Euro will collapse… and soon – British MEP

reply to post by triune


We could see an EU wide civilwar in the next few decades.

Germany in many senses is like Prussia and the EU like the German Confederation. This quote from Bismarck could very well be prophetic.

Not through speeches and majority decisions will the great questions of the day be decided - that was the great mistake of 1848 and 1849 - but by iron and blood

There will be a breaking point with immigration and xenophobia soon, especially in the wake of global economic collapse. Factions will form. Demogogues will lead xenophobic neo fascists and their paramilitary arms in crushing non Europeans. Their primary targets will be those of African, Arab, and Turkish ancestry.

Europe will look like Bosnia, but there will be no NATO to intervene. At the same time I would look at the US Civil War as the Central government consolidates power over its member states. States that try to secede or rebel will get crushed.

Will it become a World War?

It depends on three factions: The US, Russia, and the Islamic world.

If the US and the UK oppose "blood and iron" there will be a fight. It will be WW2 with better weapons.
If Russia fails to supply the EU with energy, there will be a fight. Again WW2 with better weapons.
If the Islamic world, including a resurgent Turkey, declared Jihad against the EU, we are looking at the 10th Crusade and probably the liberation of Constantinople.

Regardless of who starts it, we have had a global conflict each century, without fail since the 16th century. We will have another world war.

reply to post by MikeboydUS


I quite agree with a lot of your points...

The time scale tho is the interesting one.. and I think we'll reach boiling point a lot quicker than in previous ages, which in turn leaves the elites little time and room to manoeuvre.

Cue up the song 'Entry of the Gladiators:Thunder and Blazes'. Fire the funny money from the circus cannons. This three-ring marvel is just about to get started. I think this is the show where the lion-tamer finally gets his head bit off by the tired,angry lion who's been whipped one time too many.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by triune

 

We could see an EU wide civilwar in the next few decades.

There won't be a civil war, because Europeans are not that fool to fight for ANY present governments. If the Governments are saying, go and fight, do you know what will be the reaction of the Europeans? Ha-ha-ha. We won't fight, because some greedy moron wants more money (As all war is usually centering around economics). All European countries are capable to keep their present economic state on their own if necessary.

And if the Euro will collapse, my nation, Hungarians are just going to say... BWAHAHAHAA! as we're almost the only ones whose don't have Euro in the Euro zone and we don't really want it at all either. Our money is maybe weak comparing to the Euro, but at least we're setting the prices and not the EU.

If Russia fails to supply the EU with energy, there will be a fight.

You never heard about alternative energies, right? The EU can use water and wind energies anytime. Also almost each country has nuclear power plants. So what energies are you talking about? Gas? That can be solved on other ways. But the Russians are also not willing to risk any war as they also don't want war.

reply to post by Sentinel412


You would be amazed at what desperate hungry unemployed people will do, especially to feed and clothe their children.

No one thought after World War One that Europe would ever have another war like that again for a long long time.

Had the Great Depression never happened, they would have been right.

An economic collapse is a catalyst for hate and extremism.

Hungary may be different than many other European nations, but what will you do if the Germans say you will comply or we will crush you? I would guess most Hungarians would fight for their homeland?

Alternative energies can only go so far.

Trust me when I say human nature is still human nature and in desperate times humans will do real stupid things.

If I would have went back in time to 1920 and told them 25 years from now everything between Normandy and Moscow will be ruins and millions would be dead in the greatest war ever seen by the human race and Germany started it, They would laugh me out of their continuum.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
You would be amazed at what desperate hungry unemployed people will do, especially to feed and clothe their children.

Actually you would be amazed how the countries in the E.U. would be capable to provide food for everyone if they wouldn't be under corporation rules. My country, Hungary, which is a relatively small country alone was the best in exports in many things, such as sugar, potato, apple, meat, etc, etc... Then the corporations came in. So, if a little country was capable to make great exports in the past, do you believe that another, larger countries in the E.U., which has similar good soils what we have are going to starv? Yes, if the people will let greedy corporations to rule. But as the people in the E.U. are against the corporations, there won't be starving, but we're rather going to eliminate some corporations instead. I believe you don't know anything of the present mentality about the E.U. citizens.

- Down with the governments
- Down with the corporations
- Down with the banks

I believe this explains all. If there will be some fight, that fight will be between the people vs. one of the upper mentioned elements. Then as the Europeans are always capable to invent themselves, our lifestyle will return back to normal. But actually we don't give a damn that Governments, Corporations and Banks live or die. As they're messing with our countries all over the E.U., they'll be the first to fly if there will be any problem (You can see the first signs of it. Great taxes on banks and corporations.). And if they're out from the picture, each country can return to it's natural life. European country will be no in food and water shortage as Europe has plenty of resources,

I think that we need a one world currency because we have a one world economy. When put to the task, and on a level playing field, which a world currency would create, the US can outproduce anyone in the world on a per capita basis. That means good things for America, as opposed to the direction we are heading now. No longer could cheap foriegn labor be used to destroy our standard of living and levels of production.

As for the Euro collapsing, I think those fears are overblown. It will be much easier to transfer to a one world currency if we can do it without economic chaos. Of course the PTB may think that is neccesary before it is accepted and others may view it as an opportunity to enrich themselves before the fact.

Then again there is so much we don't know that it is hard to come up with a proper solution to our woes.

I do think us all working together is part of the answer and a one wrold currency would bring us closer to that eventuality.

Think we could handle life without currency trading?

reply to post by Sentinel412


You have studied the Great Depression I would assume?

The French Rveolution? The Revolutions of 1848? The Revolutions of 1905-1911, 1917-1923?

The historical precedent is that desperate people take desperate actions.

We'll just have to wait and see when the global economy collapses what Europe does.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


That is true and something I was about to point out myself.

Thing is though, with Greece almost going bankrupt, Ireland getting into trouble plus one or two other European countries, it's been fairly obvious that the Euro as a currency has been on the brink of collapsing for a long time.

I'm just glad Tony Blair and Gordon Brown didn't sign us into it because otherwise we'd be in even more of a mess than they left us in to begin with, especially if Europe looks to us to help them out.

Which could start more trouble with Britain still in financial crisis and owning billions in debt so to then be expected to bail out European allies when we're unable to afford it and the growing resentment for our perceived lack of help or care of the situation will only make things escalate.

That's when I think the US or China will swoop in, especially China with their strong export trade.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by Sentinel412

 

You have studied the Great Depression I would assume?

Actually I live in the European Union (Nope. I'm not happy about it.) and I know the Great Depression inside out (Especially the hidden parts of it what is used to be missing from the history books.). And I also do know what people are capable to do here and I know what they'll do. My country is also well known about how to start revolutions, so you don't have to present revolutions to me at all. Trust me. There won't be any world war. We, Europeans don't want to fight for some greedy or megaloman idiot. We rather kick them out, then we go and eat something.

reply to post by curious7


The US is already swooping in through its defacto apparatus, the IMF, which is helping bailout Greece and Ireland.

Hopefully the IMF treats the EU better than the various banana republics its bailed out in the past.

Originally posted by Sentinel412

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by Sentinel412

 

You have studied the Great Depression I would assume?

Actually I live in the European Union (Nope. I'm not happy about it.) and I know the Great Depression inside out (Especially the hidden parts of it what is used to be missing from the history books.). And I also do know what people are capable to do here and I know what they'll do. My country is also well known about how to start revolutions, so you don't have to present revolutions to me at all. Trust me. There won't be any world war. We, Europeans don't want to fight for some greedy or megaloman idiot. We rather kick them out, then we go and eat something.

edit on 12-1-2011 by Sentinel412 because: (no reason given)

You and the ordinary people of Europe may not want to fight, but unfortunately the elite who control your countries and armed forces will. Iran is now the president of OPEC. They want to flex these muscles and show the world they are a major player. They also have a security pact with Russia and China. Europe already knows it is between the pincers.

Iran will provoke a violent response from the EU by threatening oil supplies. Rather than be held hostage to either OPEC (Iran) or Russia, the German led EU will attack Iran to secure oil supplies. This in turn will trigger the security pact with Russia and China which will then attack across Europe. Welcome to WW3.

Bare in mind that at this future time the EU will be the ranking power in the west and may well consider the US as an enemy.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by triune

 

We could see an EU wide civilwar in the next few decades.

It will not escalate to an EU-wide civil war. No European is yet loyal enough to the Union to lay down their life for it. There will be police actions across the continent, enforced in one country by peace-keepers/EUROPOL from another country. This is how Israel defines its conflict with Palestine; you can imagine what they will get away with. Remember that the Korean War and Vietnam war were both 'police actions.' It will not be a real civil war. It will be a managed civil disorder. The Union government will trim away any rebels. There will only be civil war if countries refuse to co-operate and begin to secede...

Germany in many senses is like Prussia and the EU like the German Confederation. This quote from Bismarck could very well be prophetic.

The Nazi regime was preserved in all the occupation zones of post-War Germany because it was needed. The Allies preferred to recycle Nazi assets and the state apparatus of the Third Reich. In those days, they were absolutely disinterested in 'nation-building.' The Third Reich was divided into two portions by the Allies after their own rift became apparent. The Reich was protected and hidden by the Western Allies and the USSR and was incorporated into the BDR and DDR, respectively. The reunification of Germany in 1990 brought together the two halves of the old Nazi state apparatus. It is ruled by the political descendants of the fascists. Germany had intended for decades to take over the European Union, but could not do so militarily. Instead, it conquered Europe by outproducing it.

There will be a breaking point with immigration and xenophobia soon, especially in the wake of global economic collapse. Factions will form. Demogogues will lead xenophobic neo fascists and their paramilitary arms in crushing non Europeans. Their primary targets will be those of African, Arab, and Turkish ancestry.

When it comes, the chaos will affect much more than immigrants and minorities. There will be a general breakdown in society, with anarchists and riots and partisan guerillas. All tensions will be released at the point that the Euro hits hyperinflation.

The Euro was deliberately introduced in markets that were not ready for it in order to generate the tension necessary to break down society. The European Central Bank is located in Frankfurt-am-Main, the German city where the Rothschild banking empire was born. The collapse of the Euro is designed to take place after the digitization of the banking system. This allows the system of Central Banks to maintain an accurate balance of funds to compensate for hyperinflation. The cash that people use in their day-to-day purchases will become rapidly worthless in a hyperinflation scenario. Digital transactions will be secure and accurate, leaving the Public Market paralyzed and the elite money markets intact. The paralysis of the European common market is the goal of ECB monetary policy. It aims to freeze the economies of all nations that do business in Euros, even if they possess their own currencies. This will enable the EU to loot not only its own citizens and corporations, but its neighbours and trade partners as well.

Europe will look like Bosnia, but there will be no NATO to intervene. At the same time I would look at the US Civil War as the Central government consolidates power over its member states. States that try to secede or rebel will get crushed.

On the contrary, NATO will intervene. If the Eastern States of the EU secede (they do not use the Euro and they, of all EU members, stand the most to lose if the Euro crashes) then the EU may have a legal right to declare martial law and use 'police force' to bring the Eastern States under central control. In such a scenario, these former Soviet Bloc countries may seek a resurgent Russia's protection.

In the event of an Eastern European War, NATO will be obliged to participate. Even if the EU is aggressing against its Eastern States, it will justify its actions as 'police action' and not as war. The Russians will see it differently, and may move 'peacekeepers' into Eastern Europe. The EU could see these 'peacekeepers' as unwelcome foreign invaders, and vow to expel them. The tension could very rapidly rise to the breaking point, bringing us into a war between NATO nations and CIS nations. Any such war would become a world war. Russia and China are tightening their military ties. War with one will bring war with the other.

That's how I see it going down.

Europe will be fine but the Eurozone is in trouble. When Italy and Belgium inevitably join Spain, Portugal, Greece and Ireland in the turmoil of financial meltdown, everyone in Europe will finally wake up from this absurd dream of one currency working between several countries with wildly differing economies. As idiotic ideas go, History will remember the Euro as one of the classics.

It might fold sooner than later--there is a distinct possibility that the new EU emergency fund conflicts with the German constitution and without Germany, this is all already over. I, for one, will gleefully spit on the EU's grave, and I'm not afraid to admit that.

Edit: Oh, and the most violent part of all this would probably include French truck drivers dropping loads of animal manure somewhere, as they are want to do.

deleted

Originally posted by Sentinel412

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by triune

 

We could see an EU wide civilwar in the next few decades.

There won't be a civil war, because Europeans are not that fool to fight for ANY present governments. If the Governments are saying, go and fight, do you know what will be the reaction of the Europeans? Ha-ha-ha. We won't fight, because some greedy moron wants more money (As all war is usually centering around economics). All European countries are capable to keep their present economic state on their own if necessary.

And if the Euro will collapse, my nation, Hungarians are just going to say... BWAHAHAHAA! as we're almost the only ones whose don't have Euro in the Euro zone and we don't really want it at all either. Our money is maybe weak comparing to the Euro, but at least we're setting the prices and not the EU.

If Russia fails to supply the EU with energy, there will be a fight.

You never heard about alternative energies, right? The EU can use water and wind energies anytime. Also almost each country has nuclear power plants. So what energies are you talking about? Gas? That can be solved on other ways. But the Russians are also not willing to risk any war as they also don't want war.

edit on 12-1-2011 by Sentinel412 because: (no reason given)

We in the Netherlands can provide for over 5years in Gas supply(Europe wide)

How to produce your own biogas

this is from the uk independence party...it is just politics.. nothing else..
kx

Well, yes, that's a valid point. But the fact remains that the Euro is teetering on the brink and if it does fall, the EU itself is in real existential trouble. I'm not foreseeing any wars, mind you, just a reshuffling of the European PTB and better times for all.

Just in (netherlands/euro) Game over