Odd Fellows

The order of Odd-Fellows was formed in England in 1812 as a completed organization, though some lodges date back to 1745; and it was introduced into America in 1819. In the "Odd-Fellows' Improved Pocket Manual" the author writes: "Our institution has instinctively, as it were, copied after all secret associations of religious and moral character." The "North-West Odd-Fellow Review" (May, 1895) declares: "No home can be an ideal one unless the principles of our good and glorious Order are represented therein, and its teachings made the rule of life." In the "New Odd-Fellows' Manual" (N.Y., 1895) the author says: "The written as well as the unwritten secret work of the Order, I have sacredly kept unrevealed," though the book is dedicated "to all inquirers who desire to know what Odd-Fellowship really is." This book tells us "Odd-Fellowship was founded on great religious principles" (p. 348); "we use forms of worship" (p. 364); "Judaism, Christianity, Mohammedanism recognize the only living and true God" (p. 297). The Odd-Fellows have chaplains, altars, high-priests, ritual, order of worship, and funeral ceremonies.

taken from www.newadvent.org...

From my understanding of the organization as it is today is that it is a "Friendly Society."
It was originally an offshoot of Freemasonry but eventually gave up all the secret handshake stuff to become a straight forward association that largely does private health insurance and the like, as does "The Druids" who I was a paid up member for 21 years.
My grand-dad reckoned that they were all above board so he chose them as my health-care provider.

Thanks for the info Chief, I appreciate it. Senrak, You are a Knight of Pythias, right? Would you care to comment for me on this excerpt from the link Cheif provided above?

originally from: www.newadvent.org...

The order of the Knights of Pythias was founded in 1864 by prominent Freemasons (Cyclop. of Fraternities, p. 263). In number, its membership is second only to that of the Odd-Fellows. Rosen (The Catholic Church and Secret Societies) says: "The principal objectionable features, on account of which the Catholic Church has forbidden its members to join the Knights of Pythias, and demanded a withdrawal of those who joined it, are: First, the oath of secrecy by which the member binds himself to keep secret whatever concerns the doings of the Order, even from those in Church and State who have a right to know, under certain conditions, what their subjects are doing. Secondly, this oath binds the member to blind obedience, which is symbolized by a test. Such an obedience is against the law of man's nature, and against all divine and human law. Thirdly, Christ is not the teacher and model in the rule of life but the pagan Pythagoras and the pagans Damon, Pythias and Dionysius" (p. 160). The "Ritual for the subordinate Lodges of the Knights of Pythias" (Chicago, 1906) shows that this organization has oaths, degrees, prelates, and a ritual that contains religious worship.

I kind of thought there might have been a connection between them and Pythagoras merely by the name, but I have not researched them much. No offense Cheif, but I have issues with ther Catholic Church so I take what I hear from them with a grain of salt. I find it humorous that one of the reasons they condemn this organization is they are bound to "blind obedience". If that isn't the pot calling the kettle black.

Cheif, you only pasted from the article. I'm curious; What is your take on them (Odd Fellows or the Knights of Pythias) as a Catholic and as a member of the Knights of Columbus? Aren't you bound to obedience and loyalty as well?

-A

I don't know a lot about the Odd Fellows or Knights of Pythias, however, since the Catholic Church forbids membership in these societies, I would never see myself involved with them. However, it would be interesting to know what they are all about.

I was more aiming to get a comment out of you pertaining to this statement:

Secondly, this oath binds the member to blind obedience, which is symbolized by a test. Such an obedience is against the law of man's nature, and against all divine and human law.

But don't the Knights of Columbus and indeed the church itself require "blind obedience"? Sure seems to me that they do.

You are a member of the KoC, are you not? Perhaps I misread that somewhere.

[edit on 10/18/04 by The Axeman]

Oops. Sorry, technical difficulties...

[edit on 10/18/04 by The Axeman]

In the context of that statement, blind obedience, referring to be obedient at all times without knowing what the consequences of the actions are. In the Catholic church, or the K of C, we dont' blindly follow commands...we are educated on matters of faith, and it is up to us to follow them or not. As Knights, we are to uphold our status in the community as an honourable Catholic gentlemen, but we never have to follow commands from superior officers, without knowing what it's all about. K of C isn't a secret society, we have no hidden agenda. We are trying to build a better world one council at a time.

Amazing how similar your response is to that of a Freemason who has had the integrity of his fraternity questioned. Almost identical. Not that I am questioning the integrity of the KoC, I think that alot of good can come from such organizations. I would imagine there are alot more similarities than differences between the KoC or KoP or the IOOF or Freemasons, for that matter.

chief_counsellor

You’re incorrect about the Catholic Church... They do not forbid membership like allot of fraternal originations they are based on religion. I am not stating that IOOF is a backed catholic organization but look at Phi Kappa Theta it is a Catholic Fraternity. I know a lot of catholic members.

IOOF... original manuals, lodge meeting minutes, constitutions/bylaws & misc documents from the late 1800s.

www.archive.org...

as for GUOOF...

Interesting little tidbit of history... according to wikipedia & answers.com:

"The Grand United Order of Odd Fellows is a fraternal organization founded in 1843 for black members. Created at a time when the IOOF was primarily a white-only organization, the GUOOF obtained its charter directly from the Manchester Unity in Great Britain and the American IOOF organization had no control over it. Although still in existence, membership in the US has declined, due to the mainstream IOOF no longer being segregated and the decline in fraternal membership in general."

....and found "The Official History and Manual of the Grand United Order of Odd Fellows in America: A Chronological Treatise" from 1902 on google books books.google.com...

Fascinating... even with F L T (Friendship, Love & Truth) in the forefront of their mission, that they once separated their brothers and sisters (members) based on race and gender (Rebekahs).

Originally posted by The All Seeing I
Fascinating... even with F L T (Friendship, Love & Truth) in the forefront of their mission, that they once separated their brothers and sisters (members) based on race and gender (Rebekahs).

It's really not all that fascinating if you consider the era in which these organizations were in their prime. The Odd Fellows weren't the only group with high ideals that was segregated or single-sex, that was the way society was at the time (right or wrong). Everyone and everything is a product of enviornment.

The Odd Fellows started allowing females to join the formerly all-male Lodge some years ago, yet the Rebekah Lodge still exists. However, neither is a very big organization like it was at one time. Fraternal groups in many ways are part of a by-gone era.

Regards,

Senrak,

Freemason, Odd Fellow and Druid (yeah, that's right...Druid...talk about a dead fraternal group) :-)

Wow, talk about a blast from the past!

Another couple of weeks and it would have been 4 years since the last post!

Originally posted by senrak
Senrak,

Freemason, Odd Fellow and Druid (yeah, that's right...Druid...talk about a dead fraternal group) :-)

Next time I watch This is Spinal Tap, when "Stonehenge" starts, I'm thinkin' of you, man.

In ancient times, hundreds of years before the dawn of history, an ancient race of people... the Druids. No one knows who they were or what they were doing...

Indeed. (Or as we used to say in my D&D campaigns around 1988, Druids vote for Bush.)

Here's my experience with od fellows.

Awhile ago, I and others had leased a hall in an odd fellows building. The hall was on the main floor, 6 or so steps up from street level, with a balcony at one end and a stage at the other.

Half a flight up from the hall level was a managers appartment/office.
Half a flight up from that was a hall with many hanging pics, many of the all seeing eye.

Adjacent to this hall on either side wer rooms. The rooms were all different shapes, length and some had alters, some were long and narrow, some had large tables with alot of chairs.

at the end was a kitchen. To the right, another hallway with more rooms left and right.

One room had a huge assortment of mideaval clothing, armor, weaponry and, on a shelf about 7 feet up the wall, a coffin.

Inside the coffin was a human skeleton with meat like jerky on some bones, limbs and joints wired together, red reflectors in the eye sockets and a hook screwed into the top of the spine.

Across the hall, down a few doors, was a door that lead into a huge chamber/hall at about 2 stories from the chamber/hall floor. If you stepped through the door, you would plummet about 20+ feet.

Again, every room had a different dimension and nothing was similar.

After almost stepping through the "door to nowhere", a decision was made to take the arm from the skeleton and report it. Half way back, by the kitchen, the lights were off now, and instinctively, a lighter was lit for some lighting, but as it was lit, it was noticed that the gas was flowing from the range. Fortunately, there was no explosion. A creepy feeling came over us, and returning the limb was somehow an urge almost hypnotic.

After returning the limb, on the way down, the manager was in the stairway glaring.

This happened a week after the hall was leased.

In the week prior to exploring, many times old men, I mean really old, looking like the old preacher in the movie "Poltergeist", would disappear upstairs, and would not come back down the entire time.

We exploreed once again, wondering where these men had gone, but the hall off the kitchen to the casket room and door to chamber was walled off so professionally, that you would never know it existed.

Later, talking to a local who had explored further a bit before us, we were told there was a large room past our search that had hundreds of coffins in it.

A decision was made to pack up and leave after the skeleton and gas thing.

While loading some items, standing in the bed of my truck, Just as I bent over to set down an item, a gunshot went off and a bullet flew over my head at the height I was just standing prior.

Looking up, I saw a hole in the managers window and I ran back to the building enterance for cover. I alerted those with me, and armed with items and a couple knives only, we headed for the apartment, with the caution of special forces.

As we flanked the apartment door, signaling to time an entry, the door opened.

Out walked the manager and we subdued him promptly. Withing seconds, we had him in tears, and when he was finally allowed to speak, out came his story.

An inlaw he lived with, gone on a trip, had left a sidearm under a couch cushion, loaded with hairpin trigger.

He found it, and picking it up, it discharged.

Casing the interior, we found it had shot through a horn in a stereo speaker in front of the window, out, over my head, and it did ricochet off a building across the street.

After giving the manager an emotional sentence deemed appropriate, (if even possible), we made him break the lease and said goodbye.

Later doing some research, it seems that the departed are stored on the premises, and the skeleton we found may be used in some form of ritual.

I should have used this for the contest, but being a true story, I'll post it here.

I would like some comments/feedback from any members that may shed light on the things stored and the strange rooms and pictures, etc...witnessed at Odd Fellows.

Originally posted by infinite
My dad is a member and all they do is sit around and drink beer lol I don't think he has ever attended a meeting

My father and grandfather were president and VP of the odd fellows,

I don't know what they did.

But I did some research, I have a Knights of Pythias sword.

interesting stuff

en.wikipedia.org...

www.pythias.org...

It bases its lessons and builds it ritual largely on the familiar story of the friendship of Damon and Pythias, who were historical characters living about four hundred or more years before the beginning of the Christian era. They were members of a school, founded by Pythagoras, who was known as the father of Greek philosophy.

The suggestion made by the President( Lincoln) was adopted. An application was made to Congress for a charter, and the Order of Knights of Pythias was the first American Order ever chartered by an Act of the Congress of the United States.

[edit on 123030p://bTuesday2008 by Stormdancer777]

gee imdizc4funn...
that was one hell of a trip...
you should consider entering that contest
and putting such posts in BTS and not ATS
you would most likely get some constructive feedback on how to twik it
where as here, it's just annoying


now for the rest of you guys...
not to take the spot light away from other societies
note: the thread is titled "Odd Fellows" afterall

...
can anyone tell me what "secret ceremony(s)"
this item would have been used for?

www.loudonvillefolkart.com...

[edit on 23-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]

Originally posted by The All Seeing I
can anyone tell me what "secret ceremony(s)"
this item would have been used for?

www.loudonvillefolkart.com...

The rituals of the Odd Fellows (like those of the Masons) are generally based upon Old Testament stories, including that of the Ark of the Covenant. One of the Odd Fellows Degrees deals with Moses, one with Aaron, etc.

As for the skeleton mentioned earlier, it's used as a reminder of mortality (some symbol used in Masons, Knights of Pythias, etc.) Many Odd Fellows Lodges have real skeletons (bodies donated or from medical research...not murder victims, of course) My own Lodge had a paper-mache' skeleton that looked fairly real, but I've seen real ones in Lodges too.

As for a room with a lot of coffins, I'm not sure. I do know that some of the larger Masonic buildings have crypts where their members may choose to have their bodies interred. The Masonic Scottish Rite building in St. Louis has one, but it's never been used for burial, just storage.

It's accessed from the inside, and is under the front stairs shown here:

www.scottishrite-stl.org...

It's possible the Odd Fellows had similar facilities.

www.ioof.org...

My Dear ATS Odd Fellows;
Axeman
Senrak
Infinite
Chief_Counsellar
MrNeCROS
JoshNorton
Stormdancer777
...sorry Imd12cltfunn you didn't make the cut... for obvious/fictional reasons

Gentleman (& Ladies, if i have assumed plumbing wrong)

I just wanted to say thank you for your generosity
even those that went off on loose associations.

I am currently working on a Tinwiki entry on the Odd Fellows,
and many of your insights have pointed me into uncharted waters.
I have gain a wealth of knowledge on the Odd Fellows as a result.

On this venture, i was trying to nail down a founding date for the organization... and one of the earliest accounts i came across was
in 1696; Daniel Defoe, English writer, journalist, and pamphleteer, who gained enduring fame for his novel Robinson Crusoe, mentioned a 'Society of Odd Fellows', though verification of the actual quote has not been found.

In his own days "Defoe was regarded as an unscrupulous, diabolical journalist. Defoe used a number of pen names, including Eye Witness, T.Taylor, and Andrew Morton, Merchant. His most unusual pen name was 'Heliostrapolis, secretary to the Emperor of the Moon",' used on his political satire The Consolidator, or Memoirs of Sundry Transactions from the World in the Moon (1705). His political writings were widely read and made him powerful enemies.

Does anyone have any solid verifiable reference to the founding date of the organization... earlier then Defoe? ... and just out of curiosities sake... does anyone know what "Heliostrapolis" meanings ... i have searched but found nothing.

[edit on 28-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]

reply to post by The All Seeing I


It may sound strange, far fetched whatever, but it is 100% true.
I even have one item from the room of old armor/coffin.

Believe what you may, I have great plumbing.

Let's play show and tell shall we?

I show you one of mine and you show
a photo from any you claim.

Here's a member pin that i found in a mall parking lot over 10 yrs ago,
my first introduction to IOOF existance.



my 2nd introduction was during a cemetery photo shoot this past summer...
which reminds me to transfer the pics from the camera.




[edit on 28-9-2008 by The All Seeing I]