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What is truth? Searching for reason and logic in a world dominated by faith

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posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 04:28 PM
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I've come to realize I'm merely chasing a snipe with you. There is no sufficient answer anyone can give you. It is impossible to prove the miracles performed in the Bible were real, just as it's impossible to prove that Jesus was the son of God. However, the Bible has been proven as an authentic piece of literature just as Jesus was proven to be a real historical figure. When Pilate asked Jesus "What is truth?" John 18:38, He gave him no answer. You have no genuine desire to find truth but to mock and test those who with faith. I cannot entertain your ego any longer.




posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 04:30 PM
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Originally posted by DanteMustDie
I've come to realize I'm merely chasing a snipe with you. There is no sufficient answer anyone can give you. It is impossible to prove the miracles performed in the Bible were real, just as it's impossible to prove that Jesus was the son of God. However, the Bible has been proven as an authentic piece of literature just as Jesus was proven to be a real historical figure. When Pilate asked Jesus "What is truth?" John 18:38, He gave him no answer. You have no genuine desire to find truth but to mock and test those who with faith. I cannot entertain your ego any longer.


You contradict yourself with you reply. You mention you cannot prove his miracles or that Jesus is the son of god. But you mention he is a historic figure and the bible is authentic. Which is it? A or B? To me you cannot prove you Christian belifs. I have a desire to set the record staraight. If Jesus isn't real then why follow him?



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 04:32 PM
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reply to post by WhatsHappenin666
 



Then what about the other verses I listed? What about the ones which are critical of people who do not follow his teachings and telling them they will go to hell. What kind of love it that? Sounds like you're hyporcrite who doesn't understand that you're white washing what you want to believe to make it true.


I don't tell people they will go do hell.... Hell doesn't exist. And calling me a hypocrite only inforces your ignorance. And how about you show me my white washing...


Yes, I can. Look at Mao today and what you read on the horrors of his life. Mao was not perfect but he is looked at as one of the founding fathers of China. How you do not love him as much as Jesus. What is the difference?


Why would i not, he is human... and im not responsible for his actions, nor do i care what he does... that would be his problem not mine.


Doesn't matter if it comes from a website or not. Jesus is Jesus everyone has a different view on Jesus. Seeing that you're a Christian I presented verses from the Christian bible which speak of evil against mankind.


Incorrect, im not christian... And i won't deny the evil's in the bible, but they were not from Jesus...


I can say the same for you. Are you questioning Jesus and what the so called teachings you follow. You're so quick to to say my sources are lies and propganda in making Jesus as the bad guy. You don't really believe Jesus is all love and kidness do you now?


I did not say what you posted were lies, i said you do not understand what you posted... and the one statement was propaganda... DON'T put words in my mouth. Im not questioning him, i have no reason to... You are questioning me.... and im giving you my answers.


Sigh! Yes you do! Like billions of Christians before you in your life as a Christian. You're made to believe Jesus is all loving and forgiving. Now do not give me that old comment that it's the old testement or only the laws apply for the Jews. Clearly you haven't study what you believe and act like this what mankind needs in a mythological figure.



Again, not christian man... give it up.

I wasn't made to believe anything, unlike christians, i studied on my own.... i had no one telling me what i should believe. And clearly nothing.... You know nothing about me, don't act like you do.


Clearly Jesus is an all loving God of punishment. Kind of like of serial killer.


Perhaps if you listen to Paul.... I do not.


The author used this quote to refer to the evil's of the bible and teachings of Jesus.


Yes i looked over the site, hes as misguided as you are...


Don't you just love how Chrstians explain away all of Jsus nastiness and sins (like stealing) by saying "it is a parable" or some such?


Again.... Not christian my friend.


It's a parable. It's not a real teaching. This has to be the most ridicolus belief out there.


Actually its not, he spoke in parables to weed out people that did not understand him...


We can go on and on about this. But in the end I will be proven correct because non of the figures in the bible are true or should there teachings be praticed. Let me ask you would you kill someone because they do not follow condmandments from God? Would you?


WOW, crazy rediculous man... You won't be proven correct, you've yet to prove a thing. And yes there are teachings in the bible that the world should practice, but rarely do.

No i would not kill anything...




posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by WhatsHappenin666
reply to post by Akragon
 


Sounds like you should get better morals. Because you're showing strong judgment toward me. What would Jesus do? Love? haha! Don't make me laugh. You're a perfect example of blind-faith. why won't god heal amputees? Why not? Care to answer Christian who cheery picks and can't offer proof to Jesus.


Again don't act like you know me, you don't know anything about me...

Clearly you don't know what judgement is... thats fine though... again your ignorance shows in your posts.

God doesn't intervien in human affairs, its not needed... its already a perfect system.

And yet again im not christian... You're prettty thick eh? Nor do you know what cherrypicking is.....obviously.

I can give you plenty of proof of his teachings, but im thinking... considering your attitude towards me... i barely want to talk to you let alone try to help you understand things that are beyond you...

We'll see though


edit on 29-9-2011 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 04:43 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 





I don't tell people they will go do hell.... Hell doesn't exist. And calling me a hypocrite only inforces your ignorance. And how about you show me my white washing...


Then where do you get your information of the bible and the life of Jesus? Clearly you don't read the bible. You white wash and present Jesus as this hippy figure.




Why would i not, he is human... and im not responsible for his actions, nor do i care what he does... that would be his problem not mine.


The same could be said about Jesus in the bible. He is human and responsible for his actions. He curesed humainty and we have suffered dearly.




Incorrect, im not christian... And i won't deny the evil's in the bible, but they were not from Jesus...


But you believe the Christian concept of Jesus. Clearly you get your sources from the bible and claim the evil verses by Jesus are nothing more then parables or nothing by him at all. Then how do you know what Jesus said and did? You don't You follow however you please and then deny you're this or that. You are a liar and deciver.




I did not say what you posted were lies, i said you do not understand what you posted... and the one statement was propaganda... DON'T put words in my mouth. Im not questioning him, i have no reason to... You are questioning me.... and im giving you my answers.


Again another lie by you. I used the verses to show that what jesus said is evil. I understand what the verses mean and I'm a former Christian.




Again, not christian man... give it up. I wasn't made to believe anything, unlike christians, i studied on my own.... i had no one telling me what i should believe. And clearly nothing.... You know nothing about me, don't act like you do.


It's always funny when Christians say they are not Christians but only indiviuals who believe in Jesus. Wow! What will they think of next?




Perhaps if you listen to Paul.... I do not.


What's the difference? All his followers have shown his ugliness.




Yes i looked over the site, hes as misguided as you are...


Then what is the truth? Your version of the Christian bible?




Again.... Not christian my friend.


You can deny it all you want but your Christian.




Actually its not, he spoke in parables to weed out people that did not understand him...


Everything is a parable when it's a verse that makes Jesus as the bad guy. Parable! Parable! OMG Jesus is a parable myth!




WOW, crazy rediculous man... You won't be proven correct, you've yet to prove a thing. And yes there are teachings in the bible that the world should practice, but rarely do. No i would not kill anything...


Then you do not follow as pictured in the bible. God has strict commandments. Clearly you fell to follow them.



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 04:45 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


I always find it funny when Christians always feel like they know everything and can prove their faith. But where is the proof? Where is it and why aren't you sharing? What is there to hide? Clearly Christians are afaried they will be shown as following a myth that has more people in history. You're nothing more then a white washing christian who doesn't understand the evils of the bible.



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 04:58 PM
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reply to post by WhatsHappenin666
 



Then where do you get your information of the bible and the life of Jesus? Clearly you don't read the bible. You white wash and present Jesus as this hippy figure.


Haha, clearly eh... are you that arrogant?

Did you even read my answers? Im starting to think you don't understand what "white wash" means either...


The same could be said about Jesus in the bible. He is human and responsible for his actions. He curesed humainty and we have suffered dearly.


Incorrect.... religion cursed humanity... Which is simply caused by lack of understanding of their own book


But you believe the Christian concept of Jesus. Clearly you get your sources from the bible and claim the evil verses by Jesus are nothing more then parables or nothing by him at all. Then how do you know what Jesus said and did? You don't You follow however you please and then deny you're this or that. You are a liar and deciver.


Why do you keep saying clearly? Understand what a parable is first... Also understand Jesus was not Christian... that is a concept that was designed for control over the masses, which worked.

I don't follow Jesus just so you know, i live my life by his teachings.... i follow no one. I understand his words because i've read them and studied them, unlike you i don't learn from websites.

And i don't lie either... yet you can judge me all you want....i couldn't care less



Again another lie by you. I used the verses to show that what jesus said is evil. I understand what the verses mean and I'm a former Christian.


Sorry, again you are incorrect...

And you being a former christian proves that you understand little to nothing about what he taught... Very few of them actually do...


It's always funny when Christians say they are not Christians but only indiviuals who believe in Jesus. Wow! What will they think of next?


Im glad i amuse you, again the feeling is mutual, which is why i continue this pointless discussion, for my own amusement



What's the difference? All his followers have shown his ugliness.


That IS my point... How do you not understand that... when you just stated THE POINT?


Then what is the truth? Your version of the Christian bible?


No... the bible is not truth, yet truth can be found within its pages....


You can deny it all you want but your Christian.


Theres nothing to deny... i've stated many times i don't follow Jesus... i follow no one. A christian follows their version of Jesus based around what their relgion tells them to follow... I read and study on my own, which is why i have answers to hard quesitons others do not.


Everything is a parable when it's a verse that makes Jesus as the bad guy. Parable! Parable! OMG Jesus is a parable myth


Incorrect, but feel free to state what you wish... again please... show the world your colours.


Then you do not follow as pictured in the bible. God has strict commandments. Clearly you fell to follow them.


I do not believe in the God of the bible... I believe in the God Jesus spoke of... which is not the same God IMHO

And again.... i follow no one.

Do you need to repeat yourself over and over? Do you not read what i post... or can i assume you just rant about stuff that you disargree with regardless of what is said?




posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by WhatsHappenin666
reply to post by Akragon
 


I always find it funny when Christians always feel like they know everything and can prove their faith. But where is the proof? Where is it and why aren't you sharing? What is there to hide? Clearly Christians are afaried they will be shown as following a myth that has more people in history. You're nothing more then a white washing christian who doesn't understand the evils of the bible.


I have nothing to hide, i just refuse to help someone that is being an ignorant prick... You keep calling me christian yet i've told you over and over im not christian.... understand the term before you use it.

And quit using the term white wash... Until you actually look up the definition.

As a matter of fact it would be better if you do not use any terms you don't understand.... at least that way you we have something to work with


edit on 29-9-2011 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:03 PM
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posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:04 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:05 PM
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posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:08 PM
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posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:09 PM
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posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:11 PM
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posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:14 PM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

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posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 05:15 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 06:00 PM
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Originally posted by WhatsHappenin666

Originally posted by DanteMustDie
I've come to realize I'm merely chasing a snipe with you. There is no sufficient answer anyone can give you. It is impossible to prove the miracles performed in the Bible were real, just as it's impossible to prove that Jesus was the son of God. However, the Bible has been proven as an authentic piece of literature just as Jesus was proven to be a real historical figure. When Pilate asked Jesus "What is truth?" John 18:38, He gave him no answer. You have no genuine desire to find truth but to mock and test those who with faith. I cannot entertain your ego any longer.


You contradict yourself with you reply. You mention you cannot prove his miracles or that Jesus is the son of god. But you mention he is a historic figure and the bible is authentic. Which is it? A or B? To me you cannot prove you Christian belifs. I have a desire to set the record staraight. If Jesus isn't real then why follow him?


Forgive me? Jesus of Nazareth WAS real. He claimed to be the Son of God. Can I prove he was? No. The Bible is an accumulation of writings that express eye witness accounts or retelling of stories. The writings themselves are authentic. The supernatural accounts described are left for the reader to discern. It's not my duty to prove them to you. Even Jesus' twelve disciples couldn't prove he was God, and they witnessed his power first hand. There's where that tricky thing called faith comes in. I believe the miraculous accounts described in the Bible. You don't have to. Ironically enough, that's your God given free will to decide.

Law of Authenticity: Every document, apparently ancient, coming from the proper repository or custody, and bearing on its face no evident marks of forgery, the law presumes to be genuine and develops on the opposing party the burden of proving it to be otherwise.

Prove to me Jesus didn't exist.



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 06:25 PM
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Originally posted by DanteMustDie

Originally posted by WhatsHappenin666

Originally posted by DanteMustDie
I've come to realize I'm merely chasing a snipe with you. There is no sufficient answer anyone can give you. It is impossible to prove the miracles performed in the Bible were real, just as it's impossible to prove that Jesus was the son of God. However, the Bible has been proven as an authentic piece of literature just as Jesus was proven to be a real historical figure. When Pilate asked Jesus "What is truth?" John 18:38, He gave him no answer. You have no genuine desire to find truth but to mock and test those who with faith. I cannot entertain your ego any longer.


You contradict yourself with you reply. You mention you cannot prove his miracles or that Jesus is the son of god. But you mention he is a historic figure and the bible is authentic. Which is it? A or B? To me you cannot prove you Christian belifs. I have a desire to set the record staraight. If Jesus isn't real then why follow him?


Forgive me? Jesus of Nazareth WAS real. He claimed to be the Son of God. Can I prove he was? No. The Bible is an accumulation of writings that express eye witness accounts or retelling of stories. The writings themselves are authentic. The supernatural accounts described are left for the reader to discern. It's not my duty to prove them to you. Even Jesus' twelve disciples couldn't prove he was God, and they witnessed his power first hand. There's where that tricky thing called faith comes in. I believe the miraculous accounts described in the Bible. You don't have to. Ironically enough, that's your God given free will to decide.

Law of Authenticity: Every document, apparently ancient, coming from the proper repository or custody, and bearing on its face no evident marks of forgery, the law presumes to be genuine and develops on the opposing party the burden of proving it to be otherwise.

Prove to me Jesus didn't exist.


I don't think you'll hear much from him anymore...




posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 06:29 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 

I think we made a decent argument. Judging by the censored posts, I take you guys had it out?



posted on Sep, 29 2011 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by DanteMustDie
reply to post by Akragon
 

I think we made a decent argument. Judging by the censored posts, I take you guys had it out?



Well he had it out... i got called on the word Idiot, which is exactly how he was acting. I don't agree with that warning but oh well... im not going to make a fuss over it.

Besides he had no arguement to anyone who actually understands Jesus and what he taught. This thread was mearly about him attacking other peoples beliefs, which i tend to take personally.

The fact is, whatever anyones belief is... one should not attack that belief. Leave that person to his beliefs, show love to those that hate you or even attack you... this is what Jesus taught. And actually, the only lesson from him that i struggle with.

I tend to strike back when someone hits me... but im learning





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