah was one about an active Rift Zone effect that drove lots of fluoride into that regions water and food supplies. Even the issues of don't look back to this region or turn to stone effects can find an element of truth in the issues of the Pineal Gland turning to a calcified stone. And the Bones putting on more mass due to the fluoride uptake effects on bone mass. You can tour Soddom and Gomorrah's region now and find the city covered in Basalt from volcanic rift effects and that set the fluoride and toxic metal issues into extinction land for that population. The described the effect as turning to stone.

Then, if one further studies the region one finds the cure for lots of these fluoride poisoning effects lies up the valley to the Jordan River which has some of the highest levels of Boron in the water, which offsets the body retention of fluoride. The religious Essene Sect were into the healing effects of natural things and John The Baptist was into only Baptism in the Boron Loaded Jordan River that would tend to reverse some of the fluoride loading in the body. Drinking the water of these regions is even better toward reversing fluoride retention. The Northern Essene appeared to live in an area near the region of Mt. Carmel that had many beneficial effects from natural sources that added Boron to their water and diets, and that appears to have played a role in their higher level of intelligence and going against the Babylon types that corrupted the religion.

If one knows what to look for, Nature supplies all kinds of examples that fluoride is bad and some interesting ways to lessen or repair that damage. East African Rift zone problems are a big problem in Africa and areas like Ethiopia are very bad and the porrage that most eat down there is loaded with fluoride. The Natives teeth get frosty white from the enamel damage in many cases. Kenya has like problems, just not as bad. The pollution is so bad that most of the European Union bans importation of food products from these Rift Zone areas.

Originally posted by connorromanow
reply to post by CrazyRaccoon

 

i still dont fully get this whole thing though, the human bosy needs fluoride in some form, so where are we supposed to get it from if sodium fluoride is so bad

Well i don't know what a human bosy is... but Calcium fluoride is what we may benefit from not sodium fluoride.. and 007 is an example of a fluoride candidate

I've studied fluorides for decades and worked in an area that could kill off an entire state from fluoride emissions and seen the damage to the work force and the region.

Calcium Fluoride isn't good either, but it far less bioavailable in most cases so it doesn't pose much of a problem.

There are exceptions, the grape and wine industry love to use powdered calcium fluoride as an insecticide on grapes and a few other crops. They like it because it lingers on the grapes and doesn't tend to wash away with rainfall. But, it is deadly to bugs and other issues that damage grapes.

Due to the fact they use it as an insecticide it finds its way into the grape juice and wine making processes, and is why grapes, raisins, and wine tend to have had extremely high levels of fluoride content in the end products. This is only recently being pulled down by rules and legislation to force them to drop the levels of fluoride that is acceptable in these food and drinks linked to grapes.

In the Wine business, they also used fluoride as a fermentation stop, so it was used to poison the fermentation process for wine and between this and the calcium fluoride pesticide, that caused a huge fluoride toxic effect on persons consuming wines and especially the so called "Wine-O's" of years past.

It was this use of fluoride as a fermentation stop in the wine making process that set off the issues of using fluoride on teeth to kill the bacteria on teeth that generated acids that ate enamel of teeth. The fluoride toxic effects screw up the bacterial DNA at very low levels. Sodium Fluoride attached the fluorine to the enamel and was a long term source of poison for the bacterial growths that tended to like sugar on teeth and set up the tooth decay issues for countries that used lots of processed sugars in the food chain.

Even today, one has to be carefull in wine selections to make sure you are getting wine from a country with rules to bring down the toxic load of fluoride in the wine. That tends to be the principle area for problems with calcium fluoride.

Looks like a little ATS item turned up on the disinformation agent theme.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Rather interesting reading. Disinformation games are a large part of what got fluoridation started and the need to dull the mind of the public as a second benefit for polluters and corrupt politicians.

You'll find a ton of Disinformation Agents working the JFK cover up issues, and one in particular called the "Education Forum" based in Britain is particularly bad and follows the theme of Lord Bertrand Russell and started the huge Conspiracy Book writing on the JFK assassination. Lord Bertrand Russell made statements connected to fluoridation and to the JFK assassination cover up. He was also the person that got the Manhattan Project started via Einsteins note to FDR. Lord Russell is a prime example for deceit and treachery methods foisted on the world by the ruithless powers of money.

These days the whole disinformation process has moved into the Internet Blog and Discussion Forum areas to attempt to sway information or make information Chaos to cloud up important issues.

Fluoride issues have a huge number of industry paid hacks trying to cover up the health and environmental harm issues of fluoride releases.

The fluoride associated Freon problems came to affect the entire world, and only half truths have been told as to the extent of the problems and who is generally responsible.

reply to post by MagnumOpus


aaahh the ramblings of someone who wont concede the fact that there is no conspiracy with fluoride. So he pulls out straws and goes off on tangents that are neither here or there