Compelling and Convincing Evidence that Life was Created! What Say You?

reply to post by futuretense


Very good post!

To the extreme creationists:

One cannot compare the blind faith that creationists put into those stories with thousands of years of observation, philosophy and study. All the former requires is for one to put all their faith in a story they were told not to question, whilst the latter requires one to engage in and prove theories/ideas.

How is evolution inconceivable? If all design requires a designer, then who designed God? Who designed whoever designed God? etc.

"well even scientists say they cant prove the big bang happened":
a) no one said they could
b) scientists have differing views on the origins of the universe - the big bang is not the only conceivable possibility
c) creationists can't prove their story happened but still refuse to question it.

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by Confusion42

 

No , under my logic ; it proves there is a God because you have a Universe you are living in. lol you missed the logic. God is beyond our understanding and your understanding which is clearly stated in the Bible which i believe to be his word.

edit on 04/30/2011 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)

You invoked Newton's Law, 'For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. '

Universe is created. ("equal reaction")

Created Universe needs creator ("opposite reaction" or vice versa)

Continuing your logic,

The Creator is created ("equal reaction")

Created "Creator" needs a a Creator as well ("opposite reaction" or vice versa)

and so on ad nauseum

I do give you some credit though for accepting the possibility that the Universe is infinite.

reply to post by edmc^2


If Adam and Eve were white (yeah right) and there is no evolution where do people of color come from?

Originally posted by arollingstone
reply to post by futuretense

 

Very good post!

To the extreme creationists:

One cannot compare the blind faith that creationists put into those stories with thousands of years of observation, philosophy and study. All the former requires is for one to put all their faith in a story they were told not to question, whilst the latter requires one to engage in and prove theories/ideas.

How is evolution inconceivable? If all design requires a designer, then who designed God? Who designed whoever designed God? etc.

"well even scientists say they cant prove the big bang happened":
a) no one said they could
b) scientists have differing views on the origins of the universe - the big bang is not the only conceivable possibility
c) creationists can't prove their story happened but still refuse to question it.

"How is evolution inconceivable? If all design requires a designer, then who designed God? Who designed whoever designed God? etc."

Who or what supplyed the stuff for the big bang how did it get here where did it come from?

Originally posted by kman420
Oh just thaught id throw this in too;

There is more evidence that aliens created us than "God"

Heck there is just as much evidence that the flying spaghetti monster created us, because if our own history books are as biased as the umpteen bibles there are than who can logically beleive any of them.

Plus take into account christianity and judaism are earily similar to Sumarian, Hindu and Egyptian religion, Thousands of years earlier, its just been the same stuff slightly changed over and over by whichever ruler is in power.

Anyways, aliens are real, and they created us in their image. And thats allot easier to say than 44 minutes of mumbo jumbo.

I agree mostly

Sadly, religion hampers efforts to find out these things... I wonder sometimes if the religious leaders ever have contact with aliens ? Maybe they work for them?

reply to post by futuretense


Pretty disingenuous...

Einstein talked about and referred to God often.

Originally posted by milkyway12
There is proof that God exist through Newton's Law.

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.

That means ..... it is absolutley impossible for everything you see to be around you to exist without a creator ..... or the universe has simply been around forever and ever and ever and ever ... and forever ...

Which is impossible ........................................

O wait ...

O wait ... Ha, good one!

The forever God I think is the best one, because in that case, he's already present, intimately present, right now.

reply to post by guitarplayer

"How is evolution inconceivable? If all design requires a designer, then who designed God? Who designed whoever designed God? etc."

Who or what supplyed the stuff for the big bang how did it get here where did it come from?

As I mentioned in my post, there are many different ways in which the universe could have begun. Although I grasp a basic comprehension of some of these theories (big bang, string theory, etc) I'm not qualified to explain them. I believe some of them have already been explained on this thread. Read the post I had replied to if you'd like.

I'm not specifically arguing against the possible existence of some sort of God - but against the whole creation 'world in x days', Adam and Eve etc. myth and the attitude displayed by some creationists on this thread.

reply to post by arollingstone


The Adam and Eve thing huh? Did you know that all people groups can be genticly traced back to 6 or 7 women all from the same clan. here read this book
The Seven Daughters of Eve: The Science That Reveals Our Genetic Ancestry

I have just watched a 45 minute video full of propaganda and misleading information so forgive me if I haven't read the entire comments also, I am aware these points may have already been brought up but want to put in my opinion.

The video keeps referring to the pertinent fact; that we are discovering new things every day which helps our understanding therefore we are not in possession of all the facts and therefore unable to give a definitive answer. We are however gaining new information which may lead us to an answer and just because current understanding does not allow us to see a neat mechanism that doesn't require a creator it in no way means there is not one. Answer this one if you know it was a creator: If we are complex we must agree that we are made by something as complex or more so, how then did this being originate? To simply state it always has is sidestepping the question and if you don't have the answer then surely you are on the same shaky ground upon which you place evolution. How can you denounce science for not having all the answers if you do not have them either?

The use of probability is further ineptitude and vastly misleading, the narrator states he does not have all the information on cells constantly. This means he cannot possibly calculate the variables and give probabilities, as an example consider this scenario; I throw a ball with all the force my arms can muster and it travels x distance, I throw it again with all the force I can muster. What is the probability is travels a distance equal to 3x? You would say the probability is very low maybe even operationally impossible, however you are missing information... On the second throw I had use of a tool which extended my arm length and thus made my throw more effective making it possible and maybe even probable. How can you prove we won't discover information which makes his probabilities irrelevant? You cannot and if his probabilities are irrelevant then so are his arguments.

For example to support my above claim, research has been made into naturally occurring cracks in ice within the polar ice caps, these cracks are a few atoms wide. Having injected proteins into these cracks we have seen RNA sequences form. Admittedly the proteins were already formed and put into the cracks, however this process brings the probability crashing down, making it far more likely than stated in the video. So we can already demonstrate that the math shown is wrong, how far wrong it is I couldn't say because we still don't have enough information about what is actually happening.

Considering the video was so into it's semantics and defining words, let's have a look at the word "theory". For something to be considered a theory it must be able to make predictions about behaviour within the system, let's test belief in god by this... What predictions can we make about life if we were created? How can these be tested? Did you come up with predictions? if not can you call belief in a creator a theory? If it's not a theory then you can't use science to prove or disprove it yet the video claims to do just that.

Just because you as an individual cannot conceive a mechanism for how something happened in a particular way does not make it impossible for years fire was considered a mystery and many wonderful theories were made including the supernatural. I think most of us accept that fire is not supernatural because we now have the information to show what it is and how exactly it is made. There is a very long history of science overturning supernatural explanations and you cannot propose that it will not happen again, you can even go and calculate the probabilities for yourself and you will find it is operationally impossible for a supernatural argument to be correct considering our current information on previous occurrences. Anyone who has ever studied statistics know that any set of data can be used to "prove" any number of contradictory points. QED

Hopefully one day you cretins will comprehend that while God does not exist, god is most certainly a possibility.

The truth is the truth.

reply to post by Kryties


HEY jersey shore Einstein (I know its some dude ive seen on the history channel)
Anyway, so what if he believes in some book a thousands of yrs ago, you believe in web articles , videos , books whatever is spoon fed to you by other people who claim to have specialized information you are not acquainted to.
He believes in that book from yrs ago you believe in your books.
~what do you know~

Just because I have bad spelling and grammar
does not mean I can not make scientific brake thoughts.
some of you can do nothing But ridicule.

I have been thinking about how life started
and how it came so far and did all that it has.
I now know. and most of you will find it hard to believe.

I dont wont to just tell what I have found.
and have some scientist take all the credit.

So how can I let the world know what I have discovered?
and Not lose all the credit. I am not after money.
just to have people know I came up with the idea first.

I have not told any one for twenty years.
and as the years go by.
science gives more evidence to prove what I know.

If I wright it up on facebook.
they will take copyrights?
I bet ATS would do that to.
and they just need to delete my post.
and then they can post it first!

Please, What do I do?
and I bet some others would like to know to.
so they can get ideas out and get credit for it.

reply to post by manicsloth


I have one question for all the evolutionist here and that would be the whole premise of evolution is the survival of the fittest, so my question is why is there the need for male and female in all aspects of life. It would seem to be quite the chancy thing to have to rely upon someone or something else to procreate. Have you never noticed that about nature? Why is it all the mutations to get us to this point in time depends on two opposite to make a new mutation so to say. Seem to be a very ineffective way for nature to turned out this way.

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by Confusion42

 

No , under my logic ; it proves there is a God because you have a Universe you are living in. lol you missed the logic. God is beyond our understanding and your understanding which is clearly stated in the Bible which i believe to be his word.

edit on 04/30/2011 by milkyway12 because: (no reason given)

Actually my friend, it is you who have "missed the logic". You bow down to the words of man, words of Men who wrote that fairytail thousands of years ago. Think about what you're saying here for just a minute, really think about how earlier Men have deceived you all?

You need to throw away all that nonsense that government institutions and maybe private institutions have fed you brother. You have been lied to in order to keep you herded with the rest of the vast numbers of sheoplized robots who innocently don't know any better.

Let Man pretend that he has all the answers, it's quite amusing actually. Awaken yourself to what they have tried so hard to hide from us all, and thats the power of The Cosmos. I am telling you that what I know is the truth, and you should listen to that truth my friend. Leave that false path and false Gods behind, and look up to the true Lord. That is the Universe, and it is The Universe who is God. ~SheopleNation

Sigh this again. Actually evolution doesn't even try to explain how life came about that would be Abiogenesis.

And belief in a higher power (God) and evolution do not have to clash. The only time God and evolution clash is if you go by the bible literally, a book men wrote 2000 years ago. If you are a young earth creationist then it bumps heads with evolution and science in general.

Other than that the belief of God and evolution can coexist.

After you study graduate level biochemistry and molecular biology, you will have a lot of your questions about the complexity of life answered.

The video is usefull at least for it's animations of the RNA polymerase.

The video fails to construct any original arguments that haven't been discussed/disputed elsewhere.

What say us? You really didn't have to ask...

Originally posted by guitarplayer
reply to post by manicsloth

 

I have one question for all the evolutionist here and that would be the whole premise of evolution is the survival of the fittest, so my question is why is there the need for male and female in all aspects of life. It would seem to be quite the chancy thing to have to rely upon someone or something else to procreate. Have you never noticed that about nature? Why is it all the mutations to get us to this point in time depends on two opposite to make a new mutation so to say. Seem to be a very ineffective way for nature to turned out this way.

No! The whole premise of evolution is change! Micro-Evolution deals with change over small periods of time; It's proven, observable, and irrefutable.

What you creationists are really against is Macro-Evolution; Change over long periods of time.

Adaptation is also important.

The following should be required reading for all creationists (and evolutionist) !

In order for animals to survive, they need to be able to adapt. In this part of the lesson, we will look at the types of adaptations animals can and do make. In a perfect world, animals would not need to adapt. However, with constant changes to their environment, food chain and climate, animals must adapt or face extinction. There are many examples of animals facing extinction. Later on in the course, we will take a look at some of these examples, and the reasons for their endangerment.

Source

Pretty good video. I personally feel bad for evolutionists knowing they have more faith in their religion of monkeys than God's plan and design of the universe and redemption.

Even string theory is coming out and saying the universe is designed and acts like a well created machine. Poor deceived ignorant sheep Man is their measure of all things....how problematic.