Hey ATSers, OWSers and other in need of work!!!! (Seriously)

reply to post by anon72


Great! Thanks- a job where I can DESTROY the environment with BiG OiL! Hell, I'll be working for BIG OIL. I'd rather be a FOOTBAL COACH at PENN STATE,

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Occupy never seeks the media out, they created their own to get their story out sans bias. You will not find many of these stories in the MSM or the right-wing blogs. It takes work to find them because there is a very deliberate slant against the movement. Even the more "gentle" liberal media toes the line because liberal politicians can't figure out how to deal with Occupy either, they want to co-opt but can't because the President is being protested too lol. So, in other words, it still doesn't matter whether the base is broader or not, the people you think should know this, will not do the work needed to read about it. Sounds a bit familiar.

reply to post by REDCZAR


Do you drive a car?
Do you use electricity?
Do you own a computer?
Do you own a TV?
Then you are still supporting big oil. Oil is used for plastics, paint, adhesives and so much more. Just because you "think" by not getting a job with them somehow makes you an environmentally responsible, it is just an illusion. Unless you are living a self sufficient life, growing your own food, and not buying manufactured products, then you are still supporting big oil. By owning these products, and then blasting big oil, you are in effect a hypocrit.

Originally posted by haarvik
reply to post by REDCZAR

 

Do you drive a car?
Do you use electricity?
Do you own a computer?
Do you own a TV?
Then you are still supporting big oil. Oil is used for plastics, paint, adhesives and so much more. Just because you "think" by not getting a job with them somehow makes you an environmentally responsible, it is just an illusion. Unless you are living a self sufficient life, growing your own food, and not buying manufactured products, then you are still supporting big oil. By owning these products, and then blasting big oil, you are in effect a hypocrit.

Well I don't really have a CHOICE do I ? Big Oil is the ONLY game in town. If were going to really WHORE myself out, I'd join the MILITARY and go off and slaughter innocent brown people somewhere. Just so I can have money for college- to get a useless degree in say journalism and hope to someday be in a position to sniff Diane Sawyers seat. Cause they only put IVY LEAGUE silver spoon fed red diaper babies on the TV news.

i remember on the MTV show 'Fraggle Rock'

there were the little people that were always busy with the infrastructure in that world...

they were known as the 'Do'sers (the working class Do-ers of society)

that $100k wage is big $ for the non-elites in this present social-economic class structure
but is chicken feed in comparison to the top level Execs & Elites walking away with Millions
and long term golden parachute packages in health, residual bonuses over the years and
separation bonuses in the 10s if not 100s of Million$

iow a life time of $100k annual salaries plunked down in a year...after year...after year.........




that fracking career in PA is but a carrot-on-a-stick...meant to delude the huddled masses into
dreaming in the vein of 'Somewhere Over The Rainbow'...

those opportunities will be swept away just as the Gulf offshore drilling was made nest to extinct
just as the Alaskan North Slope fields are verbotten



thanks anyhow, for your spirit of concern

reply to post by REDCZAR


No choice?

Conservation is the choice. Limit your use of these things. I ride a motorcycle instead of a car. 40+ mpg. Only by local, in season goods. No shipping, supports your community, avoids the big corps, etc. Spend a year cutting your home electricity use in half, and then convert to solar. Stop using plasticware, or buying single serve bottles. Start using glassware and real plates and silverware. Start buying in bulk. No more bottled water, and bottled soft drinks. Get a good filter and drink out of a glass, and then wash and reuse it. No styrofoam for anything. No chinese dollar store disposable items. Eliminate junk, and waste.

We all have choices. We've been misled.

I'm not perfect at it yet, but I'm getting better and better at avoiding the things that contribute to the problem and finding the things that eliminate the problems. If we all work at it, then we take big corps, and big oil out of the picture.

OH for the love of all that is good...OWS seriously can't keep it's story straight.

I swear OWS was crying about "jobs"...bring back our jobs, we need jobs, they have taken all our jobs, we can't survive because there are no jobs.

And now someone shows that there ARE jobs out there, if you are willing to do some work, maybe you have to move, but there IS work.

And now all of a sudden, "Oh no, OWS was never about jobs".


It's over anyway...if this thread wasn't here...OWS wouldn't even be being talked about on ATS anymore. It has died, and it has failed. I keep hearing "just wait until spring"...oh yeah...really dedicated "revolution" you have going on there..."WE WILL FIGHT FOR OUR FREEDOM...when it's sunny and a bit more mild outside."

No...they aren't lazy at all


ETA: I had to break my promise that I was done talking about OWS to post this...but when I see such distortion of message...it just pisses me off. OWS may not think they are useful idiots (which I think they are)...but do they honestly think the rest of the entire world are complete idiots that can't remember two months ago???

reply to post by REDCZAR


You are correct. But making statements like that about not working for big oil doesn't equate to anything realistic.
It's kind of like the people in the 90's who were protesting fur coats. They protested and picketed companies for killing farm raised animals, yet were pro choice. So it was ok to kill a fetus, but not a farm raised animal? Now that was the height of hypocracy. It is no different than what is happening with big oil. They will exist as long as we buy the products they produce. If you want it cheaper, then you have to drill more, simple. Unless you want $20 a gallon gas, then you better let them drill where the oil is located.

When oil becomes scarce, and it will, you will see hyperinflation kick in so fast it will make your head spin. Everything you buy or do is influenced by it. You will see a loaf of bread going to $10, milk at $15 and so on. It will cost more to ship the product than it will to make it. So go ahead and villainize it but it will not change.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by hadriana

 

Which brings me to a weird thing I've been wrestling with lately- Just what IS work?

Well, my opinions haven't been too popular so far, but if you ask me, what you are doing is more productive and more like "work" than what the adjunct professor likely does.

I know a lot of adjunct professors (including my brother, and he would agree), and basically that is the same as being unemployed. You get a lot of clout and a couple of thousand dollars salary per semester to go teach some students an entry level course out of text book that they could have read themselves.

You just can't seem to stop making inaccurate claims. Seriously, do not ever claim that an adjunct is basically the same as being unemployed.

My wife is an adjunct professor of English. She routinely teaches 4-6 composition courses and spends hours grading and helping students (who can't seem to read a syllabus...go figure). I think she (and anybody else that does what she does) would probably punch your lights out for the crap you are spewing.

reply to post by yadda333




So she isn't a adjunct. She is actually taking 4-6 adjunct positions. At say $2500 per course, she is pulling in $10,000 plus per semester, which puts her salary at least at $30k. So, yes, she is working a full-time job.

Her condition is rare.

Most of the adjuncts I know teach 1 or 2 classes. I know A LOT of adjunct professors. Just about everybody I know teaches at least 1 class. I happen to know one lady that makes $100k per year as an adjunct. She flies out of state to teach her course at a college. I can't imagine the logic behind some college flying in a professor to teach one class? But she does, and she makes great money doing it.

I still say gardening, and keeping up a home, and living off things you can produce is far more "work" than being an adjunct professor. Maybe for your wife it is a lot of work, because she has taken on a lot of courses. In reality, your wife should have a salaried position, that is far too much work for an adjunct.

reply to post by yadda333


As far as I am concerned, college now days is worthless, and overpriced. It is more important for a football coach to make $26M a year than educating students.

My oldest is a junior in HS. We are now starting the process of looking at schools. It is amazing that a four year degree, at a state school, would be $160K! I would expect that for an Ivy league school! It is friggin ridiculous! My wife graduated in 1987, and it cost her $5k a year at a private school! This is nothing more than a scam. The colleges have proliferated the value of a degree so now businesses think they have to hire people with one or they are getting sub par employees. It's no wonder some of the OWS protesters are screaming about student loans. For christs sake, it would take them 30 years to pay that off!

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by yadda333

 

So she isn't a adjunct. She is actually taking 4-6 adjunct positions. At say $2500 per course, she is pulling in $10,000 plus per semester, which puts her salary at least at $30k. So, yes, she is working a full-time job.

Her condition is rare.

I still say gardening, and keeping up a home, and living off things you can produce is far more "work" than being an adjunct professor.

An adjunct is a non-tenured track lecturer. The benefit to the university is that they do not have to pay a salary, medical, etc. So yes, she is an adjunct.

Again, you are using a small number of cases and applying them across the board. You should not generalize like that.
1. That's not how much my wife makes per course or per year.
2. You are not qualified to determine how much "work" goes into being an adjunct professor.

reply to post by yadda333


I am definitely qualified to determine how much work goes into being an adjunct. I've done it, my brother does it regularly, my best friend does it, and also works as a student advisor full-time, the guy that rented our upstairs the last 2 years does it. One of my drinking buddies is a tenured professor and researcher. A couple of people that work for me also teach courses once or twice per week. I am sometimes asked to be a guest speaker in certain courses. I'm pretty intimately connected with the University scene here. I could put up even more details of positions my friends hold in the University from top to bottom, but it would just sound like bragging.

I used $2500 as a very general example, but I also said I knew a woman making $100k. I realize there is a vast range. BUT, the vast majority of folks are bringing in $1500 to $2800 per semester per class for community college and/or public University in the two states I am familiar with.

I don't know how much your wife makes, or how much she works, but I know for certain that there are a large number of adjunct professors bringing in a minimal fee to do minimal work. It is extremely common at all levels. If your wife does what you say she does, then she is surely aware of the "norm," and for you to deny it is just being confrontational for no reason.

I also have to say, this thread has been extremely entertaining. Things I would normally say to my friends, that fit these stereotypes and are in these situations, and are common conversational material, are strking some serious sensitive chords here in this thread. I love sensitive people! This has been very enlightening and entertaining for me. I hope you guys aren't this thin-skinned in real life.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
[

I do happen to despise laziness. It really irks me. I hate the extensions of unemployment benefits, and it looks like they are about to get extended yet again.

That is the type of thing I hate. I do not believe there are no jobs that pay better than unemployment. I believe people are milking it, and if the government cut off the benefits, all of a sudden they would find ways to survive. I'm fine with 13 weeks, but 99 weeks is outrageous.

You think that everyone on unemployment for an extended period of time is lazy?

How narrow minded. How far can you see from in front of your face?

reply to post by getreadyalready


Teaching several classes for minimal pay is the "norm" where we work.

You have have struck a nerve because you seem to have extremely strong opinions and you like to generalize a lot. I think this is a bad combination and there seems to be a lot of it going around.

If more people would just stop, realize that they don't know everything, and try to see things from multiple perspectives then maybe this world could become a better place to live.

reply to post by illuminatislave

You think that everyone on unemployment for an extended period of time is lazy?

Yes. Absolutely.

There is no excuse for being on unemployment for more than a month or two. None whatsoever, I don't know any more assertive language I can use. There are jobs available for people that want to work. It may not be the job they want, it may not be the pay they need, it may not be where they want it to be, but there are jobs.

If the unemployment benefits went away, an awful lot of these people that "can't find" jobs, would suddenly and miraculously find something to help them survive.

reply to post by yadda333


Why is generalizing a bad thing, if it is identified as generalizing? If I tried to say everything was an absolute with no exceptions, then that would be a problem, but my generalizations are generally accurate.

Now, in my post just before this one, I spoke in an absolute. I tried to make it as clear as possible. People that are receiving unemployment benefits for more than a month or two are absolutely lazy. Maybe they don't realize it, and maybe they don't intend to be, but the fact is, they are. WIth more effort, they could find another way instead of sucking up unemployment checks.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


Ridiculous. Show me where in this thread or on ATS anywhere where a pro-occupy person has said "Occupy is only about a jobs" or for that matter has said "it was never about jobs". You contradict yourself constantly in your arguments against Occupy.

How many times have you said there is no clear message? As soon as you think you have a point to argue suddenly you claim the message is one specific thing. I'm sorry that it is so difficult to comprehend a message that won't fit in a soundbite.

You sticking your fingers in your ears and blindfolding yourself does not mean Occupy is over, it only just started.

..."WE WILL FIGHT FOR OUR FREEDOM...when it's sunny and a bit more mild outside."

They didn't leave by choice and actions will continue over the winter.

reply to post by Kali74


Maybe you should re-read my post and quote me where I said that is OWS's ONLY message.

It was part of their message...1 of a million that they had, but one that was screamed about the loudest.

Here is the beloved 99% declaration

sites.google.com...

9. Jobs for All Americans. Passage of a comprehensive job and job-training act like the American Jobs Act to employ our citizens in jobs that are available with specialized training. The American People must be put to work now by repairing America's crumbling infrastructure and building other needed public works projects. In conjunction with a new jobs act, reinstitution of the Works Progress Administration, Civilian Conservation Corps and similar emergency governmental agencies tasked with creating new projects to provide jobs to the 46 million People living in poverty, the 9% unemployed and 16.2% who are underemployed.

OWS WAS about jobs...don't give me this crap that it wasn't. So it's time for the group of people that were crying about jobs to man up, go get a job, and stfu. Yes, you may have to move *GASP*...yes...you may have to actually WORK to get a job. And look, these jobs pay great...so don't cry about the jobs available not being able to provide a livable wage. They aren't going to be able to sip on their Starbucks and blog on the iPads while doing this job...it is hard work, long hours, and a dirty job...but it's a JOB.

So what is "occupy" going to do? Are they going to admit that YES, there are some good jobs out there...or are they just going to keep crying about everything and not doing anything about it?

Or OWS can just continue to do what they've done...shift whenever they are made to look stupid..."hey look guys...now we are being oppressed by the evil police because they are enforcing LAWS". Let's now protest the right to break laws and set up tent cities. Because that is all OWS has become...a protest for the right to "occupy".

Occupy is dead...it has lost momentum big time...stragglers will hold on...but it's dead. BTW...did you see the stock market today???


I think I will go back to my position on not talking about OWS...you can't have a debate where facts, logic, and basic comprehension is absent...which is exactly the reason I stopped in the first place.

reply to post by getreadyalready

Things I would normally say to my friends, that fit these stereotypes and are in these situations, and are common conversational material, are strking some serious sensitive chords here in this thread.

We aren't your friends and we don't know you or your manner. We are not sitting around your living room over drinks and having good times. We're on a discussion forum discussing a matter that some of us actually participate in or throw in as much support as possible, when you throw labels around they are sticking to us whether you mean for them to or not. And now you want to label us as sensitive because we called you on it?

I find it ironic that you support something that you are too lazy to find anything out about then turn around and label the people doing the thing you support, lazy.