Two groups of Middle Eastern men caught on the Arizona/Mexico border...others managed to escape

Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback

Originally posted by SiCkBoY

Lets not get into that, as I don�t want to humiliate you with your lack of world knowledge. Just keep in mind that America is the whole world, and the rest are just wee Islands, brains #2

Well, you go ahead and try it. In the meantime, I have a fabulous work of art for you admire.

Is it art?

I am not even an Irish Catholic so why would this matter to me, I grew up with the back drop of bombings and shootings, seeing the IRA plant a 1000lb van bomb in a wee town I worked in as 16 year old, when it did go off, I had to pull my friend up the street with the lower half of his body missing, until some passer by in shock told me to let him go as he was already dead, don�t preach about the IRA to me man, I grew up in a place in south Armagh locally known as �the SAS playground� and have always considered the Provos (IRA) my natural enemy, as they have nearly killed me on many occasion.

The likes of you would run a mile from a war wee lad, your the type who talks the talk, and when it comes to the walk, Walks........away.......

So in essence you freak, you have just showed a Jewish person a picture of a SS officer saluting Hitler, so tell me this, did I humiliate you that much, that you needed to do that?

Must have......

[edit on 31-7-2004 by SiCkBoY]

Shoot them in the head and bury them in the desert nobody will ever know what happened to them!

I live in Arizona, illegal immigration is a huge problem, dont get me wrong, the majority of illegals are very nice people and really do want to make a living. However, they have been a huge burden on us tax payers because they come across and immediately head for the DES office to get cash assistance, welfare and food stamps. It is very upsetting because the application asks if you are a legal resident, but it is an optional question that does not have to be answered. Back when I was only making 9.50/hr, and my girlfriend was pregnant, we applied for cash assistance or food stamps and they said I made too much money, however they will grant assistance to people who arent even citizens of the US and are here illegally? Theyre turning their backs on citizens while giving our money to illegals. Not to mention the fact that recently there has been a good number of middle easterners, as well as many other non-Mexicans coming up. Sure most are probably just looking for a new life, but the law of averages dictates some of those are likely militants and we have no idea they are here. And with all the drugs that are smuggled up here with no problem, explosives, and dare I say, nuclear material would be just as easy to bring up. So something definitely needs to be done, whatever it may be, because right now, things arent good.

Keep insults out of this thread please,

Asala

Originally posted by hideous_toejam
I think this article provides the emperical evidence that, not only would Mexicans and terrorists continue to circumnavigate any wall or mine field, but it would be the smarter ones that do so. However, we must not discount the power of free enterprise. We would certainly see businesses pop up on the Mexican side of the border such as "Stairway to Heaven" - a company that utilizes used airline stairway roll-ups as a way, for a small fee, to get folks over the wall and on their way to the promised land. Or, how about "Two-legged Trail to Freedom" , a guide service for negotiating a safe, and two-legged, pathway through the mine fileds.

Toejam, if you think an article about sheep fences is a good place to start on this debate, then maybe we should terminate this amicably now. Your suggestion of airline staircases is moot, since a wall wouldn't be any more unguarded than a prison wall. We have the technology to make any wall a formidible obstacle to those who will harm us, whether they're Latin American, or Arab, or Asian, or European, or African. Infrared sensors and cameras, UAV's, night vision, seismic detectors, spotlights. Border patrol needs to be revampeded to become both law enforcement and military.

Your euphemisms are unsuited to deal with the reality that exists at the border. There is nothing "anti-man" about a wall. Man is free to wander, but man is also free to defend his territory when it is invaded.

Eastern-Diamondback: Palestine is Isreal's harpy or to put it more primitively, their bitch, but a bitch with teeth. The walls a nice concept for trying to seperate these two but I think not unlike my link above, the harpy will find a way to get around it and get around it with a vengance.

The wall in Israel must come with a political solution as well. A political solution can help reduce the desire to destroy Israel (although the radical moslem groups want Israel destroyed and will always have the desire), and the wall will reduce the ability to destroy Israel by those who will still possess the desire. The solution needs to be two-pronged. So too does the solution to the American-Mexican border problem.

I think you're right that things need to improve in Mexico to really resolve the illegal immigrant issue. I obviously disagree about the wall but, in fairness, we could have very dark days ahead and a wall, replete with towers and weaponry (and the friggin' mine fields too), may become necessary on both our Mexican and Canadian borders. I will be sad if that day comes. It will be the times of the anti-man.

I'm glad that you can look at the issue rationally. While you and I may not agree on all the points of this topic, we can be reasonable.

The Mexican government can rail all they want about maintaining some type of control or influence with their emmigrants but, if I remember the story correctly, once Daisy left the farm, she never came back.

But in this instance, Daisy remains in shouting distance.

If you are of English descent, you're ancestors most certainly immigrated from England. If you're of Native American descent, then you are correct that your ancestors had not, in more recent history, immigrated. For more reading on who really conquered and peopled the Americas, check out this link -
Click Here

Immigrants move to different countries and different societies. My ancestors went from England proper (and a few from Scotland) to an English colony. As for the American Indians, they came from Northeast Asia, and occupied two continents that, based on archaeological evidence, already had people living there, too. Their occupation of North America was rather sparse as well. At most seven million people occupying seven million square miles of land? I've never been of the belief that anyone has a racial birthright to all the land of a continent. Any claim on land is contingent on one's ability to populate it, utilize it, and/or defend it.

I was going to respond to the remainder of your rebuttals but as I re-read your responses to mine about "being tired" of this or that I "act like so many other people", I realized that whatever I would have to say to you would be treated in the same fashion. You're basically a blocked horizon, a closed door and, as such, not open to new ideas or perspectives

Your ideas in past posts are not unlike many others that have been posted at this site, or discussed in the real world. I've posted on several threads already, and the same counter-arguments are made time and time again. So forgive me if I say I'm bored with the typical responses which don't address the issues that have been raised. I respond to people who respond to me with thought out response; I don't just say, "Your wrong," or "You're stupid and don't know what you're talking about," and leave it at that.

...especially the very priggish remark about your ancestry. You're ancestors probably were English - probably Tories fighting to keep the status quo the same. Mine fought on the side of the Revolution and you know what, we won!

If my ancestors were Tories, my family would very likely have been living in Canada. They were not--one of my great-great-great-great-great grandfather was supposed to have fought as a North Carolina militiaman under Nathaniel Greene. And yes, we did win.

Originally posted by SiCkBoY
I am not even an Irish Catholic so why would this matter to me, I grew up with the back drop of bombings and shootings, seeing the IRA plant a 1000lb van bomb in a wee town I worked in as 16 year old, when it did go off, I had to pull my friend up the street with the lower half of his body missing, until some passer by in shock told me to let him go as he was already dead, don�t preach about the IRA to me man, I grew up in a place in south Armagh locally known as �the SAS playground� and have always considered the Provos (IRA) my natural enemy, as they have nearly killed me on many occasion.

Clarify, are you from Ireland or Northern Ireland? Are you Irish or Ulster?

Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback

Originally posted by SiCkBoY
I am not even an Irish Catholic so why would this matter to me, I grew up with the back drop of bombings and shootings, seeing the IRA plant a 1000lb van bomb in a wee town I worked in as 16 year old, when it did go off, I had to pull my friend up the street with the lower half of his body missing, until some passer by in shock told me to let him go as he was already dead, don�t preach about the IRA to me man, I grew up in a place in south Armagh locally known as �the SAS playground� and have always considered the Provos (IRA) my natural enemy, as they have nearly killed me on many occasion.

Clarify, are you from Ireland or Northern Ireland? Are you Irish or Ulster?

Irish or Ulster lol lmao? was that a joke? what�s "ulster" I am from Northern Ireland, therefore I am Irish, one cant be Ulster if from Ulster, Ulster is a place not a people, Ireland is a country, ok man you really have made your vast world knowledge known to me!

Ulster is a province of Northern Ireland; the people from Ulster are not Ulster, or Ulsterish lol.

One can be from Northern Ireland and either Irish or British in nationality terms, they can also be an Irish catholic or Irish Protestant. We can also have dual nationality (i.e) Irish/British, but I can assure you that there is no group of people called Ulster.

AND

Don�t some of you find it rather hilariously ironic, that the fact is if you go back a few years into �new Americas� Vast (not to make you feel left out lol) history, you might just find a lot of you are all just European emigrants (that were dropped on heads as kids), and at the end of the day have no right to put up boarders, if anyone, this should be down to the native American, indeed to keep you out.

But I guess things have changed in the big boiling pot, Ooh sorry, that�s a pre 9/11 phrase, and everything has changed in the USA post 9/11, Well, Ermm, Yea, apart from the Government that let you all down so much!



[edit on 31-7-2004 by SiCkBoY]

Seriously, many of you guys need some serious introspection. Really, why ANYONE would want to cross a border into the US astounds most of the worlds population. And the attitudes of many who have commented in this thread just confirm this. Has it occurred to you that the US is no longer a desirable place to emigrate to, and no wonder.

"shoot them in the head" ffs.

Originally posted by SiCkBoY

Irish or Ulster lol lmao? was that a joke? what�s "ulster" I am from Northern Ireland, therefore I am Irish, one cant be Ulster if from Ulster, Ulster is a place not a people, Ireland is a country, ok man you really have made your vast world knowledge known to me!

Ulster is a province of Northern Ireland; the people from Ulster are not Ulster, or Ulsterish lol.

Save your smugness for another audience. I simply forgot to add the term I wanted to stress. It was supposed to say Ulster "Irish", quote marks emphasized. Ulster is a Protestant and British creation, not an Irish and Catholic entity. It was created to protect area Protestants from the rule of Irish Catholics. The Irish largely want a united Irish state and care not for Protestant control and self-rule of the northern counties of the island. To them, the idea of Ulster, or "Northern Ireland" has no validity.

Irish Catholics are as "Ulsterish" as the red Indians are American, descendents of one population living in a foreign political construct.

One can be from Northern Ireland and either Irish or British in nationality terms, they can also be an Irish catholic or Irish Protestant. We can also have dual nationality (i.e) Irish/British, but I can assure you that there is no group of people called Ulster.

And this is all political semantics.

Don�t some of you find it rather hilariously ironic, that the fact is if you go back a few years into �new Americas� Vast (not to make you feel left out lol) history, you might just find a lot of you are all just European emigrants (that were dropped on heads as kids), and at the end of the day have no right to put up boarders, if anyone, this should be down to the native American, indeed to keep you out.

The Indians, or reds, tried their best to kick us out, often with French (pre-Revolution) or British assistance, and repeatedly got their asses kicked in the process. Now they want to complain because they ended up on the losing end of the fight? But I guess that reflects your lack of knowledge on American history. I guess those emmigrants who "got dropped on their heads" had enough sense to go to a country where their descendents ended up living a much more pleasant life than those who stayed ever had.

Originally posted by Romeo
Really, why ANYONE would want to cross a border into the US astounds most of the worlds population. And the attitudes of many who have commented in this thread just confirm this. Has it occurred to you that the US is no longer a desirable place to emigrate to, and no wonder.

Will you please be more specific? Who is this "most of the world's population?" Elitist European and Canadian lefties? Why do a million people a year actually immigrate here, and thousands upon thousand more try to but fail? Am I missing something?

Originally posted by Romeo
Seriously, many of you guys need some serious introspection. Really, why ANYONE would want to cross a border into the US astounds most of the worlds population. And the attitudes of many who have commented in this thread just confirm this. Has it occurred to you that the US is no longer a desirable place to emigrate to, and no wonder.

Come on down to Arizona, ask about half the people here.

seriously? half your population are illegal Mexicans etc?

Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback
Will you please be more specific? Who is this "most of the world's population?" Elitist European and Canadian lefties? Why do a million people a year actually immigrate here, and thousands upon thousand more try to but fail? Am I missing something?

I've travelled extensively and continue to. I assure you the standard of living throughout Europe and many parts of Asia is higher than the US and far safer in many respects. Lose your job bud and you'll soon find out. The US is headed into a depression and your admin knows it. Do you?

Well, it seems that way, mostly Mexicans, but also alot of middle-easterners, Indians, orientals, and every kind of Eastern European. But I'm sure the number is actually less. The point is, these people are not interested at all in who is president, or which country he is invading, or why, they are only interested in coming here to work, and obtain state assistance to escape the poverty in Mexico or whatever country they may come from. Diamondback is right when he said that the "world" youre referring to, are ultra liberal Western Euros and Canadians, because immigration to our country has not slowed down at all. We're not heading into a depression, Bush will soon be voted out, and America will be as strong as ever.

[edit on 31-7-2004 by 27jd]

Hi 27jd. I hope you're right regarding a depression. It would be a tragedy. I have many friends in the US. It is not my intention to cause anyone any angst here and so there's no mistake, I'm Australian, so yeah my world is limited too I guess, isn't everyone's. I am not without US experience though and I still have family in Chicago, and Europe. Still, its not my place to to try and inform you about your own country. Try reading Richard Russell. 80yo WW2 US fighter pilot come economic guru.......when you get to 80 you say what you want and NOONE can argue with his patriotism:

45 trillion unfunded social security and medicare liability

Originally posted by Romeo

I've travelled extensively and continue to. I assure you the standard of living throughout Europe and many parts of Asia is higher than the US and far safer in many respects. Lose your job bud and you'll soon find out. The US is headed into a depression and your admin knows it. Do you?

I traveled fairly extensively around the world, too. But the US has one of the highest GDP's in the world.

2003 GDP's

and in regards to the election....It will be the ultimate test of your "democracy". Will the election proceed? What if Bush decides he "needs" to toast another country in "retaliation to xyz" a day or 2 before the election. I honestly doubt you'll need to vote this year. If the election goes ahead then maybe my paranoia has been misplaced and I will ask forgiveness.

Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback

I traveled fairly extensively around the world, too. But the US has one of the highest GDP's in the world.

2003 GDP's

Come on mate, that's just the asset side of the cash book. Now have a peek at the other side....