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Stop blaming HAARP for natural disasters.

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posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 06:15 PM
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I've been a lurker for a while and this is my second thread (first one was closed). having done some research on HAARP, as it is a constant source of conspiracy theories, I have found NOTHING that would lead me to believe it can cause earthquakes. I'm not the all-knowing source of knowledge on HAARP, so i am open to evidence anyone has. However i do have a few questions: If HAARP was a secret government seismic/weather weapon, why would every document be open to public view? Why would students be allowed and welcomed to help with research there? Why are there open houses held there every summer? How could HAARP cause any severe reactions in the ionisphere, when the sun exerts far more power on it than HAARP ever could, and the minute changes made by HAARP are rectified within moments? Please discuss in a mature manner.

haarp official website
wiki page
youtube vid about haarp




posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 06:28 PM
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Originally posted by CyberFawkes1105
I have found NOTHING that would lead me to believe it can cause earthquakes.

Then you don't know much about Nikola Tesla, the man who demonstrated this technology over 100 years ago.


Originally posted by CyberFawkes1105
I'm not the all-knowing source of knowledge on HAARP,

Then read a book like this or like this and you will.

Or you could listen to the usual suspects on ATS tell you that 100-year old technology is impossible.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 06:33 PM
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reply to post by GoldenFleece
 





Then you don't know much about Nikola Tesla, the man who demonstrated this technology over 100 years ago.


tesla machine used mechanical oscilation to match the resonant frequency of buildings, haarp uses an array of antennas and a high powered transmitter to Influence the ionisphere then study it. not the same technology AT ALL.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 08:11 PM
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reply to post by CyberFawkes1105
 

OK then, so when you say "I'm not the all-knowing source of knowledge on HAARP, so I am open to evidence anyone has" and I post a link to a book titled Angels Don't Play This Haarp: Advances in Tesla Technology, what you really mean to say is, you think you're all-knowing about HAARP and you're not open to any evidence to the contrary.

Fair enough, but why not be honest in your original post?



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 08:19 PM
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I quite agree. I wish people would stop blaming HAARP for every natural disaster on the planet. It might be able to ionise the air, but it cannot move a molehill, let alone billions of tons of rock. Not even Tesla caused a earthquake, but he did wreck a building using different technology.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 08:21 PM
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I don't agree at all. It's not coincidence that this machine just so happens to be running at full power when events like this happen. I'm not saying the Japan quake wasn't natural..just saying..HAARP is a very probable culprit and to deny that is ignorance.
edit on 13-3-2011 by Ear-Responsible because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 08:40 PM
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reply to post by GoldenFleece
 


There's a difference between evidence, and propaganda written to ride a conspiracy wave (as this book appears to be). I am open to evidence and would like to hear yours, and would appreciate you responding without the callous tone.


edit on 13-3-2011 by CyberFawkes1105 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 08:40 PM
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For people that think nothing could possibly be going on, and that it's acompletely open thing : from HAARP's own site :



This computer system operates as a world wide web server to provide information to the public concerning unclassified programs only. You may freely access all of the files and images that have been made available on the various home pages hosted by this server. Spend as much or as little time as you wish but remember that this is a U. S. Government computer system.


www.haarp.alaska.edu...

Groups that have oversight here too, which include the Air Force and the Navy : www.haarp.alaska.edu...

Not saying something 'is' going on, but that it's easily possible.

Ah yeah, and if you think you can just take a trip down there and have a look around whenever you want :



Can I visit HAARP?

The HAARP Research Station does not employ sufficient on-site staff to allow routine tours of the facility. Entry to the facility is normally restricted to those having a need to conduct business at the facility.


www.haarp.alaska.edu...
edit on 13-3-2011 by Hitoshura because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 08:51 PM
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reply to post by Hitoshura
 



This computer system operates as a world wide web server to provide information to the public concerning unclassified programs only. You may freely access all of the files and images that have been made available on the various home pages hosted by this server. Spend as much or as little time as you wish but remember that this is a U. S. Government computer system.

this is similar to the terms of service on any website. this is appears on any government site. Since the project is jointly funded by the government (as most large-scale research projects are) this makes a lot of sense.



Can I visit HAARP? The HAARP Research Station does not employ sufficient on-site staff to allow routine tours of the facility. Entry to the facility is normally restricted to those having a need to conduct business at the facility.

From a research standpoint this makes a lot of sense. It wouldn't be very condusive to a good research environment to have tourists gawking around the facility. many places don't allow tours, this doesn't neccesarily mean anything nefarious is involved.
edit on 13-3-2011 by CyberFawkes1105 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 09:12 PM
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reply to post by CyberFawkes1105
 


Ok, maybe I was stretching it a bit so thanks. Still wondering exactly what the Air Force and Navy have to do with it though, and you can bet we won't find all of those details. The site also mentions that the DoD have an interest for some innocent sounding reason, but it makes me wonder.

I get that I might be wrong though and that HAARP might be fine, just making sure I stay open minded to other possibilities.
edit on 13-3-2011 by Hitoshura because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 09:15 PM
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Jesse Ventura in his show wasn't allowed access to it. There is also deals made between the U.S. and Russia not to use weather modification weapons during either peace time or war which proves that they do exist. It is possible in theory, but whether or not there is enough distance for HAARP to effect anywhere in the world is doubtful. Most likely they run experiments messing with the environment and unintended consequences probably happen.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 09:17 PM
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I appreciate your input, need more open minded people on here. All the recent haarp talk has sparked my interest in the subject. Here's to hoping we can get to the bottom of it.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 09:33 PM
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If HAARP was a secret government seismic/weather weapon, why would every document be open to public view?


It is very naive to think that every document related to HAARP is available to public view. There are many documents available to the public with some promotional, educational and congressional records available. Generally these documents just focus on the ionosphere effects for over the horizon radar. Within these documents there are indications of weather manipulation, ground penetrating radar uses and other uses.



Why would students be allowed and welcomed to help with research there?


It is still new technology and lots is still being learnt about it. They need scientists and researches to continue work to further understand and refine the operation.



Why are there open houses held there every summer?


The site at Alaska is one of the first HAARP installations and is relatively a low power one in the Mega Watt range. Now there are a lot more sites around the world. Here in Australia we have at least two, possibly three HAARP sites. These are not open to the public along with many other sites around the world that go into the Giga Watt range. There have been some rumours or Tera Watt capabilities but have not been able to confirm.



How could HAARP cause any severe reactions in the ionisphere, when the sun exerts far more power on it than HAARP ever could, and the minute changes made by HAARP are rectified within moments?


It has do do with focusing the energy at a specific point. The suns energy covers about half of the Earth's surface area. HAARP has the ability to focus and regulate all of its energy into a small area. At the right frequencies this allows the energy to bounce of the ionosphere and establish radio links with submarines, at other frequencies it allows for weather manipulation, at other frequencies it performs ground penetrating radar. Put enough energy into the ground penetrating radar and the ground does start to heat up and expand.

There is some evidence to indicate that HAARP had a part to play in the recent Chile and Haiti earthquakes as well as the boxing day tsunami with the seismic signatures, confirmed HAARP operation and other intelligence data. It is still a bit early to confirm if HAARP had a part to play with the recent earthquake, but considering the recent track record it is a valid line of enquiry. As 9/11 is just swept under the carpet it is important to realize that there are psychopaths running the show with no regard for human life, killing is a job for them. I do caution to not let them of the hook so lightly.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 09:41 PM
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Originally posted by CyberFawkes1105
reply to post by GoldenFleece
 

There's a difference between evidence, and propaganda written to ride a conspiracy wave (as this book appears to be). I am open to evidence and would like to hear yours, and would appreciate you responding without the sarcasm.

I see, so the book "appears to be propaganda" for what reason -- the title? Or the fact that they actually print the original 1987 Bernard Eastlund patents that HAARP is based on and reference every bit of information from that point forward?

Speaking of propaganda, it always amazes me that people won't research anything beyond what Wikipedia, the government or media says but they somehow expect answers from ATS posters instead of people who've done the real research in order to write a book.

Hang around a while. I'm sure Phage or Weedwhacker or some other know-it-all will be by to give you all the "evidence" you require. And I guarantee that information will be worth every penny you paid.

BTW, I'm not blaming it for anything.

Is HAARP responsible for natural disasters? I have no idea.

Is it possible? Only the most gullible or duplicitous would say otherwise...


edit on 3/13/2011 by GoldenFleece because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 09:46 PM
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reply to post by kwakakev
 





There is some evidence to indicate that HAARP had a part to play in the recent Chile and Haiti earthquakes as well as the boxing day tsunami with the seismic signatures, confirmed HAARP operation and other intelligence data.

Now would be the perfect time to share that evidence. simply stating that the evidence exists isn't going to prove anything.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 10:03 PM
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reply to post by GoldenFleece
 





they actually print the original 1987 Bernard Eastlund patents that HAARP is based on and reference every bit of information from that point forward?

you've yet to provide any actual info, this being the point of the thread, instead you've gotten stuck on this book.
If the book provides good info i am very interested in it, but for this thread i'm not asking for book recommendations.
All I want is clear scientific evidence/documentation one way or the other.



It always amazes me that people won't research anything beyond what Wikipedia, the government or media says but they somehow expect answers from ATS posters instead of people who've done the real research.

Really? Is it so amazing that people might share information collectively, and then discuss said info in a mature manner (kind of the point of ats)? I guess maybe it is, at least nothing you've shown leads me to believe otherwise.



Is it possible? Only the most gullible or duplicitous would say otherwise...

I never said it wasn't possible, only that i haven't seen any evidence that would lead me to believe that it was.
If you have info, share it. If not, then don't waste my and the other readers time.

P.S. If your going to try and show off your vocab look up what the word means first.
edit on 13-3-2011 by CyberFawkes1105 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 10:46 PM
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reply to post by CyberFawkes1105
 

Hey man, I don't mean to be hard on you, but it seems your mind is pretty well made up until you get the "evidence" you're looking for, which would be what -- a confession?

Kinda reminds me of the people who've spent the last 10 years demanding "evidence" and "proof" that 9/11 was an inside job. There's enough friggin' evidence to fly a 767 through, but the real problem is they refuse to open their eyes and accept the obvious because it makes them too uncomfortable.

Anyway, this 2008 interview with Benjamin Fulford about Japan being threatened with HAARP earthquakes and nuclear disasters isn't proof, but it sure is interesting. Very interesting:


BTW, Fulford says the New Madrid fault will be the next HAARP-engineered earthquake, so if that happens, maybe you'll be less of a skeptic.


edit on 3/13/2011 by GoldenFleece because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 10:59 PM
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I blame HAARP for all disasters, not just natural ones.When I crap and find myself out of toilet paper I blame HAARP. Pizza is late? HAARP's fault. Nightmare? HAARP.

We might as well assume HAARP is omnipotent, since it has Tesla Hidden Technology(TM).



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 11:01 PM
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reply to post by CyberFawkes1105
 

but yet this stuff is still possible, not like they aren't already hiding stuff from us in the first place.



posted on Mar, 13 2011 @ 11:05 PM
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Here is one article in Spanish that looks into some of the Haiti earthquake and shows the operation of HAARP at the time www.bibliotecapleyades.net... . I did see some seismic data at the time of the Chile earthquake, but trying to find it again after so long is difficult. There are many links to other papers in the one provided, for a brief overview of HAARP www.bibliotecapleyades.net... .

One interesting thing with many earthquakes attributed to HAARP is low epicentre at around 10km deep, which the Japan quake has. It is common for natural earthquakes to have the epicentre at around 100km deep. There are other threads around here that does show HARRP was operational at the time.



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