Dome Of The Rock UFO: Hoaxes Are Easy - Extended Discussion.

Hello SkepticO

I enjoyed the read.

It reminded me a lot of a thread I authored a while back which was banished to the hoax realm:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Top notch video by the way!

Originally posted by Pimander

Originally posted by Unknown Soldier
IThe believers preach of disinfo agents, cover ups yet they are in fact what they have grown to bec0me fear and loathe. The irony.

Are you claiming to have studied this subject? You think there has been no cover up? Get with the program, that is so misleading. If you have studied this topic with an open mind you know for a fact there have been cover ups left, right and centre. This field has been awash with disinformation.

You also don't have to be a believer (in aliens being behind it) to know that there is a cover up. Don't be fooled readers. If someone is well informed and claims there is no cover-up then be suspicious.

Originally posted by Unknown Soldier in response to the above
reply to post by Pimander

 

Did i say there is no cover up ? No you are taking things out of context here. Yes there is a cover up, however this Jerusalem hoax is just that. No need for a cover up of something that is fake. The roswell cover up is an example of an obvious cover up no question. Not even comparable to this hoax. Im saying the disinfo agent, paid debunker cop out is played out here and abroad in these circles.

Apologies for misunderstanding you there.

I agree that the disinformation agent card is played too often when someone tries to defend the indefensible. However I am sick of that line being rolled out to stop any debate about disinformation agents existing. They do exist. They operate on ATS. Not all for the government/intelligence either. I am writing a thread on this and will give you the heads up when it is completed if you like. And no way am I naming names. I may include a couple of hints is all. I am not getting banned for making an accusation I can't prove. I won't be able to provide specific examples and I think that would only cause a row and prove nothing anyway.

As for being a knower. There is more than one on here. Some know stuff they will not say on record. I have said this to another member, I will not unfairly post what I have been told in private that backs up what I say. If you are a gentleman you will understand why I have said that.

As for this Jerusalem footage being a hoax, if no witnesses can be found then it is. But not because it could be hoaxed. Anything could be with modern PC's.

Originally posted by Pimander
And no way am I naming names. I may include a couple of hints is all. I am not getting banned for making an accusation I can't prove.

Sounds like a cop-out and just another way of trying to shut down debate. You don't "agree that the disinformation agent card is played too often" at all, you want to provoke it more. Inspire fear and distrust among the members, you can (try) to control the conversation, so that certain opinions are dismissed.

reply to post by Pimander


Dude, this entire website is disinformation

Originally posted by WingedBull

Originally posted by Pimander
And no way am I naming names. I may include a couple of hints is all. I am not getting banned for making an accusation I can't prove.

Sounds like a cop-out and just another way of trying to shut down debate. You don't "agree that the disinformation agent card is played too often" at all, you want to provoke it more. Inspire fear and distrust among the members, you can (try) to control the conversation, so that certain opinions are dismissed.

edit on 15-2-2011 by WingedBull because: (no reason given)

Oh it's you again. What other organisations do they work for then? (A joke so keep your hair on.)

Why do you repeatedly try to tell people what their opinion is? I don't need you to say what my opinion is, I'm far better at it than you as I happen to know what it is. You're such a troll! Sad.

I think this sighting is genuine and is not a hoax.
Just that some of the videos were faked on purpose to heighten doubt...

The read was top of the line and this is one of those that seem unaltered, realistic enough to make me 90% sure its authentic indeed. I think that there are too many hoaxes out there. Ultimately, it is slowing down the process of us finding out the TRUTH about ufos and aliens. The government puts out hoaxes to throw us off. There are also people that are craving attention so they make us stories about encounters.

www.youtube.com...

this was found by four teens in Panama. They said they were playing at the park and someting approched them.
Then they threw rocks at it and died. Then they said they threw it in the water and now that's what it looks like. The news company reporting it seems legit. So I'm wondering? does this have any significance.

www.youtube.com...

also theres videos out there that just say something about alien definitions. When infact it is undetermined if they have real connections with these beings. I believe people use these hoaxes as means to gain credibility for money or for exposure. Perhaps they want to be in the public eye or they were paid to say that they plugged Unidentified flying objects.

reply to post by plutoice


photoshop is a hell of a program

I'm new here but I have already seen a few exciting sights that later was found to be a hoax.

So I must ask in the life of ATS is there been any sight that wasn't declared as a hoax ?

There seems to be a constant thinking problem on these boards.

It doesn't always have to be either/or, guys. You can: accept that there are some VERY strange coincidences connected to this "hoax," and that even by a hoaxers' standards these videos don't make much sense...and want to look into these things...without saying you believe anything in particular. What remains are facts, and then the questions those inspire. Other than that, I see people making big ass assumptions left and right based on nothing at all, and then trying to convince everyone THEY'RE right. Could we all just share info we collectively find online, and stop ridiculing each other? If this case is closed for you, you don't need to be here. So, either have fun sharing ideas and info, or move on...! haha

Things that could have been done days ago but haven't been done yet:

1. Translate YouTube comments and Hebrew site comments/threads to discover local conversation about the sighting. I've only done this a bit, but have found a few references to people seeing the thing. For what it's worth, haha. Maybe they saw a weird star that night and then made connection, who knows. Everyone's saying that Jerusalem isn't going bonkers over this, but no media has interviewed a single source there, and since no one here is reading local sites...how would you know?

2. Get traffic reports/weather info about the area in order to estimate how many people would have been around dome

3. When you get clues of disinfo, look into the connections.

*The slanted media portrayal of the event from the get-go - no CNN iReport saying "did you see it?," the multiple and similar UFO sightings happening right now, a blog about a YouTube UFO cover up went down right after being tweeted, it was never reposted - no explanation from blog which had no author or comments, the web cams that captured the "orb" used to load first few days of sighting getting out...and then past dates stopped loading...this thread has been deleted, and then shut down, with the site owner participating in it and warning me...I have to keep starting over with my posts because of this)

4. Get two to five video professionals who have no attachment to this story to give their take on the original videos vs. the videos as a whole...not if they could recreate them, but if any of the videos are first, sufficient for analysis, and then secondly, if they seem authentic/faked.

If ANW is behind this hoax, or is set up to discredit the original videos by supporting them, or is just trying to get traffic...that pisses me off. But unless we really INVESTIGATE, WHAT ARE WE DOING HERE?

Once a UFO sighting that can be corroborated by lots of independent witnesses and happens on live air, we won't NEED to have threads like these. We're supposed to be a little paranoid, no? That's what makes us better, that's what makes us

Yes, we should assume all UFO videos are fake or not real - again, I have never ever stated I thought any of the videos were 100% genuine - but we should also assume the "powers that be" are gonna try to fool us, too.

Oh, some more fun food for topic...

Considering the similarities between the Utah and now Toronto sightings (Toronto, multiple videos - I saw a tweet about a Toronto UFO - someone asking "did anyone see that last night" - when I was researching Jerusalem UFO, never saved tweet though...but there were reports of Toronto UFO after that.)

Do you guys think the hoaxers were some how tipped off about these? Knew they were gonna happen? Wanted to distract people with an even better, faker, more drawn out show?

And is now Google Street View getting in on the hoax action? /5s5rxnw


That's a tiny url link, original URL pasted weird, here again:
google street view ufo funny

Originally posted by plutoice
this was found by four teens in Panama.

It is probably a sloth with mange.

Originally posted by plutoice
www.youtube.com...

What does a song by Celly Caine have to do with anything?

Originally posted by uncuuncu
I think this sighting is genuine and is not a hoax.
Just that some of the videos were faked on purpose to heighten doubt...

Based on what evidence? It is a genuine hoax nothing more... proven a HOAX

reply to post by hootlj


Translation have been done. These questions you bring up are irrelevant after the fact the videos are doctored fakes. As far as a youtube cover up goes that is mere assumption thus far. You are referring to a thread about a yt spam channel. That spammer has nothing in relation to this hoax.

If ANW is behind this hoax, or is set up to discredit the original videos by supporting them, or is just trying to get traffic...that pisses me off.

I agree it pisses me off too, right along with the "fake planes" and "orbies" crowd. ANW has made a circus out of the UFO subject. MC is a wasteoid using the UFO subject as a urinal for self gain, a vehicle to spread rumors and outright lies. Then we are left to clean it up and sanitize ufology of his disinformation. If you add up all the hours us UFO nuts have spent debating and debunking this debacle it would blow your mind. There is no "set up" only MC making a jack ass of himself like always.

MC thrives off the easily influenced and manipulated, he is a professional liar by trade.

But unless we really INVESTIGATE, WHAT ARE WE DOING HERE?

We investigated, we are here to educate others on the dangers and dishonesty of HOAXES like this. Knowledge is something to be valued, this is another lesson and wake up cal to those who believe everything they see and hear. Turns out hoaxers are crafty but not perfect.

I agree it's pretty irrelevant at this point. Hoaxers have had plenty of time to clean up their trail by now. Same for any sort of cover up operation.

That's sort of my point. We got bogged down in all the amateur/anonymous video analysis "proof" that the original videos were hoaxes - which SkepticOverlord, despite all the other "tasty" UFO sightings happening right now to harp on, was obsessed with shoving down our throats, that we never fully looked at the other pieces of the puzzle.

And sorry, I still think it's ironic that a blog post about a YouTube UFO cover up specifically regarding Jerusalem UFO case...went down without trace in a matter of seconds. You can see this happen in real-time on past UFO hoax thread...I read post, posted to forum, and then it vanished/errored.

Probably coincidence...but come on...can you blame me for wondering???

If we all search different search engines/sites in real time, we can probably catch more of these types of events...and come up with more patterns. I still say, this incident aside...what it teaches us is that disinformation theories are virtually impossible to debate.

reply to post by hootlj


Yeah this kind of thing is nothing new. Hoaxers not only Hoax photos and video but will recruit people and use them. In this case ANW is similar to the (Infa Red Sky Alliance) fake planes hoax cult.www.abovetopsecret.com...


All though it is not so much a cult but a tabloid it uses many of the tactics and tools of the hoaxer trade. Mind games, telling you what you want to hear ect. What i have said all along disinformation is disinformation in the form of a hoax it is just as much a disservice as the USAF with a swamp gas excuse. While people drool over CGI, Night Vision of planes, Wedding cake models real UFO sighting happen and pass under the radar. This is what i mean by ; they are the disinformation agents they scream out against. When people realize something is a hoax after investing belief in it they become desensitized. They prey on people like me and you interested in UFO's seeking answers.

Fool me once shame on you
Fool me twice shame on me

Yeah, I totally get that, but ATS members aren't any more trustworthy as far as I can tell. So, when they "diss" ANW, I'm almost curious about ANW has to say. Sorry. TATS is gradually earning my trust back, but until a significant time has passed since they first 404ed/then shut down that HOAX thread, the verdict's still out.

Is it possible to watch the interview with the people who shot the Jerusalem vid live? Someone on this thread said it was being done by Universe Today....

Originally posted by nitro67
Is it possible to watch the interview with the people who shot the Jerusalem vid live? Someone on this thread said it was being done by Universe Today....

As soon as I hear from Mark that it's up, i'll post a link.

He still hasn't confirmed who he is interviewing, I have asked but he's being tight lipped. We shall see soon hopefully, if the person he is supposed to be interviewing actually does it!

Interview has been done, waiting on it being put online.

Will link up as soon as I get it.