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Government Motors Volt Costs Taxpayers $250,000 per Vehicle

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posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:18 PM
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So it costs 250k to produce a auto that sells for 40k and they want to control your healthcare even more and many other things.

When will people ever learn that is why the Government is so screwed up oh and they tend to blow up or catch on fire as well.




posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:20 PM
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reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


Apaprently Indigo and I are able to shoot down each and every claim here! GM is not a failure and as Indigo said that Fords stock plummeted 45% means nothing right? Might as well let them collapse and get sold off right?

Winning!



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:22 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


Apaprently Indigo and I are able to shoot down each and every claim here! GM is not a failure and as Indigo said that Fords stock plummeted 45% means nothing right? Might as well let them collapse and get sold off right?

Winning!



You often claim to shoot down peoples arguments..........and 90% of the time you havent.......

This case is no exception...........

I wish i had a nickel for every time you claimed this.......

Not just HIS argument but many other people on this thread who have provided information contradicting and destroying your claims.......



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:46 PM
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reply to post by Indigo5
 

Are you insane? Or, are you Dudley D in disguise?


The energy problem WILL be solved...either by us or China. china has the advantage right now in capability to get sh^% done without the idealogical politics....


Are you not aware that China is still Communist? The only permissible "ideological politics" are those of the State; dissident bloggers go to prison or disappear!

As for "the energy problem," how can the U.S. even compete, when its largest component, oil and gas, is hamstrung and crippled by the Obama administration?

No rational person believes we can wean ouselves from fossil fuels overnight or in 20 years, absent a miraculous breakthrough in fusion. If we're going to be independent, we have to maiximize efficiency and production of relatively clean alternatives to coal (which powers your EVs, by the way!).

Our domestic gas and oil reserves are sufficient, together with Mexican and Canadian imports, to eliminate reliance upon unstable and antagonisitc Middle East supplies.

Obama and environmentalists could not care less about the economic impact of misguided energy policies upon the middle class.

This is the person who promised that electricity proces would "necessarily skyrocket" under his administration, and whose DoE Secretary Chu promised that we would be paying "European prices" for gasoline ince he had his way!


Americans have the advantage of being the greatest innovators and inventors on the planet...we invented the automobile.


You'd better tell that to the Germans (Benz), the French (Cugnot), the British (Trevithick), the Swiss (de Rivaz), and the Scots (Anderson ); who beat Henry Ford by about 100 years!


But as long as we are hobbled by this kind of self interested propaganda campaigns and those partisans who embrace it, China will eat our lunch. Sad, but true.


China's house of cards is already collapsing around it.

The Communist Party has turned its back on ... progressive policies. [T]he current leader, is presiding over an era marked by ... the reversal of reform. There has been ... renationalization of the economy and a marked narrowing of opportunities for foreign business.
[T]he global boom of the last two decades ended in 2008 when markets around the world crashed. ... Now ... every nation wants to export more and, in an era of protectionism or of managed trade, China will not be able to export its way to prosperity ... . China is more dependent on international commerce than almost any other nation, so trade friction -- or even declining global demand -- will hurt it more than others. The country ... could be the biggest victim of the eurozone crisis.
China ... will soon have one of the worst [demographics]. The Chinese workforce will level off in about 2013, perhaps 2014, according to both Chinese and foreign demographers, but the effect is already being felt as wages rise, a trend that will eventually make the country's factories uncompetitive.
At the same time that China's economy no longer benefits from these three favorable conditions, it must recover from the dislocations -- asset bubbles and inflation -- caused by Beijing's excessive pump priming in 2008 and 2009, the biggest economic stimulus program in world history (including $1 trillion-plus in 2009 alone). Since late September, economic indicators -- electricity consumption, industrial orders, export growth, car sales, property prices, you name it -- are pointing toward either a flatlining or contracting economy. Money started to leave the country in October, and Beijing's foreign reserves have been shrinking since September.

The Coming Collapse of China: 2012 Edition

Maybe, while your head was in the sand, you missed the reports leaking out of China of mass protests in numerous cities and provinces, or the increased crack-downs upon dissidents and opponents of the Communist regime.

But, then again, given your and others' socialist inclinations, maybe this is what you want for the U.S., as well.

Back on-topic, even GM sees that its production in Brazil, China and Russia (the "BRIC" countries) are vital to its future.

The potential for Chevrolet’s continued growth is demonstrated in the emerging markets of Brazil, Russia and China. Chevrolet’s combined sales strength in the “BRIC” countries, including India, is unmatched.

media.gm.com...

deny ignorance

jw





edit on 2-1-2012 by jdub297 because: removed "Dumbass"



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 03:51 PM
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reply to post by jdub297
 





Are you not aware that China is still Communist? The only permissible "ideological politics" are those of the State; dissident bloggers go to prison or disappear!


I had to laugh at his comment considering all China does is hack and steal technology



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:29 PM
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reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


This is a glimpse of another scenario that would begin shortly thereafter the auto industry collapsed, regulation would be laxed in a sad attempt to "stimulate" the economy and that would've caused riots and forced the initiation of martial law.

We cannot just sit idly by and watch our nation burn before our eyes hence why GM was given money because of how intricate and vital it is to the national economical infrastructure and apparatus it tilts in any direction the rest of the nation will tilt in that direction as they are as vital as banking, shipping, ground transport, water transport, rail, petrolchems (whose influence and reach is being drastically curtailed), Geological Generation (solar, hydra, wind, other) automotive! GM is America, America is GM! Hence why they got The US Secret Service contract for "The Beast"! Motorcade! Only American by law!



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:44 PM
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Originally posted by jdub297
reply to post by Indigo5
 

Are you insane? Or, are you Dudley D in disguise?



At first I wondered who is "Dudley D"? Then I realized I didn't care and stopped reading.

You OP has been shown to be propaganda funded directly by Exxon Mobile and the Koch brothers and it is plain to anyone with a 5th grade education in math that the math is false.

Carry on with the thread though. It capitalizes on folks willingness to abandon actual thought, even basic math skills, as long as they can rant about how Obama is a "Socialist"....and in that regard I imagine it will sadly have a loyal following.

Peace out.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 04:49 PM
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reply to post by jdub297
 


Hey, hey! Don´t joke!
You can´t compare a mitical Traban to this veicle that within 5 years won´t be seen in any street of the world!
Trabants are getting few and few.. but after 30 years are still there!
Can you do that with another car?

Trabi for president (anyhow will be better than Obama, Monti Python, Merdel and Szarkozi!)



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
It just really makes you so damn mad that GM is still around. It makes your blood boil that Americans still have jobs in America don't it?


I know you have some comprehension issues so I will ask you again. Do you know the difference between chapter 7 liquidation and chapter 11 debt restructuring. Your hystronic logical fallacy implies that General Motors would have applied for the former, this is not the case. They needed the latter as the debt has now be shifted (unconsitutionally) to the United States taxpayers.


You hate the fact that GM is a resounding success again! You hate the fact that America is now allowed to compete again!


General Motors is far from a resounding success. They are getting by on the backs of United States taxpayers by the wrongful misuse of our tax dollars. The bankruptcy courts are in place for just this reason. It really is only a matter of time before the unresolved issues at General Motors force it to once again consider debt restructuring or sticking their greedy hands out to the United States taxpayers again.




edit on 2-1-2012 by AugustusMasonicus because: networkdude has no beer.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:07 PM
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reply to post by Indigo5
 


He thinks you're me or I'm you, I don't know. Alot of uneedless time wasting if you ask me. Carry on!



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by Indigo5
 


He thinks you're me or I'm you, I don't know. Alot of uneedless time wasting if you ask me. Carry on!


What is uneedless?

Considering this sort of things happens quite a bit on ATS, I think its a fair assessment to consider all things could be possibilities..........



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:13 PM
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reply to post by AugustusMasonicus
 


Do you even know how much it costs to run a car company and do you really think that the total TARP money went solely to R & D on the Volt? GM put up more then half. It was mainly a payroll underflow risk assessment.

Let us not also forget about it's multi billion dollar licensing revenue deal for licensing it's products for small scale replication. That in itself would've flung like 10,000 licenses spanning over a hundred years and more. Like 20 car companies and like 8.000 individual car badges.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:18 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
Do you even know how much it costs to run a car company and do you really think that the total TARP money went solely to R & D on the Volt? GM put up more then half. It was mainly a payroll underflow risk assessment.


Once again, because I know you do not fully read posts (or worse yet, ignore the facts contained within them), they should not have gotten ANY money from United States taxpayers. They should have entered chapter 11 debt restructuring and not touched a penny of anyone else's money. Taxpayers should not be forced via fiat to fund government picked winners and loosers.


Let us not also forget about it's multi billion dollar licensing revenue deal for licensing it's products for small scale replication. That in itself would've flung like 10,000 licenses spanning over a hundred years and more. Like 20 car companies and like 8.000 individual car badges.


Who cares? What does this have to do with stealing taxpayer's money? Why should I, or anyone else, be forced to become part-owner of a crap car company? Government should not be invloved in giving money to any private sector industry.

Read my post several times prior to replying so I do not have to repeat myself 50 more times.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:33 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 


Apaprently Indigo and I are able to shoot down each and every claim here! GM is not a failure and as Indigo said that Fords stock plummeted 45% means nothing right? Might as well let them collapse and get sold off right?
Winning!


In your dreams.

Let's take a look at Ford (F) from the time that it and GM were trading in the $2.50 range;
right before all of GM's shareholders($0.00/share), creditors and bondholders ($0.17/Dollar) (preferred creditors under the Constitution and 250 years of Bankruptcy law) were thrown to the dogs in favor of the UAW.

quote.morningstar.com...
From $2.50 to $10.00, Ford is about 400% UP since GM's value went to $0.00! At $18.00, it was over 700% UP!
What a foolish comparison!

Your misguided efforts have "shot down" only your own credibility; and, now you've drug Indigo inbto your morass of illogic and falsehoods.

Whether your "projections" are based upon a 10-year, or a 20-year window, they are pure fantasy. The Volt will drop from the market like the junk its parent's stock is as soon as the government tales its thumb off the scale.

Too bad for the two of you. You probably once had something worthwhile to offer.

Not anymore.

deny ignorance.

jw
edit on 2-1-2012 by jdub297 because: cite



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:40 PM
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Originally posted by nuspy
reply to post by jdub297
 


Hey, hey! Don´t joke!
You can´t compare a mitical Traban to this veicle that within 5 years won´t be seen in any street of the world!
Trabants are getting few and few.. but after 30 years are still there!
Can you do that with another car?

Trabi for president (anyhow will be better than Obama, Monti Python, Merdel and Szarkozi!)


I saw a TV special about an Indiana man who has a Trabant collection! Over 40 mpg, and all of them running even to this day!

I apologizre for the unwarranted quality comparison. The similarity to a government-supported, forced-down-your-throat at any cost Volt is undeniable, though.

Consumers wouyld never have bought this without government distortion of the market, and no profit-driven organization would've built one.

jw



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 05:47 PM
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Originally posted by Indigo5

Originally posted by jdub297
reply to post by Indigo5
 

Are you insane? Or, are you Dudley D in disguise?


You OP has been shown to be propaganda funded directly by Exxon Mobile and the Koch brothers and it is plain to anyone with a 5th grade education in math that the math is false.

Carry on with the thread though. It capitalizes on folks willingness to abandon actual thought, even basic math skills, as long as they can rant about how Obama is a "Socialist"....and in that regard I imagine it will sadly have a loyal following.

Peace out.


Funny how GM itself has not even attempted to challenge what its "Government Affairs" director and chief spokesman have admitted is "basic math."

You can manufacture all the phony projections and quote from all the insulted "greenies" who can't face the truth.

Fact is, GM was offered MULTIPLE opportunities to contest the numbers before the study AND the article went to press.
They. Said. NOTHING!

I would guess that GM knows better than any fanatical environmentalist or any socialist does what the true figures are, including bogus "projections."

Deny ignorance

jw
edit on 2-1-2012 by jdub297 because: u



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 07:51 PM
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reply to post by jdub297
 


Look at the rise and spike, all lead by anticipation of the rollout of The Volt and after the media started approving it Big Oil stepped in and threw in a temper tantrum and started lobbying to get it killed. Remember, it was when the slide down started is when Rush Limbaugh started to talk yap on it and got slammed!

GM is undergoing a resurgence right now and is too early to just simply write them off!



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 08:06 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by jdub297
 


Look at the rise and spike, all lead by anticipation of the rollout of The Volt and after the media started approving it Big Oil stepped in and threw in a temper tantrum and started lobbying to get it killed.


The chart in the quote you are responding to is for Ford.

General Motors had its Initial Public Offering in November of 2010, it stock went up a few dollars a share to its high after the Volt came out, not before, and have gone steadily down since then.


GM is undergoing a resurgence right now and is too early to just simply write them off!


What resurgence.? Their stock is rated 'D' which is a 'sell' and investor sentiment is predicted to be down for the next year. source




edit on 2-1-2012 by AugustusMasonicus because: networkdude has no beer.



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 08:35 PM
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reply to post by AugustusMasonicus
 


I don't trust ratings agencies on stocks as they are under the sole and exclusive thumb of The SCUM as they control who gets what rating. Since GM refuses to bow to them they are amongst the latest "victims" to be downgraded!



posted on Jan, 2 2012 @ 08:52 PM
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Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
I don't trust ratings agencies on stocks as they are under the sole and exclusive thumb of The SCUM as they control who gets what rating. Since GM refuses to bow to them they are amongst the latest "victims" to be downgraded!


Thestreet.com is not a ratings agency, it is website used by stock traders to gauge sentiment and gather information via historical charts and data. Try actually viewing the links I provide instead of making silly pronoucements about your catchphrase boogieman.




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