Apollo Moon Landings a Hoax? Then Read This

Originally posted by patternfinder

Originally posted by patternfinder
Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by patternfinder

 

You don't know anything at all about radiation of any sort, do you?
The radiation in the Van Allen belts consists of high energy particles, not electromagnetic radiation. It doesn't have a frequency. (now you're going to tell me everything has "frequencies").

did you know that an electromagnet uses alternating current to generate a field around a coil? do you think that alternating current isn't a frequency? does 60 hz sound familiar?

Doesn't an electromagnet usually use a DC ?

Otherwise wouldn't the poles switch with every half oscillation?

Originally posted by Frira

Originally posted by godWhisperer
reply to post by patternfinder

 

i have watched that guy's videos and he makes some great points. i wish there was a capable person debunking the stuff he says. even with the internet, it's difficult for a layman to authoritatively say what is possible and what wasn't.

one interesting thing the aussie kid made me aware of was werner von braun's book 'conquest of the moon' which outlines what von braun thought...

Perhaps putting that little publication in context can be helpful, starting with the publication date.

yup, 1953 so clearly we would have had the time to refine the process to what we were told happened.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by patternfinder

 

I didn't say can't. I said doesn't.

listen, radiation period has the ability to cook....radiation is vibration, that's why radiation messes up cells, because it is not harmonious to normal cell radiation......this non harmony, depending on how much pressure (wattage=volts x current) is applied to this non harmonious movement that causes friction, which in turn causes heat.....it's not too hard to understand..........

Originally posted by patternfinder


i have no idea, you were the one who brought up electromagnetism......

Oh my. No idea at all.

Electromagnetic radiation has nothing to do with electromagnetism. Electromagnetic radiation is light. Electromagnetic radiation is x-rays. Electromagnetic radiation is radio. Electromagnetic radiation is microwaves.

Electromagnetic radiation occurs at different frequencies. At very high frequencies (ultraviolet and upwards) it carries enough energy to remove electrons from atoms. That's when it becomes ionizing radiation. Microwaves cannot do that but they can make water molecules wiggle.

High energy particles are not the same as electromagnetic radiation. High energy particles have no particular "frequency". They're just zipping through space really really fast. It is high energy particles which is the source of radiation in the Van Allen belts.

Originally posted by patternfinder

Originally posted by Frira

Originally posted by patternfinder
sounds all warm and fuzzy and i'm sure with the feelings that you feel about it, you surely wouldn't want to believe that your dad was involved, even if it was unwittingly, in something that never actually came to fruition...i'm sure that would be devastating to you....but, strong emotions about a particular subject are a very nice way to not be very open minded about a situation...in conclusion, while very warm and heart felt, it didn't provide me any proof of your claim......

I did not count the question marks in my OP, but there are several.

Which one asked if anyone thought my story was warm and fuzzy and can you remind why I asked about that?

sorry, that was just my account of it......

I'm not really a warm fuzzy kind of guy, but my Dad was really something special and when I write him, I'm sure it gathers a lot of gently heating lint-like particles!

So, I understand, but it highlighted something which was not relevant to the content and came off to me as an attempt to disengage from the content-- especially after seeing two references to the warm and fuzzy.

Then again, the thread has taken its own life-- "aussie guy" and radiation & vibrations! Interesting enough.

Oh well, y'all have fun-- I need sleep and have an early day.

Originally posted by Phage

Originally posted by patternfinder


i have no idea, you were the one who brought up electromagnetism......

Oh my. No idea at all.

Electromagnetic radiation has nothing to do with electromagnetism. Electromagnetic radiation is light. Electromagnetic radiation is x-rays. Electromagnetic radiation is radio. Electromagnetic radiation is microwaves.

Electromagnetic radiation occurs at different frequencies. At very high frequencies (ultraviolet and upwards) it carries enough energy to remove electrons from atoms. That's when it becomes ionizing radiation. Microwaves cannot do that but they can make water molecules wiggle.

High energy particles are not the same as electromagnetic radiation. High energy particles have no particular "frequency". They're just zipping through space really really fast. It is high energy particles which is the source of radiation in the Van Allen belts.

edit on 9/5/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)

hmm, so the electrons are just wiggling in wire when there is a short between positive and negative? this isn't causing electron flow eg...ripping electrons from atoms down a row? what proof do we have of this phenomenon?

You know, I never understood all these "we didn't land on the moon" theories.

If the US was going to "fake it", to beat the Russians... why do it more than once? I could see if they faked it once, so as to "beat" the Soviets to the chase. But the Apollo program was HUGE.

So your telling me that NASA faked Apollo 11, 12, 14, 15, 16 and 17? Then they also faked Apollo 8, and 10, and the 13 disaster? Then that must mean that the Soviets also faked Luna 20 and 24. All the moon rock samples must have been fake as well. Every single picture of the surface of the moon must also be fake. And if NASA had to fake the Apollo missions, that would mean they were incapable of doing their jobs. Which would lead me to HAVE to believe that every mission since was a fraud too. Everyone between NASA and the Soviet program must have been in on it, or were "faked out" by a select few. We spent billions upon billions of dollars sending satellites and rockets into orbit simply to fake it?

I understand the debate about radiation, the Van Allen belt, etc etc etc. I'm sure that they were aware of how to avoid, or at least minimize the exposure to high-energy protons. Otherwise, we wouldn't have accomplished a single maned orbit of earth.

So if you feel the moon landings were faked, why then would they do it so many times?

(PS- I haven't had the chance to go through the "Young Aussie" post as it is over 400 pages and contains mostly bickering between a select few).

reply to post by patternfinder

No.

The atoms are not ionized, they remain neutral. The electrons in an electrical current are being "traded" from atom to atom. Each atom gets an electron and gives one up. That's why there has to be a circuit, without it there is no exchange.

As a technician, maybe you should ask an electrical engineer about it.

Originally posted by DerekJR321
You know, I never understood all these "we didn't land on the moon" theories.

If the US was going to "fake it", to beat the Russians... why do it more than once? I could see if they faked it once, so as to "beat" the Soviets to the chase. But the Apollo program was HUGE.

So your telling me that NASA faked Apollo 11, 12, 14, 15, 16 and 17? Then they also faked Apollo 8, and 10, and the 13 disaster? Then that must mean that the Soviets also faked Luna 20 and 24. All the moon rock samples must have been fake as well. Every single picture of the surface of the moon must also be fake. And if NASA had to fake the Apollo missions, that would mean they were incapable of doing their jobs. Which would lead me to HAVE to believe that every mission since was a fraud too. Everyone between NASA and the Soviet program must have been in on it, or were "faked out" by a select few. We spent billions upon billions of dollars sending satellites and rockets into orbit simply to fake it?

I understand the debate about radiation, the Van Allen belt, etc etc etc. I'm sure that they were aware of how to avoid, or at least minimize the exposure to high-energy protons. Otherwise, we wouldn't have accomplished a single maned orbit of earth.

So if you feel the moon landings were faked, why then would they do it so many times?

(PS- I haven't had the chance to go through the "Young Aussie" post as it is over 400 pages and contains mostly bickering between a select few).

funding....you can go to youtube and watch his videos, there's quite a few of them.......

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by patternfinder

 

No.

The atoms are not ionized, they remain neutral. The electrons in an electrical current are being "traded" from atom to atom. Each atom gets an electron and gives one up. That's why there has to be a circuit, without it there is no exchange.

As a technician, maybe you should ask an electrical engineer about it.

edit on 9/5/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)

so, when you provide a substrate into an atmosphere of radiation that is effected by this radiation, you aren't essentially providing it a circuit?

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by Videot

 

There isn't really any temperature on the Moon but the cameras were finished to reflect sunlight. Perhaps if they were left for an extended period in either sunlight or shade there may have been a problem, but they weren't. There is such a thing as thermal "inertia". It takes a while for something to heat up and cool down.

The body of the cameras provided shielding from radiation. In addition the film magazines themselves had additional shielding.

edit on 9/5/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)

First post here. I seem to recall a hasselblad guy explaining how the cameras had no special shielding-insulation, thermal or any other. I have read a bit from you around here, normally spot on, this must be the first time you miss a shot, or are you going to tell us that the poor old man was lying?

Edot to add: I also have fond memories of christmas and santa claus, just FYI.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by patternfinder

 

How about you tell me what the "frequency" of 5MeV electrons is.
How about 40MeV protons?

I kinda hate to get in the middle of this(!), but doesn't the theory of wave/particle duality imply that all particles do indeed have a frequency? I vaguely remember an equation from college physics that relates the two, though not the details.

And of course, if string theory is correct (decidedly undecided at this time) everything is made up of oscillations.

Originally posted by OccamAssassin

Originally posted by patternfinder

Originally posted by patternfinder
Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by patternfinder

 

You don't know anything at all about radiation of any sort, do you?
The radiation in the Van Allen belts consists of high energy particles, not electromagnetic radiation. It doesn't have a frequency. (now you're going to tell me everything has "frequencies").

did you know that an electromagnet uses alternating current to generate a field around a coil? do you think that alternating current isn't a frequency? does 60 hz sound familiar?

Doesn't an electromagnet usually use a DC ?

Otherwise wouldn't the poles switch with every half oscillation?

ha ha, i almost didn't see this post....i was wondering if phage was going to pick that up, but you did.....well done

reply to post by patternfinder


Could you clarify your post a little? Are you saying they faked 6 moon landings because they got money for it? Or are you referring to a specific youtube poster?

If your saying that they faked the moon due to them getting money... well sorry I just don't buy that. No pun intended.

Every single argument trying to prove the moon landings a hoax can be refuted. So now it seems people are arguing over radiation levels. But I take little value in armchair physicists hypothesis.

Originally posted by Videot

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by patternfinder

 

How about you tell me what the "frequency" of 5MeV electrons is.
How about 40MeV protons?

I kinda hate to get in the middle of this(!), but doesn't the theory of wave/particle duality imply that all particles do indeed have a frequency? I vaguely remember an equation from college physics that relates the two, though not the details.

And of course, if string theory is correct (decidedly undecided at this time) everything is made up of oscillations.

well, phage is relying on the idea that a particle isn't a wave.....i am of the idea that a particle is made up of waves......that's where we are butting heads....

Originally posted by DerekJR321
reply to post by patternfinder

 

Could you clarify your post a little? Are you saying they faked 6 moon landings because they got money for it? Or are you referring to a specific youtube poster?

If your saying that they faked the moon due to them getting money... well sorry I just don't buy that. No pun intended.

Every single argument trying to prove the moon landings a hoax can be refuted. So now it seems people are arguing over radiation levels. But I take little value in armchair physicists hypothesis.

I believe the main reason that any "hoaxer" would give is that it was done to maintain an appearance of technical superiority over the USSR. It was a time of Cold War, and the Russians were getting ahead in leaps and bounds at the time. The Space Race was the main public battlefront.

Originally posted by DerekJR321
reply to post by patternfinder

 

Could you clarify your post a little? Are you saying they faked 6 moon landings because they got money for it? Or are you referring to a specific youtube poster?

If your saying that they faked the moon due to them getting money... well sorry I just don't buy that. No pun intended.

Every single argument trying to prove the moon landings a hoax can be refuted. So now it seems people are arguing over radiation levels. But I take little value in armchair physicists hypothesis.

sorry, yes, they did it for funding.....remember, john f kennedy put some pressure on them too......i've seen them do way more for way less.......

Originally posted by patternfinder

Originally posted by Videot

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by patternfinder

 

How about you tell me what the "frequency" of 5MeV electrons is.
How about 40MeV protons?

I kinda hate to get in the middle of this(!), but doesn't the theory of wave/particle duality imply that all particles do indeed have a frequency? I vaguely remember an equation from college physics that relates the two, though not the details.

And of course, if string theory is correct (decidedly undecided at this time) everything is made up of oscillations.

well, phage is relying on the idea that a particle isn't a wave.....i am of the idea that a particle is made up of waves......that's where we are butting heads....

If I remember correctly, the very issue that Phage brought up, that electrons can exist at different energy levels, is all about the vibrational energy they possess, hence their associated frequency. Don't quote me on that though!

PS I have to take that back - electron volts is all about kinetic energy apparently (straight line momentum, I guess). I had to look it up!


PPS BUT, particles do have wavelength, so they do have frequency. The equation is Wavelength = Planck's Constant divided by Momentum (or in the case of electrons, electron volts).

reply to post by patternfinder

You're correct. That's why I asked for the frequency of a 10MeV electron. Its wavelength can be calculated but it doesn't really mean much unless the particle is being considered as a wave.

In any case the point I was attempting to make was that there is a great deal of difference between particle radiation (ionizing) and electromagnetic radiation (ionizing and otherwise) and their effects. Comparing the effects of microwaves to the effects of high energy particles is meaningless.

I think that only the first moon landing was fake. Since then they definetly went to moon, but not the first time at least..