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Could we please drop the Kerry/Vietnam scrutiny!?

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posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 12:35 PM
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Recent weeks have been bogged down with he legitmacy of John Kerry's service in Vietnam. The airwaves and television media outlets will not get off of this topic.

People of course will say that Kerry left himself open to this scrutiny by building the foundation of his campaign on Vietnam. Granted. But what does this have to do with the issues?

In my opinion, the economy, health care, education, the environment, welfare, Middle East diplomacy, world deplomacy, food regulation, corporate regulation, and social matters take far more precedent than whether or not John Kerry was shot at or not, or whether he deserved the medals.

Kerry went to Vietnam. Bush did not. Who cares? At this point, both campaigns are so worried about spinning eachother into oblivion that we all have lost focus on what really counts; Who will run this country better?

Lose the spin, and urge the media to do the same.

[edit on 27-8-2004 by LukeNYC]




posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 12:39 PM
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I believe that a candidate's integrity is of the uptmost in importance.

The answer is no, Luke, we will not drop it.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 12:48 PM
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I agree with you Luke that I would like to see a campaign focused on the issues. But Kerry has repeatedly attempted to use his Vietnam service to deflect from his record as one of the most liberal senators.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 12:50 PM
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Ive said it once, Ill say it again. Kerry used his service as a cornerstone of his campaign to counteract claims he is soft on defence. If you doubt this see my Defence post on the Issues 2004 forum. He opened the Pandoras box and brought his record up for scrutiny. Its not anyones fault but his and his handlers that they did not look more closely at his record before they used it. The Genie is out of the bottle and try as he might Kerry can't force, SLAP sue, or get his wife to buy its way back in.

(i posted this in another thread, but it is very relevant here)



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 12:51 PM
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Here's the deal. The swift boat people, who fund thier own commercials and books, have a right to give thier version of the story. Just like Michael Moore has his right to make millions off of his documentary (which as he proclaims is totally biased and is based off of his personal opinions). Bush has gone on record as saying he doesn't support the Swift Boat ads. Of course they don't hurt him by bringing the facts about Kerry's service to light, but he's not funding them, so he can't stop them.

Further more, Kerry was the one who made his military service and medals his primary focus of this campaign. Anyone who saw the Dem Comvention knows this is true. Hell, he had Steven Speilberg make a flipping mini movie about it. If Kerry wants to use this to push his campaign, then he better be ready to have it under a microscope as well.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 01:14 PM
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Kerry's over-reaction to a relatively minor change in veterans polling two weeks ago and the resultant firestorm of media attention brought on by that reaction can be laid solely at his own feet. The first SBVT ad was not getting much traction outside of conservative news, websites and veterans groups until Kerry more or less lost his temper at having veterans turn their backs on his speech and poll numbers go down. Now the Kerry campaign itself is fanning the flames daily I think in an effort to avoid his more shocking failures as a U.S. senator.

If I was Kerry I think it would be less damaging to my base voter numbers and media supporters if I could keep the subject on the swift boat veterans (enemy) rather than on my senate record (me) until the RNC convention starts and takes the media spotlight away. A few days to a week of relative quiet would ensue where I could regather my composure.

I am wondering if someone of Kerry's temperment could handle the stress of a terror or international crisis in an effective manner.

Appease, appease, appease, ATTACK - is the way I think it would go - as sure path to disaster as I've ever seen.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 01:27 PM
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I agree whole-heartedly that a candidate's integrity is a major factor. Granted. So then if we are defining integrity as one's service during the vietnam era, so be it. Bush didnn't go and there is great question as to whether he even showed up for duty in Texas and Alabama. Is that integrity? Kerry served. That we DO know. To scrutinize above all other things right now is a low blow to the people. Focus on what is going on with our country and who can lead it.

I agree that, as i said, that Kerry left himself open. But this is not what the election is about.

I would also like to reming everyone that liberal is not a bad word.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 01:37 PM
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I do believe that one's reputation is very important and if he has lied about his service in Vietnam then possibly what else is he lying about.

However at this stage is there strong undeniable evidence that he lied about his service record?

Another issue which is more important, who has the best manifesto, who will more likely deliver better?

I'm not an American but i'd personally vote for Kerry. He's at least been in war and experienced it's horrors, he seems a more reasonable man than Bush and to be honest America hasn't done well politically.

You need someone like Kerry who will push to rebuild international relationships and not so adamant on invading every country that's suspected of housing or helping terrorists.

We've seen what Bush can do, now let's give Kerry a chance.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 02:00 PM
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Kerry brought the Nam thing to the table to distract the ignorant voters of the US in to not seeing his real record of dirty deals raising taxes and flip flopping on issues depending on where the money is coming from. Remember Clinton and how he had a lot of promises to and as soon as he took office everything went the other way. Sad part is Clinton was the first and only Dem I ever voted for and may be the last.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 02:24 PM
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Sorry, but no.

This is a guy who got 3 purple hearts in less then 4 months. There is something wrong there. There were guys there for a year or more who had less. Add to that the fact that 1 (or more) of those may have been self inflicted plus there are dozens of men that served with him that dispute his accounts of what happened (including a US admeral and my friends dad who is one of the most honerable people I have ever met) - all the while while he boasted of his supposed heroics to make people feel he was a tough guy - and I'd say it should not be dropped.

Sorry, Kerry supporters want it dropped because it will change a lot of peoples view on him, and voters have the right to know that he is a habitual liar.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by American Mad Man
This is a guy who got 3 purple hearts in less then 4 months. There is something wrong there. There were guys there for a year or more who had less.


Kerry didn't award himself those medals, they were given to him by the US Military. Perhaps if people feel they are not deserved, they should be pointing the finger elsewhere. I'm sure they weren't given away like candy to good kids at the mall, they were given when they felt they were deserved and warranted.

The fact he served at all gives him a different perspective on issues that I think could be valuable to have in the White House. He's not my favorite guy, but he's one choice for president, and one that I personally feel might be beneficial in the current climate.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 03:47 PM
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At least Kerry had the stones to go over there and not opt out to fly planes in the Air National Guard.

Durring that time it was well known the national guard service was a way to avoid serving in Vietnam



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 12:31 AM
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Originally posted by HowardRoark
At least Kerry had the stones to go over there and not opt out to fly planes in the Air National Guard. Durring that time it was well known the national guard service was a way to avoid serving in Vietnam


Annnnnnnnnnnd? Bush has never made an issue of his Guard service. But Kerry wears his like a cloak when it suits him. To bad he seems to have believed the lies (must of repeated them often) and now its comming back to bite him in the ass.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 01:01 AM
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No one ever seems to face the point that kerry did not give himself his medals they were given to him by the military. Thirty years ago they thought he was worthy enough to be awarded them now all of a sudden people are popping up saying wait a minute kerry is a coward he doesent deserve his medals. All I have to say is were where these people thirty years ago?

Even if everything these people say about Kerry are true the sad thing is that he is still better qualified then our current president.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 01:17 AM
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SPACEDOUBT REPORTING FOR DUTY

I think Kerry's Vietnam contemporaries may be ticked off
all these years later, because they were present for JK's
early self-agrandizment. Back then, when accumulating
atta-boy points, he probably had no idea how many people would be able to scrutinize his record. The record may be real, But I suspect he devil is in the details.

I can't but recollect an old episode of the TV series M*A*S*H,
when the bumbling Frank Burns tried to get his Colonel to recommend
him for a purple heart, due to injury from a shell fragment..eggshell..


[edit on 28-8-2004 by spacedoubt]



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 04:16 AM
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Although, I can understand the political and even the other motivations for discussing Kerry's Viet Nam service, I think it detracts completely (duh) from the real issues.
How ironic that the self-focussed Viet Nam generation is once again fighting that horrible war and accusing and cross-accusing while their sons and grandsons are dying in Iraq. Self indulgence? I'm of that era and I wish we'd just get the hell over it and worry more about our childrens' future and less about our past.
joey



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 04:23 AM
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I think AMM new avatar is kickin. Aside from that I don't care. Came across an American that was Republican against Bush. Need more people like that.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 04:29 AM
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We're not dropping the Swiftiversy.

Bush wants us to with this "I denounce all 527's including the one's my campaign coordinates" as his one shot to try and put a human face on that Axis of Evil called the RNC meeting in NYC all next week to pretend it's moderate, pro-issue and not negative.

I call BS. Let him share the spotlight all week with his Swiftie spawn.

It's his creation. He can specifically denounce it any time he likes. And it will go away when he quits farting around with his hostage demands of "I'll stop coordinating lies about Kerry when MoveOn stops telling the truth about me."

Bah. Swiftnards are the hump on the RNC's ugly back now.

Let Dr. Bushenstein live with his monster a while. I'd say another week should be enough.


[edit on 28-8-2004 by RANT]



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 04:47 AM
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Kerry should be thankful that people are focusing on his cowardly self rewarding behavior during the war and his traitorous behavior after the war, instead of his horrendous voting record. I think Kerry is behind the swiftvets ads because being a traitor and liar is perhaps easier than having to justify his voting record. This guy is a moron and he is going to lose the election.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 01:44 PM
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I understand, i'm getting sick of it too.....

A liar is a liar, and thus you lose respect from others trying to gain it with lies.....I agree, but it doesn't change the fact that he's a loser, a liar, an exaggerator, and maybe demented about other things...

I stopped listening to this horse# along time ago, right after I found out he was full of #, i didn't need to hear anymore.. Why beat a dead horse.



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