The Tea Party Republicans Are Responsible For The Ratings Downgrade

Democrats and republicans are both respomnsible for this mess.The actual people who where running the government while all of this spending occured.

This thread is one big fail train. Default is impossible when you print your own cash. Until you're ready to move past this ridiculous us vs them left vs right mentality we will never make any real eadway in this country. Since your have a short term memory issue, may I remind you Obama is the one that threatened default. The repubs said no new taxes. Obama wanted compromise but upon examination his "compromise" means " my way or the highway". Financial collapse hits in less than one year in my opinion so S&P did the veeerrrryyyy least it could do

reply to post by faithparadigm


You are totally wrong. Obama and the democrats would have voted a simple bill to raise the debt ceiling that would have prevented default, something that has been done numerous times in the past without one side threatening to make the country default if they didn’t get their way, as the republican tea party did this time.

Originally posted by inforeal
All this noise doesn’t come close to refuting the simple facts I posted. S&P stated in their official reason for the downgrade:

predictability of American policymaking and political institutions have weakened at a time of ongoing fiscal and economic challenges to a degree

Now look closely at the statement and see:

Predictability refers to the fact that in the past, although there has been dispute along political lines, nevertheless the politicians at least had the sense not to threaten default in the past.

Who in this instance threatened default?

Unfortunately you folks are merely defending something you have inwardly become attached to. This is making you not see what is clear and simple. Shouldn’t we here try to DENY IGNORANCE and be objective?

Who in the budget dispute threatened default? The answer is the Republican Tea party. Infact many of them said default was no big thing, such as Michelle Bachman.

Obama bent way over, many believe too far over to placate their demands, and they still threatened to default the US economy if they didn’t get their way.

JUST THE FACTS MAN, JUST THE FACTS

INFOREAL!

It might end up being a good thing to get this ridiculous spending and government under control.Might lead to rough times but maybe it will help people realzie this kind fo debt in isane to be in/\.The same ole history of repeating this default from happening is gonna happen anyways.Greece and Italy and both about to default on their debt.

If someone does not puit their foot down and say ENOUGH!!! the default will occur later and be even worse than it all ready would have been.Italy and Greece are both headed towards a default.

Originally posted by beezzer

Liberal/Progressve poster; Tea Party started this. They are bad. They ruined everything.

Tea Party/conservatve/or just a practical minded response;

Well, to be honest, the tea Party probably IS going to "ruin" everything that liberals and progressives stand for, so folks can probably expect them to scream bloody murder, cry, wring their hands, and claim that the Tea party people eat babies without salt.

It's the same drill for anyone that bucks their agenda. Target and demonize.

Matter of fact, that may be how I decide to vote - just vote for whoever the liberal/progressive types are demonizing the worst, and you can't go wrong, since those are obviously the folks who are the worst threat to the intrusive "big government" agenda.

Originally posted by SeventhSeal

Originally posted by MidnightTide
All I hear from OP is blame the Republicans, blame the tea party - when are we finally going to see a Liberal admit that the left has the equal share in the mess the financial markets are in.

I am guessing I will see a pig fly first.


reply to post by SeventhSeal

 

Sorry, the money has run out, people will start to have to look out for themselves - as it should be.

edit on 7-8-2011 by MidnightTide because: (no reason given)

Are you another member who forgot we had 8 years of a Republican President destroying this country and its economy?

Seriously.

Wake up.

And look at how much MORE damage a Democrat has achieved in less than 3 years compared to that 8! Them boys are hell on wheels, ain't they?

reply to post by ogbert

Ron Paul, speaking to university students actually suggests, calling all of the social programs a failure and starting over with a 10% flat tax across the board to manage the government with nothing coming back. This would leave many elderly to starve or depend on family, not to mention what would happen to the sick.

I prefer it direct from the source not filtered through a reporter with an agenda.

So,What did Ron Paul ACTUALLY say

Q: Are you still in favor of abolishing Social Security?

A: Yes, but not overnight. As a matter of fact, my program’s the only one that is going to be able to take care of the elderly.

I’d like to get the young people out of it, just the younger generation, because there’s no money there, and they’re going to have to pay 50 years and they’re not going to get anything. I’d take care of all the elderly, all those who are dependent, but I would save the money from this wild spending overseas.
Source: 2008 GOP debate in Boca Raton Florida Jan 24, 2008

Let people get out of Social Security; it’s a failure
Right now they’re getting behind because they’re having a 10% to 12% inflation rate and we give them a 2% increase, and they’re really hurting. I don’t want taxes on the Social Security benefits that they receive. I have a bill in that would secure the trust fund, where none of that money could be spent in the general revenues. So in many ways, the goal would be to get us out of this program that is a failure. It doesn’t work, and is going to bankrupt this country. The only way you can do that is save enough money, tide the people over, let the young people get out, because they’re going to be paying all these years and they’re not going to get anything. I probably have the only program that would really help the elderly because the money’s not going to be there. There’s no way these cost-of-living increases are ever going to keep up with their benefits are never going to keep up with their cost of living. They’re decreasing. My program has a better chance of helping them than any other one.
Source: 2008 GOP debate in Boca Raton Florida Jan 24, 2008

Never voted to spend one penny of Social Security money
Q: You said in 1988 that you would abolish Social Security. You’re OK with Social Security now?

A: I think we need to offer the kids the chance to get out. But right now, if we don’t save the money, we can’t take care of the other. I never voted to spend one penny of Social Security money. So I’m the one that has saved it. I say take that money--and I say this constantly--don’t turn anybody out on the streets--people we have conditioned--but I would say take care of the people that are dependent on us. The only way you can do that is cut spending. If we don’t, they’re all going to be out in the street. Because right now Social Security beneficiaries are getting 2% raises, but their cost of living is going up 10%. A dollar crisis is going to wipe them all out.... www.ontheissues.org...

Originally posted by eNumbra
- Tea party becomes an official political party and politicians run under it's banner and some even get elected.

When did that happen?
It only took a year to go from "there is no tea party, we are just ordinary Americans" to suggesting they are an actual party and won seats running in it. Some people forget history and some make it up.

reply to post by inforeal

And at what point do we stop enough debt? Since March of 1962, the federal debt ceiling has been raised: 69 times. That is 49 years, and about 1.4 times a year, the debt ceiling has been voted on, and raised. So when do we say enough is enough, we can no longer afford to continually raise it up? That is fiscal irresponsiblity on the part of the government and someone had to say enough.
Even our creditors, the biggest ones were scared of what they were seeing in the fiscal policies. This worry has led to a lack of confidence. And if there is a lack of confidence, they are not so willing to lend money.

Originally posted by inforeal
We can thank the fanatic tea party and their republican lackeys for the first downgrade of American bonds in history.

Indeed there is no doubt their blackmail scheme to threaten the country with default ( by not raising the debt ceiling) if they didn’t get their way is the direct reason for the downgrade. They essentially signaled that the American system is no longer tenable and unreliable.

Read the S&P explanation for the downgrade:

“More broadly, the downgrade reflects our view that the effectiveness, stability, and predictability of American policymaking and political institutions have weakened at a time of ongoing fiscal and economic challenges to a degree more than we envisioned when we assigned a negative outlook to the rating on April 18, 2011.”

Obama tried to be conciliatory and maintain the integrity of the political structure but the republican tea party ruptured moderation with their fanatic blackmail and threats to destabilize the American economy by threatening not to raise the debt ceiling at a time when the American economy is in a precarious condition bordering on another depression as the above words indicates: time of ongoing fiscal and economic challenges

For those who think the tea party are good, quaint, and useful then this proves you are in grave error and that their fanaticism can and likely will be the catalyst for the destruction of the American economic system if they are not soon reined in.

www.salon.com.../tech/htww/2011/08/05/standard_and_poors_downgrade

“House Republicans refused to compromise. House Republicans refused a grand bargain that liberals viewed as a massive step backwards for progressives. House Republicans own this credit downgrade.”

edit on 6-8-2011 by inforeal because: typo

You took a snippet from S&P just to make it lean towards your interests. If Obama was trying so hard to stop this...pay attention on this question... WHERE WAS HIS PLAN? Obama had nothing to bring to the table. All he said was "i want to raise the debt ceiling" and had everyone else do the grunt work. It's obvious this man is in no way shape or form a leader. You're ignorant to believe a group of people with no majority vote in any house is to blame. Pure ignorance.
Also... I like your second snippet. Not quoting S&P, but quoting salon.com to help prove your lies. You shouldn't be allowed to start threads.

reply to post by sdcigarpig


First of all, Bush is responsible for 6.1 trillion of the new debt out of 14 trillion, Obama is 2.4 trillion.

WHERE WAS ALL THE DEBT OBSESSION WHEN BUSH WAS DOING WORST?

ALL OF A SUDDEN A BLACK DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT AND THE REPUBLICANS GO CRAZY OVER DEBT.

WHERE WERE THEY WHEN BUSH WAS DOING IT?

THE LAST TIME THE DEFICIT WAS BALANCED BTW WAS UNDER BILL CLINTON! GEORGE BUSH SENT THE DEBT INTO THE STRATOSPHERE

reply to post by Athin


It is you who is ignorant. That quote is from the S&P statement, I used the link to the source it is from, so be careful throwing around insults if it is you who is the ignorant party.

You have no intelligent response to my post all you did was insult me, therefore it is you who should be banned from posting, not me.

You have not come close to refuting anything I have posted so come back when you can contribute some intelligence to the thread and not insults that reflect on you

reply to post by inforeal


Completely agree. The Republicans wanted everything to be done their way and they practically took the american people hostage by saying 'If we don't get our way then you're all going to have to suffer'. They took a huge and very selfish risk that has now caused one of the most detrimental things we were trying to avoid in the debt talks.

Then again we wouldn't have had to worry about the debt talks or losing our credit rating if Obama had actually done what he promised but instead he just extended everything that Bush did, created a healthcare bill that nobody actually wanted (putting us trillions more in debt) and has thus far caved to the Republicans every demand.

But the point is the downgrade of our credit rating could have been avoided if the Republicans hadn't been so selfish and agreed to a balanced compromise much earlier in the talks. No matter how much they don't like taxes they have to realize that taxes are necessary to raise revenue. I don't care how many pledges Grover Norquist makes you sign, at some point you just have to say to yourself, "My economy and country are more important than some damn pledge that I signed to get votes".

reply to post by wlffmn27


Believe me I am no fan of the fraud Obama, I think he is a terrible president. Read the many threads I have started denouncing this wimp and or turncoat.

In this case he should have called their bluff or threatened, like they threatened default, to invoke the 14th amendment, but Obama didn’t have the guts to do that.

If he is a coward he should have never ran for president and at least let Hillary have it, she has more courage than him

reply to post by inforeal


Exactly. By the time he said that he was even considering using the 14th amendment it was too late anyway.

Whatever way you look at it both sides deserve the blame for this mess. It's absolutely ridiculous the way these people act. The thing that angers me the most is the childish slandering and the whole idea that they're in office to do what's right for their party and not their country.

reply to post by inforeal


Lol aw man, I knew when reading just the title you were gonna take some serious flak. You know how right wing this board is.

Me thinks you did this on purpose. Nice troll.

this should be titled "Shoot the Messenger If It makes You Feel Better"

reply to post by crimvelvet


reply to post by crimvelvet


Yeah,

It was an opt-out suggestion. Been a few months since i heard it. I didn't remember the opt-out part, but this is still how they are thinking.

Just search google ron paul opt-out flat tax and there are plenty of vids of him him suggesting this. Austerity is the trend.

Also, i've heard him mention Austrian economics, which in my opinion is better than voodoo economics. However, we need an equal playing ground, as the corporations have usurped too much power. If a corporation can be deemed to be like an individual; then how come they can own other corporations, without being guilty of slavery?

Also, we had a gold standard during the Great Depression--they simply horde the gold. Why not greenbacks? look where they got Lincoln and JFK.

Og

Ron Paul called it. The REAL father of the Tea Party is saying www.newsmax.com... how there will be a backlash from the real Tea Partiers. The tea Party was co-opted by fake ass conservatives like Palin, Bachmann and Perry. If you don't vote Ron Paul, you vote for debt slavery for yourself, your kids, your parents, your aunts/uncles and grand kids for THE REST OF THEIR LIVES!!!!!!!!