China 'Developing Military Spacecraft'

reply to post by silo13


Deep thoughts indeed. One point which stands out to me, is the idea that either China or the US could stand alone against any percieved interstellar threat. If the Earth were to come under attack from beyond the limits of the atmosphere no one nation could protect its interests. There would have to be a concerted effort on the part of all spacefaring nations , to produce a system to protect the world together.
And, while it is a sobering thought that such weapons could pheasibly be turned against the Earth, its worth remembering that as it stands, most airforces have the capacity to turn small nations to rubble within hours these days, should they wish to do so. Hellfire missiles, nuclear warheads, bunkerbusters. The collection of munitions that can be bought to bare against our fellow man is as it stands enormous, horrific , and when veiwed as a whole paints a pretty unfortunate picture of our habits as a species if you think about it.
Back to the point. China seems a little behind at this point. The article points out the existance of the American space plane, and its being an apparant analogue for the one built by the Chinese. I wonder how much espionage has occured around that issue !

The Chinese Lunar Probe sent back photo's of our base up there.

That's why China and India are flipping out right now.

reply to post by TrueBrit


Not likely to be anything to do with an external threat. If there is an external threat we are toast. Not much any stealth fighters or mini shuttles is gonna do about it.

No, this is just China trying to get up to speed with the western powers in terms of equipment quality. Necessary to resume what they believe to be their rightful place as the dominant influence in region.

The quality gap will continue to close rapidly. As western companies will continue scrambling to sell them anything they can legally for a next quarter pay off. They will steal that which they cant get legally. Within 20-30 years they will be innovating with the best of us.

The western corporate world has a short term focus and few scruples. The chinese corporate world has a long term outlook and no scruples whatever. I know where my bet would be placed.

in my honest opinion space based weapons are not going to happen. just suspend your opinions for a while and consider that the globe is surrounded by a kind of customs pat-down protocol. yes i am talking about a presence that will not permit such a scenario. consider for one moment the reason why they signed a treaty not to deploy space based weapons. i believe this was a face-saving exercise by the superpowers who attempted it but were always thwarted by 'customs'.
please peruse this link www.stargate-chronicles.com...
many thanks to zorgon for sending me the link when we conversed about a similar incident in the late eighties/early ninties.
i believe certain articles of hardware were introduced into orbit piece by piece due to the hostile environment as well as the payload specialists knowing very little if nothing of the contents. utilising compartmentalisation of tasks and knowledge in an attempy to circumvent 'customs'.
there are some in the know who will read this and will feel the hairs on the back of their necks rise.
i believe 'customs' will always sniff out anything contraband be it from visual inspection or by impressing on the astronaut(s) during eva.
i feel the day any given power succeeds in lofting and deploying a weapons systems into orbit will be the day the gloves come off and it will be part and parcel of the 'customs' agenda.
regards f

The following is not classified.

In 1976, the US Air Force and Lockheed Martin's Skunkworks introduced the prototype for what would become the F-117 Nighthawk stealthfighter. In 1977 it would fly for the first time at Area 51 of Nellis Air Force Base.

It was not until 1988, that the F-117 Nighthawk would be revealed to the public.

In 1957, the US Air Force and Boeing, began developmental work on the X-20 Dyna-Soar, a hypersonic multi-role combat transatmospheric craft. Technology developed in the X-15 hypersonic research aircraft program, began in 1954, would be used to create the X-20.

Also in 1957, Lockheed Martin's Skunkworks would begin work on the Archangel Program to replace the U-2. Archangel 12 or the A-12, predecessor of the SR-71 Blackbird, would be chosen in 1959 to replace the U-2. Like the stealthfighter prototype, the A-12's 1962 shakedown flight was at Area 51 of Nellis Air Force Base.

In 1962, the X-20 was revealed to the public.

In 1962, a hypersonic drone, the Lockheed D-21, similar to the X-15, was developed to piggyback on the A-12.

In 1964, the SR-71 Blackbird was revealed to the public.

In 1965, development began for a hypersonic replacement for the SR-71 and the A-12, based on the X-20 "boost glide" design codenamed Rheinberry.

Even though the Rheinberry project was supposed to have been cancelled in 1967. The prototype and its design has never been revealed to the public and to this day remains classified. The only thing ever declassified was the demonstrator engines, the Pratt & Whitney XLR-129, which was said to have 250,000 lbs of thrust.

The Space Shuttle Orbiter, has a liftoff weight of 240,000 lbs and its three main engines have 400,000 lbs of thrust each.

The Rheinberry, if comparable in size and weight to the X-20 Dyna Soar, whose liftoff weight was around 12,000 lbs, should have easily been able to achieve orbit with the XLR-129 engine.

What does all of this mean?

It means we developed a multi role combat spacecraft in 1957.

reply to post by MikeboydUS


seems an excellent chronolgy of re-usable delivery systems.
not to be confused with fixed space based systems.
payload is also a different kettle of fish.
f

Originally posted by fakedirt
reply to post by MikeboydUS

 

seems an excellent chronolgy of re-usable delivery systems.
not to be confused with fixed space based systems.
payload is also a different kettle of fish.
f

Well the article is about a Chinese X-37B knockoff, a reuseable launch vehicle.

My ultimate point was the US developed the X-20 back in the 1950s and the Rheinberry from the 60s was never made public.

We are 50 years ahead of the PRC when it comes to combat spacecraft.

The US just landed a space plane which spent over 200 days in space, this year 2010.
The space plane is a uav which is capable of multitasks.
I am sure this is a great spur to the russians and chinese to develope their own craft to equal this feat.
It is already too late to stop the weaponisation of space.
We have stuff in orbit right now......."the rods from the gods" and other technologies of war.

MIRV anyone?...

reply to post by MikeboydUS

point taken and absorbed
2nd
f

reply to post by stirling

i've a couple of pics of it on the landing pad. with regards to your last sentence, i would appreciate any footage or links that these 'rods from the gods' have actually been deployed and/or utilised. i do not doubt their existence, i doubt they have/will be used offensively.
f
will look in tomorrow going to bed now ta.

reply to post by stirling

hi stirling
got any dirt for me?
2nd
f

They sort of already "took the war to space" or at least proved that they could when the shot down a satellite a few years ago. A warning shot over the bow, so to speak.

In a way, if wars are unavoidable and they so insist on fighting them, sure,,,take them into space where fewer innocents will get hurt, including our planet. They could strap one of their guys to this craft (preferably the leader who made the decision to go to war to begin with) and of their opponents to another, and we can all make popcorn and watch it from the safety of our ground. Hey...a person can dream....

The truth of it is that it's more likely a craft to optimize damage on the earth. And hey, if it happens to come in handy during an alien invasion or to break up a comet heading toward us, that's a nice side benefit too to help us justify our penchant for building toys of mass destruction.

reply to post by silo13


Maybe there are 'Aliens' on Mars... they know they are there and hostile but arent saying anything to us????

It's possible.... why else would you build a craft for fighting in space?

Or this is just precaution.... just in case there are hostiles around!

reply to post by Silcone Synapse

Lets just hope the Chinese do not continue to test space weapons by blowing up old satellites,or they will make ANY space travel a lot more dangerous,if not next to impossible(due to bits of space debris).

No one has the right to spoil our spacefaring chances by messing about with weapons up there IMO

Maybe you should tell the US that..
They put most of it up there..

reply to post by ~Lucidity


ground/atmosphere based systems fair enough but i still stand by my statement that it seems no weapons are or will be deployed in orbit or space. read about scott mclelland if you have not had the pleasure. what that guy witnessed, i saw almost the same bar the inner cabin incident. my view was of the payload bay only. other incidents of scrutiny i have also observed and in doing so came to the conclusion (imo) that the whole weapons thing up there is a no-no.
if you consider that in warfare, the high ground gives one the edge. air superiority gives you control over air/land and space will give you control over all of the above. if the star wars system was the solution to defence of nations, how is it that it never got off the ground? the russians had the resources and so did the americans.
my conclusion to that was they couldn't deploy and so saved face by signing arms reduction treaties etc.
f

Originally posted by tom502
I think the days of US world domination are closing down. All other nations, unless they are the children of the US(France)

If anything the US is the child of Europe. What insolence!
Just sayin'.

On topic: I'm one of the crazies that believe the US has got technology that would blow our flat little minds, make war by way of deception, you don't show your aces.