The UK Riots are the future, if not the norm, and here's why.

When you let the banking cartel rob you blind..

When you let the government rob you blind..

When you let the corporations rob you blind..

When you let the crown consolidate your wealth..

You can't really complain about people stealing from the shops on your street.

You also really can't blame a people who sit by while all this happens to them and expect them to stand up to physical riots. They are more interested in observing the outcome and posting it on youtube or facebook.

What did you expect, people to stand up for individual freedom? I kind of did.

Good thing I snapped out of it quickly.


Edit: I don't see this as a UK problem, but rather a global problem. So if you want to play patriot and say I don't understand the UK, I won't debate you. My point is that we sit by and let so much evil occur and then point fingers when we can no longer deny it. No one ever points the finger at themselves, however. Even though we wail about the politicians and bankers and corporate heads having the same lack of insight or morality.

It's sad.

Two hours of ATS chat with at least 6 British people telling you exactly the opposite, and how things are in this country and you came up with that?

Sorry, but

Originally posted by sbctinfantry
When you let the banking cartel rob you blind..

When you let the government rob you blind..

When you let the corporations rob you blind..

When you let the crown consolidate your wealth..

You can't really complain about people stealing from the shops on your street.

You also really can't blame a people who sit by while all this happens to them and expect them to stand up to physical riots. They are more interested in observing the outcome and posting it on youtube or facebook.

What did you expect, people to stand up for individual freedom? I kind of did.

Good think I snapped out of it quick.

Pure And Simply Ignorant.
2nd Line Ditto

Originally posted by sbctinfantry
When you let the banking cartel rob you blind..

When you let the government rob you blind..

When you let the corporations rob you blind..

When you let the crown consolidate your wealth..

You can't really complain about people stealing from the shops on your street.

You also really can't blame a people who sit by while all this happens to them and expect them to stand up to physical riots. They are more interested in observing the outcome and posting it on youtube or facebook.

What did you expect, people to stand up for individual freedom? I kind of did.

Good think I snapped out of it quick.

Are you even from the UK, that post is nothing more than bile In fact I don't even think it deserves this response.

If we are to take the "deny ignorance" approach, why is it so hard to point out that this is the direction society is choosing to head into?

Let's start being honest with eachother for once. This ride is long, hard, and full of surprises. That's life.

Until an innocent person is killed in one of the fires they're setting , then this will be seen for what it is , mindless criminality and violence .
I'm all for the people rising up , but for a cause , not just rob and burn .

Yes they are deserved, but not in the looting, arson and out right criminality kind of way.

It's unfortunate that it has started this way, but we really need to continue and finish this through peaceful non compliance.

reply to post by sbctinfantry


Just because this is a conspiracy website does not mean that everything is a conspiracy. These rioters are nothing more than opportunists that are taking advantage of a situation where htey feel they can justify breaking the law. I can tell you know that the overall view from the British public is that this is unacceptable. The trouble is that the majority of the rioters are black, this will be the catylist for the right wing organisations to start a civil war. The EDL and BNP will be rallied by this as they know they are due to get alot of extra support.

They are not helping themselves or the country, Britain is tollerant and accepting of immigrants but that won't last forever if people keep seeing scenes like these, wether the be racially motivated or not the people will still see the color of their skin on the news and make their own assumptions.

reply to post by sbctinfantry


You can't really talk about our economy when the whole worlds economy is also down the pan. Yes, people shouldn't be rubber necking - but they are, and that's what they do. People don't have any training, and people are scared to go and confront hundreds of people with bricks and fire and frankly watching the police struggle is frightening.

On the subject of the police - they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. Right now, it's "why aren't they stopping it" but if they up the force, police brutality will be called quick as you like. It's happened before. It makes things very difficult. We're fighting against emergency service cuts, and that also doesn't help.

These people are mainly kids, which makes it harder. It boils down to something along these lines: People should bring their kids up better. This means cutting benefits for having kids. Cutting council houses to stop people from having kids in order to gain things. Fair enough, this will be really nasty for some people who genuinely need it but it's being abused, and I agree with the government for cutting this down. THIS is how to stop the riots. It's not as simple as you make it out to be. People are starting to copy-cat riot so they can pick up some shiny new things and take them back to their flats to gloat. If a citizen goes on to the street and tries to stop them, they might have 10-15 people on to them, and are they going to survive? What if they get targetted and no one can help them?

We can't go out there with guns. People are scared to go out there without any way of protecting themselves, and I don't blame them. Britain doesn't and will never act nor think like the US. People need to start realising that. Telling us how to do things over the internet won't help this because you're not here to understand how we work, and probably never will. We're calling Cobra meetings. We're getting the pictures of people rioting and broadcasting them, which will get a response.

London might be burning, but frankly, we're doing the best we can with what we've got.

Originally posted by michael1983l
Just because this is a conspiracy website does not mean that everything is a conspiracy.

A conspiracy, of course not. A lack of motivation, determination, courage, strength, morality, insight, honor, integrity, and general laziness maybe.

As for the rest of your post, you can find fault in anyone at any time, for any thing. It's when you start to point the finger in the mirror that the truth comes out. Unless every person standing on the street can say they did everything they could, I believe they are at worst to blame and at best lazy youtubers and cowards.

I think pacifism is dead. The looters are obviously not pacifist since they can't get their message out in a peaceful way. And the non-violent protesters obviously aren't for peace either since they're more interested in murdering looters than they are in changing the system.

It's no wonder we aren't winning.

I'm from the UK and im sat bang in the middle of it (riots in London)

And im glad its going on. How about that, I really hope this is the spark that starts it all )

You reap what you sow, this is an entire generation who have been abandoned by capitalist society, the rioters are predomantly black youths.In areas of london where unemployment is 50%+ among that section of society and has been for many years.
This has been on the cards for a long time, it just needed a catalyst to start it.

Originally posted by Ayana
reply to post by sbctinfantry

 

You can't really talk about our economy when the whole worlds economy is also down the pan. Yes, people shouldn't be rubber necking - but they are, and that's what they do. People don't have any training, and people are scared to go and confront hundreds of people with bricks and fire and frankly watching the police struggle is frightening.

What I am saying is that it is the future of the world, and it is our faults as individuals to correct it. Not pawn off responsibility for action or inaction to some outside entity like the police or military. These riots will be seen worldwide, and the response will be much the same unless something changes. The human race has become domesticated.

Is it so hard to imagine the citizens bringing the police water and food, organizing vehicle barricades, providing other forms of support in the form of assistance in any variety.

On the subject of the police - they're damned if they do and damned if they don't. Right now, it's "why aren't they stopping it" but if they up the force, police brutality will be called quick as you like. It's happened before. It makes things very difficult. We're fighting against emergency service cuts, and that also doesn't help.

If you live in fear of doing your job, you need to change your job. I spent time in a warzone where if you make a wrong move you could face prosecution, if not death. I was charged with war crimes for bad decisions. Guess what, I still did my job proudly. I held my head up high and was prepared to spend 15 years in jail for a crime. I faced all of that and never faltered, and I'm lucky to have retired out of service honorably with full benefits because I didn't take a deal, or bargain, or jeapordize my ideals. If the police don't have the same conviction, that is a personal issue.

These people are mainly kids, which makes it harder. It boils down to something along these lines: People should bring their kids up better. This means cutting benefits for having kids. Cutting council houses to stop people from having kids in order to gain things. Fair enough, this will be really nasty for some people who genuinely need it but it's being abused, and I agree with the government for cutting this down. THIS is how to stop the riots. It's not as simple as you make it out to be. People are starting to copy-cat riot so they can pick up some shiny new things and take them back to their flats to gloat. If a citizen goes on to the street and tries to stop them, they might have 10-15 people on to them, and are they going to survive? What if they get targetted and no one can help them?

I know we've talked, and I know that you are aware of my background in the military. It's strange that you would bring up children at all. Criminals are criminals. If the parents didn't raise them right, I can understand some concern and desire for reform. That comes later. Right now, crimes are being comitted, and whether it's a man, woman or child, you can't discriminate on account of race / sex / age / religion when it comes to justice. These crimes aren't of ignorance, they are of greed.

We can't go out there with guns. People are scared to go out there without any way of protecting themselves, and I don't blame them. Britain doesn't and will never act nor think like the US. People need to start realising that. Telling us how to do things over the internet won't help this because you're not here to understand how we work, and probably never will. We're calling Cobra meetings. We're getting the pictures of people rioting and broadcasting them, which will get a response.

If the people of the UK felt that they needed guns to defend their streets, they should have risen up to demad gun rights. I don't understand how that is even a logical paragraph. Whatever methods you have to quell a riot are not working. If your solution is to fix it in a few days, then maybe you should tell the population to wait that long. I'm sure they'll be okay with it... right?

London might be burning, but frankly, we're doing the best we can with what we've got.

I fully agree that the UK is underprepared to handle this situation, I'm only stating that the situation is a manifestation of all the poor policies and lack of care on behalf of the people and their government.

So, alpha and omega, at the end of things we come ot a close and agree.

It is easy to talk a big game hiding behind a computer screen but when thugs are roaming streets in your city setting places on fire and looting then you can post about how tough you are and how you would stand up to them. Fact is, you are not there so it is easy to criticize someone else. I think the Brits are holding up pretty well to be honest, they are doing the smart thing and not confronting these people, what would that solve?

Do I think their police could do a better job than what I have read? Of course but they are limited in what they can do for a reason. The British do not believe in gun rights like we in the United States do for a reason. So quit acting like you have some plan laid out on how you would handle every possible event that could occur because fact is, no one expected this.

Originally posted by sbctinfantry
When you let the banking cartel rob you blind..

When you let the government rob you blind..

When you let the corporations rob you blind..

When you let the crown consolidate your wealth..

You can't really complain about people stealing from the shops on your street.

You also really can't blame a people who sit by while all this happens to them and expect them to stand up to physical riots. They are more interested in observing the outcome and posting it on youtube or facebook.

What did you expect, people to stand up for individual freedom? I kind of did.

Good thing I snapped out of it quickly.


Edit: I don't see this as a UK problem, but rather a global problem. So if you want to play patriot and say I don't understand the UK, I won't debate you. My point is that we sit by and let so much evil occur and then point fingers when we can no longer deny it. No one ever points the finger at themselves, however. Even though we wail about the politicians and bankers and corporate heads having the same lack of insight or morality.

It's sad.

edit on 2011/8/8 by sbctinfantry because: (no reason given)

Sadly, many people just don't see it. They are up in arms about the rioters (I'm not condoning violence here) but not about the massive theft, fraud and crimes of the gubberment and the banksters.

Many have said things like they would shoot the protesters - but where is the same indignation about the murders of innocents in Libya, Afghanistan. Where's the indignation about the massive theft of their wealth by the criminal government and banksters?

If there have to be violent riots, I would at least prefer to see the banks, etc, being attacked - but it looks as though many rioters currently are emulating the government itself - and pillaging the small fry.

reply to post by sbctinfantry


its so sad so many fall into this category. an then they blast you. guess they love crooks as long as they arent stealing what the cunsomers want. star an flag good job op

reply to post by Misoir

"they are doing the smart thing and not confronting these people- what would that solve"?! sputter..
cant even fathom that logic.. the organized criminals /terrorists running amok in england must love that attitude.
"if god did not mean for them to be sheared ,he would not have made them sheep". as the
bandit leader says in magnificent seven..
and i am behind my computer screen in the middle of phoenix arizona.. now just a old guy with a double barrel shotgun handy..honestly, how many of these type thugs have i ever confronted? actually quiet a few..have i ever used a gun? several times..a sword cane one night. i've had a fractured skull, broken collarbone, broke my knuckle..(dont count on winnin em all)..but id sooner die on my feet than live on my knees. and i'm far more inclined to respond with a gun these days. i'm crippled up and cranky..i dont call the police. and neither do the neighbors..we live around a city park, mostly hard working mexicans. no trouble here in the three years i been here. it wouldnt be tolerated..it would be dealt with.

Originally posted by Misoir
It is easy to talk a big game hiding behind a computer screen but when thugs are roaming streets in your city setting places on fire and looting then you can post about how tough you are and how you would stand up to them. Fact is, you are not there so it is easy to criticize someone else. I think the Brits are holding up pretty well to be honest, they are doing the smart thing and not confronting these people, what would that solve?

Do I think their police could do a better job than what I have read? Of course but they are limited in what they can do for a reason. The British do not believe in gun rights like we in the United States do for a reason. So quit acting like you have some plan laid out on how you would handle every possible event that could occur because fact is, no one expected this.

I was a US Army Infantryman and am medically retired due to injuries sustained in combat operations in Iraq. I will be glad to share some credentials with you if you are willing to do the same.

I have also challenged my local police department over the misuse of government funds called the STEP Program (Selective Traffic Enforcement Program) where officers were being paid to write speeding tickets, but unable to assist even a crime they happen upon or a stranded motorist. The going rate for this program? > $45 an hour. Provided by the DOT to use the pulbic like an ATM machine to generate revenue. It was corrupt and I risked a lot speaking out, but I have gotten enough people to push the city council next time it comes up for renewal.

I also saved a soldiers life who was trying to kill himself, and then protected myself from him as he turned the knife on me.

I also stood trial for a war crime and was offered deals while being threatened with 15 years in prison, I fought it and got out honorably with full benefits.

I also have a picture in my media of my kevlar helmet with a bullet hole through it. Check for yourself.

I have plenty of examples of doing the right thing, pushing myself and being the best person, father and American I can be. If someone doesn't love their ideals enough to fight for them or put them on the line, then they deserve what they get.

I'm sorry if my message is unpopular, or rash. It is the truth. We as a people, as a race, are domesticated. If you want to keep living the lie, that's more than fine with me. To me, freedom is a decision you make when you awaken each day, and protection of it and any of your ideals sometimes means blood and sweat.

It's sad that the only ones willing to give up that sweat and blood in the UK are the looters.


Edit; I hit post thinking that I didn't have to add that we are here to "Deny Ignorance" but we are so quick to judge an opposing view harshly and as a group without even weighing the merits, or based off an impression of the messenger. The truth doesn't always come from a happy pretty place, the truth isn't always kind, and it's not always popular. Maybe some of you can take that advice to heart.

To sum up the negative reaction that I got in chat for this idea today:

"When fires are raging all around you, and people are looting, if you do something then something bad might happen to you. So do nothing and let your houses burn down."

I've spent all day trying to understand this logic.

Help me, please.