Putting It All Together: A theory of historical proportions involving WA,ID,MT,WY,NV,OR and CA.

Originally posted by iballs
reply to post by UtahRosebud

 

...theories, opinions and facts are always welcome here at ATS. But this thread is not about HAARP

This isn't about HAARP. Like magma, HAARP is directly related to the Earth's tectonic field; one is a by-product and the other is engaged in exploiting the fact that all plates are polarized. Magma will always be a by-product of polarized plates connecting.

Icelandic volcano's ash blanket was electric
Iceland's volcanic ash is electric
Wiki: Earthquake Light

If you're reading only HAARP or magma, subduction, hot water springs etc - they're all a collary example of the plates being polarized; they're an extension of and no more.

The question to ask is what is electrically exciting the plates? Can this be observed in real-time?

Now is this still about HAARP or are you connecting tectonic plates to electricity? Did you really believe that the plates are moving on their own, because of inertial weight and angular kinetic momentum? If so, why isn't it continuous and why now - why does it work in pulses? What's the "difference" that's caused a dramatic change?

Far be it for me to get in the way of your observations. Thought I could help. Reject all and the above as mis-guided and I apologize for taking your time.

edit on 18-4-2011 by iballs because: (no reason given)

I'm curious how you explain the molten outer core of the earth where there is no plate movement

The plates are continually moving driven by convection and whether they have an electrical charge or not has no effect on whether they will move or not. This is a proven fact that plates move on top of the aethosphere.

As to "taking a step back and seeing the bigger picture", I have a problem with believing that with the major quakes as of late that have moved entire countries several feet AND/OR knocked the earth's axis would not cause major quakes elsewhere in the world.
Japan's 9.0 shifted everything over there so much I can't see how the west coast of the US would NOT be effected! How could a plate shift several feet on one side and NOT shift on the other side?? I understand that the plates don't necessarily "fit" together quite that well, but wouldn't we see movement either in one area or a cumulative effect of several plates to equal that shift??
Westcoast, again I have to say that you (and MANY knowledgeable others here at ATS) have really helped to open my eyes to more than I could have pictured on my own.

reply to post by westcoast


Very nicely put together. S & F and all that.

What if the Cascadian Subduction Zone doesn't end where they think it does?

Um, of course it does not end - it goes right the way down past the end of South America ultimately! All one long continuous 'subduction' zone - if they are right that these are subduction zones rather than spheroidal fracture zones that are not actually subducting. Spheroidal fracturing does not eliminate fault sticking by the way. Take a look at the whole of the Pacific area and tell me how it can move in so many different directions at one without a mid-pacific ridge like in the Atlantic? I commented some time ago about the line of volcanoes in Cali that is spaced just right for the presumed distance for volcanoes from the 'subduction' boundary. A line just like the one running down Chile.

Then take a look at the latest offering from Robert Smith on the Yellowstone plume and shake your head at how they can be so positive about something one minute and then change it all the next.

Compare:
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/cb10405cd59e.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/43f4b26209bf.jpg[/atsimg]

One minute it goes down at 60 degrees (ish) and the next 40 degrees?

The fact of the matter is that the scientists know nothing and the description of them as "Men in white coats guessing" is I am afraid very apt much of the time.

Put your whitecoat on westcoast - you can do just as good a job as them. (Which is not saying you are guessing any more than they are, or perhaps I should say we can all guess as well as they can!)

I was asking myself what you would look for if trying to trace a plume. Well hot Springs of course.

Not necessarily. There are many sources of hot springs and many will not be a source from a plume. Bear in mind the hot springs in Arkansas for example. No plume, and very likely not even a volcanic source. That does not detract from the premise, just noting.

we need to study the quakes prior to the 9.1 in Japan and see if there were any very shallow quakes there

Tons - and who says it is an unknown fault? If you looks at the latest fault mapping in Google earth then this bunch of quakes falls right at the end of a marked fault zone and straddles the area to another which pretty much says to me that even if they did not twig this it is not new.

In the last 2 years there have been 530 recorded quakes in the area bounded by Lat 37 to lat 39 and Lon -120 to Lon -118.

It is a demonstrable fact that something changed around 5pm UTC on the 14th April this year. The steady trend of deeper quakes was suddenly and abruptly stopped.

The maroon colour is the depths and the blue is the magnitudes.



What could cause such a sudden change? The conspiracy theorist in me says nuclear test hoping to be covered up by the Japan radiation.

I will put up this set of graphs which is part of a study I am doing of earthquakes numbers in the 2 year period 01 Apr 2009 to 31 Mar 2011. Nevada happens to be in this 'set' which is the western side of the USA.

You can get an explanation of the graphs here and this also currently shows USA Central as well.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c82841192bb0.png[/atsimg]

Imagine if the Cascadian Subduction zone actually extended that far (possibly further)? If there were a major 'unzipping' the displacement of magma could be significant. If that were to happen, what would the impact be on the calderas? I had already expected that the cascade volcanos would be triggered in a mega thrust quake (most of them last had a major eruption 300 yrs ago, same as the last mega thrust quake)....but would the calderas in Oregon, California and Wyoming also be impacted?

Oh Ya. In a worst case scenario they will all go boom!

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f3c361360076.jpg[/atsimg]

reply to post by PuterMan


As always Puterman excellent post!
Looks to me (please remember I am a novice here ) that 2010 shows a jump in the majority of the areas graphed. Out of curiosity though, I would love to see an example or two of years previous. Most of us have noticed an increase in EQ's worldwide, and it would be great if we could see evidence of this in graphs such as these you have shared with us!

reply to post by westcoast

The most recent, inlcuding the 4.1 and 4.6 are all around 15 km deep. That is getting towards the bottom of the North American plate, I believe.

Please do correct me if I am wrong but I believe the North American plate is 350 km deep.

That said SOMETHING happened at Nevada on the 14th April. Here is another graph of just the depths in the aforementioned Lat/Lon box for just the time around the change. This is a dramatic change in my opinion.



[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f3c361360076.jpg[/atsimg]

reply to post by avatar22


I am working on it, but it is a massive task and it may be a month or so yet before I have it all put together properly.

I know I have put this one up before but I will show it again just for interest. It come from the project I am working on.



[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f3c361360076.jpg[/atsimg]

reply to post by PuterMan


Thanks! I completely understand that all of this is a serious undertaking and really appreciate all that you put into it.

What minimal research I am able to do comes mainly from the posts and links "experts" here at ATS share with the rest of us, due to the fact that I have NO idea where to start as well as an old computer so am not able to take advantage of so many useful programs available.

reply to post by iballs

I don't believe anyone on ATS understands the electrical importance of this interaction; everyone seems to miss electrical arching observed and photographed during volcanic eruptions.

More people than you might imagine are aware of the electrical nature of our planet and it seems that the geologists are just waking up to that as well with the new Yellowstone study.

Now some links for info about the electrical arching(sic) would be good. In order not to derail this thread you could post in the Geophysics thread where we discuss these sorts of things.

USGS

Just noticed something and wondering if the experts might chime in here.
Looking at the current USGS map of the CA/NV area
We have all been somewhat focusing on the new NV swarms and the North Pacific area.
If you look closely as the days go on the past week's eq's drop off the map, you can more clearly see the current swarms. The one in the north-central California area, the Nevada swarm, and the third in the Mexicali area.
My thought is this...
The frequency of eq's has always been quite constant throughout California, showing patterns here and there, but quite widespread. They are now centering into these locations, and fewer and fewer are occuring in the other areas of CA.
IF this is true, what could this mean? Does this make it MORE important to watch these areas? Or is it possibly more of a map pointing towards another location we need to find?
Just thinking out loud and would love to hear what there is to say on this.
Thanks

reply to post by kro32

wow this is wrong on so many levels I wouldn't know where to begin lol

I beg to differ. There is an element of truth in this. Not probably in the way that it is posted but there is an electrical involvement in earthquakes and volcanoes, one which mainstream geology is only just beginning to realise. Please try not to allow your mainstream geological education to close your mind to other possibilities beyond those of the Church of Geology. As is so often proved these can be wrong.

I would also point out to you that is an accepted fact by geologists that fracture in earthquakes can melt the rocks. I agree this is nothing to do with large magma chambers but.....

www.sciencemag.org...

I am sure as a geologist you can get the full text.

For those who do not want to pay the stupid prices these people charge you could try this PDF from the University of Oregon.

reply to post by iballs

There's a branch of planetary mechanics that's defense based; from which HAARP was derived. It's at the basis for HAARP and how it delivers energy to the Earth to effect a change. The ionosphere is only a transport - HAARP can't function without certain satellites and their analysis of the electrical layer, of the plate in question, as the frequency values are constantly changing. All of this if studied closely will lead to how gravity is manufactured - it's frequency.

Darn it! You mentioned the HAARP word. That is a real shame as the electric universe theory does have it's part to play in earthquakes and I had assumed this was what you referring to. It seems that you were not so don't bother with trying to explain how HAARP causes earthquakes because it does not, neither does it cause magma chambers.

They just had a 6.6 in the Kermadec Islands which are about 551 miles from New Zealand. I am new at learning about a lot of this. Could this have anything to do with what is being talked about here?

reply to post by kro32

I'm curious how you explain the molten outer core of the earth where there is no plate movement

The plates are continually moving driven by convection and whether they have an electrical charge or not has no effect on whether they will move or not.

Driven by convection? I too am curious how you explain that statement. It is not proven that they move, only in one school of thought. Can you prove that the outer core is molten?

This is a proven fact that plates move on top of the aethosphere.

Bit of an error for a geologist. Asthenosphere is the word you are looking for assuming of course that we are taking about the lithosphere floating on something

Linky-poo

Could do with seeing some links from you as well. You may be a geologist but that does not excuse you from backing up your statements here on ATS.

Originally posted by coloradokat
They just had a 6.6 in the Kermadec Islands which are about 551 miles from New Zealand. I am new at learning about a lot of this. Could this have anything to do with what is being talked about here?

In all probability no as they often have largish quakes in that area. I was wondering where the next six+ was going to appear as it was getting a bit overdue.

reply to post by westcoast

The plume angles downward 150 miles to the west-northwest of Yellowstone and reaches a depth of at least 410 miles, Professor Smith said in a release the university issued Monday. The study estimates the plume is mostly hot rock, with 1 percent to 2 percent molten rock in "sponge-like voids" within the hot rock.

I like to think the entire planet like a big reactor. In fact we little know about the internal processes in and around the core of our planet or any planet for that matter. The quote above brought to my mind the idea that this is stuff directly from the earths molten core. If the layers of crust around the planetary nuclei act as containment fields for all sorts of discovered, theorized and yet undiscovered forces and processes, in Yellowstone we clearly see a breach in this ..lets call it ..reactor vessel that surrounds the earths core. To me is amazing that pockets of primordial stuff can be captured and remain active retaining their fiery nature so far away from the earths molten core that only it's unknown gigantic and mysterious forces are able to support the fierce transmutation of ordinary matter. There also has to be some other process here that we are completely unaware off. There has to be recycling of elements to and from the core or at least to and from near core pockets of transmuting elements.

I also think that instead of spending money for something elusive in projects like CERN, we could just be really discovering nature, by trying to approach the earth's core somehow.

reply to post by westcoast



Awesome spread there man!

Just to add, on your hotsprings map.............I lived in Idaho for about 10 years, and there are A LOT more hotsprings around there then what you have shown so keep that in mind..


Also its well known that the area especially Boise and the desert areas, then towards the east and south, at one time was VERY volcanically active.........

Youre on the right track.........GOOD JOB BUD!

Thanks again to all for the responses. I don't have time right now to answer them all, but:

Puterman, as always I appreciate your excellent work. Regarding 'them' knowing the subduction zone extends further south; Here is a good example of a fault map of california:
map

It indicates the cascade subduction zone ends in Northern california, and basically turns into the san andreas fault. All you have to do though is look at a map of hisorical quakes and you can (as you say) follow a clear line from Alaska all the way down through chili. But hey....who are we to say?

As to the depth of the plate; perhaps I should have said that they(quakes) were getting towards where I thought the subduction zone would be, based on some of the papers on depth study I linked.

So many more things to say but I gotta go. Thanks to all the support. There are so many great threads just in the fragile earth forum alone that I didn't think many would read.

You know why I give WC's theory credence and will be taking this very seriously, one name: Edgar Caycee.

Now take a look at Caycee's 'future map of the USA' and tell me what you see and how this relates to WC's original post:



Also here is some other interesting tidbits regarding what Caycee forsaw happening ot the west coast of the USA many years ago:

paranormal.lovetoknow.com...

Other Earth Changes As Predicted by Cayce

The map of the entire world changes starting with the polar shift. Cayce also predicts the following in detail. A note of caution, Cayce never gave an exact year for any of the following:

The Great Lakes will empty into the Gulf of Mexico.

Los Angeles and San Francisco will disappear as land along the west coast of America breaks up.

Japan will sink into the sea.

The upper portion of Europe will be changed instantaneously.

New land will appear off the East coast of America.

Following increased volcanic activity, earthquake activity will increase in California as well as the area between the south of Nevada and Salt Lake.

Land disturbances along the East Coast will cause the disappearance of part of New York State and New York City.

Part of the Carolinas and Georgia will also be lost

Cayce predicted that the safest lands will include Virginia Beach, part of Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois. A significant part of the south and east parts of Canada will also survive.

Originally posted by spacebot
reply to post by westcoast

 

The plume angles downward 150 miles to the west-northwest of Yellowstone and reaches a depth of at least 410 miles, Professor Smith said in a release the university issued Monday. The study estimates the plume is mostly hot rock, with 1 percent to 2 percent molten rock in "sponge-like voids" within the hot rock.

I like to think the entire planet like a big reactor. In fact we little know about the internal processes in and around the core of our planet or any planet for that matter. The quote above brought to my mind the idea that this is stuff directly from the earths molten core. If the layers of crust around the planetary nuclei act as containment fields for all sorts of discovered, theorized and yet undiscovered forces and processes, in Yellowstone we clearly see a breach in this ..lets call it ..reactor vessel that surrounds the earths core. ...There has to be recycling of elements to and from the core or at least to and from near core pockets of transmuting elements.

...

S&

...and there are other variables too - like the influence of -and interactions with- the planet's magnetic field.

Interesting, complicated and more about systems theory than any direct cause-and-effect theory can possibly accommodate. imho

reply to post by Disconnected Sociopath


Thank you for the map. This may seem odd, but I have never really looked at or studied his work. I have seen this before (and may have even used it or one similar to it) on the arkansas thread, when talking about the new madrid but I didn't pay attention to the west coast, as I was focused on Arkansas. (ironic, eh?)

I have to say, it is a bit eerie. The new coast line pretty much follows the accepted location of the Cascadian subduction zone AND where I (and obviously others) think it continues on. Now, also taking into consideration the very important underground aquifer locations (kro23 suggested?) and it makes this map even more plausible. If there were to be a major rupture (like on what happened on the seafloor of Japan, only bigger) the saturation of the land would come into play BIG time. Also, if there ARE a network of plumes these would obviously be impacted and perhaps set off a chainreaction, further leading to the end result as shown in the map.

I just got an email from an ATS member providing a link to a heat flow map. (many thanks!) Here is the link to the map of North America:

heat flow map

It comes from the: Global Heat Flow Database of The International Heat Flow Commission

here
So I think it is reliable.

Compare the red for the states in my hot springs map. As I said before and will say again, I only mapped out the hottest ones...there are many, many more. Interesting.

I have to say too that I am really enjoying some of the other discussions about topics I have never heard of. Do they tie in? Who knows. We WON'T know however if we never consider it!