This Forum Should Be Closed Down !

reply to post by ProRipp

New engines ?
C'mon Essen open your mind back up I credit you with more intelligence than that my friend ?

You may want to have a read through this:

Experimental Test of the Influence of Propulsion
Efficiency on Contrail Formation

Originally posted by SaberTruth
I'm going to take the anti-chemtrail tact and just write off all their photos as hoaxes, ignore gradual changes over decades most of them don't even remember, claim that because I can come up with another possible explanation that it must be the real one, tell people they can't believe their lyin' eyes or memories, and demand they post 500 photos so I can still brush it all aside.

Seriously, with all the photos and videos and links posted in this thread, adding more to the pile won't convince the unconvinceable... and we have already stated that both sides do this.

Pictures can prove things however. Pictures of persistent contrails, or crossing contrailsl do not prove that there is a conspiracy of secret aircraft spraying us with chemicals.

Pictures can however disprove the assertion by chemtrailers that persistent contrails did not exist until the 90s, or that aircraft did not have intersecting/parallel contrails back then either.

A picture of an Airbus 340, flying alongside an Boeing 707, can prove that one plane can make contrails while another one is not

reply to post by firepilot


Ive never stated they were spraying 'us' my stance is they are spraying in the knowledge
that it is benefitting the planet !
But for me and in my opinion and my (rapidly) advancing years they ARE spraying 'something' !

Peace

Originally posted by Adyta
If any forum should be shut down, it's the dream / prediction forum. Nobody cares that you had a dream Obama was from another planet and he is secretly pilfering this planet of it's sea salts.

It's such an absurd forum.

It's good entertainment to read though and i suspect half the people in that forum are their for that only purpose. to be entertained. so what if it doesnt say fiction....if you want to pretend it is and let it entertain you then go for it. if not then DON"T GO VISIT THAT FORUM.


Why is it in America we think Everybody has to do what we want. Why should thousands/ millions of people no be allowed to post those topics because you don't think they should ? Really.....it should shut down just for you?

Uhhh Selfish much ?

Originally posted by SaberTruth

Originally posted by firepilot
Higher bypass turbofans are more likely to make contrails, than older turbojet engines.

I called this one! Maybe I should join one of those predictions threads. o.O

Would you like to read a scientific report, that states exactly what I just said? What did you think of the photo?

I hard mention in another thread of the planes turnining 180 and going back from where they came !
This was pounced on by a long standing member of ATS who shall remain nameless, who questioned the validity of
such a manouvre !

www.youtube.com...

Peace

reply to post by ProRipp

Anyone thinking that chemtrails are anything other than **fiction** needs to contact a psychiatrist, --not a psychologist --because as you know, only psychiatrists can prescribe drugs, and MEDICATION will surely be needed by those people!! You're seeing boogey-men in the skies. Yeah, that's right: "BOOGEY-MEN IN THE SKIES." So go wear your plastic-blend aluminum hat and protective goggles. I hear a certain brand of air freshener is ideal to counteract the stuff "they" are spraying, but I won't reveal the brand or scent.

Please hold the last paragraph as my feeble attempt at sarcasm. It was written to illustrate the *usual* kind of debunker ridicule that comes at people posting about the validity of the chemtrail phenomenon. As you can see, "debunkers" usually provide no evidence, themselves. Rather, they attack the person, not the idea. It's called "research by proclomation." In other words, simply ridicule an idea and then proclaim it to be nonesense. No evidence needed. Just mention any of the following: aluminum hat, medication, boogey-men, etc. Then just inappropriately connect the phenomenon with Bigfoot, the Lochness Monster, Chupacabra or Mothman. Sorry if my first paragraph incensed anyone, it was pure satire of the debunker mindset.

And how is an airplane turning, evidence of anything beside that it turned? Would you prefer that it was made illegal for airplanes to turn?

If there's so much evidence, then why can't the theorists actually collect it in one place?

What they need is a web site that:

A) Contains the best evidence to support the theory, in an easily accessible form (i.e., not buried in 90 minute YouTube videos, or in 300 page discussion threads, just laid out neatly).
B) Removes evidence that is shown to be false (and actively request and seek out corrections).

Now why exactly does such a site not exist? Don't you want to convince anyone?

reply to post by ProRipp

But for me and in my opinion and my (rapidly) advancing years they ARE spraying 'something' !

Look....that is such an easy claim to make. And, anyone can "believe" anything, obviously.

Problem with a "belief" is.....unless you have evidence it is still just a personal opinion, absent any substantiation.

In this case, the SOLID evidence belies these claims and "beliefs"... with the proper understanding, experience, and knowledge of the science and technical aspects.

Another thing that should investigated by the "believers" is the connection to the very, very real charlatans who promote this "chem"-trail myth. THEY have gotten a lot of people all het up, and wrapped around the axle --- a lot of those people are just ignorant of science, and have fallen for the hype and hoax, because of that dearth of knowledge.

So.....those gullible, and earnest "believers" do the work of the hucksters, for them!! And, it just has snowballed ever since......

reply to post by GhostLancer


I hope your not telling me that the chupacabra does'nt exist ?
How very dare you !

Peace

As you can see, "debunkers" usually provide no evidence, themselves. Rather, they attack the person, not the idea. It's called "research by proclomation." In other words, simply ridicule an idea and then proclaim it to be nonesense. No evidence needed.

I don't get it. The debunkers are providing all the evidence. Example, it was asked why two planes at the same apparent height could produce different trails, and this incredibly detailed research study was given that explains it.

elib.dlr.de...

So how is that providing no evidence?

reply to post by weedwhacker


As stated at the outset WW it's my personal opinion based on my age and
experience throughout those years !
But I Bet youe got a 'switch of DEATH' on your plane eh ?

Have ya go on have ya ? ha ha ha

All in good spirit

Peace

reply to post by weedwhacker


I am glad to see you in the chemtrail arena Weed.

I gave up. I have came to the conclusion that these "believers" (since I am in the "denier" category) are just like religous people, it is a faith thing. That is all I am going to say because I know where it is going to go.

Have a good day.

reply to post by ProRipp


So....based on this response, you wish to be viewed as if trolling with this thread topic and OP?

I mean....it looks that way (not just this reply, but a pattern of a few others). You may wish to clarify, because some of those responses come off as flippant.

AS TO the OP.....really, this Forum and "Fragile Earth" are similar.....but, I think of this one as a sub-set of "FE", in a way. Because, the Earth has many other aspects, besides just the atmosphere and climate.

reply to post by vermonster

It's alarming to me to see that there are apparently a good number of ats members who seem to only enjoy reading chemtrail threads and then expressing their disbelief in them......that doesn't sound like an interesting way to pass the time to me....

Vermonster, it shouldn't be that alarming to you. The chemtrail conspiracy comes complete with people paid to sit on their computers and debunk them. And the more political activism and awareness that results, the harder they are gonna be working to try to make people think that this scenario is scientifically improbable. Consider this....there are plenty of people who hold the same kind of positions these ATS "debunkers" claim to have that say chemtrails are real. It's the same situation with 9/11. The paid shills are abundant on threads on that topic always trying to claims their scientific knowledge confirms the O.S. If their scientific knowledge is so sound, then why are there so many others scientists, engineers, etc., that say the opposite?

They try to play on the general population's overall lack of knowledge of science and physics in attempt to manipulate people into focusing less on the other evidence that is less scientific. Not every single piece of evidence in either of these topics relies completely on science for it to be fact.

reply to post by weedwhacker


Apologies if I seemed flippant that wasn't my intention !
I was trying to keep the thread light-hearted not trying to offend either side in any way !
My stance is that, for me the things i have seen and things I have read point to this 'phenomena' as
being something real !
Patents exist technologies exist documentation exists which all support the idea of spraying chemicals
into the atmosphere as a way of deflecting/reflecting harmful rays away from earth in an effort to combat global warming/climate change !

Not to poison us !

Peace

reply to post by NightGypsy


Argument from ignorance, of course.

Yet again. And, irrelevant. Invalid comparison.

However, one point of validity in that diatribe is that those delusional people who flock to the sorts of crap "9/11 conspiracy" garbage are prone to fall for "chem"-trail nonsense too....it's the nature of the beast. Oh, and yes...one more valid link that these types share --- a terrible lack of comprehension of real science and physics, and a "lemming-like" quality that allows them to be led along, by others, in that same merry-go-'round of ignorance.

It even can draw in a few (handful) of otherwise intelligent and specialized "credentialled" folks....people who actually are using their various degrees outside their fields of expertise, but they have a "diploma" to give them that false "cred"......

It’s become nothing more than a killzone for the deniers to, assassinate character, belittle and ridicule the people who believe that this phenomenon is real, and are genuinely concerned at the ramifications and effects (if any) on the health of the population !

That's a silly reason to shut down a forum.
Every conspiracy theory is met with opposition, and every forum is visited by immature idiots, but that's no reason to take ANY discussion off the table.

If we all agreed on everything, there'd be nothing to discuss and nothing to learn.

reply to post by DeReK DaRkLy


If you read another of my posts you will have seen that I didn't really want it shut down but anted to see a little decorum and dare I say respectby both sides to one another !
It's been okay in here up to know I think ?

Anyway thanks for your input my friend

Peace