Prayer Currently Deemed Illegal in BOE Meetings, page 9

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reply posted on 20-1-2011 @ 11:15 PM by SevenThunders

reply to post by bogomil

Seems to me you are doing the ad-hominem attacks and soapbox liberal/atheist hatred of Christianity.
Obviously you approve of the strong arm tactics of the state enforcing the state religion, atheism. Moreover you apparently don't know anything about the Rutherford institute and the types of cases they take.

Enforcing the state religion, which is what this law is all about is a violation of the 1rst amendment. The latter does not include the phrase "separation of church and state" by the way. The current interpretation of the separation of church and state would require folks to cease practicing their religion in state settings in violation of the first amendment's religious freedom clauses.

reply posted on 20-1-2011 @ 11:24 PM by TheWalkingFox

reply to post by gnosticquasar

Prayer is not an arrestable offense.

However, mandating a prayer as part of a government function is another kettle of fish. As was asked, why in the world do you need to pray before a board of education meeting, anyway?

reply posted on 20-1-2011 @ 11:26 PM by TheWalkingFox

reply to post by SevenThunders

Actually the state religion is agnosticism; legally, the US government and the government of all states are required to, to put it simply, state "no comment" when it comes to religion. It comes with being a pluralistic nation with freedom of faith, as opposed to a state with one particular mandated faith.

reply posted on 21-1-2011 @ 05:56 AM by bogomil

Re Seven Thunders

You wrote:

["Seems to me you are doing the ad-hominem attacks and soapbox liberal/atheist hatred of Christianity"]

Seems to me, that you read so selectively, that you only get what fits into your 'first predetermined answer, then invented facts to prove it'. And then spice it with rhetoric and bad semantics.

I operate from a basis of political philosophy on liberal, egalitarian, secular democratic society, where ALL extremism is a subject for what you so eloquently call 'hatred'. Dissenters from the procedures of such (specified) democratic society, when being loudmouthed about it, are representing political attitudes of fascism.

Don't flatter yourself or try to capitalize on your 'tactical' persecution complex by believing or suggesting, that you are being singled out. Had the subject been introduction of 'Sieg heil' at such meetings, my reaction would have been the same.

The christian bag of tricks from the manual of '1001 ways of deflecting opposition' is wearing thin. If you read back on the thread, this time also including rational arguments against your own extremism, you'll find find reasonable propositions on various perspectives of the situation.

But as having rational dialogues isn't your intention at all, this is ofcourse irrelevant to you; you're here to preach your elitistic message (and in this case) to whine about your denied privileges.

edit on 21-1-2011 by bogomil because: syntax

reply posted on 21-1-2011 @ 06:19 AM by Miraj

reply to post by suigeneris

Firstly.

This is clearly a persecution of christians, because christians are the only ones who pray.
I mean can anyone think of a religion besides Christianity, that prays on a daily shedule with specific instructions to do said prayer? I certainly cannot.

Secondly, perhpas instead of posting some news article that anyone could have written you cite the law that makes it a felony to prayer.

Lastly, why do you need to pray at a Board of Education meeting?

Another thought is, how would they know you're praying, because praying is pretty quiet. You know unless it is one of those people that gets all in your face about their religion and how people need to be all about their religion or it's intolerance or persecution.

But that has nothing to do with this post.

reply posted on 21-1-2011 @ 03:21 PM by Lilitu

Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by suigeneris

Firstly.

This is clearly a persecution of christians, because christians are the only ones who pray.
I mean can anyone think of a religion besides Christianity, that prays on a daily shedule with specific instructions to do said prayer? I certainly cannot.

Oh my! What a sheltered existance you lead. I would have thought that everyone would know this after 911.

Salah

Ṣalāh or Ṣalāt (Arabic: صلاة‎; pl. ṣalawāt) is the practice of formal prayer in Islam. Its supreme importance for Muslims is indicated by its status as one of the Five Pillars of Sunni Islam and of the Ten Practices of the Religion of Shi'a Islam. Salah is a ritual prayer, having prescribed conditions, a prescribed procedure, and prescribed times. Performing salah is obligatory for all adult Muslims, ...

Fact is that prayer is the most common practice of nearly every religion known to humans.

reply posted on 21-1-2011 @ 04:06 PM by SevenThunders

reply to post by bogomil

I like the way in your mind that a humble prayer before God is equivalent to a Nazi salute. Here in the US we have this thing called the first amendment that allows one to practice one's religion. If a muslim at that board slapped down a prayer rug and faced Mecca and began to pray to his demons, he has that right by our constitution.

You are so egalitarian and open that you feel the urge to immediately arrest all christians expressing their faith. My how our great nation has fallen and how sad it is that so many have received the full soviet inspired communist brainwashing inculcated by our government controlled education camps (a.k.a public education).

reply posted on 21-1-2011 @ 04:14 PM by awake_and_aware

reply to post by SevenThunders

Atheists vary rarely comdemn anyone's right to freedom of expression. If you want to believe this, believe this. But don't expect to be free from criticism just because your philosophy, morality comes under the label "Religion".

That amendment allows for the freedom of religion AND, and most importantly the freedom FROM religion. A wall of separation between Religion and state.

reply posted on 21-1-2011 @ 05:57 PM by SevenThunders

reply to post by awake_and_aware

Since atheists are the largest mass murderers in all history and have the worst record of oppression than any other group I'm surprised you would say this.

In the end, there is only the total atheistic contempt for the historical truth that the atheistic regimes of the 20th century, Communism, Nazism and Fascism, for instance, had systematically and deliberately mass murdered at least 10,000 times more people than all of the theistic regimes, completely combined, that had ever, in fact, existed on the entire face of the earth. The lack of religion, as empirically proven many times over, has been fully responsible for massive acts of evil that no seriously minded and holy person, interested only in loving God in all matters, would ever even dare think of doing, much less actually doing such evil deeds.

Read more: socyberty.com...

reply posted on 21-1-2011 @ 06:04 PM by rnaa

reply to post by SevenThunders

You are so egalitarian and open that you feel the urge to immediately arrest all christians expressing their faith.

You are arguing over nothing!

Nobody is arresting anyone, whether Christian, Hindu, or Pagan, for praying. Praying is not illegal, period, let alone a felony.

The OP is just trying to stir up divisive arguments. There is no evidence in the article submitted that has anything to do with arresting people for praying anytime they please.

There is a report that OFFICIAL PRAYERS at OFFICIAL GOVERNMENT BUSINESS MEETINGS are banned while a lawsuit is settled.

It is not, in any way what-so-ever, an attack on or persecution of Christianity, prayer, or religion in general. If it is an attack on anything it is an attack on un-Constitutional religious encroachment into Government business. Period.

edit on 21/1/2011 by rnaa because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 22-1-2011 @ 05:03 AM by awake_and_aware

reply to post by SevenThunders

LOL!

Communism, Nazism and Fascism = Atheism?

Lack of belief in a God leads to racial hatred, fascism and communism?

Cool story bro, i think you need to do some research. It's the lowest trick in the book to bring up genocide in history and link it to Atheism. Stalin, for example wasn't a communist because he didn't believe in God, he had an ideology.

I could name far worse religious dictators, Catholicism has been associated with the fascist right-wing throughout history and even supported Hitler in his regime, they certainly didn't stand up to the injustice.

Most Atheists who think do not wish history to repeat itself and can see the injustice that has been done throughout history whether it has been done by an Atheist or a Theist.

Be nice if you could include a source when you source nonsense.

reply posted on 23-1-2011 @ 06:49 AM by bogomil

Re Seven Thunders

You wrote to me:

["I like the way in your mind that a humble prayer before God is equivalent to a Nazi salute. Here in the US we have this thing called the first amendment that allows one to practice one's religion. If a muslim at that board slapped down a prayer rug and faced Mecca and began to pray to his demons, he has that right by our constitution.

You are so egalitarian and open that you feel the urge to immediately arrest all christians expressing their faith. My how our great nation has fallen and how sad it is that so many have received the full soviet inspired communist brainwashing inculcated by our government controlled education camps (a.k.a public education)."]

As I said earlier, you're using this forum to preach and tell the world how persecuted you are.

Had you been interested in anything outside that, you would have addressed my post instead of re-writing it in your mind and then answer your own fantasy reconstruction of my words.

reply posted on 27-1-2011 @ 09:15 PM by acuna

reply to post by suigeneris

It's not that we Atheists care of you pray, so there's nothing that scares us about it you are free do do what you like. However, a govermental body praying a Christian, Catholic, Buddist, Jewish, Muslim, or Hindu prayer as part of that governmental public process really kind of messes with the 1st amendment.

Now to make it an arrestable offense... that's a bit over the top.

reply posted on 12-2-2011 @ 07:18 PM by JohnSmith880