A true prophet of God

reply to post by benrl



Wikipedia can be a very dubious source.

The top of the page even indicates that the entry is being checked for 'neutrality'.

reply to post by XplanetX


Pastors, Elders, Church leaders are all called to higher standards, they guard the flock.

This man has routinely allied himself with questionable movements, Kansas City Prophets, Watchmen Nee and Watchmen Lee, the Local church movement.

All of which have serious doctrinal issues, His Ministry seems to revolve around selling books and tapes, his website leads you to a store, and then how to book him for speaking engagements.

Living streams ministry, and the Local church movement have been known to sue other churches over defamation claims and copyright infringement.

I simply suggest when you find someone who claims to be a prophet test the spirt with all the tools at your disposal including google.

In my opinion he is a conman at best.

As for what ever perceived disrespect I may be showing to a false teacher, I would ask what respect the apostle showed when dealing with demons and false teachers, they rebuked them and delt with them loudly and in public.


ETA.

I Knew about the movements he was in and his name from my History in a devote Charismatic Church, one that mentioned this man. Wikipedia didn't give me that first hand experiences.

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by XplanetX

 

Pastors, Elders, Church leaders are all called to higher standards, they guard the flock.

This man has routinely allied himself with questionable movements, Kansas City Prophets, Watchmen Nee and Watchmen Lee, the Local church movement.

All of which have serious doctrinal issues, His Ministry seems to revolve around selling books and tapes, his website leads you to a store, and then how to book him for speaking engagements.

Living streams ministry, and the Local church movement have been known to sue other churches over defamation claims and copyright infringement.

I simply suggest when you find someone who claims to be a prophet test the spirt with all the tools at your disposal including google.

In my opinion he is a conman at best.

As for what ever perceived disrespect I may be showing to a false teacher, I would ask what respect the apostle showed when dealing with demons and false teachers, they rebuked them and delt with them loudly and in public.


ETA.

I Knew about the movements he was in and his name from my History in a devote Charismatic Church, one that mentioned this man. Wikipedia didn't give me that first hand experiences.

edit on 29-8-2011 by benrl because: didn't see last post before posting.

edit on 29-8-2011 by benrl because: (no reason given)

In my past, I too have been affiliated with dubious groups.

You will find that most churches have been infiltrated by the enemy in some fashion. The key is to keep your eyes focused on Christ. I draw the line when somebody teaches errant doctrine.

reply to post by XplanetX


And this man and his ministry he is associated with continue to publish questionable doctrine (Watchmen Nee) and litigiously persecute fellow christian churches for things like copyright and slander (usually around claims of it being a cult)

But I guess we will have to agree to disagree on what makes a true prophet of God.

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by XplanetX

 

And this man and his ministry he is associated with continue to publish questionable doctrine (Watchmen Nee) and litigiously persecute fellow christian churches for things like copyright and slander (usually around claims of it being a cult)

But I guess we will have to agree to disagree on what makes a true prophet of God.

I think we are on the same team brother.

I am just more cautious to judge, if you can find an explicit case of him teaching a false doctrine and still teaching that false doctrine today, then you will convince me.

I was part of a church where I was not happy with the way they distributed the collections. I felt they were paying the ministry staff too much, so I left. The point of this thread is to display how God can and still does use people today to prophesy. I don't mind that we have taken a little detour to examine this man's character and his past but let's try and focus on his message.

reply to post by XplanetX


I guess to me my case is more about his associations (not just past but current) and actions of the ministry movements he is apart of.

No church is perfect as you said, Mine was selling products during church service... That doesn't necessarily have to pollute the message, but should give one serious pause about the source of the message to begin with.

There are not prophets anymore. Some people can channel or use psychic abilities to see the future, that's all, Most of these people, just repeat what we can hear by ourselves in many youtube videos and call that their own prophecy.

Originally posted by Trueman
There are not prophets anymore. Some people can channel or use psychic abilities to see the future, that's all, Most of these people, just repeat what we can hear by ourselves in many youtube videos and call that their own prophecy.

A real prophet would not seek fame or fortune getting on tv and he would definately not claim he was a prophet. The prophets never claimed to be prophets, all they did was come to bear the messages, and as the stories of their messages and miracles became known, it was the people that said "Come and see! A prophet of the Lord is amoung us!". The prophets of old didnt come out of the closet and announce "I am a prophet of God, fear me or die!", they did what they had to do which was relay God's messages and laws to the people, or deliver a swift kick in the ass to people like Jezebel and Ahab. Real prophets walk amoung the people, and many in the past could have been easily mistaken for a beggar or a bumb. The real prophet isnt the guy you see on tv, he is the man walking the streets delivering God's messages from street corners.

I'm not saying that men on tv are not Godly men and that they are not delivering the messages the Holy Spirit puts in their hearts. I'm saying a real prophet isn't going to be hawking tapes and videos for cash. Real prophets are provided with the tools they need by God himself, and you will know when youre in the presence of a real prophet because the Holy Spirit follows them around like a cloak and when the real prophet speaks you will listen wether you want to or not, you may not heed his message but you will hear it.

In the past we did not have TV, Video, DVD, Blue Ray or the Internet.

If we have these mediums available today and we do not use them, then we are stupid. I do not know if this man is using these mediums and the message of God for profit. If he is, God will judge him accordingly. This thread is designed to expose his message, let's analyse the message rather than shoot the messenger.

I'd be suspicious of any prophet who has a slick looking website complete with a "store" section.
www.streamsministries.com...

Remember what Jesus did to the buyers/sellers and the money changers near the temple?

Jesus and the righteous prophets in the bible never tried to make money off the prophetic work they were assigned.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
I'd be suspicious of any prophet who has a slick looking website complete with a "store" section.
www.streamsministries.com...

Remember what Jesus did to the buyers/sellers and the money changers near the temple?

Jesus and the righteous prophets in the bible never tried to make money off the prophetic work they were assigned.

edit on 30-8-2011 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)

1CO 9:3 This is my defense to those who sit in judgment on me. Don't we have the right to food and drink? Don't we have the right to take a believing wife along with us, as do the other apostles and the Lord's brothers and Cephas? Or is it only I and Barnabas who must work for a living?

1CO 9:7 Who serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat of its grapes? Who tends a flock and does not drink of the milk? Do I say this merely from a human point of view? Doesn't the Law say the same thing? For it is written in the Law of Moses: "Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain." Is it about oxen that God is concerned? Surely he says this for us, doesn't he? Yes, this was written for us, because when the plowman plows and the thresher threshes, they ought to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest. If we have sown spiritual seed among you, is it too much if we reap a material harvest from you? If others have this right of support from you, shouldn't we have it all the more?
But we did not use this right. On the contrary, we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of Christ. Don't you know that those who work in the temple get their food from the temple, and those who serve at the altar share in what is offered on the altar? In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel.



How much this man draws as his own income is an unknown. If he is living an opulent lifestyle through profits from God's word, then God will judge him accordingly. He is still entitled to receive an income in the same way that a typical worker recieves an income. (according to scripture)

Originally posted by XplanetX

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by XplanetX

 

And this man and his ministry he is associated with continue to publish questionable doctrine (Watchmen Nee) and litigiously persecute fellow christian churches for things like copyright and slander (usually around claims of it being a cult)

But I guess we will have to agree to disagree on what makes a true prophet of God.

I think we are on the same team brother.

I am just more cautious to judge, if you can find an explicit case of him teaching a false doctrine and still teaching that false doctrine today, then you will convince me.

I was part of a church where I was not happy with the way they distributed the collections. I felt they were paying the ministry staff too much, so I left. The point of this thread is to display how God can and still does use people today to prophesy. I don't mind that we have taken a little detour to examine this man's character and his past but let's try and focus on his message.

edit on 29-8-2011 by XplanetX because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-8-2011 by XplanetX because: typo

I think Jesus would be pissed off to know that ministers are getting paid to spread his message. Being paid to spread the word pretty much negates your rewards in heaven because you are reaping rewards in the world. I wonder if paid ministers could be part of the "false prophets" and psuedo-christians Jesus said he would cast away as if he never new them? Youre not doing Christ's work if youre getting paid, he was all about suffering in this world to purify you and make you ready for heaven, and if youre making 60,000+ year paycheck for preaching you definately are not suffering!

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by XplanetX

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by XplanetX

 

And this man and his ministry he is associated with continue to publish questionable doctrine (Watchmen Nee) and litigiously persecute fellow christian churches for things like copyright and slander (usually around claims of it being a cult)

But I guess we will have to agree to disagree on what makes a true prophet of God.

I think we are on the same team brother.

I am just more cautious to judge, if you can find an explicit case of him teaching a false doctrine and still teaching that false doctrine today, then you will convince me.

I was part of a church where I was not happy with the way they distributed the collections. I felt they were paying the ministry staff too much, so I left. The point of this thread is to display how God can and still does use people today to prophesy. I don't mind that we have taken a little detour to examine this man's character and his past but let's try and focus on his message.

edit on 29-8-2011 by XplanetX because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-8-2011 by XplanetX because: typo

I think Jesus would be pissed off to know that ministers are getting paid to spread his message. Being paid to spread the word pretty much negates your rewards in heaven because you are reaping rewards in the world. I wonder if paid ministers could be part of the "false prophets" and psuedo-christians Jesus said he would cast away as if he never new them? Youre not doing Christ's work if youre getting paid, he was all about suffering in this world to purify you and make you ready for heaven, and if youre making 60,000+ year paycheck for preaching you definately are not suffering!

edit on 30-8-2011 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

Similar to Paul I spread the word with the expectation of receiving nothing. All christians have been given this task by God. Paul makes the point that he does his work for the gospel for no wage so that people with hard hearts do not take offence. He does make it clear that those who devote themselves to spreading the gospel full time deserve a wage.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by XplanetX

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by XplanetX

 

And this man and his ministry he is associated with continue to publish questionable doctrine (Watchmen Nee) and litigiously persecute fellow christian churches for things like copyright and slander (usually around claims of it being a cult)

But I guess we will have to agree to disagree on what makes a true prophet of God.

I think we are on the same team brother.

I am just more cautious to judge, if you can find an explicit case of him teaching a false doctrine and still teaching that false doctrine today, then you will convince me.

I was part of a church where I was not happy with the way they distributed the collections. I felt they were paying the ministry staff too much, so I left. The point of this thread is to display how God can and still does use people today to prophesy. I don't mind that we have taken a little detour to examine this man's character and his past but let's try and focus on his message.

edit on 29-8-2011 by XplanetX because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-8-2011 by XplanetX because: typo

I think Jesus would be pissed off to know that ministers are getting paid to spread his message. Being paid to spread the word pretty much negates your rewards in heaven because you are reaping rewards in the world. I wonder if paid ministers could be part of the "false prophets" and psuedo-christians Jesus said he would cast away as if he never new them? Youre not doing Christ's work if youre getting paid, he was all about suffering in this world to purify you and make you ready for heaven, and if youre making 60,000+ year paycheck for preaching you definately are not suffering!

edit on 30-8-2011 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

I agree with you that they are overpayed, but I believe they still deserve a wage and so does Paul the apostle. Paul's reward in heaven will be greater as he worked to support himself so that he was not a hindrance.

reply to post by XplanetX

How much this man draws as his own income is an unknown. If he is living an opulent lifestyle through profits from God's word, then God will judge him accordingly. He is still entitled to receive an income in the same way that a typical worker recieves an income. (according to scripture)

Well, a man needs a source of income, yes...but making money off doing prophetic work... Im not sure.
I'd like to know where exactly does the bible teach that the prophets were allowed to make money preaching about God? Which of the prophets made money doing prophetic work for God?

Im not judging, nor am I saying I'm more righteous than him, but IMO, prophetic work is more than just any everyday work. So I'm not sure it sounds right that this prophet is selling all these things through his website.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by XplanetX

 

How much this man draws as his own income is an unknown. If he is living an opulent lifestyle through profits from God's word, then God will judge him accordingly. He is still entitled to receive an income in the same way that a typical worker recieves an income. (according to scripture)

Well, a man needs a source of income, yes...but making money off doing prophetic work... Im not sure.
I'd like to know where exactly does the bible teach that the prophets were allowed to make money preaching about God? Which of the prophets made money doing prophetic work for God?

Im not judging, nor am I saying I'm more righteous than him, but IMO, prophetic work is more than just any everyday work. So I'm not sure it sounds right that this prophet is selling all these things through his website.

edit on 30-8-2011 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)

edit on 30-8-2011 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)

On this page I have already posted Paul's 1st letter to the Corinthian church, In chapter 9 starting in verse 3.

I have also stated in this thread that I had to leave a church where I thought that the ministry staff were overpayed. Provided the prophet, teacher or minister is not extracting a large wage but enough to live a modest life, I am okay with it.

reply to post by XplanetX

Provided the prophet, teacher or minister is not extracting a large wage but enough to live a modest life, I am okay with it.

Well, fair enough.
I would not try to get into how much money this prophet has been making with his teachings.